Top Irish Lawyer to be charged...

Rows Grower

With stealing 400 euro from a clients ATM account.

Strange carry on...

https://www.herald.ie/news/top-lawyer-to-face-charge-of-stealing-400-from-clients-bank-card-at-atm-39122977.html

Rodney Bathgate

A pretty dodgy profession.

Rows Grower

There's dodgy and there's outright professional misconduct, this sounds a bit more than dodgy.

Chalk McHugh

His client broke one of the golden rules of life; never give anyone your bank card and PIN number. And why did it take him years to realise the deceipt? Silly carry but if the lawyer is guilty as charged he'll probably get a small punishment. Cant see him having a holiday in Mountjoy. Bizarre stuff.

nthclare

The bar always defends the bar .

listermint

It's there a league table....

Danzy

Lots of dodgy lawyers out there, not just exceptional cases.

Shouldn't he be chasing ambulances or defending the valour of a pond rat with over 100 convictions?

No moral scruples.

Ticking and Bashing

It's strange to hand over your ATM card and your PIN and not to review the transactions afterwards to double check that the appropriate withdrawal was made.

Rows Grower

Chalk McHugh wrote: »

His client broke one of the golden rules of life; never give anyone your bank card and PIN number. And why did it take him months to realise the deceipt? Silly carry but if the lawyer is guilty as charged he'll probably get a small punishment. Cant see him having a hokiday in Mountjoy. Bizarre stuff.

His small punishment will include loss of earnings that will amount to millions of euro.

If he is convicted, but seeing as he is one of Irelands top lawyers I can't see the Gardai taking a prosecution unless they had a firm belief they would secure a conviction.

How you can make out the victim is at fault is baffling.

Chalk McHugh

Rows Grower wrote: »

His small punishment will include loss of earnings that will amount to millions of euro.

If he is convicted, but seeing as he is one of Irelands top lawyers I can't see the Gardai taking a prosecution unless they had a firm belief they would secure a conviction.

How you can make out the victim is at fault is baffling.

He's not at fault but shouldn't be handing out his bank card and PIN for anybody. The lawyer, if guilty, is a lowlife scumbag. I have little faith in our judicial system punishing a fat cat like this accordingly.

Rows Grower

Chalk McHugh wrote: »

He's not at fault but shouldn't be handing out his bank card and PIN for anybody. The lawyer, if guilty, is a lowlife scumbag.

There can be a lot of reasons why someone would have to ask someone else to withdraw money for them and some people would be considered more trustworthy than others.

un5byh7sqpd2x0

Ticking and Bashing wrote: »

It's strange to hand over your ATM card and your PIN and not to review the transactions afterwards to double check that the appropriate withdrawal was made.

Perhaps he was incarcerated?

Chalk McHugh

Rows Grower wrote: »

There can be a lot of reasons why someone would have to ask someone else to withdraw money for them and some people would be considered more trustworthy than others.

I wouldn't trust a lawyer as far as i could throw them.

paddy19

"However, as well as withdrawing €200 for the legal matter, the solicitor is also alleged to have taken out an extra €400 which he kept for himself.

I'm shocked, shocked that a member of the legal profession has allegedly ripped off a client ... surly some mistake, confusion or misunderstanding.

The only question that arises is why didn't he stick another €400 onto the bill like the rest of his colleagues..

McCrack

If he pleads or is found guilty the law society will move to strike him off, theft or dishonesty on the part of a solicitor is a big no no

nthclare

Best thing the layer should do is hand back the money and a few thousand on top.

Dragging his reputation through the media and wasting court time etc would be pointless...

Talk about being caught by the bagoullies .

lomb

I think he was just billing him in advance!

Chalk McHugh

No doubt the lawyer will have some excuse to throw some doubt no matter how little into the equation. Lets see how it pans out but i have no faith in a big fat cat lawyer losing his career or millions of euro over this. If guilty he should be locked up even but zero chance of that happening.

Rockbeast2

Walking to ATM
Withdrawing cash.
Returning ATM card.

= €400.00

EDIT: €325.00 + 23% VAT per hour or part thereof.

Time is money, baby! :-)

Rodney Bathgate

nthclare wrote: »

Best thing the layer should do is hand back the money and a few thousand on top.

