Refunded School voluntary contribution because of Covid19 closures

JimmyVik

So I posted in the teaching forum that I got back 50% of the "voluntary" contribution, as did a friend with a child in another school, and it seems there is a bit of a debate there. I was only posting to say it was a good thing and thankyou really..



Now i didnt realize but that thread has mostly teachers in it so they would probably be against giving it back.


So posting here as there are probably more normal parents here.


Have you got part of your voluntary contribution returned yet?


If not are you going to ask for it?


If you they dont give it to you are you going to "volunteer" to not pay it next year?


Do you think the schools should keep it.


Will you pay monthly in future just to avoid such a scenario should the virus take hold next year again?


Might be a better, fairer discussion about this in after hours.

Edgware

We have got a refund from the V.E.C. adult education section for a course my wife was doing.
I can see the schools being reluctant to return funds as they will be incurring a lot of extra costs for cleaning, sanitising etc.
Needless to say it will merit a call to Joe

JimmyVik

Edgware wrote: »

We have got a refund from the V.E.C. adult education section for a course my wife was doing.
I can see the schools being reluctant to return funds as they will be incurring a lot of extra costs for cleaning, sanitising etc.
Needless to say it will merit a call to Joe

Not up to the parents to fund that though.
As I said elsewhere. I will be paying the voluntary contribution monthly next year. And any attempt to increase it and I will pay a big fat ZERO for the year.


They have been taking the p1ss with it for many years now and I just happily paid it.

Edgware

JimmyVik wrote: »

Not up to the parents to fund that though.
As I said elsewhere. I will be paying the voluntary contribution monthly next year. And any attempt to increase it and I will pay a big fat ZERO for the year.


They have been taking the p1ss with it for many years now and I just happily paid it.

I know that it is not up to the parents but the Government contributions aren't adequate.
If you want your kids to be educated in a filthy kip don't pay.

Jim Root

They probably need the cash, I won’t be pressing the issue.

Blush_01

I think it's an interesting take, a bit of a "cutting off your nose to spite your face" move, but if you don't care about your kids not having light, heating, toilet roll, a clean school, soap, hand sanitiser, art supplies, sports equipment, that kind of thing, then great idea.

I wonder if I could claim back all the car tax I'm paying at the moment since I'm not using the roads?

rainbowtrout

Edgware wrote: »

I know that it is not up to the parents but the Government contributions aren't adequate.
If you want your kids to be educated in a filthy kip don't pay.

OP got that answer in the education forum but wasn’t happy that he was told that schools will have extra running costs and hopes the people in this forum will support his scabbiness

SEPT 23 1989

I won't be looking for it back

It's children's education we are talking about here

One eyed Jack

JimmyVik wrote: »

So I posted in the teaching forum that I got back 50% of the "voluntary" contribution, as did a friend with a child in another school, and it seems there is a bit of a debate there. I was only posting to say it was a good thing and thankyou really..

Now i didnt realize but that thread has mostly teachers in it so they would probably be against giving it back.

You didn’t realise there would be mostly teachers in the Teaching forum?

JimmyVik wrote: »

So posting here as there are probably more normal parents here.


Have you got part of your voluntary contribution returned yet?


If not are you going to ask for it?


If you they dont give it to you are you going to "volunteer" to not pay it next year?


Do you think the schools should keep it.


Will you pay monthly in future just to avoid such a scenario should the virus take hold next year again?


Might be a better, fairer discussion about this in after hours.

That doesn’t sound like much of a thank you, it sounds like a wind-up looking for a debate, if I’m being completely honest.

I have been paying voluntary contributions to various schools now for the best part of 18 years since I have had 5 children going through multiple schools. I pay these contributions every year, some years to 3 separate schools. I don't mind contributing to the schools, but when I hear the money is going to heating and cleaning etc, it frustrates me greatly that the 2 incompetent political parties that have been in government are unable to fund the most basic needs in the schools.
That said, only 1 school I pay into say the contributions are being used for extra curricular activities, school events etc rather than basic needs like heating and cleaning.
With Covid-19 and schools returning in Sept, the schools are going to have to now provide hot water and soap for handwashing (yes, this is not provided in many schools), hand sanitizer and other requirements to prevent the spread of this virus. Who is going to pay for all that? My taxes certainly don't seem to be.

byhookorbycrook

Perhaps the OP should have attended the school meeting where the accounts are shown to the parent body and s/he could see where the money goes . It’s certainly not spent on spa days for staff or even tea or coffee for the staff room.

