hazard pay ?

Cupatae

Should essential workers get paid extra for the risk? most people are getting wages for having to stay home only seems right those taking extra risk should get paid extra?

Del Griffith

I think they definitely should.

But will they, thats another question entirely

Calhoun

I was under the impression those staying at home are doing it for the greater good and hence why they are getting paid for it because otherwise they would starve and go homeless.

Maybe not your point but its almost as if its stay at home for the craic and do **** all when allot of civil liberties are being curtailed to ensure we get on top of this. Also by the fact people are staying at homes is supposedly reducing that risk down for those working.

To your question its a hard one, its easy to say sure because its on the internet but allot of the essential workers will still have jobs when all of this is over an allot staying at home may not have.

callaway92

Very, very cynical way at looking at it (not my belief, but just a thought), but wouldn’t part of training to be a Doctor/Nurse etc include the idea that things like this can happen?

Darc19

A lot of places that have "essential" staff but who would not be classified as health / medical staff, are paying extra. Most seem to be paying 10% extra.

But there are hundreds of thousands who would love to be out of the house and working - this home schooling lark isn't fun and for many, personal relationships can be fraught.

eviltwin

I work in an essential service working with people who are high risk and social distancing isn't an option. No hazard pay for us and I know that we wouldn't get it if we asked. Tbh, I'm just grateful to have a job.

Pseudonym121

No need for hazard pay. But afterwards it would be great for health care workers to have equal pay for equal work, a government that honours contracts with us and an HSE which is focused on care provision as opposed to choking us with pointless layers of management.

It would be great if, instead of hazard pay now, the public supported those measures afterward. They would benefit everyone.

Sleeper12

Cupatae wrote:

Should essential workers get paid extra for the risk? most people are getting wages for having to stay home only seems right those taking extra risk should get paid extra?

I'm a plumber and I'm essential worker. You honestly think I should double my rates tomorrow because I'm taking a risk to provide a service for vulnerable people?

I don't think anyone should be paid extra. The government is borrowing billions to pay everyone at home and trying to keep the economy going. We're all in this together. The people who stay at home & follow the rules and don't spread the virus are hero's too. In actual fact the people sticking to the rules will save more lives than our front line health workers. Now everyone pat themselves on the back please

Tom Mann Centuria

Certain nurses are still waiting for the back pay of the payrise we were awarded after the industrial action over a year ago, and certain hospitals (mine) haven't begun to pay it at all yet, let alone the back pay. So I'd say its unlikely we'll get any additional pay. They have given staff free food in the canteen though which is very welcome for those who eat there(but I choose to sit in my car on breaks anti-social/sensible social distancing these days )

What is more likely when this is all over, and the country is trying to get back on its feet, is they'll cut our pay again and take holiday days off us like the last time. For the greater good (the greater good).

recyclebin

I guess those in the medical field like Nurses and Doctors were already at risk from lots of other things before the coronavirus. It's more the people that work in supermarkets on a very low wage that might be due an extra couple of euro an hour or else they may start quitting in their droves to protect themselves and their families.

Cupatae

Sleeper12 wrote: »

I'm a plumber and I'm essential worker. You honestly think I should double my rates tomorrow because I'm taking a risk to provide a service for vulnerable people?

I don't think anyone should be paid extra. The government is borrowing billions to pay everyone at home and trying to keep the economy going. We're all in this together. The people who stay at home & follow the rules and don't spread the virus are hero's too. In actual fact the people sticking to the rules will save more lives than our front line health workers. Now everyone pat themselves on the back please

I dunno compare your situation to that of a lets say a nurse, say they have to go home to someone that might be high risk? i mean you could ask everyone to leave the room and use PPE. Alot more manageable and more controllable risk...

Take the same scenario for someone on minimum wages, same risk or higher than you but paid far less, still think they should get less?

thats not meant as a dig either just saying there are different situations at play. And of course the people at home are doing a mighty job aswell not knocking anyone.

Sleeper12

Cupatae wrote: »

I dunno compare your situation to that of a lets say a nurse, say they have to go home to someone that might be high risk? i mean you could ask everyone to leave the room and use PPE. Alot more manageable and more controllable risk...