Dragging his reputation through the media and wasting court time etc would be pointless...

Talk about being caught by the bagoullies .

I doubt we will ever learn this solicitors name.

Chalk McHugh

nthclare wrote: »

The bar always defends the bar .

The bar is pretty low when it comes to the bar defending the bar.

Chalk McHugh

Rockbeast2 wrote: »

Walking to ATM
Withdrawing cash.
Returning ATM card.

= €400.00

Time is money, baby! :-)

Exactly. The Spanish lad didn't realise that was the lawyers fee for walking across the road and having to withdraw money for him. Those manssions in Foxrock they live in dont come cheap. Someones gotta pay for it.

the beer revolu

Barring a barring, I'm not sure the bar will do anything.

Harry Palmr

Surely if someone is found guilty and needs to pay a court fine or fee you simply leave having signed that you will pay and then you go to an ATM or whatever and do so yourself?

Why would you be stopped from doing that? Or was this upstanding solicitor preying on someone who has poor English and got directed by his legal eagle?

Edgware

McCrack wrote: »

If he pleads or is found guilty the law society will move to strike him off, theft or dishonesty on the part of a solicitor is a big no no

Especially when caught

Rows Grower

Rodney Bathgate wrote: »

I doubt we will ever learn this solicitors name.

Oh we will, it will be held in an open court like any other case.

He's only a lawyer, why should he be treated differently to a plumber or a bin man?

Not only must justice be done but it must also be seen to be done.

Brendan Flowers

What's with the clickbait title OP? Are you looking for a job with TheJournal.ie or something?

the beer revolu

Imagine losing your career over €400.
What a dope.

Rows Grower

Brendan Flowers wrote: »

What's with the clickbait title OP? Are you looking for a job with TheJournal.ie or something?

My apologies Brendan, did I waste some of your time?

biko

Some people just can't be trusted.

Marcusm

Rows Grower wrote: »

His small punishment will include loss of earnings that will amount to millions of euro.

If he is convicted, but seeing as he is one of Irelands top lawyers I can't see the Gardai taking a prosecution unless they had a firm belief they would secure a conviction.

How you can make out the victim is at fault is baffling.

Based on the Indo article, he’s a criminal defence solicitor with a practice funded by legal aid. I doubt the guards would avoid an opportunity to charge him.

the beer revolu

Marcusm wrote: »

Based on the Indo article, he’s a criminal defence solicitor with a practice funded by legal aid. I doubt the guards would avoid an opportunity to charge him.

I'd imagine that An Gardaí are mature enough to realise that someone has to defend people on Free Lega Aid and not have a vendetta against those that do.

Zebra3

I'm sure the system will come down hard on him and give him a hard slap on the wrists.

the beer revolu

Zebra3 wrote: »

I'm sure the system will come down hard on him and give him a hard slap on the wrists.

I'd say not many people see prison time for non violent theft of €400.
If found guilty, he will be struck off and will lose his career, and rightly so.
He will suffer more than your average person who nicks €400.

McCrack

the beer revolu wrote: »

I'd imagine that An Gardaí are mature enough to realise that someone has to defend people on Free Lega Aid and not have a vendetta against those that do.

Yes Gardai understand the rights of suspects.. Which includes access to a solicitor, no problem there.. Situation here is perhaps this particular solicitor is not liked and what goes around comes around as they say

mountai

the beer revolu wrote: »

I'd say not many people see prison time for non violent theft of €400.
If found guilty, he will be struck off and will lose his career, and rightly so.
He will suffer more than your average person who nicks €400.

No he wont be struck off . Remember a few years ago , when numerous low life solicitors were found out ripping off clients , who were awarded damages by the tribunal , after suffering horrific violent and sexual abuse ? . These so called "Professionals" were also awarded costs , but not happy with these costs , they plundered the amounts awarded to their clients as well . Of course their "Watchdog" the Law Society , took action , didnt they ??. Not one of them was disbarred .

McCrack

mountai wrote: »

No he wont be struck off . Remember a few years ago , when numerous low life solicitors were found out ripping off clients , who were awarded damages by the tribunal , after suffering horrific violent and sexual abuse ? . These so called "Professionals" were also awarded costs , but not happy with these costs , they plundered the amounts awarded to their clients as well . Of course their "Watchdog" the Law Society , took action , didnt they ??. Not one of them was disbarred .

