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Getting spare key (without master key) - Cork

  • 09-10-2019 10:53am
    #1
    enrique66_35
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 277 ✭✭


    I recently bought a FZ6s from a dealer here in Cork and the bike only came with the one key (black case) and its seen some use!
    Just wondering if anyone knows if its possible to make a copy of that key (including the transponder chip for the immobiliser) without the red master key?
    If so, any recommendations for someone in Cork who can do it?

    I emailed Ross Motorcycles given they're Yamaha dealers and haven't gotten an answer.

    Any ideas/similar experiences welcome!


Comments

  • #2
    CJhaughey
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,907 ✭✭✭✭CJhaughey


    enrique66_35 wrote: »
    I recently bought a FZ6s from a dealer here in Cork and the bike only came with the one key (black case) and its seen some use!
    Just wondering if anyone knows if its possible to make a copy of that key (including the transponder chip for the immobiliser) without the red master key?
    If so, any recommendations for someone in Cork who can do it?

    I emailed Ross Motorcycles given they're Yamaha dealers and haven't gotten an answer.

    Any ideas/similar experiences welcome!
    Ring them, forget emails they don't work in Ireland.;)


  • #3
    galwaytt
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,822 ✭✭✭✭galwaytt


    I don't know about the FZ6, but a friend had that issue with and FJR and the answer was 'No'. New ECU & lockset required.

    Ode To The Motorist

    “And my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, generates funds to the exchequer. You don't want to acknowledge that as truth because, deep down in places you don't talk about at the Green Party, you want me on that road, you need me on that road. We use words like freedom, enjoyment, sport and community. We use these words as the backbone of a life spent instilling those values in our families and loved ones. You use them as a punch line. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the tax revenue and the very freedom to spend it that I provide, and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said "thank you" and went on your way. Otherwise I suggest you pick up a bus pass and get the ********* ********* off the road” 



  • #4
    zubair
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,459 ✭✭✭zubair


    It's definitely been done before but the general belief is that it's not possible. This is probably due to how yamaha communicate it.


  • #5
    enrique66_35
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 277 ✭✭enrique66_35


    That's what I feared...I'll give Ross a ring when I get a chance and have it confirmed!

    Not exactly comparing apples and oranges but I had an issue previously where I lost the transponder chip from one key to a Toyota Hilux but was able to programme a new chip using a vehicle's ECU and the other working key. Took a series of key in and out of ignition and opening and closing the driver's door a set number of times but it worked.


  • #6
    galwaytt
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,822 ✭✭✭✭galwaytt


    Try someone like Autokey or the Lock Doctor: they do a lot of car keys, so may have seen a Yamaha before.

    Ode To The Motorist

    “And my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, generates funds to the exchequer. You don't want to acknowledge that as truth because, deep down in places you don't talk about at the Green Party, you want me on that road, you need me on that road. We use words like freedom, enjoyment, sport and community. We use these words as the backbone of a life spent instilling those values in our families and loved ones. You use them as a punch line. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the tax revenue and the very freedom to spend it that I provide, and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said "thank you" and went on your way. Otherwise I suggest you pick up a bus pass and get the ********* ********* off the road” 



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  • #7
    zubair
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,459 ✭✭✭zubair


    galwaytt wrote: »
    Try someone like Autokey or the Lock Doctor: they do a lot of car keys, so may have seen a Yamaha before.

    Yes. And if you find somewhere that has uncut yamaha keys your chances might be better, not sure if that would make a difference but it could help. I think it can be done the same as any other bike though, I suspect the whole red key thing is poor communication from yamaha and then the urban legend started.


  • #8
    CJhaughey
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,907 ✭✭✭✭CJhaughey


    Try this crowd, but do it soon...
    http://motomatrix.co.uk/


  • #9
    pappy1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17 ✭pappy1


    Did you try getting a standard key cut and holding your original key right next to it (new key going in and original key upside down or at a 90 degree angle)
    Works for me with me hornet for fooling the hiss/ecu
    I know it does not get you a spare key but at least you will have a new one

    Also the chip in my key is encrypted only Honda could make me a copy
    But I found a place in dub city centre that done it for half the price


  • #10
    CJhaughey
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,907 ✭✭✭✭CJhaughey


    HISS can code a new key onboard, you don't need a master key just a chipped blank.


  • #11
    enrique66_35
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 277 ✭✭enrique66_35


    Thanks for the suggestions everyone. Sent a message to motomatrix so will update when I hear back. Will also try Autokey as was suggested earlier as well.


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  • #12
    enrique66_35
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 277 ✭✭enrique66_35


    Just a quick update - Motomatrix can do it for £65 per cloned key plus £5 postage back to me plus whatever An Post charge to post the original key over to them to start with.
    Autokey - waiting to hear from their bike locksmith. Ideally he can do it on site since I believe its a mobile unit that covers Cork and avoids sending the only working key in the post.
    If I have to post it, I'd be inclined to go with Motomatrix seeing as they specialise in this job and the response was really quick.