Take the same scenario for someone on minimum wages, same risk or higher than you but paid far less, still think they should get less?

thats not meant as a dig either just saying there are different situations at play. And of course the people at home are doing a mighty job aswell not knocking anyone.

I wasn't comparing me to a front line medical worker as that isn't what the thread tile says. I mean I could be in a house where the whole family have the virus but the lie to me so they get their shower repaired & they have hot running water again but there is no comparing me to a medic.


The point is this isn't the time to talk about pay hikes or bonus money. The government now has to pay the entire country 350 per week at a time when it is bringing in no taxes. An awful lot is being asked of everyone in Ireland right now.



We need to put our head down till we beat this thing. I have no doubt when the dust settles the ground swell of support from the public, nurses will get all moneis owed to them & next time they look for a raise they will have 4.5 million in their corner fighting for them.



That's all in the future. For now we need everyone to follow the simple rules & make front line doctors & nurses jobs a little easier. Right now I'd bet every doctor & nurse in the country would prefer everyone to stay indoors & follow the rules then get a pay rise.

CIARAN_BOYLE

I'm not willing to argue for hazard pay but if any nurse or doctor made the argument that they cant go home to their family for risk of bringing anything back I would support allowances being made for them to be provided funds to rent alternate accommodation.

SEPT 23 1989

We collapsed the economy to give front line staff a clear run at fighting this

That should be enough

Fr_Dougal

SEPT 23 1989 wrote: »

We collapsed the economy to give front line staff a clear run at fighting this

That should be enough

We collapsed the economy to save our own lives, we didn’t do it for the benefit of front line staff.

Del Griffith

callaway92 wrote: »

Very, very cynical way at looking at it (not my belief, but just a thought), but wouldn’t part of training to be a Doctor/Nurse etc include the idea that things like this can happen?

We're not just talking doctors and nurses here, off-licences are open for example, would you fancy going into work and dealing with the public all day during a pandemic, or lose your job?

I'd be tempted to just say f*ck it myself and stay at home unless there was some sort of hazard pay. Risk has gone up considerably for these people, I doubt it was in the standard contract for a shelf stocker in a supermarket to have 1000x more chance of catch a potentially fatal virus during his or her daily duties.

whiskeyman

For anyone saying 'we need to pay our doctors and nurses better after this':

The inevitable recession means any pay increases are a long way away.
If anything, huge cuts may be on the cards for so many / increases in taxes.

Cupatae

Sleeper12 wrote: »

I wasn't comparing me to a front line medical worker as that isn't what the thread tile says. I mean I could be in a house where the whole family have the virus but the lie to me so they get their shower repaired & they have hot running water again but there is no comparing me to a medic.


The point is this isn't the time to talk about pay hikes or bonus money. The government now has to pay the entire country 350 per week at a time when it is bringing in no taxes. An awful lot is being asked of everyone in Ireland right now.



We need to put our head down till we beat this thing. I have no doubt when the dust settles the ground swell of support from the public, nurses will get all moneis owed to them & next time they look for a raise they will have 4.5 million in their corner fighting for them.



That's all in the future. For now we need everyone to follow the simple rules & make front line doctors & nurses jobs a little easier. Right now I'd bet every doctor & nurse in the country would prefer everyone to stay indoors & follow the rules then get a pay rise.

While i agree with your point it isnt about money, but i cant help but feel sorry for people that for example are being highly exposed to it such as supermarket workers and stuff, Its very easy say forget the money when ur on a plumbers wages compared minimum wage. They are risking alot for very little.

Again that isnt a dig at anyone else or that we shouldnt be all workin away regardless, i just think these people should b rewarded for there efforts and the exceptional risk they face, and by proxy there families face aswell

Sleeper12

Cupatae wrote:

While i agree with your point it isnt about money, but i cant help but feel sorry for people that for example are being highly exposed to it such as supermarket workers and stuff, Its very easy say forget the money when ur on a plumbers wages compared minimum wage. They are risking alot for very little.

