FF senator gourging at the trough.

Jinglejangle69

Fianna Fáil leader Micheál Martin has admitted a party senator has questions to answer over his poor voting record in the Seanad, where he claimed €73,000 in expenses but didn't vote on most days.

https://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/fianna-fail-senator-who-missed-three-quarters-of-seanad-votes-has-questions-to-answer-martin-admits-972014.html


I’m sure people will be just as outraged here as about other politicians on other threads.

Won’t hold my breathe as it’s not a negative FG story.

Ashleigh1986

And people wonder why there's a low turn out for elections !!!

Snow Garden

We all know FF is full of gangsters.

I guess we thought FG might be more honest. They aren't.

I guess we believed in New Politics. It was waffle.

FF = FG = Corrupt.

Mayo politicians seem to only care about gouging the taxpayer. Enda and Mulherrins are very bad for it. Pee Flynn taught them well!

bunderoon

95-99% of politicians are self serving. You would be a fool to think that these type of people go into the Dail to make the country better. That is the guise alright but it is purely to get as much as they can, for as long as they can.
Same goes for a fairly large portion of upper levels of the civil service.

They are lucky that a lot of the Irish are ignorant and lazy/too cowardly to make a difference - so the status quo is upheld.

The country needs a new party and to get that, there needs to be a huge mindset change at every parish pump as to stop people voting for either cheek of the same arse.

Jimbob1977

The Seanad was retained to give Enda a kicking.

We had our chance and we blew it... in typical Irish style

Snow Garden

Jimbob1977 wrote: »

The Seanad was retained to give Enda a kicking.

We had our chance and we blew it... in typical Irish style

And then Enda promised to reform it and even commissioned a report.....but nothing happened......

That’s 23-24 grand a year in travel expenses!

I’ve said it in another thread. I have carers come 3 times a day to help me with my dad and it’s a mix of HSE employees and agency staff. They have different calls to different homes 7 days a week. Both use their own transport but the HSE employees get a travel allowance to cover costs but agency staff have to pay for their travel out of their own pocket.

Sometimes the agency staff may only have 2 half hour calls in a day. That’s one hours work. Those types of days they are pretty much working for nothing (travel costs and tax). I called workplace relations about it as I was convinced that they should be paid for driving from job to job but they told me it’s not illegal.

This guy with his 23-24 grand a year travel expense is probably around the same amount as the agency carers gross wage which they have to pay their own expenses out of.

Totally wrong. So, if you’re a politician reading this....... you disgust me for this carry on.

bunderoon

Strawberry Milkshake wrote: »

That’s 23-24 grand a year in travel expenses!

I’ve said it in another thread. I have carers come 3 times a day to help me with my dad and it’s a mix of HSE employees and agency staff. They have different calls to different homes 7 days a week. Both use their own transport but the HSE employees get a travel allowance to cover costs but agency staff have to pay for their travel out of their own pocket.

Sometimes the agency staff may only have 2 half hour calls in a day. That’s one hours work. Those types of days they are pretty much working for nothing (travel costs and tax). I called workplace relations about it as I was convinced that they should be paid for driving from job to job but they told me it’s not illegal.

This guy with his 23-24 grand a year travel expense is probably around the same amount as the agency carers gross wage which they have to pay their own expenses out of.

Totally wrong. So, if you’re a politician reading this....... you disgust me for this carry on.

As I wrote in my above post, they are in the job to get as much as they can for as long as they can.
https://www.thejournal.ie/katherine-zappone-travel-expenses-2732813-Apr2016/

GhostyMcGhost

bunderoon wrote: »

As I wrote in my above post, they are in the job to get as much as they can for as long as they can.
https://www.thejournal.ie/katherine-zappone-travel-expenses-2732813-Apr2016/

I’d actually love to see what route she does take in the end. I’m 100% sure it’s the 22km one

James Brown

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

Fianna Fáil leader Micheál Martin has admitted a party senator has questions to answer over his poor voting record in the Seanad, where he claimed €73,000 in expenses but didn't vote on most days.

https://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/fianna-fail-senator-who-missed-three-quarters-of-seanad-votes-has-questions-to-answer-martin-admits-972014.html


I’m sure people will be just as outraged here as about other politicians on other threads.

Won’t hold my breathe as it’s not a negative FG story.

I was interested until you got all party political broadcast.

Personally I don't hold FF in any high regard. It's hard to be disappointed in a party when you have such low expectations.
The Seanad should be closed. It's the elephants graveyard of Irish politics.

touts

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

Fianna Fáil leader Micheál Martin has admitted a party senator has questions to answer over his poor voting record in the Seanad, where he claimed €73,000 in expenses but didn't vote on most days.

https://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/fianna-fail-senator-who-missed-three-quarters-of-seanad-votes-has-questions-to-answer-martin-admits-972014.html


I’m sure people will be just as outraged here as about other politicians on other threads.

