Simon Harris. Buzz Killington

Ralph Ciffereto

Not content with trying to make a few cans in your mates gaff up to half the cost of a night in the pub, the boy king has dreamt up more nonsense to push.


https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/health/alcohol-crackdown-cheap-drink-deals-to-take-a-hit-and-shoppers-wont-get-loyalty-points-38496566.html

I

What's coming next? Raising the age limit to 21? State off licences, sparse in umber, like in Sweden? Some sort of stealth law that will try force Wetherspoons out of the country, like a minimum price per pint within certain council areas? It seems the 3 day promotions law will force them to get rid of the 2.25 pints of Fosters they run on Mondays (or ran at least, it was great last summer to watch a whole night of world cup ball and have change from a 20)

I was in Australia for a year some years ago. In some ways it had a lot to show us the right way things were done. Nightclubs open until nearly 5am, some other bars essentially open 23 hours day, it was a great time to be alive as a young lad.

In other ways the state intervention in your life was Orwellian. Take home alcohol could only be bought at an actual off licence or supermarket- no getting a few from a local Centra equivalent or a petrol station. Anyone serving alcohol, be it a pub, nightclub or off licence, had to complete a one day alcohol awareness course. Christ, anyone working in a venue with a gambling machine (i.e. most Aussie pubs) needed a gambling awareness ticket. As for being out drinking, less salubrious bars would have marshals wandering through handing out bottles of water and giving people 30 minute time outs from the bar, more if you weren't a regular than if you were drunk.
Since I lived there they have essentially killed the Sydney nightlife. 10am closing for off licences (something this dump preceded them in circa 2008), earlier closing for most bars and nightclubs, the city is dead now.

All of the above was part of the reason I could never settle there, the over reaching arm of the state getting into you at every corner. They even have sniffer dogs at train station barriers- not to catch the thousands of aggressive meth addicts roaming the streets but rather to get kids carrying weed, young people heading to clubs with a pill or a bag of white on them.

But let's face it, minimum alcohol pricing, opening hours, the decline of club culture, we're dying a death thanks to vengeful nerds like Simon who seem to have a pathological hatred of young people having the type of fun he never did.

Is there a site showing what **** in the Dail voted to pass this wretched bill?

biko

.

Alcohol crackdown: Cheap drink deals to take a hit and shoppers won't get loyalty points
Cut price and short term deals also facing ban
Certain special offers will also be cut out

Eric Cartman

Why does he have to ruin everything good

Pauliedragon

Yet I'm on a 2 year waiting list for a 20 minute eye test too see if I'm slowly going blind or not. Nice to see the priorities are in order. Cheers Simon don't forget to bring in a rule where all off licenses have to have pricing in braille.

elperello

Ralph Ciffereto wrote: »

Not content with trying to make a few cans in your mates gaff up to half the cost of a night in the pub, the boy king has dreamt up more nonsense to push.


https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/health/alcohol-crackdown-cheap-drink-deals-to-take-a-hit-and-shoppers-wont-get-loyalty-points-38496566.html

I

What's coming next? Raising the age limit to 21? State off licences, sparse in umber, like in Sweden? Some sort of stealth law that will try force Wetherspoons out of the country, like a minimum price per pint within certain council areas? It seems the 3 day promotions law will force them to get rid of the 2.25 pints of Fosters they run on Mondays (or ran at least, it was great last summer to watch a whole night of world cup ball and have change from a 20)

I was in Australia for a year some years ago. In some ways it had a lot to show us the right way things were done. Nightclubs open until nearly 5am, some other bars essentially open 23 hours day, it was a great time to be alive as a young lad.

In other ways the state intervention in your life was Orwellian. Take home alcohol could only be bought at an actual off licence or supermarket- no getting a few from a local Centra equivalent or a petrol station. Anyone serving alcohol, be it a pub, nightclub or off licence, had to complete a one day alcohol awareness course. Christ, anyone working in a venue with a gambling machine (i.e. most Aussie pubs) needed a gambling awareness ticket. As for being out drinking, less salubrious bars would have marshals wandering through handing out bottles of water and giving people 30 minute time outs from the bar, more if you weren't a regular than if you were drunk.
Since I lived there they have essentially killed the Sydney nightlife. 10am closing for off licences (something this dump preceded them in circa 2008), earlier closing for most bars and nightclubs, the city is dead now.

