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When will NDLS be reopening? (open 8 June 2020)

  • 11-05-2020 10:56am
    #1
    username?!
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 521 ✭✭✭


    I'm looking to get a category added to my license and can't do it online as I've no GOVid and that is all closed up.

    Whats the best guess of when the NDLS might be opening up again?


Comments

  • #2
    splinter65
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,420 ✭✭✭splinter65


    username?! wrote: »
    I'm looking to get a category added to my license and can't do it online as I've no GOVid and that is all closed up.

    Whats the best guess of when the NDLS might be opening up again?

    Not until August at the earliest.


  • #3
    Kopparberg Strawberry and Lime
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,964 ✭✭✭Kopparberg Strawberry and Lime


    splinter65 wrote: »
    Not until August at the earliest.

    Anything to prove this or just speculating ?


  • #4
    splinter65
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,420 ✭✭✭splinter65


    Kopparberg Strawberry and Lime wrote: »
    Anything to prove this or just speculating ?

    https://www.ndls.ie/news/156-important-notice-for-customers-attending-an-ndls-centre.html

    Go to the Q and A.


  • #5
    Kopparberg Strawberry and Lime
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,964 ✭✭✭Kopparberg Strawberry and Lime


    splinter65 wrote: »
    https://www.ndls.ie/news/156-important-notice-for-customers-attending-an-ndls-centre.html

    Go to the Q and A.

    All it says is that it's being reviewed and they'll post updates on the websites and in line with RSA website too.

    No dates mentioned for reopening of the centers


  • #6
    username?!
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 521 ✭✭✭username?!


    splinter65 wrote: »
    Not until August at the earliest.

    I'm really hoping thats not the case and to be honest, I would be shocked if it was tht long.


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  • #7
    splinter65
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,420 ✭✭✭splinter65


    Kopparberg Strawberry and Lime wrote: »
    All it says is that it's being reviewed and they'll post updates on the websites and in line with RSA website too.

    No dates mentioned for reopening of the centers

    There’s no dates mentioned because they genuinely have absolutely no idea when offices like this will be in a position to reopen.
    The fact that right now you can consider that if your licence is due to expire anytime between now and the last day of June that it is extended for 4 months ( bringing some drivers/learners up to Halloween) will give you an idea of how far off a reopening possibly is.
    The fact that a lot of people can actually renew because they are registered on MyGov.ie means that it’s only a % who can’t.
    I work in a public semi state office which has been closed to the public since March 13 and was told today that the very earliest we will be opening is after June 29th.
    Until then we’re doing our best with customers over the phone and by email but it’s very stressful for both staff and customers.
    It’s the risk to the customers that’s the problem.


  • #8
    galwaytt
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,822 ✭✭✭✭galwaytt


    ...I think we might be on the cusp of what happened here in 1979 or in the last month in the US: a licence amnesty.....

    Ode To The Motorist

    “And my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, generates funds to the exchequer. You don't want to acknowledge that as truth because, deep down in places you don't talk about at the Green Party, you want me on that road, you need me on that road. We use words like freedom, enjoyment, sport and community. We use these words as the backbone of a life spent instilling those values in our families and loved ones. You use them as a punch line. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the tax revenue and the very freedom to spend it that I provide, and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said "thank you" and went on your way. Otherwise I suggest you pick up a bus pass and get the ********* ********* off the road” 



  • #9
    MascotDec85
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,924 ✭✭✭MascotDec85


    galwaytt wrote: »
    ...I think we might be on the cusp of what happened here in 1979 or in the last month in the US: a licence amnesty.....

    I’d be utterly, utterly amazed, given the progress that’s been made on road safety in the last 20 years or so, that they’d go backwards to the extent of what occurred in 1979.


  • #10
    galwaytt
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,822 ✭✭✭✭galwaytt


    MascotDec85 wrote: »
    I’d be utterly, utterly amazed, given the progress that’s been made on road safety in the last 20 years or so, that they’d go backwards to the extent of what occurred in 1979.

