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Social distancing Megathread

  • 15-03-2020 1:30pm
    #1
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 510 ✭✭✭ trapp


    This needs to be discussed as a separate issue from the virus itself.

    Of course the measures being taken are being implemented to save lives, prevent the health system from collapsing under the strain, to protect the vulnerable and at risk.

    These measures are needed and I'm not in anyway against them.

    But we can't just see everything in black and white. We could if there was an end in sight in a matter of weeks or even months but there isn't.

    How long before the effects of isolation become another grave issue along with the virus?

    Everyone is clear on the health effects of loneliness. Everyone is clear on the effects of unemployment on physical and mental health. Many are going to be effectively unemployed for a long period of time and may remain so after the crisis.

    How will this isolation affect anyone with depression, suicidal tendencies, mental health difficulties?

    How will this isolation affect people confined to home and living in dysfunctional families with problems of abuse, drugs and alcohol abuse?

    How will this affect the most disadvantaged children in our society with no escape to school and no education for a prolonged period of time?

    What will the rates of domestic abuse, suicides etc be if social isolation is implemented over a prolonged period?

    I repeat, I support the measures being implemented to save lives. The experts are doing their best in an evolving situation where everything is new.

    This can be done for weeks without doubt, but is it tenable for months?

    I repeat, I don't know but it needs to be discussed.

    Mental Health and suicide, anxiety etc were all major issues and thinking about suicide major killers up to a couple of weeks ago.

    I know this virus has the potential to kill many more people than suicide but the long term effects of social isolation need to be discussed.


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Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 17,516 ✭✭✭✭ Idbatterim


    the first week or two its a bit of a novelty and probably easy to limit contact. Like you say, how long will that go on? if they keep pubs, clubs , resteraunts, cafe's closed etc, its one thing. But if they were allowed open, I think you would see discipline fading fast, certainly with younger people...


  • Registered Users Posts: 13,646 ✭✭✭✭ Inquitus


    trapp wrote: »
    This needs to be discussed as a separate issue from the virus itself.

    Of course the measures being taken are being implemented to save lives, prevent the health system from collapsing under the strain, to protect the vulnerable and at risk.

    These measures are needed and I'm not in anyway against them.

    But we can't just see everything in black and white. We could if there was an end in sight in a matter of weeks or even months but there isn't.

    How long before the effects of isolation become another grave issue along with the virus?

    Everyone is clear on the health effects of loneliness. Everyone is clear on the effects of unemployment on physical and mental health. Many are going to be effectively unemployed for a long period of time and may remain so after the crisis.

    How will this isolation affect anyone with depression, suicidal tendencies, mental health difficulties?

    How will this isolation affect people confined to home and living in dysfunctional families with problems of abuse, drugs and alcohol abuse?

    How will this affect the most disadvantaged children in our society with no escape to school and no education for a prolonged period of time?

    What will the rates of domestic abuse, suicides etc be if social isolation is implemented over a prolonged period?

    I repeat, I support the measures being implemented to save lives. The experts are doing their best in an evolving situation where everything is new.

    This can be done for weeks without doubt, but is it tenable for months?

    I repeat, I don't know but it needs to be discussed.

    Mental Health and suicide, anxiety etc were all major issues and thinking about suicide major killers up to a couple of weeks ago.

    I know this virus has the potential to kill many more people than suicide but the long term effects of social isolation need to be discussed.

    You don't need to isolate yourself completely, you can meet up in a Forest, a Park, for a walk along the beach. We just need to frame social contact differently for the next while, get outside, avoid the Pubs and Restaurants etc. Keep your distance.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 510 ✭✭✭ trapp


    Idbatterim wrote: »
    the first week or two its a bit of a novelty and probably easy to limit contact. Like you say, how long will that go on? if they keep pubs, clubs , resteraunts, cafe's closed etc, its one thing. But if they were allowed open, I think you would see discipline fading fast, certainly with younger people...

    Exactly everyone is reading books, cleaning the house etc.

    It's the best option available at the moment, no doubt.

    But long term how grave could the effects be on the vulnerable?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 452 ✭✭ Logan Roy


    Social distancing and social isolation are two completely different things. Besides with technology etc it’s really not that difficult to keep in touch with people these days. We’ll be fine.


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,695 ✭✭✭ Quantum Erasure


    ...about a mile?