All of the above was part of the reason I could never settle there, the over reaching arm of the state getting into you at every corner. They even have sniffer dogs at train station barriers- not to catch the thousands of aggressive meth addicts roaming the streets but rather to get kids carrying weed, young people heading to clubs with a pill or a bag of white on them.

But let's face it, minimum alcohol pricing, opening hours, the decline of club culture, we're dying a death thanks to vengeful nerds like Simon who seem to have a pathological hatred of young people having the type of fun he never did.

Is there a site showing what **** in the Dail voted to pass this wretched bill?

Hate to be the bearer of bad news but this stupid Bill is supported by all the main parties FG FF LAB SF etc. and not a peep out of the Independents either.

Long running thread about it here - https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057676265&page=260

lawred2

Pauliedragon wrote: »

Yet I'm on a 2 year waiting list for a 20 minute eye test too see if I'm slowly going blind or not. Nice to see the priorities are in order. Cheers Simon don't forget to bring in a rule where all off licenses have to have pricing in braille.

Maybe things might be better if the HSE wasn't spending so much on alcohol related injuries and illnesses.

Ralph Ciffereto

elperello wrote: »

[/B]


Hate to be the bearer of bad news but this stupid Bill is supported by all the main parties FG FF LAB SF etc. and not a peep out of the Independents either.

Long running thread about it here - https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057676265&page=260

Did any members dissent on this? Surely it wasn't fairly unanimous.

I'd be a reluctant FF or FG voter anyway as I can't stand the left, but to think they didn't try and stop this is madness.

elperello

lawred2 wrote: »

Maybe things night be better if the HSE wasn't spending so much on alcohol related injuries and illnesses.

Maybe.
However, it's not the purchase of drink that causes health problems it's how it is consumed.
This law penalise's people who drink sensibly as well as abusers and does nothing at all to address problem drinking in pubs or clubs.

elperello

Ralph Ciffereto wrote: »

Did any members dissent on this? Surely it wasn't fairly unanimous.

I'd be a reluctant FF or FG voter anyway as I can't stand the left, but to think they didn't try and stop this is madness.

Yes it was.
The only dissenting voice in the Oireachtas was Senator/Prof. Sean Barrett an economist from TCD. He correctly pointed out that the extra which will be paid by the consumer is a direct gift to the drinks industry. The only gain for the exchequer is the VAT which will be displaced from other purchases anyway.

Pauliedragon

lawred2 wrote: »

Maybe things might be better if the HSE wasn't spending so much on alcohol related injuries and illnesses.

And you think these proposals will change that?

lawred2

Pauliedragon wrote: »

And you think these proposals will change that?

It won't make it worse anyway

paw patrol

lawred2 wrote: »

Maybe things might be better if the HSE wasn't spending so much on alcohol related injuries and illnesses.

society should have the pay the bills for people who misbehave.
medical bills for drunken misadventure could easily be charged to the offenders.

but instead it the population who'll pay.

harris is a gob****e but so are the rest of them for going along with it.

paw patrol

lawred2 wrote: »

It won't make it worse anyway

unless people drive north to buy cheap booze by the ton and then we see the Revenue lose out

TuringBot47

Pauliedragon wrote: »

Yet I'm on a 2 year waiting list for a 20 minute eye test too see if I'm slowly going blind or not. Nice to see the priorities are in order.

Well you could pay to get your eyes privately checked.
How much would it cost for a private consultation? €100 ?
Or even a trip to SpecSavers for a routine test?

Nice to see your priorities are in order too.

In Ireland we do abuse alcohol, it's the focus of every event, college, work, weddings, funerals, birthdays, anniversarys.

So unless we end up with some state card giving everyone an allowance per week (again which can be bypassed) then people are given the freedom to self destructive behaviour.

Kermit.de.frog

So many seem to be in denial about this country's crisis with alcohol.

This is a good start but harsher policies are needed in my opinion.

Another thing that needs to be challenged is advertising and how this country is promoted and associated with drink around the world. On the latter there is no virtue in promoting your country as a land of alcoholics (and then Irish people get offended abroad when they are referred to as drunks). What goes around comes around with that. This nonsense with associating Guinness for example (run by a British company) with our country - I can't understand why that is allowed to continue unchecked (for example like every high profile guest has to have a pint of guinness in public (Obama, the Queen etc...).