    Considering they do 100k tests a year, then by August they'd have a backlog which, coupled with continued demand for tests at the same time, is YEARS to clear.

    And when a Learner Permit is only good for 2 years, it'd mean effectively that you would not expect to get a test date inside the vailidity period of your LP. This is untenable, and something will have to give.

    They could get ADI's to do them under contract, which'd help.

    And for motorbike tests there is no reason why they're cancelled at all: they don't even share a vehicle, and communication is by radio.

    Ode To The Motorist

    “And my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, generates funds to the exchequer. You don't want to acknowledge that as truth because, deep down in places you don't talk about at the Green Party, you want me on that road, you need me on that road. We use words like freedom, enjoyment, sport and community. We use these words as the backbone of a life spent instilling those values in our families and loved ones. You use them as a punch line. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the tax revenue and the very freedom to spend it that I provide, and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said "thank you" and went on your way. Otherwise I suggest you pick up a bus pass and get the ********* ********* off the road” 



  • #11
    MascotDec85
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,924 ✭✭✭MascotDec85


    galwaytt wrote: »
    Considering they do 100k tests a year, then by August they'd have a backlog which, coupled with continued demand for tests at the same time, is YEARS to clear.

    And when a Learner Permit is only good for 2 years, it'd mean effectively that you would not expect to get a test date inside the vailidity period of your LP. This is untenable, and something will have to give.

    They could get ADI's to do them under contract, which'd help.

    And for motorbike tests there is no reason why they're cancelled at all: they don't even share a vehicle, and communication is by radio.

    Time will tell but I cannot imagine they’ll hand out licences like sweets. Also, If ADIs were to be contracted to do tests (another thing I doubt will happen due to training requirements etc) who is going to teach the pupils who will want those tests?


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  • #12
    cherryghost
    Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 17,137 Mod ✭✭✭✭cherryghost


    MascotDec85 wrote: »
    Time will tell but I cannot imagine they’ll hand out licences like sweets. Also, I’ve ADIs were to be contracted to do tests (another thing I doubt will happen due to training requirements etc) who is going to teach the pupils who will want those tests?

    I've my mandatory lessons done and then some, but I wouldnt feel deserving of taking a licence on the free anyway.

    That being said, if delays of tests go well into next year, I'm well and truly fecked tbh. Already had a bad time the past 2 months walking hours a day to get essentials for my family.


  • #13
    galwaytt
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,822 ✭✭✭✭galwaytt


    MascotDec85 wrote: »
    Time will tell but I cannot imagine they’ll hand out licences like sweets. Also, If ADIs were to be contracted to do tests (another thing I doubt will happen due to training requirements etc) who is going to teach the pupils who will want those tests?

    There are far more ADI's than testers, and they're not all busy all the time. I daresay given the opportunity, even on a contract basis, you'd see ADI's find a way to do it............

    Ode To The Motorist

    “And my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, generates funds to the exchequer. You don't want to acknowledge that as truth because, deep down in places you don't talk about at the Green Party, you want me on that road, you need me on that road. We use words like freedom, enjoyment, sport and community. We use these words as the backbone of a life spent instilling those values in our families and loved ones. You use them as a punch line. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the tax revenue and the very freedom to spend it that I provide, and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said "thank you" and went on your way. Otherwise I suggest you pick up a bus pass and get the ********* ********* off the road” 



  • #14
    MascotDec85
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,924 ✭✭✭MascotDec85


    galwaytt wrote: »
    There are far more ADI's than testers, and they're not all busy all the time. I daresay given the opportunity, even on a contract basis, you'd see ADI's find a way to do it............

    You can’t double job. It would be a clear conflict of interest. If an ADI was to become a temporary or permanent tester they’d have to surrender their ADI Permit and remove their names from any driving school they’re connected with.


  • #15
    galwaytt
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,822 ✭✭✭✭galwaytt


    MascotDec85 wrote: »
    You can’t double job. It would be a clear conflict of interest. If an ADI was to become a temporary or permanent tester they’d have to surrender their ADI Permit and remove their names from any driving school they’re connected with.