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  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 510 ✭✭✭ trapp


    Inquitus wrote: »
    You don't need to isolate yourself completely, you can meet up in a Forest, a Park, for a walk along the beach. We just need to frame social contact differently for the next while, get outside, avoid the Pubs and Restaurants etc. Keep your distance.

    But for how long is this tenable?


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 11,991 Mod ✭✭✭✭ riffmongous


    Inquitus wrote: »
    You don't need to isolate yourself completely, you can meet up in a Forest, a Park, for a walk along the beach. We just need to frame social contact differently for the next while, get outside, avoid the Pubs and Restaurants etc. Keep your distance.

    Depends though, actually Austria has gone far enough to ban the above more or less, you're only allowed to walk with people you live with. Mental imo, and harsh on those of us living alone


  • Registered Users Posts: 13,646 ✭✭✭✭ Inquitus


    trapp wrote: »
    But for how long is this tenable?

    It's tenable for as long as it needs to be, usually you meet someone for a pint in Gibney's, now instead take a walk from Malahide to Portmarnock and back instead, adjust behaviours but still keep up face to face contact.


  • Registered Users Posts: 9,261 ✭✭✭ Dodge


    trapp wrote: »
    But for how long is this tenable?

    Literally nobody can give you an answer. Just do your best to keep your own head straight and if enough of us do, we’ll be OK


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,661 ✭✭✭ Fann Linn


    I wouldn't be a pub drinker so that won't affect me either way but enjoy going to gaa matches so that will be a downer.
    I've a few books out from the library, plenty of magazines on my RB digital app and the wife is currently knitting away, happy as Larry.

    Heading out now for a cycle to get some air and get away from boards for a few hours.
    Enjoy.


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  • Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators, Regional North Mods, Regional West Moderators Posts: 81,470 Mod ✭✭✭✭ biko


    Many boardsies have been at it for years..


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,158 ✭✭✭ TheAnalyst_


    Inquitus wrote: »
    It's tenable for as long as it needs to be, usually you meet someone for a pint in Gibney's, now instead take a walk from Malahide to Portmarnock and back instead, adjust behaviours but still keep up face to face contact.

    That’s not true. People will not tolerate economic devastation and indefinitely putting their lives on hold. It won’t take too long before deaths become acceptable.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,662 Duke of Url


    biko wrote: »
    Many boardsies have been at it for years..

    Isn’t that a requirement of becoming a Mod?


  • Registered Users Posts: 995 ✭✭✭ BrianBoru00


    Logan Roy wrote: »
    Social distancing and social isolation are two completely different things. Besides with technology etc it’s really not that difficult to keep in touch with people these days. We’ll be fine.

    There's a difference between video link and phone calls and in person contact .
    Of course we ll "be fine" ...but for how long ?
    OP has a valid point and if this goes on for four months there will be a massive spike in domestic violence . Loneliness will increase and so will suicide.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 510 ✭✭✭ trapp


    Inquitus wrote: »
    It's tenable for as long as it needs to be, usually you meet someone for a pint in Gibney's, now instead take a walk from Malahide to Portmarnock and back instead, adjust behaviours but still keep up face to face contact.

    That's not what I'm talking about though.

    What about those with mental health difficulties which will become pronounced with no escape through work or hobbies?

    What about the 100s of young men, already a high risk group for suicide, left effectively idle and unemployed for potentially months?

    What about rural men who's only social contact might be a trip to the pub or the GAA match and who might not have family?

    I repeat, these measures are not being criticised, I'm just worried how long they're tenable for vulnerable people and remember mental health issues are often hidden so the vulnerable may not even be known.


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,179 ✭✭✭✭ rossie1977


    trapp wrote: »
    But for how long is this tenable?

    Next phase is closing bars/restaurants completely or limiting hours between 6am and 6pm

    Next phase after that is closing everything but food stores and pharmacies and telling everyone to stay home unless its essential

    Next phase after that is to force everyone to stay home. People only allowed out once a week to do emergency shopping for a maybe one hour but would need written request.

    Final phase is nobody is allowed out on the street, some places bolted shut to stop people leaving. Army bring food to you

    Does anyone want the country to enter final phase?


  • Registered Users Posts: 20,393 ✭✭✭✭ Stark


    That’s not true. People will not tolerate economic devastation and indefinitely putting their lives on hold. It won’t take too long before deaths become acceptable.

