American resident claiming children allowance?

Guffy

Is an Irish citizen, living in the USA full time, in Ireland 1-2.5 months a year entitled to claim childrens allowance for 3 US born children with Irish passports?

hawthorne

Guffy wrote: »

Is an Irish citizen, living in the USA full time, in Ireland 1-2.5 months a year entitled to claim childrens allowance for 3 US born children with Irish passports?

No- you do not qualify for child benefit- you do not fulfill the HRC.

GerardKeating

Guffy wrote: »

Is an Irish citizen, living in the USA full time, in Ireland 1-2.5 months a year entitled to claim childrens allowance for 3 US born children with Irish passports?

Are the children resident in Ireland ?

splinter65

Guffy wrote: »

Is an Irish citizen, living in the USA full time, in Ireland 1-2.5 months a year entitled to claim childrens allowance for 3 US born children with Irish passports?

Are the children living full time in Ireland with a parent?

Guffy

splinter65 wrote: »

Are the children living full time in Ireland with a parent?

Nope parent lives and married in the states near 30 years. Comes over for month give or take every summer and maybe a random couple of weeks every year to visit home and collect the Childrens allowance from the bank.

Guffy

hawthorne wrote: »

No- you do not qualify for child benefit- you do not fulfill the HRC.

I do actually, thanks for your input though. I will assume you were referring to the situation and not myself personally

GerardKeating

Guffy wrote: »

I do actually, thanks for your input though. I will assume you were referring to the situation and not myself personally

I think it was assumed you were asking about your own situation.

Guffy wrote: »

Nope parent lives and married in the states near 30 years. Comes over for month give or take every summer and maybe a random couple of weeks every year to visit home and collect the Childrens allowance from the bank.

In the case you outline above, the "parent" is either committing fraud against the Department of Social Protection, or just telling porkies to you.

splinter65

Guffy wrote: »

Nope parent lives and married in the states near 30 years. Comes over for month give or take every summer and maybe a random couple of weeks every year to visit home and collect the Childrens allowance from the bank.

Jesus the greedy bastard. If he gets caught he’s looking at a big fine and even a conviction as well as paying it back.
The greed of some people is unreal.

splinter65

I’d like to add here that I believe this story like I believe the moon is made of green cheese.

Sleeper12

Maybe things have changed since my kids were kids but don't you have to collect at least every six months & sign every six months? I can't imagine coming to Ireland once a year would be enough to keep children allowance

I am also assuming that it's a wind up

hawthorne

Guffy wrote: »

I do actually, thanks for your input though. I will assume you were referring to the situation and not myself personally

Yes- I was refering to the situation. And I presumed you asked for yourself.

hawthorne

Sleeper12 wrote: »

Maybe things have changed since my kids were kids but don't you have to collect at least every six months & sign every six months? I can't imagine coming to Ireland once a year would be enough to keep children allowance

I am also assuming that it's a wind up

It is most likely a wind up.
First- it is not called child allowance- it is named child benefit.
Child allowance is something entirely different. This is paid out if you are on a jobseekers payment- but to get that you have to live in Ireland and sign on on a regular basis. Impossible to do that when you live in the States.
Secondly - CB is paid in the post office with the help of a little book you get from the department every year. Each month has a voucher type page in the book. Nobody can just go in and cash in 6 months worth of CB.
Books are sent out every year to your Irish address.You get also spot checks from time to time to validate your claim and your presence in Ireland. My wife got checked 5 times in 18 years.
I'd safely say that SW passes on the CB data to the Irish revenue. Any irregularities there would quickly be reported back to them.

kilsmum

You can get child benefit paid into your bank account. I did with mine. So no book and no visits to the post office.