Won’t hold my breathe as it’s not a negative FG story.

So not much time off for the the Fine Gael social media spin team this Christmas I see. I presume we the taxpayer are paying you double time for working over Christmas. Wouldn't ye be better off trying to do something useful like, I don't know, sort out the homeless crisis, rather than trotting out the same old line of Fianna Fail are bad. We all know that. We got it when we ****ed them out on their arses 10 years ago and put you lot in instead. 10 years of it's not our fault it was broken when we got here is wearing a little thin. We put ye in to fix the stuff Fianna Fail messed up. 10 years later it's becoming clear you are just as corrupt and utterly useless as they are. No one cares about this stuff. If you honestly think a few FF TDs voting incorrectly or some FF senator not voting at all is going to paper over the utter shambles you've made of the homeless crisis, or the Dublin Children's hospital, or the national broadband schema, or the rental market, of the economy outside the M50 then God help me I'll trottle the first FG candidate who turns up at my door. It's no wonder we're all voting independent. You make Mattie McGrath look like the decent option!!

Jinglejangle69

touts wrote: »

So not much time off for the the Fine Gael social media spin team this Christmas I see. I presume we the taxpayer are paying you double time for working over Christmas. Wouldn't ye be better off trying to do something useful like, I don't know, sort out the homeless crisis, rather than trotting out the same old line of Fianna Fail are bad. We all know that. We got it when we ****ed them out on their arses 10 years ago and put you lot in instead. 10 years of it's not our fault it was broken when we got here is wearing a little thin. We put ye in to fix the stuff Fianna Fail messed up. 10 years later it's becoming clear you are just as corrupt and utterly useless as they are. No one cares about this stuff. If you honestly think a few FF TDs voting incorrectly or some FF senator not voting at all is going to paper over the utter shambles you've made of the homeless crisis, or the Dublin Children's hospital, or the national broadband schema, or the rental market, of the economy outside the M50 then God help me I'll trottle the first FG candidate who turns up at my door. It's no wonder we're all voting independent. You make Mattie McGrath look like the decent option!!

Just as I thought.

I’d test the waters and see if it gets the same reaction as Dara Murphy’s thread and I’ve been proven correct.

The usual posters here can’t have anything posted that paints another party in a bad light like FG are.

Can we not discuss FF because of FG?

Seriously the nonsense about paid FG spin units here and somehow I’m part of it is absolutely pathetic.

It really is, do you actually believe it like?

EDIT- you’ll throttle the first FG candidate that comes to your door?

Course you will mate course you will!

j8wk2feszrnpao

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

Can we not discuss FF because of FG?

Eh, you were discussing FF, and then brought FG into it.
Two faced of you to start rambling towards others for your own-like actions.

_Kaiser_

Jimbob1977 wrote: »

The Seanad was retained to give Enda a kicking.

We had our chance and we blew it... in typical Irish style

The Seanad was retained, because most people realised giving FG even more of a free hand than they already had was a "bad thing".

The people wanted it retained and reformed rather than outright abolished - but in typical FG style, Enda blew it

_Kaiser_

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

Just as I thought.

I’d test the waters and see if it gets the same reaction as Dara Murphy’s thread and I’ve been proven correct.

The usual posters here can’t have anything posted that paints another party in a bad light like FG are.

Can we not discuss FF because of FG?

Seriously the nonsense about paid FG spin units here and somehow I’m part of it is absolutely pathetic.

It really is, do you actually believe it like?

EDIT- you’ll throttle the first FG candidate that comes to your door?

Course you will mate course you will!

Any corruption or dodgy actions, regardless of party affiliation, should be fully investigated and necessary sanctions taken where warranted.

Happy?

I don't think anyone has a problem with that by the way. I do think they have a problem with the "law and order" party and their hangers-on trying to claim some sort of moral and political high ground and employing whataboutery tactics, when their own TD's have been exposed as being at the same things and more!

salmocab

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

Just as I thought.

I’d test the waters and see if it gets the same reaction as Dara Murphy’s thread and I’ve been proven correct.

The usual posters here can’t have anything posted that paints another party in a bad light like FG are.

Can we not discuss FF because of FG?

Seriously the nonsense about paid FG spin units here and somehow I’m part of it is absolutely pathetic.

It really is, do you actually believe it like?

EDIT- you’ll throttle the first FG candidate that comes to your door?

Course you will mate course you will!