BonsaiKitten

You know what? Teachers don't like that schools rely on voluntary contributions either. Teachers don't like that they are expected to fund school materials from their own pockets.

If you care so much, get onto your local TDs and ask them to press the issue. Start a petition online to increase school funding. But don't piss and moan at schools that are trying to raise enough money to literally keep the lights on.

This is it

Won't be looking for it back. I know the teachers struggle as it is to provide essentials for the kids and know of friends who are teachers who have to spend their own money on basic things like white board markers, etc.

As was said above, it's for your own kids sake.

TheValeyard

So OP,

That's two threads not going your way. How's that working out?

buckwheat

Only a complete arsehole would look for it back

gnf_ireland

Absolutely no way I would consider asking for a rebate on voluntary contributions from the school. Its actually criminal that schools are not funded to a proper level that includes basic running costs of heating, lighting, insurance etc. The schools should also be able to support a basic level of extra curricular activities out of their grants, such as sports and other PE necessities (and I am not talking about after school clubs or anything like that).

I am a firm believer that the children's allowance should be reduced by 40 euro a month per child and the schools should be paid the extra 500 euro per student - but on the condition that they pay for all books, copies, photocopying, etc etc. And of course, they would not be permitted to ask for any additional contributions.

Its a classic scenario of would you be willing to pay more tax for better services - those losing out on the children's allowance are the exact same people benefiting from the better funded school system.

I genuinely hope that COVID will see a transformation in the way so many things are run, and we use this opportunity to think outside the box. For that reason alone, I would like a second election this year to let the people speak again and see if it can make things better or worse - but the current situation is an absolute mess.

byhookorbycrook

byhookorbycrook wrote: »

Perhaps the OP should have attended the school meeting where the accounts are shown to the parent body and s/he could see where the money goes . It’s certainly not spent on spa days for staff or even tea or coffee for the staff room.

Youre obviously in the wrong school!








Joking:D

Muahahaha

How much is the voluntary contribution? I remember it was around 20 euro in the mid 90s, where is it at now

byhookorbycrook

SouthWesterly wrote: »

Youre obviously in the wrong school!








Joking:D

Give me a few addresses ( won’t tell anyone , I SWEAR!)Monart here we come ( having hijacked the swimming bus !

We don’t even use the school phone for personal calls and buy stickers / prizes/ printer cartridges from our own money .

Ubbquittious

Is there any school that doesn't do this voluntary contribution bullsh1t or is it literally ""all the go""?

ILoveYourVibes

Muahahaha wrote: »

How much is the voluntary contribution? I remember it was around 20 euro in the mid 90s, where is it at now

About 200 for primary school and 250-300 for secondary now I believe.

It was about 170 for me in secondary.

Is there any school that doesn't do this voluntary contribution bullsh1t or is it literally ""all the go""?

Also its in NO way voluntary ..voluntary my arse.

Muahahaha

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

About 200 for primary school and 250-300 for secondary now I believe.

It was about 170 for me in secondary.



Also its in NO way voluntary ..voluntary my arse.

jaysis thats a fair old whack from the days it was IR£20. What started off as a token amount has grown more than 10 fold. With two kids in secondary that would cost 600 odd a year which is a significant sum for a family on a low income.

endacl

JimmyVik wrote: »

Now i didnt realize but that thread has mostly teachers in it so they would probably be against giving it back.

Speaking as a teacher, I’ll certainly miss the extra income generated by my share of the voluntary contribution. Will have to rethink the new car this year.

:rolleyes:

You do realise the money you pay often means there’s paper in the jacks so your kid[s) can wipe his/her/their arse(s)?

2Mad2BeMad

endacl wrote: »

Speaking as a teacher, I’ll certainly miss the extra income generated by my share of the voluntary contribution. Will have to rethink the new car this year.

:rolleyes:

You do realise the money you pay often means there’s paper in the jacks so your kid[s) can wipe his/her/their arse(s)?

In my school (9years ago) we had to ask for toilet roll. Problem was if you badly had to go you had to run 1 end of the hall get the roll and key for the toilet then rush to the other end.

