City boy wants to be a dairy farmer...

pauldavis123

There is a 60 acre dairy farm in my family that I have been offered as they dont want to sell it to a third party.

I was looking at the price of milk at 30c a liter and seeing that a cow can produce 8000 liters a year, abouy €2400 per cow per year.

Goood numbers if you have a hundred cows!

Obviously you have to feed them but with a robotic milker is this not the easiest game in town?

Please give me a reality check before I buy a farm :pac:

valtra2

Shhh don't tell anyone else. It's money for jam.

jaymla627

valtra2 wrote: »

Shhh don't tell anyone else. It's money for jam.

No questions asked finance from lely is a great job too....

Oasis1974

You need cows first where you gonna get them from a website or you know a cow seller? Plus you need to stick your arm up everyone of there bums to make sure theirs milk in them allegedly?

patsy_mccabe

pauldavis123 wrote: »

There is a 60 acre dairy farm in my family that I have been offered as they dont want to sell it to a third party.

I was looking at the price of milk at 30c a liter and seeing that a cow can produce 8000 liters a year, abouy €2400 per cow per year.

Goood numbers if you have a hundred cows!

Obviously you have to feed them but with a robotic milker is this not the easiest game in town?

Please give me a reality check before I buy a farm :pac:

Beef farmers protesting outside meat factories, because they are losing money. Most own their own farms and some would have well in excess of 60 acres.

Reality check !!!!!!!!

pauldavis123

Oasis1974 wrote: »

You need cows first where you gonna get them from a website or you know a cow seller? Plus you need to stick your arm up everyone of there bums to make sure theirs milk in them allegedly?

There is coows there already. As for sticking my arm in them, I've done a lot of sewer drain work on sites :eek:

pauldavis123

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

Beef farmers protesting outside meat factories, because they are losing money. Most own their own farms and some would have well in excess of 60 acres.

Reality check !!!!!!!!

I see that but where is the €250,000 going (assuming you have 100 cows!)

pauldavis123

Also is there a way to work out how many cows you can put in an acre? Land is good in Tipp I'm told.

whelan2

Go work on a dairy farm for a week in the spring. Have you ever milked a cow?

_Brian

Do you think your going to wander into a bank with no farming experience, training or knowledge and get a line of maybe €8-900,000 credit, how do you see that conversation going?

The outlook for dairy is very uncertain, were already seeing processors warn the market is poor and prices are stagnant or dropping.

I think your napkin sized business plan would need to be thinking 25c or less for milk.

Dairy is the only gig in town, no doubt. But new entrants, even with existing land are servicing huge debt which in a time of uncertain prices is a concern.

whelan2

Not all cows give 8000 litres a year. Very few do in fact

Shefwedfan

I would apply as a farm hand for at least a month and see how you get on, if you are serious then do for free or minimum wages

Statement like land is good because it is in tipp is a worrying. Land in the middle of Meath can be s**t if not looked after. You could end up with fields of land which all need to be reseeded, how will you pay for that? Especially if milk production is down because the grass is poor

Any machinery on farm? Any trailers? Do you have a jeep and trailer if you want to move cattle?

If all the land all wired to stop the cows roaming? If not for wire/posts etc?

These are just some of the questions you need to consider

Timmaay

whelan2 wrote: »

Not all cows give 8000 litres a year. Very few do in fact

National average is say 5500l. Let's call it 10c/l profit or 550e/cow. 60 cows on the 60 ac would be 33k salary for the year for yourself. Please absolutely forget about that 2400e/cow gross income figure.


Actually wait, "robotic milker, easiest game in town". Sounds like your trolling us your that far from reality 2bh ha.

Shefwedfan

Timmaay wrote: »

National average is say 5500l. Let's call it 10c/l profit or 550e/cow. 60 cows on the 60 ac would be 33k salary for the year for yourself. Please absolutely forget about that 2400e/cow gross income figure.


Actually wait, "robotic milker, easiest game in town". Sounds like your trolling us your that far from reality 2bh ha.

I don’t think trolling I just think the Op is not aware....people have very little concept of running a farm and what it takes....especially if city based....

People think sure grass is free and you get milk.....what are the overheads.....I didn’t even bother mentioning fertiliser for the fields or how he would pay for that

Does the farm have proper sheds to house the cows in winter, I don’t think he realize that during the winter your production is almost zero....have the farm feed for winter? If not where is he getting it?

pauldavis123

whelan2 wrote: »

Go work on a dairy farm for a week in the spring. Have you ever milked a cow?

Planning to go down alright, used to hard work so looking forward to it.

pauldavis123

I'm 100% not trolling, just doing some basic numbers.

even at 10c profit with 100 cows producing 5500l its €55k profit according to the guy above.

How much in euros will a cow eat per year?

Sorry for the stupid questions but you got to start somewhere!

Mooooo

pauldavis123 wrote: »

I'm 100% not trolling, just doing some basic numbers.

even at 10c profit with 100 cows producing 5500l its €55k profit according to the guy above.

How much in euros will a cow eat per year?

Sorry for the stupid questions but you got to start somewhere!

At 60 acres and 100 cow's your talking over 4/ ha full time. That means extra feed in the shoulders of the year along with needing more ground for young stock and winter feed prob another 60 again. Over the whole farm a sr of 2.5lu/ ha would be a rule of thumb to start off with. If you're serious about it work on a dairy farm for a bit, talk to teagasc etc and the people already on the land. Not as straight forward as you're thinking. 3 years ago price hit 22 cent base which meant 0 profit or less for most

893bet

pauldavis123 wrote: »

I'm 100% not trolling, just doing some basic numbers.

even at 10c profit with 100 cows producing 5500l its €55k profit according to the guy above.

