Northside Flooding

manna452121

Some very bad flooding at Coonagh and the Na Pairsaigh pitch.https://www.limerickleader.ie/video/home/474690/watch-limerick-residents-urgently-react-after-waking-up-to-severe-flooding.html Keep your feet dry by washburn2157, on Flickr Under water by washburn2157, on Flickr

jbkenn

Word is, some collection of highly motivated OPW workers, left a flood gate they were working on, open on Friday evening and took off for the weekend, shur what could go wrong?

phog

As with most disasters you have con men who try take advantage :mad:

kilburn

Terrible time for the families involved hope it gets resolved quickly

jbkenn

jbkenn wrote: »

Word is, some collection of highly motivated OPW workers, left a flood gate they were working on, open on Friday evening and took off for the weekend, shur what could go wrong?

Way too much encroachment on the floodplain over the years, unfortunately. Not just in Limerick but all the way down from Athlone etc. Anyone who recalls the Northside of the city before Ashbrook and Clonmacken were built will recall those areas being boggy for most of the year.

The floods in July and last weekend are warning signs.

jbkenn

Deleted User wrote: »

The floods in July and last weekend are warning signs.

Warning signs of what?

Phileas Frog

jbkenn wrote: »

Warning signs of what?

Impending Doom!

How exactly did the Shannon coming through a levee destroy Na Piarsaig? Their pitches are miles from the river, across 2 roads

jbkenn

jbkenn wrote: »

Warning signs of what?

That the floodplains have been severely damaged. Rivers are meant to flood, it can't be avoided, nor should it. If you remove a floodplain from one place, the water has to go somewhere else. The entire northside of the city has been radically altered in the last 50 years, Ashbrook, Clonmacken, Caherdavin Lawn are all areas that would have periodically flooded (and would never have been all that dry).

It's silly, imo, to build on them, complain when they flood, and then spend millions of flood defences. Just leave them do what they are meant to do.

Cookiemunster

Deleted User wrote: »

That the floodplains have been severely damaged. Rivers are meant to flood, it can't be avoided, nor should it. If you remove a floodplain from one place, the water has to go somewhere else. The entire northside of the city has been radically altered in the last 50 years, Ashbrook, Clonmacken, Caherdavin Lawn are all areas that would have periodically flooded (and would never have been all that dry).

It's silly, imo, to build on them, complain when they flood, and then spend millions of flood defences. Just leave them do what they are meant to do.

Yeah, it's a bit late for that. That horse has well a truly bolted.

Cookiemunster

Cookiemunster wrote: »

Yeah, it's a bit late for that. That horse has well a truly bolted.

You'd think that but our city council, in their infinite wisdom, want to run a great big road through the floodplain above UL. Damage there, put further strain on the city etc.

martyc5674

Cookiemunster wrote: »

Yeah, it's a bit late for that. That horse has well a truly bolted.

Can’t argue with that, but throwing money at flood defences that will need constant upgrading and cause much anxiety for those relying on them to protect their homes is hardly money spent wisely. I think we should be taking a step back and maybe spending the money on relocating people/businesses and reinstating the flood plains. At least it would be sustainable.
To be fair we don’t know what weather extremities are going to be thrown at us in the next 50/100 years, but we’re getting an idea and we should plan appropriately.
Marty.

jbkenn

Phileas Frog wrote: »

Impending Doom!

How exactly did the Shannon coming through a levee destroy Na Piarsaig? Their pitches are miles from the river, across 2 roads

The whole area is crisscrossed with open drains, stop on Condell Road at the back of Na Piarsigh and you will see the culverts under Condell Road.

jbkenn

Deleted User wrote: »

That the floodplains have been severely damaged. Rivers are meant to flood, it can't be avoided, nor should it. If you remove a floodplain from one place, the water has to go somewhere else. The entire northside of the city has been radically altered in the last 50 years, Ashbrook, Clonmacken, Caherdavin Lawn are all areas that would have periodically flooded (and would never have been all that dry).

It's silly, imo, to build on them, complain when they flood, and then spend millions of flood defences. Just leave them do what they are meant to do.