No such thing as hot water.
And contribution was around 100-150
God only knows what it will be when my kid starts school

nthclare

This isn't voluntary, I've seen it before and teachers calling out the names of the kid's in class or asking them to put up their hand's if they've paid the voluntary contribution.

Then it's easy for the other kid's to know who's paid and who didn't.

A very subtle way of undermining other students and making the ones who did pay feel resentful towards the kids who are less well off or who's parents said feck this. We've paid enough for books etc...

My son's very intuitive and it's easy for him to spot something that's subtly unfair or not right.
He called me on the phone and told me what the teacher did. Luckily myself and his mum who aren't together split it between us.
But it wasn't fair on the other students.

It's similar in housing estates from the Celtic tiger era, who's builder's promised they'ed cut the grass for the first ten years as part of the scheme.

Then the bottom falls out of it, the estate is three quarters occupied and it's left to the residents to get in contractors to do the landscaping.

There's always a few house's who are to the wire financially, and maybe offer half of what they're looking for.
It's dressed up as you're free to donate what ever you want, no worries...but it's 200 a year..

Annually they send out a list of those who paid and those who didn't are not included in the list.

I think legally they can post a letter out, but they can't directly say who didn't pay.

So in a roundabout way it's easy to see who's name isn't on the list....

Pure middle class narcissistic fckery going on there...

nthclare

Ubbquittious wrote: »

Is there any school that doesn't do this voluntary contribution bullsh1t or is it literally ""all the go""?

There's a few in Clare whom I'm told can manage their budget's ok.

But if you make account of all the photocopying distribution your kid gets throughout the year, it'll more than likely add up.to 30 euro's.

Where's the rest being spent ?

rainbowtrout

nthclare wrote: »

There's a few in Clare whom I'm told can manage their budget's ok.

But if you make account of all the photocopying distribution your kid gets throughout the year, it'll more than likely add up.to 30 euro's.

Where's the rest being spent ?

Ever seen the heating and electricity bills for a school?

nthclare

rainbowtrout wrote: »

Ever seen the heating and electricity bills for a school?

No, as far as I know schools have to provide heating and electricity for the students and staff.

I remember doing a tourism course year's ago, and learning about the early 20th century and each kid would bring in a sod of turf for the fire, I thought we're beyond that now.
Maybe they should bring in a litre of kerosene in their lunch box every day throughout the winter.

Or else they could all rotate their physical education classes and go spinning and have them all connected to the mains, so if there's 8 classes they'll generate enough power throughout the day.
And it can be a sustainable school, Gretta could cut the ribbon in the new green school..

Would that be ok ?

byhookorbycrook

There can be confusion between a “ voluntary contribution “ and certain expenses.
In primary school , photocopying, printing, art supplies , standardized tests etc. aren’t optional - they need to be paid, in the same way as books .
The “ voluntary contributions “ are an extra charge which may go to pay for electricity, heating, lighting and cleaning supplies .

rainbowtrout

nthclare wrote: »

No, as far as I know schools have to provide heating and electricity for the students and staff.

Yep and the budget they get isn't enough to cover the bills unfortunately. The voluntary contributions also cover things like toilet rolls and soap.

Ubbquittious

rainbowtrout wrote: »

Yep and the budget they get isn't enough to cover the bills unfortunately. The voluntary contributions also cover things like toilet rolls and soap.

2 toilet rolls, 2 bars of soap and the rest of it is spent on posh biscuits, comfier office chairs and high end Apple laptops for the teachers. Probably a few posh dinners for the teachers and board of management throughout the year as well

Purple Mountain

I literally paid my son's final term contribution days before school shut.
I pay per term.
No way will I follow up looking for it back.
Swings and roundabouts and all that.
We usually have an end of year fundraiser as a whole school community, that's gone now so I won't be putting my hand in my pocket to support that but equally the school is down that revenue.
Wouldn't look for it back anyway. It is what it is.

nthclare

rainbowtrout wrote: »

Yep and the budget they get isn't enough to cover the bills unfortunately. The voluntary contributions also cover things like toilet rolls and soap.

I know you mean well, and I think we're being pissed on and told it's raining by the system.

My lad burnt his school books up the land there the other day, it was symbolic to him to make a Wickerman like structure and burn the lot of it.. and take a picture of it...
No animals were harmed in the production..