So good start by the government ending cheap deals and cheap selling but they need to go further in my opinion.

As for the OP - you describe the young late night drinking culture in Dublin as fun. Go in to Dublin City Center most nights after 12 am as a sober person and "fun" is not how most would describe it.

drunkmonkey

All he's missing is the SS uniform.

Pauliedragon

lawred2 wrote: »

It won't make it worse anyway

It won't make it worse so basically these new laws won't change anything with drunken fools. We're gonna spend god knows how much changing legislation that will have no effect. Makes perfect sense. It costs an absolute fortune in lawyers fees to even make the smallest change in law. Other countries with the same expenditure on drunks don't have waiting lists explain that? I worked in pubs/nightclubs for 20 years if people want to get hammered they will end of.

gctest50

lawred2 wrote: »

Maybe things might be better if the HSE wasn't spending so much on alcohol related injuries and illnesses.

Maybe things might be better if the HSE wasn't spending so much on compensation for avoidable errors :

Between 2013 and 2017, the State has paid

€448,686,570

to settle claims against the HSE out of court.

drunkmonkey

and that doesn't include the cervical check debacle which is still ongoing.

punisher5112

Oh how sick of these fools I am ....


I can't afford to go out and hardly able to afford to drink in....

If these deals are gone then I'll be buying bulk outside the state when possible.

893bet

He is moron.

LiamoSail

I dislike these measures as much as the next lover of a few cans, but the evidence suggests such measures are effective.

Allinall

punisher5112 wrote: »

Oh how sick of these fools I am ....


I can't afford to go out and hardly able to afford to drink in....

If these deals are gone then I'll be buying bulk outside the state when possible.

You sound like you have a drink problem.

There’s lots of things I’d love to do but can’t afford them.

Guess what? I just don’t do them.

drunkmonkey

LiamoSail wrote: »

I dislike these measures as much as the next lover of a few cans, but the evidence suggests such measures are effective.

In driving people to drugs.

Scotland alcohol consumption has declined but their drug related deaths have increased at a huge rate since the price increase.

punisher5112

Allinall wrote: »

You sound like you have a drink problem.

There’s lots of things I’d love to do but can’t afford them.

Guess what? I just don’t do them.

Yeah I drink 24 /7.....

Will ya ever cop on will ya....

Why can't I have a few beers every so often.... I shouldn't be penalised for doing so.

lawred2

gctest50 wrote: »

Maybe things might be better if the HSE wasn't spending so much on compensation for avoidable errors :

You're 100% right. Shambles of an organization.

However what has that do with alcohol related illnesses or injuries being covered by the taxpayer?

Atlantic Dawn

If only we had serious problems that need to be tackled like housing and insurance that the same energy could be channelled in to fixing.

Have they done studies of countries around the world with alcohol 50% the price of here, perhaps that's the solution.

Allinall

punisher5112 wrote: »

Yeah I drink 24 /7.....

Will ya ever cop on will ya....

Why can't I have a few beers every so often.... I shouldn't be penalised for doing so.

If you can afford it, then no problem. Work away.

Nobody is penalising you.

The Satanist

I remember the circle jerking done when they managed to get a pint of Guinness into Barack Obama. It's not so much the actions of politicians that annoys the **** out of me, It's the sheer hypocrisy. They would sell their mothers to get a selfie with Donald Trump and a pint of Guinness.

DeanAustin

The Satanist wrote: »

I remember the circle jerking done when they managed to get a pint of Guinness into Barack Obama. It's not so much the actions of politicians that annoys the **** out of me, It's the sheer hypocrisy. They would sell their mothers to get a selfie with Donald Trump and a pint of Guinness.

That's not just politicians to be fair. You can bet your bottom dollar most people in this country would be reaching for the smartphone if they ran into Trump regardless of their stated opinion about him.

punisher5112

Allinall wrote: »

If you can afford it, then no problem. Work away.

Nobody is penalising you.

Oh they will be.... I work hard and play hard.....

I work hard for tha money, so hard for tha money.

Outlaw Pete

The public gets the politicians they deserve at the end of the day.