  • #13
    enrique66_35
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 277 ✭✭enrique66_35


    zubair wrote: »
    Yes. And if you find somewhere that has uncut yamaha keys your chances might be better, not sure if that would make a difference but it could help. I think it can be done the same as any other bike though, I suspect the whole red key thing is poor communication from yamaha and then the urban legend started.

    From a bit of internet research it seems the red key is what a dealer or indeed anyone can use to programme in new blank keys by following a timed sequence of turning the bike on and off.
    I could source a transponder chip & get a blank cut but without the red "master" key I don't think its possible to programme the new key with just the working black key - i.e. can't put the ECU in programming mode other than with red key. I'm happy to be proven wrong as that route would avoid sending the working key in the post :eek:


  • #14
    TeaBagMania
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,192 ✭✭✭TeaBagMania


    enrique66_35 wrote: »
    I recently bought a FZ6s from a dealer here in Cork and the bike only came with the one key (black case)

    have you contacted the dealer you purchased from? they should step up and assist you with this matter


  • #15
    zubair
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,459 ✭✭✭zubair


    enrique66_35 wrote: »
    From a bit of internet research it seems the red key is what a dealer or indeed anyone can use to programme in new blank keys by following a timed sequence of turning the bike on and off.
    I could source a transponder chip & get a blank cut but without the red "master" key I don't think its possible to programme the new key with just the working black key - i.e. can't put the ECU in programming mode other than with red key. I'm happy to be proven wrong as that route would avoid sending the working key in the post :eek:

    I wouldn't be sending my only working key in the post for starters. Secondly, you're still unsure if it's possible to copy the black, I think it is, but it would be better to be at the bike to test it and to avoid any hassle afterwards.


  • #16
    enrique66_35
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 277 ✭✭enrique66_35


    Yeah I'm a bit nervous about that (posting the key) even though motomatrix say they can clone the black key without needing the red key or access to the bike.

    Gonna contact autokey again and see if their locksmith can do the work on site. Misplaced the key for about ten minutes the other day and the panicky search convinced me I definitely need to have a spare!


  • #17
    enrique66_35
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 277 ✭✭enrique66_35


    Just an update for anyone who's interested...
    Autokey - can do it while I wait but I need to bring the bike to them in Newlands Cross - €80. Can also do it by post but I've backed off that idea in case the key is lost plus the turnaround time.
    LockDoctor - their guy can come to me and do it on site (great!!) but €160!:eek:
    Motomatrix - needs me to post the key to them (cost £65 per key + £5 postage) - non runner due to risk of key being lost in post.

    Any other suggestions welcome but TBH even for the price, the convenience of Lockdoctor coming to me and doing it at my home on a Saturday might be worth it!


  • #18
    GBX
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,133 ✭✭✭✭GBX


    I'd be getting Lockdoctor out given your location. As getting the bike either you or somebody else (van or a mate driving and covering petrol) up the motorway to Dublin to Autokey will cost more than the extra €80.


  • #19
    galwaytt
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,822 ✭✭✭✭galwaytt


    enrique66_35 wrote: »
    Just an update for anyone who's interested...
    Autokey - can do it while I wait but I need to bring the bike to them in Newlands Cross - €80. Can also do it by post but I've backed off that idea in case the key is lost plus the turnaround time.
    LockDoctor - their guy can come to me and do it on site (great!!) but €160!:eek:
    Motomatrix - needs me to post the key to them (cost £65 per key + £5 postage) - non runner due to risk of key being lost in post.

    Any other suggestions welcome but TBH even for the price, the convenience of Lockdoctor coming to me and doing it at my home on a Saturday might be worth it!

    €160 is nothing if you lose the only key you have........can you not ride the bike to them ? (where are you based ?)

    Ode To The Motorist

    “And my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, generates funds to the exchequer. You don't want to acknowledge that as truth because, deep down in places you don't talk about at the Green Party, you want me on that road, you need me on that road. We use words like freedom, enjoyment, sport and community. We use these words as the backbone of a life spent instilling those values in our families and loved ones. You use them as a punch line. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the tax revenue and the very freedom to spend it that I provide, and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said "thank you" and went on your way. Otherwise I suggest you pick up a bus pass and get the ********* ********* off the road” 



  • #20
    enrique66_35
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 277 ✭✭enrique66_35


    galwaytt wrote: »
    €160 is nothing if you lose the only key you have........can you not ride the bike to them ? (where are you based ?)