He was never great at school and the system is ****e for kid's who are more practical rather than academic...

It was a proud moment for me to see it all going up in smoke,and a relief to him.

He's quite intelligent but he didn't fit into the curriculum and the new ways they're being thought to divide and multiply..

I remember doing math's homework with him year's ago and we were both on different planet's, because they fcked it up along the way...it's not simple or practical anymore

Ubbquittious

I remember during the heady days of the celtic tiger the primary school I went to sent a letter to all their past pupils looking for donations for some extension they were building or goodies to fill said extension with. On the letter it stated

No donations under €250 will be accepted.


The utter cheek of the fcukers

rainbowtrout

Ubbquittious wrote: »

2 toilet rolls, 2 bars of soap and the rest of it is spent on posh biscuits, comfier office chairs and high end Apple laptops for the teachers. Probably a few posh dinners for the teachers and board of management throughout the year as well

We pay for our own tea and biscuits. Nothing is supplied. As for the rest......:rolleyes:

nthclare wrote: »

I know you mean well, and I think we're being pissed on and told it's raining by the system.

My lad burnt his school books up the land there the other day, it was symbolic to him to make a Wickerman like structure and burn the lot of it.. and take a picture of it...
No animals were harmed in the production..

He was never great at school and the system is ****e for kid's who are more practical rather than academic...

I don't see what burning his books has got to do with what is effectively fundraising to keep the lights on, but if you talk to teachers you'll find that most buy stuff for their classrooms out of their own pocket, we don't get free tea and biscuits etc at work, we pay for them ourselves, and the budget that the school gets isn't anywhere near enough to cover the basics which is why schools do so many fundraisers. There are 35 classrooms in my school, each has at least 2 radiators, add in a staffroom, offices, communal areas and corridors and I'd estimate that there are 90 radiators in the building. Compare that with an average home which has maybe 9 or 10 and considering the heating bill for the year.

I don't agree with some of the methods being used in primary school at all l (I'm a secondary teacher), nor do kids who are practical get the easiest time in secondary school, there is huge scope to change and improve this area. Probably won't happen any time soon though.

Muahahaha

byhookorbycrook wrote: »

There can be confusion between a “ voluntary contribution “ and certain expenses.
In primary school , photocopying, printing, art supplies , standardized tests etc. aren’t optional - they need to be paid, in the same way as books .
The “ voluntary contributions “ are an extra charge which may go to pay for electricity, heating, lighting and cleaning supplies .

I think ultimately it is a political problem. Central government deliberately under funds the school system so principals are left with little option but to fundraise through 'voluntary contributions'. They were £20 when I went to school and it was controversial back then so can only imagine it is more so now that it is 300 euro. The more parents pay the less Government have to fund education.

nthclare

Muahahaha wrote: »

I think ultimately it is a political problem. Central government deliberately under funds the school system so principals are left with little option but to fundraise through 'voluntary contributions'. They were £20 when I went to school and it was controversial back then so can only imagine it is more so now that it is 300 euro. The more parents pay the less Government have to fund education.

I read a lot of old book's and am interested in our heritage, history and culture.

The schools are probably too big now and I suppose for a young person to get a job in a school as a teacher such as one of those small schools you'll see dotted around the coastlines of Clare and Kerry. Must be a dream come true, imagine looking after a small amount of rural kid's , and being able to see them from infants up until 6th class.

I know a few teacher's along the coast, you'd meet them surfing on warm spring and summer evening's after work and they're in the zone. Hardly any stress, fresh air and as one guy tells me he came from a city and applied for a rural teaching position.

It's like being in Ryan's daughter, teaching good kids, able to walk down to the beach and forage around rock pools now and again...

Do they still do nature walks. My favourite part of the week in the early 80's out amongst the trees and shrubs, I'm in North Clare myself, but grew up on the banks of the Shannon Estuary,so my primary school was a 5 minute walk from the mudflats...

It must be difficult in an urban school that's for sure..

There's less over head's in rural areas and probably a lot of old money in the sticks..

JustAThought

I know one of the local schools pre-lockdown had every child buy and bring in a washbag with alcohol hand sanatiser ,squirty soap and their own hand towel in it. Expensive business - and Incan’t imagine the schools win’t be doing that if/when they re-open.