People were happy enough to buy into this man's bull**** when he was clearly lying and pandering, just because it was what they wanted to hear at the time. No amount of pointing out how disingenuous he was being would suffice, people didn't want to hear it, he was doing what they wanted him to do and that was all that mattered. Nevermind that he was lying, he wasn't walking on them, twas the other people, and so was grand. Well now he's more indiscriminate about who he walks on.

Sciprio

The Satanist wrote: »

I remember the circle jerking done when they managed to get a pint of Guinness into Barack Obama. It's not so much the actions of politicians that annoys the **** out of me, It's the sheer hypocrisy. They would sell their mothers to get a selfie with Donald Trump and a pint of Guinness.

That's always bugged me as well. Complain about Irelands drinking culture and yet anyone that's famous gets a pint of Guinness shoved in their face. Hypocrites!

Annasopra

elperello wrote: »

Maybe.
However, it's not the purchase of drink that causes health problems it's how it is consumed.
This law penalise's people who drink sensibly as well as abusers and does nothing at all to address problem drinking in pubs or clubs.

Huh? There's no problem drinking in homes?

Annasopra

drunkmonkey wrote: »

In driving people to drugs.

Scotland alcohol consumption has declined but their drug related deaths have increased at a huge rate since the price increase.

Is there evidence of links?

The Late Late Show

It is time Simon Harris (who himself drinks) abandons this nonsense. It seems to originate from a doctor who is a member of a Catholic splinter cult and passing off nonsense due to his faith rather than his profession (by the way, Catholics don't ban alcohol. Neither did Muslims (early Muslims had communion like ceremonies with wine even) until someone got the idea they did and became leader of Saudi Arabia. So this doctor could be part of the newfound Wahhabi style Catholics) as medical science. Cynically, the pub brigade join forces with this doctor to work against a common enemy: cheap alcohol in Tesco, etc.

People should meet with Harris is his constituency and lobby him to drop this nonsense. At the moment, I an coincidentally reading and enjoying The Testaments. That and its famous predecessor The Handmaid's Tale show us flashbacks of how oppression comes about in piecemeal. Misogyny, racism and sectarianism were the motives in these books but here a focus on health extremism and it being passed off as normal science is the preferred fascism. That and insurance industry left hike their premiums.

“​Now I'm awake to the world. I was asleep before. That's how we let it happen. When they slaughtered Congress, we didn't wake up. When they blamed terrorists and suspended the constitution, we didn't wake up then, either. Nothing changes instantaneously. In a gradually heating bathtub, you'd be boiled to death before you knew it.”

― Margaret Atwood

Remember that, before Harris gives us our health-based Gilead. There is a drive to make pubs and offlicences owned by pubs the only sellers of alcohol and dear prices. Like Gilead had nothing to do with religion and all to do with male white power, Harris' agenda is all about pubs and tax.

This is the cult by the way:

The Pioneer Total Abstinence Association of the Sacred Heart.

Sounds very Gilead/Handmaid's Tale/Testaments to me. Blessed be the fruit, may the lord open. Blessed be the fruit of the vine, I say.

completedit

The very fact people take issue with a picture of Obama with a Guiness shows how odd this countries attitude to alcohol is. It's just a drink, it's just alcohol but we have made it to be this taboo thing that yet somehow is ubiquitous in our culture. This creates a forbidden fruit effect and results in the binge drinking culture

lawred2

elperello wrote: »

Maybe.
However, it's not the purchase of drink that causes health problems it's how it is consumed.
This law penalise's people who drink sensibly as well as abusers and does nothing at all to address problem drinking in pubs or clubs.

How can you separate consumption of alcohol from where alcohol is purchased in bulk?

drunkmonkey

drunkmonkey wrote: »

In driving people to drugs.

And this is the single biggest issue I can see with this. The sheer amount of illegal, yet widely available drugs circulating at the moment is bewilderingly high.

People will immediately turn to drugs, especially if they'd already dabbled in the past. The issues that plagued Limerick, and are currently in Drogheda, will spread everywhere, once the demand starts going through the roof.

And our Garda service have shown time and time again how incompetent they are in dealing with basic policing matters, never mind full on drug feuds.


On top of that, the only people being hit by this, are those who can't afford to go to the pubs (conveniently, pubs are left out of these measures). My dad would drink, easily, 12 cans a day of Guinness. He's retired and although he's not an 'alcoholic' in the stereotype way (ie; not abusive, a scrounger etc.) you can be damn sure all this will do is leave less money in his pocket for food as there is no way will he just stop drinking. He'll just drink less, and eat less (of course I'd be there to step in as I see him daily, and can help out, but there are many, many, more just like him who live alone and a price increase will simply lead them to having less money for heating and eating).


