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AntiBody Testing

  • 05-05-2020 11:51am
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 1,338 ✭✭✭ Eire Go Brach


    Anyone know of any antibody testing in Ireland?

    Just wondering when it will be available to public or even privately.
    I had all the symptoms but very mild. It would be nice to know for sure.


«13

Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 5,298 ✭✭✭ JTMan


    The Tropical Medicines Board offer a Coronavirus Antibody Test. Details here.

    Superdrug offer a Coronavirus Antibody Test too which I guess you could order via Parcel Motel/Parcel Wizard but it is currently sold out.

    In a few weeks, Coronavirus Antibody Test should get much easier to order online.

    Hopefully there will be a common standard for immunity passports soon too. Interesting FT article (paywall) on this today.

    Has anyone done a Coronavirus Antibody Test?


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,893 ✭✭✭ afatbollix


    A few in work have had them done.

    My boss had one when we started lockdown. He's had a cough for months paid privately for it in London £350 at the time. Came back negative, He was gutted as he wanted to travel again.

    I'm part of a study in the UK with a uni, I had a swab test done about 2 weeks ago (Neg), They are going to do the antibody one next at some point.

    You can order them online, Make sure they are a Abbott or Roche one.


  • Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 12,888 Mod ✭✭✭✭ iguana


    afatbollix wrote: »
    You can order them online, Make sure they are a Abbott or Roche one.

    You can order them online but you have to get the vial of blood back to the clinic in Britain, so I don't think it's very doable just yet. I'm honestly chomping at the bit to get it done. I'm having one of those months long illnesses that many covid cases are reporting and in terms of getting medical advice going forward as this illness/recovery just drags and drags on, I really, really want to know what I have. It's really head wrecking to be sick for ages with no actual diagnosis.


  • Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 12,888 Mod ✭✭✭✭ iguana


    afatbollix wrote: »
    My boss had one when we started lockdown. He's had a cough for months paid privately for it in London £350 at the time. Came back negative, He was gutted as he wanted to travel again.

    There weren't antibody tests yet at that time. Did he have a private PCR test for active virus? Because even if he had a cough, if he had been having symptoms for months he'd have been extremely unlikely to have had detectable virus in a swab at that point. If the cough was caused by Covid infection, months on it would have been something like post-viral chestwall inflammation causing the cough. Though he really should get it checked out as it could be much more serious.


  • Registered Users Posts: 375 ✭✭ dennispenn


    afatbollix wrote: »
    A few in work have had them done.

    My boss had one when we started lockdown. He's had a cough for months paid privately for it in London £350 at the time. Came back negative, He was gutted as he wanted to travel again.

    I'm part of a study in the UK with a uni, I had a swab test done about 2 weeks ago (Neg), They are going to do the antibody one next at some point.

    You can order them online, Make sure they are a Abbott or Roche one.

    a swab test? arent they said to be pretty innacurate?


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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,893 ✭✭✭ afatbollix


    The swab test is for if you have Covid at that time. It was to see if I had it at that time of the test if I had the virus with no or mild symptoms. They did 20k over a weekend. The result was that 1 in 400 had the virus at the time of the swab.

    About my boss, Ya it was the German one. The man has too much money and as I said it was negative.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,574 ✭✭✭ yosemitesam1


    https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.05.21.108308v1

    Just blood testing for antibodies could be underestimating the total amount of people exposed.
    Interestingly,
    however, we found evidence of S protein-specific IgA and IgG at mucosal sites of
    individuals with mild COVID-19. There, mucosal S protein-specific IgG levels
    appeared to mirror the systemic, i.e. serum, titers of these antibodies. Mucosal S
    protein-specific IgA levels, however, were even detectable at several mucosal sites of
    about 15–20% S protein-seronegative individuals. Interestingly, mucosal S protein-
    specific IgA levels correlated inversely with patient age.


  • Registered Users Posts: 9,465 ✭✭✭ YFlyer


    [quote="afatbollix;113540691

    You can order them online, Make sure they are a Abbott or Roche one.[/quote]

    You'll trust those test?