Regarding the original OP thou I probably wouldn’t ask he does have a point - particularly as the schools are now shut and should not be incurring those additional costs - photocopying/artwork/light/heat/third term bulk toiletrolls etc. A 1/3 credit rollover to the next year or refund would probably be appreciated by many.

Much as in the same way I don’t understand how two of the schools locally manage to have left on the major corridor lights to entire floors ON. Surely someone in ‘authority’ should have noticed by now or should be in charge of flicking the master switch to off when they leave the building - for the next 6 months. I wonder is their heat on too?

ILoveYourVibes

nthclare wrote: »

There's a few in Clare whom I'm told can manage their budget's ok.

But if you make account of all the photocopying distribution your kid gets throughout the year, it'll more than likely add up.to 30 euro's.

Where's the rest being spent ?

Oh we have to pay 50 euro on top of the contribution for that. There were other extras too.

If you wanted to take french for example another 150 euro. Mine was a state run public secondary.

We had no science labs or equipment. No sports grounds. The school entrance opened up onto a high street. It was not a suitable building for a school. And the classes were HUGE.

jimmycrackcorm

The thing I don't get about the voluntary contributions is, there is no accountability for where or what it gets spent on

We have a very active PA who do a lot of fundraising for the school.

This is it

nthclare wrote: »

I read a lot of old book's and am interested in our heritage, history and culture.

The schools are probably too big now and I suppose for a young person to get a job in a school as a teacher such as one of those small schools you'll see dotted around the coastlines of Clare and Kerry. Must be a dream come true, imagine looking after a small amount of rural kid's , and being able to see them from infants up until 6th class.

I know a few teacher's along the coast, you'd meet them surfing on warm spring and summer evening's after work and they're in the zone. Hardly any stress, fresh air and as one guy tells me he came from a city and applied for a rural teaching position.

It's like being in Ryan's daughter, teaching good kids, able to walk down to the beach and forage around rock pools now and again...

Do they still do nature walks. My favourite part of the week in the early 80's out amongst the trees and shrubs, I'm in North Clare myself, but grew up on the banks of the Shannon Estuary,so my primary school was a 5 minute walk from the mudflats...

It must be difficult in an urban school that's for sure..

There's less over head's in rural areas and probably a lot of old money in the sticks..

My son is in a rural school, mixed classes for most years, 5 teachers and just over 100 students. They still need voluntary contributions to keep them going. I'm on the PA and it's a constant battle to raise money for things like buses for school trips, external doors because the ones in place are falling apart, basic maths supplies, under sink heaters so there's sufficient warm water.

Schools are underfunded and while not everyone can contribute, I've no issue contributing myself for the good of my kids education.

JimmyVik

nthclare wrote: »

There's a few in Clare whom I'm told can manage their budget's ok.

But if you make account of all the photocopying distribution your kid gets throughout the year, it'll more than likely add up.to 30 euro's.

Where's the rest being spent ?

Toilet roll apparently Wonder how much toilet roll theyve used in the schools since March.
Ours is primary school and its €320 per year.
Now they did sent me back €160 this year, so I cant complain this year.
But it better not increase next year. Or it will be voluntary.



I see its about 50/50 in here, with odd you are a scabby fcuker thrown in for good measure, which are eerily similar to the tactics the schools use to get it.

But I cant be the only person who objects to paying for education twice.
I already pay enough tax thankyou. And what I pay in taxes surely already covers toilet roll for the kids.

JimmyVik

Ubbquittious wrote: »

I remember during the heady days of the celtic tiger the primary school I went to sent a letter to all their past pupils looking for donations for some extension they were building or goodies to fill said extension with. On the letter it stated

No donations under €250 will be accepted.

The utter cheek of the fcukers

I get a letter like that from UCD every year.

JimmyVik

rainbowtrout wrote: »

We pay for our own tea and biscuits. Nothing is supplied. As for the rest......:rolleyes:

You would think you got nothing from the us.

What about your parking space, the building you work in. The heating to keep you warm in the winter. Your staff room. Furniture. Your salary. And lets not forget, toilet roll.



I was all for the teachers and supported them to the last in other threads I posted in, but I gotta say im turning.


I pay twice for the school. Once out of my taxes and once out of the voluntary contribution. Now I am happy enough to pay it up to now, but dont start taking the P and trying to justify it.