It also annoys me, personally. I drink maybe two or three times a year, and rarely at home, but it bugs me that on one hand the meat farmer lads are protesting and the mere mention of a floor on pricing has the CCPC stepping in saying that it's illegal to have minimum pricing. Yet, for some reason this is going on at the exact same time and no one seems to care.


Aswell as; What happens to the budget beer brands? What happens when 'Steve's Orchard' is suddenly the same price as 'Orchard Thieves'? What happens the people making the lower priced alcohol when suddenly they can't compete anymore? Close the company down?


If HiNeckInn and Heineken are the same price on the shelf, it won't be long before no one can compete and Heineken are the only alcohol of it's type on the shelf, and no one in future will bother trying to compete because Heineken are already established and have a monopoly on the market, and you can't undercut them to try to gain market share.


As someone who doesn't really drink, and isn't immediately affected by it, it's a whole big pile of shite and will have massive negative implications which seem to be getting ignored.

punisher5112

Isn't it amazing that these changes don't affect those rich entitled folk.....


Earning high €10s of thousands and more..... They couldn't give a flute.

Kermit.de.frog

completedit wrote: »

It's just a drink, it's just alcohol

Do you not find it demeaning and insulting that when VIPs visit they have to be photographed with a pint of guinness in their hand?

I take it it is not the visitor's fault - it's our tourism body that oversees this.

We need to challenge our image as a nation of alcos. It does us no favors.

Maybe some don't take issue with it but as an Irish person I think it plays in to an ugly stereotype about the Irish abroad.

There is more to this country and the people in it than alcohol.

A lot of people on here for example will laugh at the portrayal on the Simpsons or Family Guy of Ireland.

I don't find that stuff so funny. I think it's a shame that that is how we are viewed around the world and we deserve it - that's how we market ourselves.

elperello

lawred2 wrote: »

How can you separate consumption of alcohol from where alcohol is purchased in bulk?

When you see someone in the supermarket buying a case of beer or a bottle of spirits they are not necessarily going home to drink the lot in one go. Lots of us like to have a drink or two at home when we feel like it and prefer to purchase at a reasonable price. Others may be buying for a family barbecue or get together. A case or bottle may be consumed but spread over a number of people.

That's not to deny that here are problem drinkers, of course there are. Indeed in my experience a lot of them don't actually buy in bulk anyway. Naggins and a few cans in a bag seem to be the preferred option of many.

The real reasons why people drink too much need to be addressed by Harris and the HSE. These reasons are complex, difficult and expensive to treat from a public health aspect . The quick fix pricing increase option will not treat the real core of the matter and is only tinkering at the edge of the issue.

punisher5112

elperello wrote: »

When you see someone in the supermarket buying a case of beer or a bottle of spirits they are not necessarily going home to drink the lot in one go. Lots of us like to have a drink or two at home when we feel like it and prefer to purchase at a reasonable price. Others may be buying for a family barbecue or get together. A case or bottle may be consumed but spread over a number of people.

That's not to deny that here are problem drinkers, of course there are. Indeed in my experience a lot of them don't actually buy in bulk anyway. Naggins and a few cans in a bag seem to be the preferred option of many.

The real reasons why people drink too much need to be addressed by Harris and the HSE. These reasons are complex, difficult and expensive to treat from a public health aspect . The quick fix pricing increase option will not treat the real core of the matter and is only tinkering at the edge of the issue.

Exactly...

I buy when on offer and it could be there weeks if not months...

I bought 2 bottles of vodka recently and have no plans to use anytime soon.

Few beers yeah will have a few but a whole slab fcuk no ...

The Late Late Show

completedit wrote: »

The very fact people take issue with a picture of Obama with a Guiness shows how odd this countries attitude to alcohol is. It's just a drink, it's just alcohol but we have made it to be this taboo thing that yet somehow is ubiquitous in our culture. This creates a forbidden fruit effect and results in the binge drinking culture

And creates room for groups like the Pioneer Total Abstinence Association of the Sacred Heart. The very name sounds like something out of Gilead in The Handmaid's Tale. This organisation had too much of a say in 1950s-1960s Ireland. Do we want to return to this?:

https://www.irishexaminer.com/farming/analysis/recruited-as-teenage-spy-by-the-pioneer-total-abstinence-association-369319.html

And oh yes when they were strong, Ireland had its Handmaids and Marthas too. They were not called that but were called Magdalenes. We had our Red Centre too and they were called Good Shepherd Convents.

listermint

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

So many seem to be in denial about this country's crisis with alcohol.