    I'm in Cork - the lady I spoke to from Lockdoctor said their guy could meet me either at home or work. I think it's mobile unit and as it was an 01 number I guess their offices are in Dublin. I was waiting on a callback/email on Friday to arrange a time which never arrived :rolleyes:


  • #21
    galwaytt
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,822 ✭✭✭✭galwaytt


    enrique66_35 wrote: »
    I'm in Cork - the lady I spoke to from Lockdoctor said their guy could meet me either at home or work. I think it's mobile unit and as it was an 01 number I guess their offices are in Dublin. I was waiting on a callback/email on Friday to arrange a time which never arrived :rolleyes:

    Lock Doctor are all over the country - including Cork ! :P

    https://lockdoctor.ie/locksmiths-cork/

    Ode To The Motorist

    “And my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, generates funds to the exchequer. You don't want to acknowledge that as truth because, deep down in places you don't talk about at the Green Party, you want me on that road, you need me on that road. We use words like freedom, enjoyment, sport and community. We use these words as the backbone of a life spent instilling those values in our families and loved ones. You use them as a punch line. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the tax revenue and the very freedom to spend it that I provide, and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said "thank you" and went on your way. Otherwise I suggest you pick up a bus pass and get the ********* ********* off the road” 



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  • #22
    enrique66_35
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 277 ✭✭enrique66_35


    galwaytt wrote: »
    Lock Doctor are all over the country - including Cork ! :P

    https://lockdoctor.ie/locksmiths-cork/

    They may say they cover Cork but there's no Cork address listed - the pin on the map is just for "Cork, Ireland". Their head office is in Limerick alright and the impression I got on the phone was the guy covering Cork was a mobile unit. I'll let ye know if I'm right if I can ever get a call back!:rolleyes:


  • #23
    galwaytt
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,822 ✭✭✭✭galwaytt


    enrique66_35 wrote: »
    They may say they cover Cork but there's no Cork address listed - the pin on the map is just for "Cork, Ireland". Their head office is in Limerick alright and the impression I got on the phone was the guy covering Cork was a mobile unit. I'll let ye know if I'm right if I can ever get a call back!:rolleyes:

    aha, didn't twig that.

    Ode To The Motorist

    “And my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, generates funds to the exchequer. You don't want to acknowledge that as truth because, deep down in places you don't talk about at the Green Party, you want me on that road, you need me on that road. We use words like freedom, enjoyment, sport and community. We use these words as the backbone of a life spent instilling those values in our families and loved ones. You use them as a punch line. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the tax revenue and the very freedom to spend it that I provide, and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said "thank you" and went on your way. Otherwise I suggest you pick up a bus pass and get the ********* ********* off the road” 



  • #24
    Hotblack Desiato
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 36,450 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    Did you contact the dealer you bought the bike from? They shouldn't be selling the bike with one key if it's chipped etc. Amateurish enough with a plain metal key.

    In Cavan there was a great fire / Judge McCarthy was sent to inquire / It would be a shame / If the nuns were to blame / So it had to be caused by a wire.



  • #25
    enrique66_35
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 277 ✭✭enrique66_35


    Hotblack Desiato wrote: »
    Did you contact the dealer you bought the bike from? They shouldn't be selling the bike with one key if it's chipped etc. Amateurish enough with a plain metal key.

    No I haven't contacted them since but I did ask when I went to pick it up and the guy said that was the only key there for it. I was too excited to bring the bike home to push the issue, perhaps foolishly. :o Gonna give LockDoctor and the dealer a call this morning to try and get this sorted.


  • #26
    TeaBagMania
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,192 ✭✭✭TeaBagMania


    Hotblack Desiato wrote: »
    Did you contact the dealer you bought the bike from? They shouldn't be selling the bike with one key if it's chipped etc. Amateurish enough with a plain metal key.

    i asked that same question on post #14, now i know why i didn't get a response
    enrique66_35 wrote: »
    No I haven't contacted them since but I did ask when I went to pick it up and the guy said that was the only key there for it. I was too excited to bring the bike home to push the issue, perhaps foolishly. :o Gonna give LockDoctor and the dealer a call this morning to try and get this sorted.

    Yes, very foolish
    Hope it was worth it because now "you're" paying for it


  • #27
    enrique66_35
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 277 ✭✭enrique66_35


    Rang the dealer and it rang out - unlikely they have a spare knocking around they forgot to give me anyhow. Rang LockDoctor and their guy in the Cork area was on holidays this week which would explain the lack of callback. Guy I spoke to said he was putting it up on the board (for what that's worth) and should hopefully get a call early next week to arrange a time for the locksmith to do the job.

