If the BBC scrap the licence fee for subscription model, are RTE..

badabing106

Will the Irish government be compelled to do the same to RTE? Or are RTE too powerful an institution


[URL] https://www.theguardian.com/media/2020/feb/16/no-10-launches-attack-on-bbc-as-licence-fee-comes-under-threat[/URL]

James Brown

badabing106 wrote: »

Will the Irish government be compelled to do the same to RTE? Or are RTE too powerful an institution


[URL] https://www.theguardian.com/media/2020/feb/16/no-10-launches-attack-on-bbc-as-licence-fee-comes-under-threat[/URL]

This is just Johnson wanting to threaten the BBC. He's already vetting which press are invited to Q&A's.
Like most things in Ireland, RTE is a great idea. Elements take advantage and there's waste. It just needs streamlining and heads to roll were needed.

TuringBot47

Why would the Irish government be compelled to ?

RTE are guaranteed the licence fees, they wouldn't survive commercially if they had to convince people to pay.

Idbatterim

should absolutely be scrapped, most of those working there, are thieveing a living!

BanditLuke

Idbatterim wrote: »

should absolutely be scrapped, most of those working there, are thieveing a living!

Ray Darcy 400k a year. :mad:

AllForIt

Every single day of the week RTE send a camera crew's across the country to video team sport's players running around on a field training. Followed by some painfully banal interview where you hear sports cliche after sports cliche. Does the country really need to know who in some minor team is out on a sports injury and other such trivial banalities. And that's aside from the actual sports events coverage itself.


That is just one example of where RTE spend or is it waste tonnes of money. IMO one thing that should happen is Ireland is we should have a national independent sports channel, one that is broadcast on terrestrial TV which I feel cold be complexly financed by in-line advertising etc. So all that sports reporting would be completely offloaded from RTE and off the pressure on their finances.

I think RTE is also full of cr*p 'ordinary ppl' TV. Whether it's Operation Transformation or what have you. This type of broadcasting should be offloaded to independant TV, in the same way you get cr*p TV on the independant ITV, rather than the state funded BBC. Although the BBC are guilty of going trash-ish too.

RTE do current affairs, investigative programming fairly well. They should stick to that kind of thing and not try to be all things to all men. If this happened, if they cut their costs and variety of output, I wouldn't mind paying a licence fee that's about 1/2 of what it is now.

rogue-entity

We pay €160/yr to fund the RTE, per household.
The British household is paying £160/yr (€180) and have easily 12x the number of households, all paying more than we do.

It's easy to praise the BBC for its programming, its engineering and the quality of its output but they also have a substantially larger budget.

While I share the opinion that there's plenty of 'fat' in RTE that could be trimmed, duplication of efforts done well in the private sector and not enough investment in the right areas, comparing it to the BBC is apples and oranges.


Would RTE survive if it went subscription only? No. Should RTE stop trying to cater to the various corners of society? No. Should RTE give up sports broadcasting? No. Though I don't watch sports and as it happens I rarely watch much TV and RTE Player won't work on my network so I listen to the radio instead.

AllForIt

rogue-entity wrote: »

While I share the opinion that there's plenty of 'fat' in RTE that could be trimmed, duplication of efforts done well in the private sector and not enough investment in the right areas, comparing it to the BBC is apples and oranges.

RTE and BBC are 'state broadcasters', so it's not a case of comparing apples and oranges, more oranges and tangerines.

Would RTE survive if it went subscription only? No. Should RTE stop trying to cater to the various corners of society? No. Should RTE give up sports broadcasting? No. Though I don't watch sports and as it happens I rarely watch much TV and RTE Player won't work on my network so I listen to the radio instead.

I wasn't suggesting RTE should completely desist from doing Sport - I am saying their incessant coverage of it should be massively curtailed.

I'm suggesting a way out of the suggested subscription model which I agree with you wouldn't work. Ppl are beginning to realize that Netflix doesn't have everything, that there is no one off sub that is going to give you everything you want to watch.