This is a good start but harsher policies are needed in my opinion.

Another thing that needs to be challenged is advertising and how this country is promoted and associated with drink around the world. On the latter there is no virtue in promoting your country as a land of alcoholics (and then Irish people get offended abroad when they are referred to as drunks). What goes around comes around with that. This nonsense with associating Guinness for example (run by a British company) with our country - I can't understand why that is allowed to continue unchecked (for example like every high profile guest has to have a pint of guinness in public (Obama, the Queen etc...).

So good start by the government ending cheap deals and cheap selling but they need to go further in my opinion.

As for the OP - you describe the young late night drinking culture in Dublin as fun. Go in to Dublin City Center most nights after 12 am as a sober person and "fun" is not how most would describe it.

Horse crap , yourself and lawred have been peddling this nonsense for two years now.

Yet consumption is down year on year on year. The youth aren't interested in drinking anymore. The adults don't bother as they can't afford it.

You two have proven nothing. All the state indicate consumption is down across the board.

The sole and only reason laws like these are being peddled the sole reason is because pubs are closing down left right and centre. And the parties funders are not happy.

That's the truth. You know it I know it lawred knows it.

Your own personal distaste for alcohol clouds your judgement immensely.

punisher5112

Drugs are out of control....

It's easier to deal with a drink them it is one on drugs believe me, I've much experience.

Annasopra

Outlaw Pete wrote: »

The public gets the politicians they deserve at the end of the day.

People were happy enough to buy into this man's bull**** when he was clearly lying and pandering, just because it was what they wanted to hear at the time. No amount of pointing out how disingenuous he was being would suffice, people didn't want to hear it, he was doing what they wanted him to do and that was all that mattered. Nevermind that he was lying, he wasn't walking on them, twas the other people, and so was grand. Well now he's more indiscriminate about who he walks on.

Lying about what?

Annasopra

listermint wrote: »

Horse crap , yourself and lawred have been peddling this nonsense for two years now.

Yet consumption is down year on year on year. The youth aren't interested in drinking anymore. The adults don't bother as they can't afford it.

You two have proven nothing. All the state indicate consumption is down across the board.

The sole and only reason laws like these are being peddled the sole reason is because pubs are closing down left right and centre. And the parties funders are not happy.

That's the truth. You know it I know it lawred knows it.

Your own personal distaste for alcohol clouds your judgement immensely.

Parties funders? What kind of bullcrap is that?

Tony EH

So tired of these pricks.

The price of a pint is allowed to out of control nearly everywhere and they hit the alternative of drinking at home too.

Have to keep the Vintners Assoc. happy. Happy at any cost to everyone else.

The Late Late Show

Some people who 'defend' this legislation talk about drunken disorderly violent youths on streets. They exist for sure. That reminds me of the part of The Handmaid's Tale where imprisoned trainee handmaids were shown and told of the time before when women were free to work and dress as they please and yes drink alcohol. Now, they can't do any of this and are told it is 'freedom from' versus 'freedom to'.

Drunken youths exist and some people drink to excess and they are getting worse and worse. No denying that. Punish THEM not the rest of us is the message our THICK politicians fail to realise. As for this alcohol is bad for you, sugar/coffee/tea/meat/oranges/tinned tomatoes/etc too, this is health-Taliban gone crazy. We have seen racist, sectarian, misogynist, religious, atheist, etc. fascism before, now it is health fascism. Time to stop this ... as it is bad for us!

the_syco

lawred2 wrote: »

It won't make it worse anyway

Actually, it may. People will go back to making homebrews, that will cause sickness and even death if the alcohol is not created correctly.

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

As for the OP - you describe the young late night drinking culture in Dublin as fun. Go in to Dublin City Center most nights after 12 am as a sober person and "fun" is not how most would describe it.

Apart from working or drinking, there are very few reasons why I'd go into the city centre, at any time.