    @TeaBagMania - I got what I believed was a good deal on the bike which is also my first bike so I admit I got carried away on the day but I wouldn't trade having the bike to ride when the weather was still decent for the €160 its gonna cost me for the spare.
    If I had insisted on the dealer getting spare cut before taking the bike I would have lost some/all of that time - my opinion and as they guy said opinions are like butt-holes, everyone's got one and they all stink! :D


  • #28
    enrique66_35
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 277 ✭✭enrique66_35


    Just to update - Graham from Lock Doctor is coming tomorrow to cut and programme the spare, was supposed to be last Saturday but delayed waiting for the blank blade to be sent down from head office in Limerick. Cost is €140 as I'm outside the city, would have been €120 in the city. I'll update when its done.


  • #29
    blade1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,605 ✭✭✭✭blade1


    enrique66_35 wrote: »
    Just to update - Graham from Lock Doctor is coming tomorrow to cut and programme the spare, was supposed to be last Saturday but delayed waiting for the blank blade to be sent down from head office in Limerick. Cost is €140 as I'm outside the city, would have been €120 in the city. I'll update when its done.

    I'd be looking for a guarantee before paying.


  • #30
    enrique66_35
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 277 ✭✭enrique66_35


    To bring this saga to a close...Graham did the job Saturday gone, was an absolute gent, in contact via Whatsapp throughout and done in about 30 minutes. I was pleased to see from a security point of view that they required a photo ID from me and recorded the licence plate of the bike, invoice issued by email on the Monday (I paid on the day so was already marked paid).
    Needless to say, the key works perfectly and as its a clone of the existing key it wont affect the ECU's two key limit.

    I mentioned I might look into getting a Yamaha branded blank off Ebay as they one supplied was a generic blue one and Graham produced an extra transponder chip and gave me the key blade pattern number at no extra cost which I was delighted with. Hope I haven't gotten him in trouble by revealing that publicly!

    Apologies if this reads a bit like a customer review but I am genuinely delighted with the service and would recommend to anyone who has a similar issue.
    Special thanks to galwaytt for the recommendation!


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  • #31
    zubair
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,459 ✭✭✭zubair


    That's great to hear, so have we also poo poo'd the idea that black Yamaha keys can't be cloned?


  • #32
    enrique66_35
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 277 ✭✭enrique66_35


    zubair wrote: »
    That's great to hear, so have we also poo poo'd the idea that black Yamaha keys can't be cloned?

    Correct, the black key was all I had for a 07 Fz6 and they were able to copy the chip and replicate as many clones of it as needed. If you wanted to add a new different chip ID to the ECU (eg to replace lost keys) you would need the red master key or a reprogramming of the ECU but where a black key is available, the cloned key works perfectly and you could in theory have as many "spare" keys which are copies of the original as you like.

    Can't say if newer bikes might have more sophisticated ECUs/transponder chips for which this wouldn't work but I'm happy and that's all that matters! ;);)


  • #33
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Slight thread hijack but can ducati keys be cloned? My multistrada only came with one key fob and I have no idea what the pin code is if that goes missing or breaks. I'm paranoid in case I lose the key!


  • #34
    enrique66_35
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 277 ✭✭enrique66_35


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Slight thread hijack but can ducati keys be cloned? My multistrada only came with one key fob and I have no idea what the pin code is if that goes missing or breaks. I'm paranoid in case I lose the key!

    I'd strongly recommend looking into getting a spare then or even keeping the original in a safe place and using the clone for day to day. Give LockDoctor a call (https://lockdoctor.ie/locations/) and put it to them. Autokey might also be able to do it but you need to bring the bike to them in Dublin. Good luck with it!


  • #35
    galwaytt
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,822 ✭✭✭✭galwaytt


    zubair wrote: »
    That's great to hear, so have we also poo poo'd the idea that black Yamaha Any keys can't be cloned?


    Indeed. You can substitute anything for Yamaha in the above.

    2, 3, 4 or 10 wheels, doesn't matter.

    There's always a guy on a laptop, somewhere, cracking this stuff.

    Ode To The Motorist

    “And my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, generates funds to the exchequer. You don't want to acknowledge that as truth because, deep down in places you don't talk about at the Green Party, you want me on that road, you need me on that road. We use words like freedom, enjoyment, sport and community. We use these words as the backbone of a life spent instilling those values in our families and loved ones. You use them as a punch line. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the tax revenue and the very freedom to spend it that I provide, and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said "thank you" and went on your way. Otherwise I suggest you pick up a bus pass and get the ********* ********* off the road” 



  • #36
    enrique66_35
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 277 ✭✭enrique66_35


    galwaytt wrote: »
    Indeed. You can substitute anything for Yamaha in the above.

    2, 3, 4 or 10 wheels, doesn't matter.

    There's always a guy on a laptop, somewhere, cracking this stuff.

    Too right, the yoke the chap from LockDoctor used was like a handheld barcode scanner that he put the key in the tray and read the code within a few seconds. Kinda scary if it fell into the wrong hands really.


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