I read recently that Netfilx aren't doing well at all. I'm not surprised. Maybe ppl are getting over this 'binge-watching' phenomenon. I still think that independent broadcast TV has a role to play all financed by advertising alone.

badabing106

rogue-entity wrote: »

We pay €160/yr to fund the RTE, per household.
The British household is paying £160/yr (€180) and have easily 12x the number of households, all paying more than we do.
.

Don't forget that RTE gets most of its revenue from Advertising revenue, more money than they get from license fees. The BBC gets none

Tg4 has approx 30 full time staff, compared to 1000 plus in rte. TG4S budget must be miniscule compared to RTE, but there is more broadcasting and programme making talent on display, no ridiculous salaries and self promotion. RTE are divorced from reality

CinemaGuy45

TuringBot47 wrote: »

Why would the Irish government be compelled to ?

RTE are guaranteed the licence fees, they wouldn't survive commercially if they had to convince people to pay.

The propaganda is so transparent we are forced to pay for it.
I never watch it unless I am stuck in a room with other people watching it.

Suckit

badabing106 wrote: »

Don't forget that RTE gets most of its revenue from Advertising revenue, more money than they get from license fees. The BBC gets none

Tg4 has approx 30 full time staff, compared to 1000 plus in rte. TG4S budget must be miniscule compared to RTE, but there is more broadcasting and programme making talent on display, no ridiculous salaries and self promotion. RTE are divorced from reality

TG4 is head and shoulders above RTE in terms of original programming and content.

Get rid of the ridiculous wages and the nepotism in RTE and we may start

to see some talent.

10000maniacs

BanditLuke wrote: »

Ray Darcy 400k a year. :mad:

Tubbs just about justifies it but Darcy? How did that ever happen? For me he peaked with that Zig and Zag show.

Orion

rogue-entity wrote: »

RTE Player won't work on my network

fixed that for you

The Satanist

10000maniacs wrote: »

Tubbs just about justifies it

WHAT?!

endacl

If the BBC make any move, RTE follow suit a year later.

Only they'll do it badly with crap presenters, and it won't be any good. And there'll be a bit about it on the Late Late Show.

10000maniacs

10000maniacs wrote: »

Tubbs just about justifies it but Darcy? How did that ever happen? For me he peaked with that Zig and Zag show.

Tubs works a grand total of eight hours a week. He justifies his enormous salary in an alternative universe where Bertie didn't ruin a generation. Also known as cloud cuckoo land, or Marbella.

PommieBast

I suspect ending the BBC licence fee is as much a sop to Rupert Murdoch et al as some red meat for the Conservative right-wing. Don't think RTE has quite the same level of enemies in high places.

Boggles

AllForIt wrote: »

That is just one example of where RTE spend or is it waste tonnes of money. IMO one thing that should happen is Ireland is we should have a national independent sports channel, one that is broadcast on terrestrial TV which I feel cold be complexly financed by in-line advertising etc. So all that sports reporting would be completely offloaded from RTE and off the pressure on their finances.

You just don't like sports it seems, sports reporting is part of every news outlet on tv and radio in every country. Why? because people like sports and they want to consume sports news.

Also what will this independent sports channel show that will make it a viable self sufficient channel?

Are they to go head to head with billion pound companies like Sky, BT and Virgin?

RTE all ready go head to head with billions of pounds worth of free to air broadcasts beamed in from the UK.

To put it in context BBCs online budget is more than RTEs entire budget.

If people really want a level playing field, Sky and BT need to be booted out of the sports market here and the billions of pounds worth of free content encrypted.

But that isn't going to happen.

RTE are badly in need of reform but lets not pretend they are comparable to giants like the BBC and Sky.

Suckit

I don't get why RTE is so rigid with its online content too. Their website doesn't work properly with a VPN, not sure if it works abroad, I haven't ever tried to access it whilst abroad. I can access much of the content with a decent VPN, but there are restrictions.
The RTE player is far more concerned about making the content inaccessible to people outside Ireland, and to stop it from being downloaded, then they are on ensuring it actually works.
Those restrictions probably add a lot of cost to their online presence, and are utterly useless and stop nothing.
If anyone wants any RTE content it is easily got.
IIRC, BBC had no issues with people viewing their iPlayer outside of the UK, but it left them open to complaints about the licence fees, and rightly so, so they put in an attempt at blocking outside viewers, but didn't seem to waste the money on the route RTE went (not sure if that's because it is worse, or not needed).
Will BBC start showing adverts if they scrap the licence?