A family in my area own several small supermarkets, off licences, and convenience stores. All of their staff are being well looked after and knowing this business family staff will get a sizable bonus when things get back to normal.

It's up to individual store to reward their staff. I guess large stores like Tesco and Dunnes mightnt be as generous.

Calhoun

Cupatae wrote: »

While i agree with your point it isnt about money, but i cant help but feel sorry for people that for example are being highly exposed to it such as supermarket workers and stuff, Its very easy say forget the money when ur on a plumbers wages compared minimum wage. They are risking alot for very little.

Again that isnt a dig at anyone else or that we shouldnt be all workin away regardless, i just think these people should b rewarded for there efforts and the exceptional risk they face, and by proxy there families face aswell

There are people who don't have the opportunity to work and who's economic means probably will not recover afterwards. There lives have been totally upended.

Additionally there is also the impact on mental health and general wellness from being stuck inside for a long period of time.

Those that still work have a level of normality and are at a lesser risk because of the social distancing that we are all in for.

We are either all in this together or not at all. Putting one group on a pedestal when we are all sacrificing is not the way to get that message across.

Sleeper12

Dunnes Stores agree to pay workers Covid-19 premium

https://www.rte.ie/news/business/2020/0330/1127359-dunnes-stores-covid-premium-payment/

eggy81

Think it's the people that are still allowed work are the winners here not vice versa, apart from medical professionals.

Cupatae

Calhoun wrote: »

There are people who don't have the opportunity to work and who's economic means probably will not recover afterwards. There lives have been totally upended.

Additionally there is also the impact on mental health and general wellness from being stuck inside for a long period of time.

Those that still work have a level of normality and are at a lesser risk because of the social distancing that we are all in for.

We are either all in this together or not at all. Putting one group on a pedestal when we are all sacrificing is not the way to get that message across.

Thats a strange way at looking at it, i 100% think nurses and doctors and frontline staff should be put on a pedestal, that aside you seem to be under the impression that by paying frontline staff extra its disrespectful to people getting paid to stay safe at home.

Why would someone at home have a problem with frontline staff being paid extra?

We are all in this together but i dont see the problem with acknowledging the fact that frontline workers are facing higher risks.

Cupatae

eggy81 wrote: »

Think it's the people that are still allowed work are the winners here not vice versa, apart from medical professionals.

I dont think there are any winners in this, i wouldnt call being exposed on a regular basis for minimum wage winning either, like alot of jobs are.

Cupatae

Sleeper12 wrote: »

Dunnes Stores agree to pay workers Covid-19 premium

https://www.rte.ie/news/business/2020/0330/1127359-dunnes-stores-covid-premium-payment/

Thats the job, well deserved imo

Calhoun

Cupatae wrote: »

Thats a strange way at looking at it, i 100% think nurses and doctors and frontline staff should be put on a pedestal, that aside you seem to be under the impression that by paying frontline staff extra its disrespectful to people getting paid to stay safe at home.

Why would someone at home have a problem with frontline staff being paid extra?

We are all in this together but i dont see the problem with acknowledging the fact that frontline workers are facing higher risks.

How is it a strange way of looking at it? Only this morning on the independent you have your man Philly McMahon on about making all his staff redundant to try and keep the business afloat. He has big concerns if he can continue post this incident, allot of others are in that same boat.

We are all supposed to be in this together so it means we all make sacrifices. Some sectors of society just happen to be on the front lines, the only reason why allot more are not on the frontlines is the understanding that they will make a big sacrifice to not go out while this gets clear.

As i have said already, allot are not just being paid to stay at home and have the craic.

Cupatae

Calhoun wrote: »

How is it a strange way of looking at it? Only this morning on the independent you have your man Philly McMahon on about making all his staff redundant to try and keep the business afloat. He has big concerns if he can continue post this incident, allot of others are in that same boat.

We are all supposed to be in this together so it means we all make sacrifices. Some sectors of society just happen to be on the front lines, the only reason why allot more are not on the frontlines is the understanding that they will make a big sacrifice to not go out while this gets clear.