    Oh I agree, I think if an ADI was to get a contract, it would have to be on the basis of not doing any instruction for the duration of any contract. More, they'd also be precluded from testing anyone they'd done EDT for.

    Or, maybe it's time to revisit the way we test in the first place, and allow some private contractors to do same as standard - kind of the National Treatment Purchase Fund........but for driving.

    Ode To The Motorist

    “And my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, generates funds to the exchequer. You don't want to acknowledge that as truth because, deep down in places you don't talk about at the Green Party, you want me on that road, you need me on that road. We use words like freedom, enjoyment, sport and community. We use these words as the backbone of a life spent instilling those values in our families and loved ones. You use them as a punch line. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the tax revenue and the very freedom to spend it that I provide, and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said "thank you" and went on your way. Otherwise I suggest you pick up a bus pass and get the ********* ********* off the road” 



  • #16
    challengemaster
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,930 ✭✭✭✭challengemaster


    MascotDec85 wrote: »
    You can’t double job. It would be a clear conflict of interest. If an ADI was to become a temporary or permanent tester they’d have to surrender their ADI Permit and remove their names from any driving school they’re connected with.

    It would only be conflict of interest if you had to test your own student. Since ADI's are the ones logging students lessons and there is a clear tangible connection down on paper, it in theory would be quite simple to exclude the ADI who signed off on lessons from the list of assignable testers for that student.


  • #17
    MascotDec85
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,924 ✭✭✭MascotDec85


    challengemaster wrote: »
    It would only be conflict of interest if you had to test your own student. Since ADI's are the ones logging students lessons and there is a clear tangible connection down on paper, it in theory would be quite simple to exclude the ADI who signed off on lessons from the list of assignable testers for that student.

    Former instructors who have moved over to become testers have to relinquish all ties with driving schools. Their names can’t appear on any websites connected with driving schools.
    I don’t make the rules, I’m just explaining how it’s not so easy on the surface as people might think. You’d be mental to close your business down entirely for what would be a temporary position. Prelockdown wait times were at the lowest level I’ve ever witnessed in the 10 years I’m instructing. Arguably, there were too many testers.


  • #18
    galwaytt
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,822 ✭✭✭✭galwaytt


    MascotDec85 wrote: »
    Former instructors who have moved over to become testers have to relinquish all ties with driving schools. Their names can’t appear on any websites connected with driving schools.
    I don’t make the rules, I’m just explaining how it’s not so easy on the surface as people might think. You’d be mental to close your business down entirely for what would be a temporary position. Prelockdown wait times were at the lowest level I’ve ever witnessed in the 10 years I’m instructing. Arguably, there were too many testers.

    I think saying it's not as easy as you think is the very mindset problem: it is easy. It's the reluctance of the State machine to change.

    And, while closing down one's business may be 'mental' - only for some. I'm sure there are ADI's out there who may have done enough professionally for whom testing would be good option. Nobody stopping ADI's from NOT staying at it - but we shouldn't preclude others.

    As for waiting times, you may be correct for some classes, but the Cat A one is going to be awkward for a while methinks.

    Ode To The Motorist

    “And my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, generates funds to the exchequer. You don't want to acknowledge that as truth because, deep down in places you don't talk about at the Green Party, you want me on that road, you need me on that road. We use words like freedom, enjoyment, sport and community. We use these words as the backbone of a life spent instilling those values in our families and loved ones. You use them as a punch line. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the tax revenue and the very freedom to spend it that I provide, and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said "thank you" and went on your way. Otherwise I suggest you pick up a bus pass and get the ********* ********* off the road” 



  • #19
    MascotDec85
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,924 ✭✭✭MascotDec85


    galwaytt wrote: »
    I think saying it's not as easy as you think is the very mindset problem: it is easy. It's the reluctance of the State machine to change.

    And, while closing down one's business may be 'mental' - only for some. I'm sure there are ADI's out there who may have done enough professionally for whom testing would be good option. Nobody stopping ADI's from NOT staying at it - but we shouldn't preclude others.