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,298 ✭✭✭ JTMan


    YFlyer wrote: »
    You'll trust those test?

    Yes.

    As per CNBC and others: "Researchers at the University of Washington School of Medicine found Abbott’s test had a specificity rate of 99.9% and a sensitivity rate of 100%, suggesting very few chances of incorrectly diagnosing a healthy person with the infection and no false negatives."


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,508 ✭✭✭ Martina1991


    afatbollix wrote: »
    A few in work have had them done.

    My boss had one when we started lockdown. He's had a cough for months paid privately for it in London £350 at the time. Came back negative, He was gutted as he wanted to travel again.

    I'm part of a study in the UK with a uni, I had a swab test done about 2 weeks ago (Neg), They are going to do the antibody one next at some point.

    You can order them online, Make sure they are a Abbott or Roche one.

    Antibody tests weren't available at the start of lockdown, not reliable ones anyway. Do you mean they had swabs done for PCR analysis?

    You can't buy Abbott or Roche antibiody tests. Those ones are only performed in laboratories.

    Be very wary of paying a lot of money for a test that may be unreliable. The FDA have already pulled 17 antibody tests off the market that had emergency authorisation use.

    https://www.labroots.com/trending/microbiology/17696/fda-yanks-covid-19-antibody-tests-market?fbclid=IwAR2mndAIP0Kbd_ASglUsQLLW_fpLp1lay1zXota148UdqnYZrUSHZUO5LJk


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  • Registered Users Posts: 5,298 ✭✭✭ JTMan


    JTMan wrote: »
    The Tropical Medicines Board offer a Coronavirus Antibody Test. Details here.

    I phoned the The Tropical Medicines Board today to get a test and they pointed me towards travelshop.ie but it is sold out on travelshop.ie.

    The Tropical Medicines Board then told me that their Dun Laoighre clinic does physical appointments but I can't get out there by day.

    Does anyone know of any GP's who are providing this test?


  • Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 12,888 Mod ✭✭✭✭ iguana


    JTMan wrote: »
    I phoned the The Tropical Medicines Board today to get a test and they pointed me towards travelshop.ie but it is sold out on travelshop.ie

    That sounds kind of dodgy? I looked at the TMB site last night and it mentioned Abbott tests on the self test kits page but today that's gone. There is no mention of what test it is on the clinic test page. They also say the blood is taken away to be analysed but that could just mean they are using a cassette test not proper ELISA testing. If it's a proper test, I'd also be interested in how they take the sample in the clinic. Is it finger prick or from a draw from a vein? I've read speculation that blood taken from a vein is more accurate than from a finger prick. I'm not sure if that's accurate or people mixing up finger prick cassette tests and taking a blood sample for an ELISA test from the finger, but it seems to me that taking a proper blood draw would be more accurate than pricking your finger and then squeezing drips of blood into a vial.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,454 ✭✭✭ Beanybabog


    iguana wrote: »
    That sounds kind of dodgy? I looked at the TMB site last night and it mentioned Abbott tests on the self test kits page but today that's gone. There is no mention of what test it is on the clinic test page. They also say the blood is taken away to be analysed but that could just mean they are using a cassette test not proper ELISA testing. If it's a proper test, I'd also be interested in how they take the sample in the clinic. Is it finger prick or from a draw from a vein? I've read speculation that blood taken from a vein is more accurate than from a finger prick. I'm not sure if that's accurate or people mixing up finger prick cassette tests and taking a blood sample for an ELISA test from the finger, but it seems to me that taking a proper blood draw would be more accurate than pricking your finger and then squeezing drips of blood into a vial.

    I just logged on here to look for this link- someone posted a link to the TMB today and it was the first I heard of the tests- it definitely had home test on the website earlier today and now it’s gone. Still in their price lists though


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,434 ✭✭✭ mandrake04


    Just been following this thread, personally having previously worked for several years as a technical instrumentation specialist on immunoassay platforms such as Architect i and Centaur and I would be extremely sceptical of any of these rapid self tests. Anything that is using freeze dried reagent or some sort of chemical reaction on a fibrous pad with full blood at this stage of the game is a load of crap.