PommieBast

Suckit wrote: »

Will BBC start showing adverts if they scrap the licence?

Since UK TV advertising revenues are in long-term decline, I doubt that is a viable business model.

Granadino

I couldn't give a ****e what they do in the UK.

Boggles

PommieBast wrote: »

Since UK TV advertising revenues are in long-term decline, I doubt that is a viable business model.

No they aren't.

They are stable and projected to experience a 10 year high this year.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/262710/television-advertising-revenue-in-the-uk/

Yurt2

The BBC is the best public service media outlet in the world by a large distance.

I've met several people from what were despotic countries on a highly restricted government censored media diet and got a window to how the world is via the BBC world service.

It's not perfect, but it's a very special organisation.

Yurt2

And just on advertising money. There has actually been a shift in the last few years back to traditional media platforms such as TV and radio, especially in large media markets like the UK. Large corporations with money to spend figured out that targeted internet advertising wasn't as effective as they once presumed.

AllForIt

AllForIt wrote: »

Every single day of the week RTE send a camera crew's across the country to video team sport's players running around on a field training. Followed by some painfully banal interview where you hear sports cliche after sports cliche. Does the country really need to know who in some minor team is out on a sports injury and other such trivial banalities. And that's aside from the actual sports events coverage itself.

What annoys me more than that, is when they do live reporting from outside the Dail, the Labour Court or Four Courts, when really it not only brings nothing to the report, but inevitably a bus drives past mid way through the report, or some scumbag shouts at the camera.

The Dail is about a ten minute drive from Donnybrook. Is there really a need to send Ingrid Miley out in a van, with presumably a driver and a cameraman?

Boggles

Yurt! wrote: »

And just on advertising money. There has actually been a shift in the last few years back to traditional media platforms such as TV and radio, especially in large media markets like the UK. Large corporations with money to spend figured out that targeted internet advertising wasn't as effective as they once presumed.

A large portion of that advertising is being spent by the online tech giants.

Irony.

Kivaro

I spend so much time watching BBC (especially 2 and 4), that I genuinely want part of my Irish Television tax to go to the BBC.
Possibly 90% of it would be fair; with the remaining 10% going to TG4, Lyric FM, and the late night/very early morning (before 7 am) and weekend RTE Radio 1 shows. Between the BBC and my streaming services, there is very little need for RTE. Putting a price on the value/worth of RTE's services; I'd give it an estimate of about €5 per month.

I have not watched RTE news or any of their current affairs programming in years due to the blatant liberal bias. The way that they stack their audiences and how they conduct polls should be investigated ................ but not by the crack RTE Investigates team.

Idbatterim

there was a very valid point made by the man in the conservative party, that these people are being turned into stars and can then earn mad incomes otherways too. These RTE "celebrities" are worthless outside of RTE pretty much. Honestly, it should be abolished, have one state channel of news, current afairs, eco eye etc. More channels fine, but they need to wash their own face, same with radio etc. Guess what will happen ? we will still have the same faces and shows, just on far less money!

Boggles

Kivaro wrote: »

I have not watched RTE news or any of their current affairs programming in years due to the blatant liberal bias.

https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=111707895&postcount=40

Years! 3 months ago, who is counting.

When I saw this news item on RTE, I said to myself "fair play to her"

Kivaro

The RTE player must have been working that day.
Looks like 56 people agreed with that post; didn't know that. Thanks.

So this is what a stalker looks like.
One of these days he will find a job and become part of real life again. It's much better than the virtual world.