As i have said already, allot are not just being paid to stay at home and have the craic.

Would you be offended if those on the frontline got paid extra as a thank you?

Calhoun

Cupatae wrote: »

Would you be offended if those on the frontline got paid extra as a thank you?

If they were the only part of society getting extra for doing their bit in this crisis then yes.

We are going to have a fairly big hangover after all is said and done and allot of livelihoods are at stake. Some recognition for that also would be good to see.

Calhoun

This is a really cool initiative that is being run at the moment, to show those on the frontline how much they are appreciated.

https://www.independent.ie/world-news/coronavirus/feed-the-heroes-campaign-raises-over-550000-to-help-frontline-staff-in-covid-19-battle-39091712.html

I think when all is said and done we should relook at who needs what from it and sort them out.

Casati

The bill to the state is 6.7 billion at the moment without any increase for public workers and it’s hard to see how anybody can be paid more. As a nation we will be paying for this for years

Pseudonym121

This is utter BS. Front line staff don't need feed the heroes or hazard pay. What they need is proper PPE AND to be treated well/properly ( equal pay for equal work, the government not reneging on contracts etc ) when this is all over as well as fewer drunk and high people insulting/assaulting us when we try to treat them over years to come. Ideally the public might also support us when we point out gaps in the health service and advocate for more resourcing to provide you all with the help YOU will beg for when you become sick --- but which many of you wouldn't support us in asking for prior to the point in time YOU yourself need it.

That'll be far more welcome and have far more impact than these passing fancies.

Blueshoe

The whole Idea of salaries needs to be scrapped across the board. Public and private.
You get paid per hour worked.

The tax payer is handing out for public sector pay packets so hourly rates for all positions should be available to view.

ELM327

The notion of pay rises in the public sector will be scrapped due to this, the money simply isnt going to be there.
And, if there was money there, I'd prefer it to go on PPE, ventilators and eventually vaccines and medications.

I appreciate the hell out of the nurses and doctors that are managing this crisis but this is the vocation they signed up for.

ELM327

Blueshoe wrote: »

The whole Idea of salaries needs to be scrapped across the board. Public and private.
You get paid per hour worked.

The tax payer is handing out for public sector pay packets so hourly rates for all positions should be available to view.

Absolute nonsense.
Salaried jobs are omnipresent in the private sector as well as public. You can be damn sure if it saved money to move to hourly pay the private sector would have done it en masse


I'd say for myself and my team if we billed in hours worked over this crisis we'd be at double our salaries! Most people on salaried jobs work in excess of 40hrs most weeks

arctictree

Cupatae wrote: »

Should essential workers get paid extra for the risk? most people are getting wages for having to stay home only seems right those taking extra risk should get paid extra?

I don't know where you are living but most people I know have had their wages slashed or businesses destroyed.

ted1

Cupatae wrote: »

Should essential workers get paid extra for the risk? most people are getting wages for having to stay home only seems right those taking extra risk should get paid extra?

If they are healthy it should not affect them more than a cold or flu which would be standard occupational hazards. Providing sick pay would be compensation

ELM327

Cupatae wrote: »

Should essential workers get paid extra for the risk? most people are getting wages for having to stay home only seems right those taking extra risk should get paid extra?

My workload has not changed, if anything it has increased.
I'm working from home but that's the only difference.

turbot

Cupatae wrote: »

Should essential workers get paid extra for the risk? most people are getting wages for having to stay home only seems right those taking extra risk should get paid extra?

A better approach would be to provide them all supports needed to minimise risk and help them manage stress / trauma - AND - make sure they're INSURED so if someone does happen, their loved ones are covered and reasonable health recovery costs are too. Insurance is more important than just paying them extra.

ted1

Fr_Dougal wrote: »

We collapsed the economy to save our own lives, we didn’t do it for the benefit of front line staff.

No. To be quite frank. The lives of young healthy people aren’t at risk.

We did it to protect the elderly and those with underline and potentially undiagnosed issues

Cupatae

Calhoun wrote: »

If they were the only part of society getting extra for doing their bit in this crisis then yes.