Your obviously not big on self awareness, you brought FG into it in the very first post and even steered the conversation that direction. If you were doing it as an experiment then the things you put into the OP would make any experiment scientifically worthless.

Annasopra

FF are the same as FG. Same right wing politics. Same careerist attitudes. Never voted either of them them and never will.

McMurphy

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

Fianna F leader MicheMartin has admitted a party senator has questions to answer over his poor voting record in the Seanad, where he claimed €73,000 in expenses but didn't vote on most days.

https://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/fianna-fail-senator-who-missed-three-quarters-of-seanad-votes-has-questions-to-answer-martin-admits-972014.html


I’m sure people will be just as outraged here as about other politicians on other threads.

Won’t hold my breathe as it’s not a negative FG story.

What's your own thoughts on the story?

All I can take from your op is that you copied and pasted a fairly short snippet of info from the link, gave no opinion of your own on the matter, and then said something about negative fg stories.

I mean people might be forgiven for thinking you didn't actually give a sh1t about the "gourging" of the senator, you just want a story to divert from FG

Martin should give your man his marching orders imo. No use shouting from the rafters at others if you're going to be all trousers and no arse when your own lads caught at it.

Jinglejangle69

McMurphy wrote: »

What's your own thoughts on the story?

All I can take from your op is that you copied and pasted a fairly short snippet of info from the link, gave no opinion of your own on the matter, and then said something about negative fg stories.

I mean people might be forgiven for thinking you didn't actually give a sh1t about the "gourging" of the senator, you just want a story to divert from FG

Martin should give your man his marching orders imo. No use shouting from the rafters at others if you're going to be all trousers and no arse when your own lads caught at it.

My thoughts is this is worst than what I thought initially.

“RTE Investigates claimed staff at Dr Swanick’s medical practice in Bellmullet said he was available to see patients on days when he was registered as attending the Seanad.”

Now that’s proper playing the system, been in two places at the same time!!

Shefwedfan

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

My thoughts is this is worst than what I thought initially.

“RTE Investigates claimed staff at Dr Swanick’s medical practice in Bellmullet said he was available to see patients on days when he was registered as attending the Seanad.”

Now that’s proper playing the system, been in two places at the same time!!

That’s not your thought, just more spin

KaneToad

Shefwedfan wrote: »

That’s not your thought, just more spin

Spin? Is it not factual?

McMurphy

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

My thoughts is this is worst than what I thought initially.

“RTE Investigates claimed staff at Dr Swanick’s medical practice in Bellmullet said he was available to see patients on days when he was registered as attending the Seanad.”

Now that’s proper playing the system, been in two places at the same time!!

Seen that, horrible scheming bastard's...... What did you think when you learned he wasn't the only one at such skulduggery though?
Enda Kenny missed 96% of votes since stepping down

Two of those trips involved instances where Mr Kenny had also recorded his attendance at Leinster House. In May 2018, he was paid for a speaking event at a two-day conference in Zurich, Switzerland, hosted by Credit Suisse.

In November 2018, Mr Kenny had a speaking event in London. This event was called "JP Morgan: Best of British Conference," and on this day, Mr Kenny's attendance was recorded in Leinster House. Despite this, he missed all three D votes that day, two of which related to Brexit.

Mortelaro

Joeytheparrot wrote: »

FF are the same as FG. Same right wing politics. Same careerist attitudes. Never voted either of them them and never will.

I don't think left wing is in the ascendancy either though or ever is it
Right wing is perceived as wrong but all it is ,is the embodiment of selfishness
Everybody is selfish
Anyone that says they aren't is a liar

Selfishness though should have some limits,let's call that decency
Slopping too much from the trough is indecent
Being ambitious or careerist is not
Limit incentives and you will get sloth
Get more and more sloth and you'll get a failing economy

Jinglejangle69

Shefwedfan wrote: »

That’s not your thought, just more spin

What’s spin???

Ahhh you’re one of them posters who hates seen a negative news story unless it’s FG.

I get it now.

Jinglejangle69

McMurphy wrote: »

Seen that, horrible scheming bastard's...... What did you think when you learned he wasn't the only one at such skulduggery though?

Shower of corrupt bastards!!

Wanderer78

Mortelaro wrote:

Selfishness though should have some limits,let's call that decency Slipping too much from the trough is indecent Being ambitious or careerist is not Limit incentives and you will get sloth Get more and more sloth and you'll get a failing economy

Our 'successful economy' doesn't seem to be all that successful for society

KaneToad

I don't think that politicians are overly compensated. Oireachtas members are generously paid but, whether we like it or not, it's a very important job. It has long hours and the work can be difficult. You also have to interview for your job every few years by going before the electorate.