    Most accurate lab immunoassay instruments are in a Serum work environment, the blood is centrifuged down so the heavier impurities are at the bottom of the gel cake and you test the serum on the top.

    I will use an analogy that full blood is like crude oil, it needs to be refined before it’s suitable to used in a high octane performance car.

    Further to that any blood sample worth its salt is taken by a Phlebotomist and sent to a lab by time & temperature controlled methods. Sending by post -nah ...maybe an ancestry saliva test but not a blood test.


    The likes of the Abbott and Roche tests are roughly around €150 to €200 per 100 test kit, the cost price of these tests to a lab is maybe double that when you factor in additional reaction vessels, tips and reagents maybe triple it when you factor in staff and instrumentation. At the most an antibody test should cost no more than €5-€10 tops.

    Paying stupid money for substandard rubbish, fools are easily parted with their money.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,130 ✭✭✭ Del Griffith


    mandrake04 wrote: »
    Just been following this thread, personally having previously worked for several years as a technical instrumentation specialist on immunoassay platforms such as Architect i and Centaur and I would be extremely sceptical of any of these rapid self tests. Anything that is using freeze dried reagent or some sort of chemical reaction on a fibrous pad with full blood at this stage of the game is a load of crap.

    Most accurate lab immunoassay instruments are in a Serum work environment, the blood is centrifuged down so the heavier impurities are at the bottom of the gel cake and you test the serum on the top.

    I will use an analogy that full blood is like crude oil, it needs to be refined before it’s suitable to used in a high octane performance car.

    Further to that any blood sample worth its salt is taken by a Phlebotomist and sent to a lab by time & temperature controlled methods. Sending by post -nah ...maybe an ancestry saliva test but not a blood test.


    The likes of the Abbott and Roche tests are roughly around €150 to €200 per 100 test kit, the cost price of these tests to a lab is maybe double that when you factor in additional reaction vessels, tips and reagents maybe triple it when you factor in staff and instrumentation. At the most an antibody test should cost no more than €5-€10 tops.

    Paying stupid money for substandard rubbish, fools are easily parted with their money.

    Pity, I was starting to ger curious there.


  • Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 12,888 Mod ✭✭✭✭ iguana


    mandrake04 wrote: »
    The likes of the Abbott and Roche tests are roughly around €150 to €200 per 100 test kit, the cost price of these tests to a lab is maybe double that when you factor in additional reaction vessels, tips and reagents maybe triple it when you factor in staff and instrumentation. At the most an antibody test should cost no more than €5-€10 tops.

    Surely you'd also have to add the cost of a nurse to take the blood sample also? Afaik, Abbott tests cost around £70-100 in the UK but that's with a finger prick blood sample.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,434 ✭✭✭ mandrake04


    iguana wrote: »
    Surely you'd also have to add the cost of a nurse to take the blood sample also? Afaik, Abbott tests cost around £70-100 in the UK but that's with a finger prick blood sample.

    Why would you need a nurse to take a finger prick sample? in case you faint?

    My costs were at a bare minimum public hospital minimum cost of test materials (including cost of instrument) and scientists as the lab is running high volume of tests and in that the nurse takes bloods as routine the cost per test is actually low, private hospital and commercial labs etc can charge what they want all I’m saying is that once you factor in the equipment, reagents, materials etc it’s not that expensive. Wouldn’t be any more than €5-€10 for a single test, you go to emergency and and they run a full panel of maybe 40 different chemistry, immunoassay and blood gas tests it does cost money but I’m talking about 1 single test which I know is base cost €1.50-€2

    Those Abbott tests are probably prick your finger and fill a vial and send it off to a lab, that test is only as good as the sample provided which is blood exposed to air and bled into a vial and posted off. This is a lot different to a blood test collected in a Vacutainer SST transported at controlled temperature promptly which would give a far better quality of sample.

    Then there’s the rapid tests, which are like drip blood into a little window and if the is a pink line in the other window it’s positive. Aside from peoples blood can vary and then might contain certain inhibitors, the test itself is probably at best room temperature which is not the optimal temperature and most instrument based tests are 37C which is the best temperature for running these tests.