This is it

JimmyVik wrote: »

You would think you got nothing from the us.

What about your parking space, the building you work in. The heating to keep you warm in the winter. Your staff room. Furniture. Your salary. And lets not forget, toilet roll.

You mean mostly the basics expected by any employee of any employer. You sound like one of these "I PAY YOUR WAGE, YOU WORK FOR ME" type, spouted to any public sector worker.

rainbowtrout

JimmyVik wrote: »

You would think you got nothing from the us.

What about your parking space, the building you work in. The heating to keep you warm in the winter. Your staff room. Furniture. Your salary. And lets not forget, toilet roll.



I was all for the teachers and supported them to the last in other threads I posted in, but I gotta say im turning.


I pay twice for the school. Once out of my taxes and once out of the voluntary contribution. Now I am happy enough to pay it up to now, but dont start taking the P and trying to justify it.

Ah, I see this is just an opportunity to bash teachers. Teachers pay taxes too. You make it sound like I should be paying for the furniture in the school myself in order to work there.

And how you've managed to decide that your support for teachers is waning because you have to pay for essentials in a school. Things that a teacher has no control over.

JimmyVik

Ive always defended teachers, but my God they are a venomous bunch on boards.
Listen to yourselves.

The pint here is that taxes pay for schools. Schools have a nice system where they are left short with the taxes and the parents have to make up the shortfall.

This is unfair dont you think.
Also If the voluntary contribution is for toilet roll and whatever else you feel like saying its for, then those costs have not been incurred since March. Well they have, but by the parent at home.
So do you really think its fair for the schools to keep that portion of the voluntary payment, when most parents are struggling at home, even having to buy their own kids toilet paper and art supplies?

Even the insurance companies are giving back money to people.
A bit of fairness is in order here.

This is it

JimmyVik wrote: »

Ive always defended teachers, but my God they are a venomous bunch on boards.
Listen to yourselves.

The pint here is that taxes pay for schools. Schools have a nice system where they are left short with the taxes and the parents have to make up the shortfall.

This is unfair dont you think.
Also If the voluntary contribution is for toilet roll and whatever else you feel like saying its for, then those costs have not been incurred since March. Well they have, but by the parent at home.
So do you really think its fair for the schools to keep that portion of the voluntary payment, when most parents are struggling at home, even having to buy their own kids toilet paper and art supplies?

Even the insurance companies are giving back money to people.
A bit of fairness is in order here.

A nice system? They're left short and have to make it up in some way or kids have to go without. Constant begging from the local community is not "a nice system". This isn't the school or teachers fault, it's Joe McHugh and those before him.

If you need the money, request a partial refund.

You're making this about teachers when it is them who often have to dip into their own pockets to pay for supplies for someone else's kids, never mind their own. They refuse to do that and your child goes without, that's the bottom line. "Voluntary" contributions are not just wanted, they're essential to the running of most schools I would think, which is unfortunate.

rainbowtrout

JimmyVik wrote: »

Ive always defended teachers, but my God they are a venomous bunch on boards.
Listen to yourselves.

The pint here is that taxes pay for schools. Schools have a nice system where they are left short with the taxes and the parents have to make up the shortfall.

This is unfair dont you think.
Also If the voluntary contribution is for toilet roll and whatever else you feel like saying its for, then those costs have not been incurred since March. Well they have, but by the parent at home.
So do you really think its fair for the schools to keep that portion of the voluntary payment, when most parents are struggling at home, even having to buy their own kids toilet paper and art supplies?

Even the insurance companies are giving back money to people.
A bit of fairness is in order here.

No teacher said it was fair, they all just told you what it was used for. That's not suggesting that it was fair at all.

As was said to you on the other thread, why don't you lobby your local TDs and ask them for increased budgets for schools to pay for essentials?

It was also pointed out to you that a school might give a refund now for the last part of this school year but there will be increased costs next year for hand sanitizer, soap, cleaning products, don't expect that costs will go down, because they won't. Again, all of this is beyond teachers control.

JimmyVik

This is it wrote: »

If you need the money, request a partial refund.

See., There is the problem.
Same old single people out tactics that they use to extract the money through embarrassment of parents and children.


Do you seriously see nothing wrong with this carry on?