    I was thinking this. Before vaccines we accepted obscene numbers of childhood deaths as "just a way of life". If the crisis drags on long enough, the increase in death rate will eventually become normalised.


  • Registered Users Posts: 17,886 ✭✭✭✭ Del2005


    A lot of kids are feed in DEIS schools. How will people who rely on school to feed their children survive? Especially since most are probably working jobs that are shut down.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,485 ✭✭✭ Andrew00


    Watch TV, sleep, go for a walk

    I love self isolation


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,065 ✭✭✭ otnomart


    Logan Roy wrote: »
    Social distancing and social isolation are two completely different things. Besides with technology etc it’s really not that difficult to keep in touch with people these days. We’ll be fine.


    This.
    and Governments need to put in place now mental health helpline facilities available both online and over the phone.


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  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 510 ✭✭✭ trapp


    Del2005 wrote: »
    A lot of kids are feed in DEIS schools. How will people who rely on school to feed their children survive? Especially since most are probably working jobs that are shut down.

    We're in dangerous times.

    The virus is the enemy but we can't view everything as simply to stop the virus forever.

    Within social distancing there will have to be ways of opening back up society.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 510 ✭✭✭ trapp


    Andrew00 wrote: »
    Watch TV, sleep, go for a walk

    I love self isolation

    You do.

    But what about all the vulnerable groups mentioned in the post.

    We could be walking into a huge mental health crisis too.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,657 ✭✭✭ AulWan


    I just read an article on RTE.ie that the UK are considering asking everyone over the age of 70 to self-isolate for four months.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,839 ✭✭✭ RoryMac


    AulWan wrote: »
    I just read an article on RTE.ie that the UK are considering asking everyone over the age of 70 to self-isolate for four months.

    That seems like a good idea once they have supports in place for the people in isolation, food deliveries, regular checkups to ensure they have everything they need and have ability to contact family etc.

    Makes sense to me to isolate the most at risk groups rather than putting the whole population into isolation that could last the same amount of time


  • Registered Users Posts: 17,516 ✭✭✭✭ Idbatterim


    RoryMac wrote: »
    That seems like a good idea once they have supports in place for the people in isolation, food deliveries, regular checkups to ensure they have everything they need and have ability to contact family etc.

    Makes sense to me to isolate the most at risk groups rather than putting the whole population into isolation that could last the same amount of time

    yeah, if its the elderly who are far more likely to die from it. The damage shutting the country down will do... well, we will see the outcome most likely... they have the schools shut. now the kids are just interacting elsewhere...


  • Registered Users Posts: 10,449 ✭✭✭✭ Thelonious Monk


    trapp wrote: »
    That's not what I'm talking about though.

    What about those with mental health difficulties which will become pronounced with no escape through work or hobbies?

    What about the 100s of young men, already a high risk group for suicide, left effectively idle and unemployed for potentially months?

    What about rural men who's only social contact might be a trip to the pub or the GAA match and who might not have family?

    I repeat, these measures are not being criticised, I'm just worried how long they're tenable for vulnerable people and remember mental health issues are often hidden so the vulnerable may not even be known.

    These people are going to have it rough, as are many people. But that's just how it is, not many options here. We'll get through it.


  • Registered Users Posts: 15,846 ✭✭✭✭ klaz


    Last time I was in a bar here, looking around, most people were in groups but chatting/typing on their phones.

    This social distancing thingy has been going on for a while now.. it's just encouraging people to move a little further apart physically... can't see how that would be so difficult for many people these days.

    "It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it." - Aristotle 



  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,126 Snow Garden




  • Registered Users Posts: 16,076 ✭✭✭✭ bucketybuck


    Social distancing won't go on indefinitely because it doesn't need to, I would have thought all this was just part of the whole "flattening the curve" thing.

    We don't need everybody to isolate until the virus goes away, because it isn't going away, we just need them out of harms way for a few weeks/months until society finds some equilibrium with the issue.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 15,696 ✭✭✭✭ VinLieger


    Idbatterim wrote: »
    yeah, if its the elderly who are far more likely to die from it. The damage shutting the country down will do... well, we will see the outcome most likely... they have the schools shut. now the kids are just interacting elsewhere...

    The NHS is still going to be overwhelemed by caring for patients under 70 because the UK governmenyt arent closing anything, recommending canceling any events or doing any social distancing whatsoever


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