Civil Service double competition quandary

MrsBean

Hi all,

I am currently in an open AO competition for the civil service, and due to interview this week. If successful I should hear soon enough and as I am already a civil servant I believe the clearance stage would move quite quickly and would likely be placed before March.

I am also in an internal HEO competition for the department I currently work in. Those interviews due end of Feb/early March.

However, the information booklet states "a candidate who... transfers out of this department will cease to be eligible for this competition".

I know I am possibly getting ahead of myself here but does anyone know:

If successful at the open AO competition can I ask PAS to place me in a role in my current department so as to still be eligible for the HEO competition?

and

Would I be considered to have transferred out of the department when informed I am successful, or when I physically start in the new role?

Thanks in advance for any info

you aren't out of yr dept until you move, contracts the lot.

PAS would in my experience be very cagey about confirming with anyone that they will or can place them somewhere specific.

Forthebuzz

I think being an AO would make you ineligible for heo anyway as most (possibly all?) interdepartmental /internal comps I have seen state that you cannot be serving as a heo already or one with the same max scale as heo which ao does so maybe check that out too

good point! i think that might come into play alright

Cakerbaker

I do know if some people who made requests and were placed as AOs in the departments they were in but that was because those departments were due to be given AOs from the batch those people were being appointed from. I know of others who made requests and weren’t accommodated as their departments weren’t due AOs in that batch.

However, as stated above, you’d need to check the HEO eligibility as you may not be able to apply if appointed as an AO. Although I do know of a few people who did manage to change from AO to HEO and vice versa but that was because they had applied for the competitions as EOs so even though they had gotten one role, they were able to stay in the competition for the other. So it may be worth enquiring to see if you would be eligible for the HEO if you get the application in before being appointed to AO (assuming that you get to be AO in your department).

Cakerbaker

And while it’s a few years ago now, from my own experience of being appointed from within the civil service to an AO role in a different department, it was anything but speedy!

MrsBean

Thanks for the replies everyone.

I had forgotten that you generally can’t go AO-HEO or vice versa. Although I know someone who did go HEO to AO in an open competition. They really wanted to get out of the department.

I applied as an EO for both. Best case scenario is getting the HEO results before the AO results, as that’s the role I would prefer. That way if I don’t get it I will still have a shot for AO.
It’s all a matter of timing really! Hopefully all will be revealed by March.

Cakerbaker wrote: »

I do know if some people who made requests and were placed as AOs in the departments they were in but that was because those departments were due to be given AOs from the batch those people were being appointed from. I know of others who made requests and weren’t accommodated as their departments weren’t due AOs in that batch.

However, as stated above, you’d need to check the HEO eligibility as you may not be able to apply if appointed as an AO. Although I do know of a few people who did manage to change from AO to HEO and vice versa but that was because they had applied for the competitions as EOs so even though they had gotten one role, they were able to stay in the competition for the other. So it may be worth enquiring to see if you would be eligible for the HEO if you get the application in before being appointed to AO (assuming that you get to be AO in your department).

VegasKnights26

Cakerbaker wrote: »

I do know if some people who made requests and were placed as AOs in the departments they were in but that was because those departments were due to be given AOs from the batch those people were being appointed from. I know of others who made requests and weren’t accommodated as their departments weren’t due AOs in that batch.

However, as stated above, you’d need to check the HEO eligibility as you may not be able to apply if appointed as an AO. Although I do know of a few people who did manage to change from AO to HEO and vice versa but that was because they had applied for the competitions as EOs so even though they had gotten one role, they were able to stay in the competition for the other. So it may be worth enquiring to see if you would be eligible for the HEO if you get the application in before being appointed to AO (assuming that you get to be AO in your department).

Hi, can I ask when this was? As I know according to a Forsa article recently there a number of newly promoted AOs that were successful on the interdepartmental HEO panel and unable to take up the HEO role as they’re now deemed ineligible, despite applying as EOs for both roles? Article seems to state PAS/DPER are unwilling to budge?

Cakerbaker

VegasKnights26 wrote: »

Hi, can I ask when this was? As I know according to a Forsa article recently there a number of newly promoted AOs that were successful on the interdepartmental HEO panel and unable to take up the HEO role as they’re now deemed ineligible, despite applying as EOs for both roles? Article seems to state PAS/DPER are unwilling to budge?

It would have been 4/5 years ago now. I hadn’t realized it was something they had tightened up on.

Ollie321

Are there certain Depts in which one can be promoted from AO to HEO? Or is it completely disallowed

VegasKnights26

Ollie321 wrote: »

Are there certain Depts in which one can be promoted from AO to HEO? Or is it completely disallowed

You can become HEO from an AO grade only if you have been successful in an open (therefore very specific) competition - generally in a public body rather than a government dept. However you can very easily become AO having been previously a HEO as they’re all open competitions. Internal/interdepartmental competitions highlight you cannot compete in a grade that is similar (ie HEO and AO end on the same payscale - despite it taking the full 10 years of being an AO to get to the same wage as HEO, and having 4 less days of leave every year 🀨)