    As for waiting times, you may be correct for some classes, but the Cat A one is going to be awkward for a while methinks.

    Pre-covid the likelihood of testers contracts not being renewed was fairly high due to the fact the waiting list was so low. All overtime was stopped and testers weren’t doing their full quota each day.
    When the RSA took on new testers they weren’t long about reducing the waiting time in my area, eg from 16-18 weeks down to around 4.
    Whilst I agree there’s nothing stopping an ADI moving over, I’m saying, that given the probable temporary nature of the position, they’d be mental to do it. Of course, some might not have a particularly strong business but essentially they’d be calling a day for a temporary job!


  • #20
    challengemaster
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,930 ✭✭✭✭challengemaster


    MascotDec85 wrote: »
    Former instructors who have moved over to become testers have to relinquish all ties with driving schools. Their names can’t appear on any websites connected with driving schools.
    I don’t make the rules, I’m just explaining how it’s not so easy on the surface as people might think. You’d be mental to close your business down entirely for what would be a temporary position. Prelockdown wait times were at the lowest level I’ve ever witnessed in the 10 years I’m instructing. Arguably, there were too many testers.

    I don't see why that couldn't temporarily be exempted as a rule while things get back under control and back to normality. Like I said, as long as you're not testing your own student (or lets say your own driving schools student, for wider coverage) then there isn't any conflict.


  • #21
    Kopparberg Strawberry and Lime
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,964 ✭✭✭Kopparberg Strawberry and Lime


    challengemaster wrote: »
    I don't see why that couldn't temporarily be exempted as a rule while things get back under control and back to normality. Like I said, as long as you're not testing your own student (or lets say your own driving schools student, for wider coverage) then there isn't any conflict.

    Because it's not just a case of passing your own students or students that use your company because you know them from lessons etc.

    It's also any students that might have left an instructor for a different company or instructor and getting failed because they did so.

    Or even if an instructor student had a disagreement from previous or they happen to know each other from other sectors like a coffee shop etc.

    There's too much conflicting interests basically.


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  • #22
    challengemaster
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,930 ✭✭✭✭challengemaster


    Kopparberg Strawberry and Lime wrote: »
    It's also any students that might have left an instructor for a different company or instructor and getting failed because they did so.
    You seem to have missed my suggestion where you use the readily available documentation with ADIs listed on it to exclude them as potential testers.
    Or even if an instructor student had a disagreement from previous or they happen to know each other from other sectors like a coffee shop etc.

    There's too much conflicting interests basically.

    But by that logic we should be importing testers from out of state, people with no ties to anyone or anything. It's a ridiculous fallacy.
    A “conflict of interest” exists when a person has a duty to more than one person or organization, and doing so causes an adverse outcome to the interest of another. In short, it’s a situation where doing what is best for two people you have a legal duty to (or have a personal interest with) is impossible because the interest of one opposes another.

    It's also still not a conflict of interest.


  • #23
    Taylor365
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,994 ✭✭✭Taylor365


    What about bike tests? That's social distancing at its heart!


  • #24
    MascotDec85
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,924 ✭✭✭MascotDec85


    challengemaster wrote: »
    You seem to have missed my suggestion where you use the readily available documentation with ADIs listed on it to exclude them as testers

    Countless pupils do EDT with one or more ADI then go to a completely different tester for tester preparation. The ADI who prepares them for test will have no paper trail to that test candidate whatsoever because they’ve not had to upload EDT info.

    At the end of the day, if the RSA think they need more testers they’ll recruit them on temporary contracts. It’s a time consuming process between application, interview, selection and training. ADIs will not be testing on an ad hoc basis.


  • #25
    biko
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 81,220 ✭✭✭✭biko


    The National Driver Licence Service (NDLS), the Driver Theory Test (DTT), and the National Car Testing Service (NCTS)
    will begin re-opening on a gradual basis from Monday 8 June.

    The re-opening of these services is being done in line with the National Return to Work Safely Protocol agreed by
    employer and worker representatives.


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