We are going to have a fairly big hangover after all is said and done and allot of livelihoods are at stake. Some recognition for that also would be good to see.

So you are saying that..for example someone going to work for near minimum wage with high risk family members at home shouldn't see anything extra for continuing there job, and that you at home sacrificing just as much and putting yourself at just as much risk and that we are "all in this together"

Id argue some people are more in this, like it or lump it in regards to there safety and there family safety. For very little, but atleast alot of companies are recognizing this and paying the staff more than the person at home because its what they deserve.

Cupatae

ELM327 wrote: »

My workload has not changed, if anything it has increased.
I'm working from home but that's the only difference.

Working from home is a massive difference, id imagine you are getting the same pay for the same work aswell?

ELM327

Cupatae wrote: »

Working from home is a massive difference, id imagine you are getting the same pay for the same work aswell?

Same pay for same work as I'm salaried and would often work from home anyway. Same as the rest of my team. One of us is in india, two in SJ, CA, and 3 here in Dublin.

Calhoun

Cupatae wrote: »

So you are saying that..for example someone going to work for near minimum wage with high risk family members at home shouldn't see anything extra for continuing there job, and that you at home sacrificing just as much and putting yourself at just as much risk and that we are "all in this together"

Id argue some people are more in this, like it or lump it in regards to there safety and there family safety. For very little, but atleast alot of companies are recognizing this and paying the staff more than the person at home because its what they deserve.

Well its all about what we mean by in this together, there are people who have shut down their livelihoods so we can get on top of this and as i said when we get out the otherside they may never recover. So i am arguing that its important to acknowledge this as it is people going out to work.

I am also saying there are other issues that come with self isolating that is not being taken into account is it as much of a factor as what those still working are going through no but its still a factor.

Your approach from the start of the thread seems to be that people are sitting at home having the craic when its not the case. If we were all out for ourselves then it would be a case of people keeping businesses running and to hell with the vulnerable.

That is not happening though as we understand that we are all in it together.

As for those on the front line minimum wage sure they should get something as i said above but if they have members at home that are really vulnerable maybe its time to quit the job they would be better on the dole? There are allot of people who are recently out of work who might take the opportunity instead.

ELM327

The reason minimum wage jobs don't get hazard pay or higher pay, is that, if the current workforce departed, they could be easily replaced with someone else willing to do the job at that pay level

Cupatae

Calhoun wrote: »

Well its all about what we mean by in this together, there are people who have shut down their livelihoods so we can get on top of this and as i said when we get out the otherside they may never recover. So i am arguing that its important to acknowledge this as it is people going out to work.

I am also saying there are other issues that come with self isolating that is not being taken into account is it as much of a factor as what those still working are going through no but its still a factor.

Your approach from the start of the thread seems to be that people are sitting at home having the craic when its not the case. If we were all out for ourselves then it would be a case of people keeping businesses running and to hell with the vulnerable.

That is not happening though as we understand that we are all in it together.

As for those on the front line minimum wage sure they should get something as i said above but if they have members at home that are really vulnerable maybe its time to quit the job they would be better on the dole? There are allot of people who are recently out of work who might take the opportunity instead.

Two things

1)Point out where i said people are sitting at home having the craic?

2)You said in one of your post you would begrudge anyone getting paid more for being on the frontline.

Also these people on the front line are just that, people aswell they have to isolate aswell when they arent a work(or have the craic depend how u wanna spin it), you from the start have adapted the "us vs Them" attitude while being on imaginary team "home"

My point front the very start is should people on the frontline get hazard pay, somehow by people like yourself this has been taken as a slight against anyone at home, when it actually meant what it says on the tin.

Cupatae

ELM327 wrote: »

The reason minimum wage jobs don't get hazard pay or higher pay, is that, if the current workforce departed, they could be easily replaced with someone else willing to do the job at that pay level

u reckon? i cant see people chomping at the bit to take em, but thats beside the point..the good people that are willing to do it should get a bonus, which thankfully is happening as big places like aldi and tescos and dunnes are all recognizing this and paying there workers extra and rightly so.