From Wikipedia
"In October 1961, the River Shannon again burst its banks, flooding almost all of Coonagh as far as the current site of the Coonagh Roundabout, causing much damage to homes, with many having to be temporarily abandoned. In places, the water rose to 5m high, and Coonagh once again became an island for a short time. Children had to be ferried out of Coonagh in gandelows to attend school. To prevent future flooding, higher banks were erected along the Shannon using mud and clay from the brick holes in Coonagh, and the M7 motorway now runs parallel with, and over, these embankments. Due to the floodwaters spreading fertile silt from the Shannon onto agricultural land, for many years after the flood Coonagh was a renowned spot for picking wild mushrooms. "
I can vouch for the mushrooms, as a kid in 1962 we did a roaring trade selling traces of mushrooms at Caherdavin Cross for 3d and 6d each to people going home from work and spending our ill-gotten gains on lemonade and icecream in Shiels shop ( where Ivan's is today)

martyc5674

martyc5674 wrote: »

Can’t argue with that, but throwing money at flood defences that will need constant upgrading and cause much anxiety for those relying on them to protect their homes is hardly money spent wisely. I think we should be taking a step back and maybe spending the money on relocating people/businesses and reinstating the flood plains. At least it would be sustainable.
To be fair we don’t know what weather extremities are going to be thrown at us in the next 50/100 years, but we’re getting an idea and we should plan appropriately.
Marty.

That is the plan for some parts of the river, not in Limerick afaik. Fully agree that's the reality we are facing in Limerick though.

jbkenn

martyc5674 wrote: »

Can’t argue with that, but throwing money at flood defences that will need constant upgrading and cause much anxiety for those relying on them to protect their homes is hardly money spent wisely. I think we should be taking a step back and maybe spending the money on relocating people/businesses and reinstating the flood plains. At least it would be sustainable.
To be fair we don’t know what weather extremities are going to be thrown at us in the next 50/100 years, but we’re getting an idea and we should plan appropriately.
Marty.

From press reports this flooding was caused by incompetence, nothing else.
https://www.limerickleader.ie/video/home/474995/breaking-opw-admits-temporary-structure-failed-and-led-to-flooding-in-limerick.html

jbkenn

jbkenn wrote: »

From Wikipedia
"In October 1961, the River Shannon again burst its banks, flooding almost all of Coonagh as far as the current site of the Coonagh Roundabout, causing much damage to homes, with many having to be temporarily abandoned. In places, the water rose to 5m high, and Coonagh once again became an island for a short time. Children had to be ferried out of Coonagh in gandelows to attend school. To prevent future flooding, higher banks were erected along the Shannon using mud and clay from the brick holes in Coonagh, and the M7 motorway now runs parallel with, and over, these embankments. Due to the floodwaters spreading fertile silt from the Shannon onto agricultural land, for many years after the flood Coonagh was a renowned spot for picking wild mushrooms. "
I can vouch for the mushrooms, as a kid in 1962 we did a roaring trade selling traces of mushrooms at Caherdavin Cross for 3d and 6d each to people going home from work and spending our ill-gotten gains on lemonade and icecream in Shiels shop ( where Ivan's is today)

Yeah, it's really only a matter of time between big floods in the area. Interesting bit of history, thanks.

kilburn

Jesus folks any concern for the families rather than culverts and Wikipedia

Limerick91

Phileas Frog wrote: »

Impending Doom!

How exactly did the Shannon coming through a levee destroy Na Piarsaig? Their pitches are miles from the river, across 2 roads

I think Na Piarsaigh have pitches in Coonagh and these are the one that were destroyed

lazyman

Limerick91 wrote: »

I think Na Piarsaigh have pitches in Coonagh and these are the one that were destroyed

No it's their main pitches that are flooded

Mad_maxx

martyc5674 wrote: »

Cookiemunster wrote: »

Yeah, it's a bit late for that. That horse has well a truly bolted.

Can’t argue with that, but throwing money at flood defences that will need constant upgrading and cause much anxiety for those relying on them to protect their homes is hardly money spent wisely. I think we should be taking a step back and maybe spending the money on relocating people/businesses and reinstating the flood plains. At least it would be sustainable.
To be fair we don’t know what weather extremities are going to be thrown at us in the next 50/100 years, but we’re getting an idea and we should plan appropriately.
Marty.

Without flood defenses, the entire nation of the Netherlands would be under water

The problem here is we don't have half enough flood defenses across the country

Kenny B

Mad_maxx wrote: »

Without flood defenses, the entire nation of the Netherlands would be under water

The problem here is we don't have half enough flood defenses across the country

Flood defenses won't work when the gate is left open, this was human error.

And many areas that are flooded occasionally should not have been built on, more human errors.

The fact that OPW are accepting the hit here, the houses affected should not be lived in again as they will always be flood risks and this is their chance to move.