A conviction of theft particularly against a client will certainly result in an application to the High Court for a strike off

Sleeper12

400 euros sounds too small an amount to take this kind of risk imo

the beer revolu

Sleeper12 wrote: »

400 euros sounds too small an amount to take this kind of risk imo

Probably not really about the money, in the same way wealthy people get caught shop lifting.

the purple tin

Marcusm wrote: »

Based on the Indo article, he’s a criminal defence solicitor with a practice funded by legal aid. I doubt the guards would avoid an opportunity to charge him.

The Gardai might well have it in for him but would it not be the DPP that decides whether or not there is a case to bring to court.

s1ippy

Sleeper12 wrote: »

400 euros sounds too small an amount to take this kind of risk imo

Unless they were doing it repeatedly and just happened to be caught this time.

Collie D

the beer revolu wrote: »

Probably not really about the money, in the same way wealthy people get caught shop lifting.

Yup. There are ***** out there who will steal just for the sake of it regardless of whether whatever they’re stealing is of any use to them.

the purple tin

Collie D wrote: »

Yup. There are ***** out there who will steal just for the sake of it regardless of whether whatever they’re stealing is of any use to them.

He probably gets a buzz from it. It would be a drop in the ocean for him so why else would he do it?

Widdensushi

his wife might have cut his cocaine /hooker allowance

Muahahaha

the beer revolu wrote: »

I'd imagine that An Gardaí are mature enough to realise that someone has to defend people on Free Lega Aid and not have a vendetta against those that do.

That depends, the most successful criminal lawyers are good because they get their clients off, often on technicalities. That can involve a humiliating experience for a Garda in the witness box in front of a judge that they have to deal with for the rest of their careers. Some criminal lawyers hate the Gardai as much as the criminals do.

Be interesting to see what comes of this. Posters will remember Judge Heather Perrin who got 2.5 years in prison for attempting to steal an elderly clients money when she was a solicitor. More recently we had the solicitor caught going into Mountjoy prison with a gram of coke in his wallet, he got off with a fine, didnt lose his career.

CrankyHaus

Considering a lawyer can be caught bringing a bag of coke into a prison, claim someone must have planted it on them, and get away Scot-free , I wouldn't hold my breath.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/courts/district-court/solicitor-caught-with-cocaine-at-mountjoy-to-avoid-conviction-1.3382222?mode=amp

That said Heather Perrin did get a prison sentence for deception of a client to give part of his estate to her children.

https://www.rte.ie/news/2012/1128/355606-heather-perrin-court/

Edgware

Beyond reasonable doubt.
"My client was instructed by the injured party to withdraw 600 euro, 200 to settle the initial bill and 400 to cover future expenses. The injured party is Spanish with limited ability in English. Clearly M'lud wires got crossed with a result in this unfortunate situation. My client , as yourself, attended Clongowes and certainly does not need to be engaging in the theft of such a paltry sum"

Edgware

Muahahaha wrote: »

That depends, the most successful criminal lawyers are good because they get their clients off, often on technicalities. That can involve a humiliating experience for a Garda in the witness box in front of a judge that they have to deal with for the rest of their careers. Some criminal lawyers hate the Gardai as much as the criminals do.

Be interesting to see what comes of this. Posters will remember Judge Heather Perrin who got 2.5 years in prison for attempting to steal an elderly clients money when she was a solicitor. More recently we had the solicitor caught going into Mountjoy prison with a gram of coke in his wallet, he got off with a fine, didnt lose his career.

Criminal lawyers dont "hate" the Gardai. Police like criminals are a necessary evil in maintaining the lawyers lifestyle. If the police didnt detect crime, arrest suspects, make mistakes the lawyers incomes would be fairly reduced.

na1

That was a legal fee for transaction

Chalk McHugh

Edgware wrote: »

Beyond reasonable doubt.
"My client was instructed by the injured party to withdraw 600 euro, 200 to settle the initial bill and 400 to cover future expenses. The injured party is Spanish with limited ability in English. Clearly M'lud wires got crossed with a result in this unfortunate situation. My client , as yourself, attended Clongowes and certainly does not need to be engaging in the theft of such a paltry sum"

Exactly.