    There’s a lot of variables that can affect testing, I think people very gullible they google this shit and think they know what they are talking about.


  • Registered Users Posts: 9,149 ✭✭✭ normanoffside


    Just booked the Anti-body test with the TMB in Dunlaogahire for Thursday.
    Will report back


  • Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 12,888 Mod ✭✭✭✭ iguana


    mandrake04 wrote: »
    Why would you need a nurse to take a finger prick sample? in case you faint?
    No, to take a proper blood draw from a vein as is the norm for every blood test I've ever had. Then have it stored properly until it is quite quickly transported to the lab under proper conditions.
    mandrake04 wrote: »
    Those Abbott tests are probably prick your finger and fill a vial and send it off to a lab, that test is only as good as the sample provided which is blood exposed to air and bled into a vial and posted off. This is a lot different to a blood test collected in a Vacutainer SST transported at controlled temperature promptly which would give a far better quality of sample.
    Because of this. In my layperson's opinion, I kind of assumed that taking a blood sample by pricking your finger and then dripping it into vial by squeezing drops of blood out of your finger would not produce a very good sample. That's before you even parcel it and send it off in the post. Tests like the Roche and Abbott tests are lauded for their sensitivity so it didn't make sense to me that you'd pay for a sensitive test and send off a kind of dodgy blood sample. I'm on a couple of online groups for people who are having a long illness at present and I've noticed a very clear trend of people getting negative results with finger prick Abbott tests and positive results for people who get a get a proper blood draw, sometimes the same person.

    I probably would pay over the odds for a correctly done test. A proper blood draw by a trained person, transport of the blood to the lab and an ELISA test. I know I'd be paying a premium but private clinics only exist in order to make profit. And in these particular circumstances, I don't expect our health service to have to prioritise people like me to knowing exactly what is wrong with us. So if I want to know, I do expect to pay.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,434 ✭✭✭ mandrake04


    iguana wrote: »
    No, to take a proper blood draw from a vein as is the norm for every blood test I've ever had. Then have it stored properly until it is quite quickly transported to the lab under proper conditions.

    Some are nurses and some are trained phlebotomist's, also there are many different tubes the most common is a yellow top SST which is a serum separator tube that has a vacuum that pulls the blood into the tube and it doesn't expose it to the air so the blood doesn't get all glugey and dry out. This is what I recommend rather than a vial.

    other tubes like the little purple top tubes used in hematology are EDTA and have an anticoagulant to preserve the blood, but this is because the tests require full blood.
    iguana wrote: »
    Because of this. In my layperson's opinion, I kind of assumed that taking a blood sample by pricking your finger and then dripping it into vial by squeezing drops of blood out of your finger would not produce a very good sample. That's before you even parcel it and send it off in the post. Tests like the Roche and Abbott tests are lauded for their sensitivity so it didn't make sense to me that you'd pay for a sensitive test and send off a kind of dodgy blood sample. I'm on a couple of online groups for people who are having a long illness at present and I've noticed a very clear trend of people getting negative results with finger prick Abbott tests and positive results for people who get a get a proper blood draw, sometimes the same person.

    I probably would pay over the odds for a correctly done test. A proper blood draw by a trained person, transport of the blood to the lab and an ELISA test. I know I'd be paying a premium but private clinics only exist in order to make profit. And in these particular circumstances, I don't expect our health service to have to prioritise people like me to knowing exactly what is wrong with us. So if I want to know, I do expect to pay.

    Abbott Architect i uses Chemiluminescence and Roche use ElectroChemiLuminescence, ELISA is a completely different process.

    Sure I understand why you want to get tested, and prepared to pay but there are many substandard tests. You could try a lab like Medlab in Stillorgan see what they are offering? you might just need a GP referral and pay for them to test.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,148 ✭✭✭ amadangomor


    Just booked the Anti-body test with the TMB in Dunlaogahire for Thursday.
    Will report back

    Please do. I was a suspected case in March but wasn't tested due to lack of capacity/fever requirement. Would be interested.