Loafing Oaf

badabing106 wrote: »

Will the Irish government be compelled to do the same to RTE? Or are RTE too powerful an institution

Why should they? Do we have to follow the British example in everything? No Irish political party nearly 'right wing' enough to contemplate such a step

Everybody knows if you turned the licence fee into a voluntary subscription, the number of people paying it would fall off a cliff, RTE would be forced to take a scythe to much of its 'public service' content, and you'd end up with something like Virgin Media...

Boggles

Kivaro wrote: »

The RTE player must have been working that day.
Looks like 56 people agreed with that post; didn't know that. Thanks.

Or you were caught spoofing..

Weird you saw my post since you have gone out of your way several times to tell me I am on your ignore list.

I imagine your pending reply may be a hat trick.

SEPT 23 1989

I would have no problem paying for BBC4 and BBC Radio 4

If RTE was one TV channel and one radio station up to that standard there wouldn't be an issue

elperello

Loafing Oaf wrote: »

Why should they? Do we have to follow the British example in everything? No Irish political party nearly 'right wing' enough to contemplate such a step

Everybody knows if you turned the licence fee into a voluntary subscription, the number of people paying it would fall off a cliff, RTE would be forced to take a scythe to much of its 'public service' content, and you'd end up with something like Virgin Media...

We have a public service broadcaster with some problems.
All we need to do is fix the problems.

zoobizoo

Kivaro wrote: »

I have not watched RTE news or any of their current affairs programming in years due to the blatant liberal bias. The way that they stack their audiences and how they conduct polls should be investigated ................ but not by the crack RTE Investigates team.

RTE don't conduct polls - they have market research companies conduct polls and then report upon them.

Usually conducted by Ipsos/MRBI on behalf of RTÉ.

As for bias - I find RTE pretty neutral overall - what bias am I missing?

zoobizoo

Costs my household approx. €3 a week.

I listen to Morning Ireland, Drive Time every day they're on and Arena and John Creedon a couple of nights a week.

I also watch generally good news coverage, the weather and used to watch the 6 Nations when they had it....

My kids watch some RTE Junior and my wife listens to Lyric in the car.

I tune in on weekends for some politics.

I get all that for less than the price of a small latte in Starbucks. That is good value.


BTW I don't agree with or rate Tubridy, Darcy or many of their entertainment shows but that's how they earn their ad revenue.

CinemaGuy45

zoobizoo wrote: »

Costs my household approx. €3 a week.


I get all that for less than the price of a small latte in Starbucks. That is good value.


BTW I don't agree with or rate Tubridy, Darcy or many of their entertainment shows but that's how they earn their ad revenue.

RTE is carried on Sky Virgin Media and other pay TV providers who use paid access subscription.

It sounds like you think RTE is a bargain so I am sure if RTE went to a subscription model you would be happy to pay a bit more and that is fine I totally agree with personal choice.

I would nearly we willing to spend money to have it removed from my channel line up.:D

I am sure most of the nation is somewhere between our two extremes.

I bet most young people would spend money on Netflix long before giving a cent to RTE.

In work you always here people talking about this or that on Netflix never here them talking about The Late Late.:D

fly_agaric

badabing106 wrote: »

Will the Irish government be compelled to do the same to RTE? Or are RTE too powerful an institution


[URL] https://www.theguardian.com/media/2020/feb/16/no-10-launches-attack-on-bbc-as-licence-fee-comes-under-threat[/URL]

Don't think the UK internal politics is relevant for here (and can't see it having an influence).

It is entirely about the Conservative party's utter hatred of the BBC ("We will whack it!" - quote from the article).

IMO they've defanged and dumbed down BBC news coverage during their rule, but it obviously isn't enough. The BBC still pumps out too much suspect "lefty" thought for their liking and unfairly eats into Murdochs' UK profits.

Damaging the BBC by cutting funding in this way (getting the public to effectively do it themselves so Conservative party can avoid blame as the BBC is still popular) is quite devious.

elperello

zoobizoo wrote: »

RTE don't conduct polls - they have market research companies conduct polls and then report upon them.

Usually conducted by Ipsos/MRBI on behalf of RTÉ.

As for bias - I find RTE pretty neutral overall - what bias am I missing?