Na Piarsaigh's 2 sand based pitches cost in the region of €230-250k each and might have to be relaid, the new floodlights and generator might have been damaged also.

That's some cost to the OPW, all for trying to fix a gate when the highest tide was due, what moron didn't wait 2 weeks til the tides were lower,?

Mc Love

Exactly Kenny - they'll find it hard to insure going forward. I apparently live on a flood plain too yet it hasnt flooded in about 20/30 years.

kilburn

Mc Love wrote:

Exactly Kenny - they'll find it hard to insure going forward. I apparently live on a flood plain too yet it hasnt flooded in about 20/30 years.

They won't get flood cover again that's for sure human error or not

chicorytip

Mad_maxx wrote: »

martyc5674 wrote: »

Cookiemunster wrote: »

Yeah, it's a bit late for that. That horse has well a truly bolted.

Can’t argue with that, but throwing money at flood defences that will need constant upgrading and cause much anxiety for those relying on them to protect their homes is hardly money spent wisely. I think we should be taking a step back and maybe spending the money on relocating people/businesses and reinstating the flood plains. At least it would be sustainable.
To be fair we don’t know what weather extremities are going to be thrown at us in the next 50/100 years, but we’re getting an idea and we should plan appropriately.
Marty.

Without flood defenses, the entire nation of the Netherlands would be under water

The problem here is we don't have half enough flood defenses across the country

It can be difficult to put measures in place to completely prevent damage resulting from what are extreme weather events. The Coonagh flooding and the Island Field floods a few years ago were both as a result of intense and torrential rainfall occurring over a short period of time. These kind of events are becoming more frequent and of increasing magnitude because of, well, I'm not certain really. Climate change brought about by global warming?? I remain somewhat sceptical with regard to that.

Cookiemunster

chicorytip wrote: »

It can be difficult to put measures in place to completely prevent damage resulting from what are extreme weather events. The Coonagh flooding and the Island Field floods a few years ago were both as a result of intense and torrential rainfall occurring over a short period of time. These kind of events are becoming more frequent and of increasing magnitude because of, well, I'm not certain really. Climate change brought about by global warming?? I remain somewhat sceptical with regard to that.

The Coonagh flooding happened because of the OPW. The flood defences would have been fine if they hadn't been at it, even with the rain.

knipex

Mad_maxx wrote: »

Without flood defenses, the entire nation of the Netherlands would be under water

The problem here is we don't have half enough flood defenses across the country

The problem is we built and are continuing to build in places that flood. Water levels are rising, climate is getting wetter and flooding events more common but we keep building in places that flood.

jbkenn

knipex wrote: »

The problem is we built and are continuing to build in places that flood. Water levels are rising, climate is getting wetter and flooding events more common but we keep building in places that flood.

The flooding in Coonagh was caused by incompetence, not rising water levels
Here is a link to the Tide gauge data for Malin Head
http://www.sealevel.info/MSL_graph.php?id=175-011
The climate is not getting wetter and flooding events are not getting more common.
Average weather data Shannon Airport month of September
1961 - 1990
Temp 13.6 C
Rain 81.8 mm
Wind 9.6 Knots (17.78 Kmh)
Source: https://www.met.ie/climate-ireland/1961-1990/shannon.html
1971 - 2000
Temp 14.0 C
Rain 80 mm
Wind 8.7 Knots (16.11 Kmh)
Source: https://www.met.ie/climate-ireland/1971-2000/shannon.html
1981 - 2010
Temp 14.2 C
Rain 75.6 mm
Wind 8.4 Knots (15.56 Kmh)
Source: https://www.met.ie/climate-ireland/1981-2010/shannon.html

Mad_maxx

knipex wrote: »

Mad_maxx wrote: »

Without flood defenses, the entire nation of the Netherlands would be under water

The problem here is we don't have half enough flood defenses across the country

The problem is we built and are continuing to build in places that flood. Water levels are rising, climate is getting wetter and flooding events more common but we keep building in places that flood.

All of the Netherlands floods, they built defenses against the threats from nature

geotrig

knipex wrote: »

The problem is we built and are continuing to build in places that flood. Water levels are rising, climate is getting wetter and flooding events more common but we keep building in places that flood.

damn those stupid vikings for not planning this better !

geotrig

geotrig wrote: »

damn those stupid vikings for not planning this better !

Wasn't the Vikings that granted planning permission for the places in the last 60 years....