There are plenty of career politicians but they must be doing something right - if they keep getting re-elected. Our system of democracy is the least worst system available. You vote for the group/person who is most closely aligned to your views. If they don't exist, run for office yourself.

vicwatson

Ashleigh1986 wrote: »

And people wonder why there's a low turn out for elections !!!

But only a select few people can vote for the Seanad

How undemocratic is that

KaneToad

vicwatson wrote: »

But only a select few people can vote for the Seanad

How undemocratic is that

60 Seanad seats

Taoiseach selects 11

NUI/TCD graduates select 6

Outgoing/incoming TDs/Senators/Councillors select 43


Seems like an ok(ish) system to elect the upper house. Most of the decisions are made by elected people. The university panel, with its 161,000 members, is a bit of a relic of times past. But the people had their chance to amend it, they declined.

salmocab

KaneToad wrote: »

You also have to interview for your job every few years by going before the electorate.

There are plenty of career politicians but they must be doing something right - if they keep getting re-elected. Our system of democracy is the least worst system available. You vote for the group/person who is most closely aligned to your views. If they don't exist, run for office yourself.

On the first point yes they go for their jobs again every few years whereas most employees once in the job have to perform consistently or get sacked they only have to convince a voters that they are there for them every few years. I’d argue they have it easier than normal workers.

On the second point keeping getting elected certainly doesn’t mean your doing a good job it means your constituents think you are, there is a world of difference between those two things.

STB.

KaneToad wrote: »

There are plenty of career politicians but they must be doing something right - if they keep getting re-elected. Our system of democracy is the least worst system available. You vote for the group/person who is most closely aligned to your views. If they don't exist, run for office yourself.

Politics is in a bad state in this country and has been for some time.

They are better than option B is the premise on which these people are voted in time and time again.

They then do a u-turn on every policy they promise.

We need a new party that can deliver on its promise, preferably one that's not religiously inclined and with new open mindedness to solving problems, like the state of our healthcare and general infrastructure that FG have run down to nothing over the past 8 years and what FF did before. We also need one that wouldn't have the working class paying for every other layabout through taxes.

They don't exist though.

KaneToad

salmocab wrote: »

On the first point yes they go for their jobs again every few years whereas most employees once in the job have to perform consistently or get sacked they only have to convince a voters that they are there for them every few years. I’d argue they have it easier than normal workers.

On the second point keeping getting elected certainly doesn’t mean your doing a good job it means your constituents think you are, there is a world of difference between those two things.

The opinion of the constituents is what counts, though. Not your opinion, nor mine. Personally, I can't abide the Healy-Raes and their ideas but who am I to say that those thousands of Kerry voters are wrong.

salmocab

KaneToad wrote: »

The opinion of the constituents is what counts, though. Not your opinion, nor mine. Personally, I can't abide the Healy-Raes and their ideas but who am I to say that those thousands of Kerry voters are wrong.

That’s exactly my point, you only have to keep the constituents happy, that doesn’t make you a good politician for the country. The dail is rammed with people who aren’t really worth the money we pay them but they keep constituents happy or enough of them to secure the seat.

KaneToad

STB. wrote: »

Politics is in a bad state in this country and has been for some time.

They are better than option B is the premise on which these people are voted in time and time again.

They then do a u-turn on every policy they promise.

We need a new party that can deliver on its promise, preferably one that's not religiously inclined and with new open mindedness to solving problems, like the state of our healthcare and general infrastructure that FG have run down to nothing over the past 8 years and what FF did before. We also need one that wouldn't have the working class paying for every other layabout through taxes.

They don't exist though.

Well why not start a party with like minded persons? If you can't find like minded people, it would suggest your views are in the minority.

This country is a centrist, conservative country. We are that way because, in general, we have a stable economy and decent living conditions. We have reasonable health care, high life expectancy, low crime, above average education system and good welfare systems.

The electorate like to return FF govts, as they are the party that most closely reflects the people. Occasionally FF drive the ship onto the rocks and the electorate can't bring themselve to vote for them. They opt for the other centrist party, FG. FG get given their turn for a while before the FF status quo returns.

I'm not a centrist voter, personally, but I can't bemoan the fact that the majority of the country doesn't share my opinion. As the great philosopher (Dunphy) says - that's politics baby!

Seth Brundle

Joeytheparrot wrote: »

FF are the same as FG. Same right wing politics. Same careerist attitudes. Never voted either of them them and never will.

Neither FF nor FG are right wing :rolleyes:

Boggles

salmocab wrote: »

That’s exactly my point, you only have to keep the constituents happy, that doesn’t make you a good politician for the country.