How much in euros will a cow eat per year?

Sorry for the stupid questions but you got to start somewhere!

55k profit? You mean 55k salary.

For working 7 days a week. 365 days a year regardless of weather. On call every night for calving, sick animals etc.

The hourly wage would be little better than minimum.

orm0nd

A relation on my o/h a few years ago inherited a fairly large farm, which was mainly sheep and tillage, also got a nice nest egg of cash.

He had a good job , short hours and earning good salary .

He got advise from "experts" and decided to give up the day job, borrow & go dairying.

A friend commented, "at the moment he has a good lifesytle , a good job, and a nice bank balance, he'll never see any of those again".

kk.man

Two things are a must in your situation

1. Go work on a diary farm for a year.

2. Get an agricultural advisor out to your farm and draw up a financial plan to see what is needed to bring it into production.

banoffe2

Come from a farm background myself, all the farmers I know would be steering their sons/daughters well away from it.
As other boardsies have commented you are working 7 days a week, calving season 24/7 , no days off
It can be a very isolating role you wont have the banter of the team at work and looking forward to breaks, booking holidays, 9 bank holidays off with pay, finishing in the evenings and walking away knowing you will have wages in your bank acc regardless of weather, markets fluctuating, brexit, all the paper work, revenue, the list goes on.
Think long and hard about it, would it be possible to buy it and let it?
Sentimentality may be influencing your decision and the fact that you will be your own boss
The very best of luck what ever you decide.

wrangler

Here's an example of accounts, take note these would be from the average of 1500 top dairy farmers, it'd take a few years to get to that level.
Accounts are on the third or fourth page
https://www.teagasc.ie/media/website/publications/2018/eProfit-Book-2017.pdf

hedzball

pauldavis123 wrote: »

I see that but where is the €250,000 going (assuming you have 100 cows!)

I'm by no means a farmer but come from the country and have worked on a few farms over the years. I wouldn't per say call it hard work in terms of its monotonous and labour intensive.

If not sleeping for 3 days while calving and milking on Christmas day is your thing its your thing. A lot of people are born into it and know no different. A lot now are pushing their kids away from it.

As for the 250k..

If you worked 7 days a week and 365 of the year you'd break 250k doing what you're doing now. Money isn't everything and its ****ing hard earned farmer from what I can see.


'Hdz

PhilOssophy

kk.man wrote: »

Two things are a must in your situation

1. Go work on a diary farm for a year.

2. Get an agricultural advisor out to your farm and draw up a financial plan to see what is needed to bring it into production.

100% to all that, don't go for a month and decide, see if you can stick a year of milking 7x2 times a week (there's no such thing as a 6 day cow), calving season (torture and extremely hard work) and at 60 acres you won't be made up to be honest with you.

I do know farmers who invested all the money in the dairy industry and ended up getting out of it. Don't make that mistake.

Buford T. Justice XIX

pauldavis123 wrote: »

Also is there a way to work out how many cows you can put in an acre? Land is good in Tipp I'm told.

With those 60 acres, you're looking at 40 cows, 8 heifers and 10 calves. At that stocking rate, you'll have to apply for a derogation to be given to allow that stocking rate on the farm, assuming that the slurry storage is already in place.

At that stocking rate, you'd already be in the top 15 or 20% in terms of stocking rate and you'd have to have a lot of things going right for you in terms of price and weather to be able to provide enough fodder for them for the entire year.

And you're expecting to do it without any experience or knowledge of farming. I'm not criticising you or your choices but putting out how I see things for you.

You'll need to get a qualification like the Green Cert sorted and a good bit of experience in milking cows and general farm management under your belt first before making that decision, I think.

alps

wrangler wrote: »

Here's an example of accounts, take note these would be from the average of 1500 top dairy farmers, it'd take a few years to get to that level.
Accounts are on the third or fourth page
https://www.teagasc.ie/media/website/publications/2018/eProfit-Book-2017.pdf

Op...please be aware...

There ARE NOT ACCOUNTS...

They are cost comparisons, and do not include all costs...indeed they do not include all income either..

The figures are entered long before proper accounts are even available or completed..

They are filled in from management figures that the farmer has best available to date, typically the first week of January, and wer NEVER ENTERED FOR THE PURPOSE OF PUBLICATION..

Much of it is guesswork (not all income has been recieved nor all Bill's paid), some of it is willie waving, some of it is downright cover up.

It does not include accurate labour costs and most inaccurate of all, it does not include capital repayments.

Drawings tax and repayments......CAREFUL

davidk1394

Go off and work on a dairy farm first. A farm with 100ish cows if possible. You’ll be at everything then. See if you like milking cows on a Sunday morning or evening and if you like working with animals. You’ll see the paper work that’s involved with farming aswell.

You’ll have to go off and do your level 6 farm training so you’ll be eligible for the grants.

Sit down with the bank and draw up a farm plan. Teagasc are running a course for new entrants to dairying. I signed up for it and it’s stsrting soon. So ring them immediately.

If it’s already a functioning dairy farm your not too bad. However if you have to go off building, you’ll spend thousands before you even see a meter of concrete being poured. Planning can be hard to getin Tipp in certain places

Donald Trump

Are you getting tips from this fella OP?