    Have a chest x ray coming up as still have respiratory issues because of whatever infection it was.


  • Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 12,888 Mod ✭✭✭✭ iguana


    Have a chest x ray coming up as still have respiratory issues because of whatever infection it was.

    Good luck with your chest X-ray, did you have blood tests to check for a secondary bacterial infection or clotting? I had those taken on the same day as the chest x-ray, so it might be an idea to enquire about them to rule out any serious causes of ongoing symptoms. Mine were all clear when I had mine. I have a diagnosis of costochondritis and right lung pleurisy, both of which are types of chestwall inflammation. I also have a little hayfever at the moment which I've never noticed before but it can be common to have worsened hayfever soon after a respiratory infection. So hopefully your issues are caused by similar. It's frustrating and boring though.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,148 ✭✭✭ amadangomor


    iguana wrote: »
    Good luck with your chest X-ray, did you have blood tests to check for a secondary bacterial infection or clotting? I had those taken on the same day as the chest x-ray, so it might be an idea to enquire about them to rule out any serious causes of ongoing symptoms. Mine were all clear when I had mine. I have a diagnosis of costochondritis and right lung pleurisy, both of which are types of chestwall inflammation. I also have a little hayfever at the moment which I've never noticed before but it can be common to have worsened hayfever soon after a respiratory infection. So hopefully your issues are caused by similar. It's frustrating and boring though.

    Was put on antibiotics as precaution against secondary bacterial infection. Good luck. Yours seems bad.

    Whatever I had induced asthma. Didn't have asthma before.
    (Maybe undiagnosed sports induced as I would get out of breath when playing sports as a kid but just thought it was me being unfit.)

    Asthma is still there slightly but no breathlessness in a good while.


  • Registered Users Posts: 9,149 ✭✭✭ normanoffside


    Please do. I was a suspected case in March but wasn't tested due to lack of capacity/fever requirement. Would be interested.

    Have a chest x ray coming up as still have respiratory issues because of whatever infection it was.

    Ditto, my test was also cancelled in March due to the backlog although I didn't have severe symptoms.
    Will be good to know If I had it, would allow me to visit my parents.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,508 ✭✭✭ Martina1991


    The renowned Mayo Clinic are reviewing many antibody tests. Unsurprisingly a lot of them are shíte.

    Don't buy tests off the internet.

    https://abcnews.go.com/US/mayo-clinic-doctors-find-covid-19-antibody-tests/story?id=70803740


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 379 ✭✭ Mike3287


    The renowned Mayo Clinic are reviewing many antibody tests. Unsurprisingly a lot of them are shíte.

    Don't buy tests off the internet.

    https://abcnews.go.com/US/mayo-clinic-doctors-find-covid-19-antibody-tests/story?id=70803740

    Bit like the actual tests then

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/news.sky.com/story/amp/coronavirus-tanzania-testing-kits-questioned-after-goat-and-papaya-test-positive-11982864


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,508 ✭✭✭ Martina1991


    Mike3287 wrote:
    Bit like the actual tests then

    That doesn't say what platform they used and since Tanzania is a poor country i doubt they were using advanced molecular methods like we are. Possibly small, cheaper rapid ones.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 379 ✭✭ Mike3287


    That doesn't say what platform they used and since Tanzania is a poor country i doubt they were using advanced molecular methods like we are. Possibly small, cheaper rapid ones.

    Isn't that the point?


  • Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 12,888 Mod ✭✭✭✭ iguana


    The Medicines and Healthcare products Regulatory Authority in the UK is stopping the use of tests done with fingerprick samples due to the likely inaccuracies from them.

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/may/27/english-retailers-told-halt-coronavirus-home-antibody-test-deliveries


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  • Registered Users Posts: 9,149 ✭✭✭ normanoffside


    Just booked the Anti-body test with the TMB in Dunlaogahire for Thursday.
    Will report back

    Just got the test done this morning. Took 15 minutes.
    It’s the Abbott test and if positive for antibodies it’s 100%. There are 5% false negatives.

    Will have results in a few days. Here’s hoping for a positive.


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