Pretty much any issue of public interest will result in accusations of bias against RTE or some other sector of "MSM.

Often in the one thread on here RTE will be condemned for being a hotbed of commies and supporting the status quo.

Boggles

zoobizoo wrote: »

RTE don't conduct polls - they have market research companies conduct polls and then report upon them.

Usually conducted by Ipsos/MRBI on behalf of RTÉ.

As for bias - I find RTE pretty neutral overall - what bias am I missing?

They are basically not racist enough.

fly_agaric

SEPT 23 1989 wrote: »

I would have no problem paying for BBC4 and BBC Radio 4

If RTE was one TV channel and one radio station up to that standard there wouldn't be an issue

Well, there still would be because an issue for those who whinge about it as I think far fewer companies will pay to advertise on any trimmed down news, political/current affairs analysis and highbrow culture-vulture only version of RTE.

Therefore need for some licence fees or a broadcast tax or whatever you call it will remain despite RTE shrinking. It could even increase (as 45 % of RTE revenues are from advertising - https://www.rte.ie/annualreport/ ; see https://www.rte.ie/annualreport/pdfs/23_financial_review.pdf.

edit: reading further into that report I think the current licence fee level would just about cover RTE 1 and Radio 1 programming with no ads (financial review p31).

Kivaro

zoobizoo wrote: »

RTE don't conduct polls - they have market research companies conduct polls and then report upon them.

Usually conducted by Ipsos/MRBI on behalf of RTÉ.

Yes, indeed they do. But it is the criteria that RTE puts forward for these polls that makes them questionable and the net of opinions is a very small one. Also look how RTE got the election results so wrong.

zoobizoo wrote: »

As for bias - I find RTE pretty neutral overall - what bias am I missing?

There is obvious bias by RTE on many liberal social issues.
In the past they stacked audiences with pro-Traveller ogranisations and supporters, which gave a skewed view of public support for issues surrounding Travellers.

Asylum seekers is another hot project for RTE. Watch reports where they interview locals about the direct provisions being forced on their communities. Why is the demographic of the people being interviewed almost always similar? Why do they not interview working people or people on the way to work early in the morning or coming home late at night?

RTE is as neutral as the North Korean news agency.

Boggles

So RTE are not racist enough, therefore they are like North Korea.

You don't watch RTE, but the one time you did it just so happened to be a resounding success story about a Refugee, which you completely flipped into a negative.

I don't think the problem is with RTE.

zoobizoo

Kivaro wrote: »

But it is the criteria that RTE puts forward for these polls that makes them questionable and the net of opinions is a very small one. Also look how RTE got the election results so wrong.


Why do they not interview working people or people on the way to work early in the morning or coming home late at night?

What criteria do RTE put forward?

end of the road

Kivaro wrote: »

Yes, indeed they do. But it is the criteria that RTE puts forward for these polls that makes them questionable and the net of opinions is a very small one. Also look how RTE got the election results so wrong.


There is obvious bias by RTE on many liberal social issues.
In the past they stacked audiences with pro-Traveller ogranisations and supporters, which gave a skewed view of public support for issues surrounding Travellers.

Asylum seekers is another hot project for RTE. Watch reports where they interview locals about the direct provisions being forced on their communities. Why is the demographic of the people being interviewed almost always similar? Why do they not interview working people or people on the way to work early in the morning or coming home late at night?

RTE is as neutral as the North Korean news agency.

once again, it's not the job of rte to be a propaganda machine for any specific group, racists, bigots, far right, far left, whatever. it's news and current affairs output is there to provide factual information and report on the news and goings on, and they do that. are they perfect? no, but anyone suggesting they are similar to the state service of north corea is seriously out of touch with reality.
perhapse you need to just accept that your views are actually in a minority, some media outlets may be willing to give your views more coverage but that is because it benefits their business, it doesn't mean more people actually agree with you.
if you want a propaganda machine that provides information to suit your views, plenty of youtube channels available.

solidasarock

Cant wait for RTE to scrap the licence fee for a subscription

Then say subscription will be mandatory