Constituents are the country. FG or FF policies don't always filter down and help at a local level.

How do you define "a good politician for the country"?

salmocab

Boggles wrote: »

Constituents are the country. FG or FF policies don't always filter down and help at a local level.

How do you define "a good politician for the country"?

Fair question, it’s hard to define but certainly someone that won’t vote along party lines if they genuinely don’t believe it’s best for the country or will risk the ire of their constituents for something they know is right. Also being in opposition shouldn’t mean opposing everything. An Australian leader of I think Queensland years ago when they brought in gun control knew he would lose his job but did it anyway because it was the right thing to do. That’s leadership.

Boggles

salmocab wrote: »

Fair question, it’s hard to define but certainly someone that won’t vote along party lines if they genuinely don’t believe it’s best for the country or will risk the ire of their constituents for something they know is right.

The Whip system makes that pretty redundant.

Any dissent we have seen is usually personal choice or based on religion or morality, which when analysed wouldn't be what is best for the country or society.

I agree though effective opposition is very important.

salmocab

Boggles wrote: »

The Whip system makes that pretty redundant.

Any dissent we have seen is usually personal choice or based on religion or morality, which when analysed wouldn't be what is best for the country or society.

I agree though effective opposition is very important.

I don’t think other countries take the whip as far as we do, not that I’d be holding the English up as the way to go but I think they often vote as they want and only really use the whip for certain items. We just seem to use it for everything and that’s across the main parties.

Boggles

salmocab wrote: »

I don’t think other countries take the whip as far as we do, not that I’d be holding the English up as the way to go but I think they often vote as they want and only really use the whip for certain items. We just seem to use it for everything and that’s across the main parties.

The English take it to the extreme as well. Wasn't 20 odd members expelled from the conservative party for voting against Bozo not so long ago?

Free votes are as rare as here as is defying the Whip.

touts

McMurphy wrote: »

What's your own thoughts on the story?

All I can take from your op is that you copied and pasted a fairly short snippet of info from the link, gave no opinion of your own on the matter, and then said something about negative fg stories.

I mean people might be forgiven for thinking you didn't actually give a sh1t about the "gourging" of the senator, you just want a story to divert from FG

Martin should give your man his marching orders imo. No use shouting from the rafters at others if you're going to be all trousers and no arse when your own lads caught at it.

Fine Gael staffers in their social media spin department dont have any thoughts. Only talking points handed to them by the Communications Director.

Jinglejangle69

touts wrote: »

Fine Gael staffers in their social media spin department dont have any thoughts. Only talking points handed to them by the Communications Director.

Pathetic.

touts

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

Pathetic.

Hit a nerve did we. You getting overtime for this? Redacted must be pumping money into his party for the election.

Shefwedfan

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

Pathetic.

Yes it is a fairly pathetic thread alright

JohnnyFlash

touts wrote: »

Fine Gael staffers in their social media spin department dont have any thoughts. Only talking points handed to them by the Communications Director.

Treble time over Christmas, dude.

Jinglejangle69

Shefwedfan wrote: »

Yes it is a fairly pathetic thread alright

Awh it’s not portraying FG in a bad light, sorry about that.

You boys can’t have it all your own way in current affairs all the time:)

Jinglejangle69

touts wrote: »

Hit a nerve did we. You getting overtime for this? Redacted must be pumping money into his party for the election.

No I just think it’s pathetic that you believe the nonsense your typing!!

Proper loony tin foil hat stuff:)

Seth Brundle

touts wrote: »

Fine Gael staffers in their social media spin department dont have any thoughts. Only talking points handed to them by the Communications Director.

In fairness, every party will have a social media team who take direction from a Comms director.
What's your point or is it simply a deflection from FF?

Jinglejangle69

Seth Brundle wrote: »

In fairness, every party will have a social media team who take direction from a Comms director.
What's your point or is it simply a deflection from FF?

Exhibit B.

The poster doesn’t realise he’s part of a spin unit himself on boards:)

Beasty

touts wrote: »

Fine Gael staffers in their social media spin department dont have any thoughts. Only talking points handed to them by the Communications Director.

Attack the post, not the poster

Annasopra

Mortelaro wrote: »

I don't think left wing is in the ascendancy either though or ever is it
Right wing is perceived as wrong but all it is ,is the embodiment of selfishness
Everybody is selfish
Anyone that says they aren't is a liar

Selfishness though should have some limits,let's call that decency
Slopping too much from the trough is indecent
Being ambitious or careerist is not
Limit incentives and you will get sloth
Get more and more sloth and you'll get a failing economy

I couldnt care less if left wing is ascending or not I will never support right wing politics.