Kilsmum

splinter65

Sleeper12 wrote: »

Maybe things have changed since my kids were kids but don't you have to collect at least every six months & sign every six months? I can't imagine coming to Ireland once a year would be enough to keep children allowance

I am also assuming that it's a wind up

The child benefit has been payable into the bank for at least 22 years. I know that because that’s how I got it for my daughter.
I never had to “sign” for it. Maybe 5 times in the 18 years I got a letter that I had to sign and return to confirm we were still here.
Non national claimants got many more letters, some as frequently as 3 times per year.
For this man living in the USA with USA born children living in the USA to successfully complete this criminal fraud required huge levels of deceit to the point of being impossible.

hawthorne

kilsmum wrote: »

You can get child benefit paid into your bank account. I did with mine. So no book and no visits to the post office.

Kilsmum

Thanks- I did not know that.
My wife had always the little books and never the bank account.

No need to come to Ireland to collect from a bank account- you can transfer money via the internet from account to account.
One more reason why it would not make any sense to come to Ireland once or twice a year when you can easily take out the money in the States. Why waste any flight tickets when you can achieve the same result with a few mouse clicks?

splinter65

hawthorne wrote: »

It is most likely a wind up.
First- it is not called child allowance- it is named child benefit.
Child allowance is something entirely different. This is paid out if you are on a jobseekers payment- but to get that you have to live in Ireland and sign on on a regular basis. Impossible to do that when you live in the States.
Secondly - CB is paid in the post office with the help of a little book you get from the department every year. Each month has a voucher type page in the book. Nobody can just go in and cash in 6 months worth of CB.
Books are sent out every year to your Irish address.You get also spot checks from time to time to validate your claim and your presence in Ireland. My wife got checked 5 times in 18 years.
I'd safely say that SW passes on the CB data to the Irish revenue. Any irregularities there would quickly be reported back to them.

There hasn’t been a child benefit “book” for around 10 years.
If you pick up your CB in the PO then you claim it by producing your SW or PSC card to be swiped by the PO clerk.
Also you could, when the books were still around, let it run for 6 months.
Better off families collected it at Christmas and in July for the holliers.

Redneck Reject

As an American living in Ireland for the last ten years, I'm sickened by this. And I hope they get caught for fraud. Chances are they are from the North US.Damn Yankees think they are entitled to everything.

Guffy

Unfortunately its not a wind up. She's been claiming it since she came back for her father's funeral in 2012. I only learned about this last week. I rang the reporting a fraud number today, before the posts started coming in, and said I'd like to report possible fraud. He asked for their name and i asked if someone living in the US who was only here a month or two in the year could claim child benefit (or allowance, not sure what term i used) he said they could so I hung up.

Will follow up on this again tomorrow thanks to the info provided, might actually wait till she fecks off back to the states again so she can't lie her way out of it. Imagine she'll be gone in the next week or so. She's been her for 2 and a bit weeks now and the kids will have to go back to school.

Guffy

hawthorne wrote: »

Thanks- I did not know that.
My wife had always the little books and never the bank account.

No need to come to Ireland to collect from a bank account- you can transfer money via the internet from account to account.
One more reason why it would not make any sense to come to Ireland once or twice a year when you can easily take out the money in the States. Why waste any flight tickets when you can achieve the same result with a few mouse clicks?

Her mother is still in Ireland, she comes back with the kids once a year or so for an extended holiday. Not costing her anything if your paying for it sure.

Guffy

splinter65 wrote: »

The child benefit has been payable into the bank for at least 22 years. I know that because that’s how I got it for my daughter.
I never had to “sign” for it. Maybe 5 times in the 18 years I got a letter that I had to sign and return to confirm we were still here.
Non national claimants got many more letters, some as frequently as 3 times per year.
For this man living in the USA with USA born children living in the USA to successfully complete this criminal fraud required huge levels of deceit to the point of being impossible.

Or... now bear with me... she used her home address she had before she left? I mean I'm sure she had a bank account at some point too so would have an address and an account into which it could be paid.

Redneck Reject

Were the kids born in Ireland or the US? If the latter I don't understand how they could claim at all. Since the kids would be classed as US citizens with Irish decent. Thats a big loophole then they are manipulating.

splinter65

Guffy wrote: »

Or... now bear with me... she used her home address she had before she left? I mean I'm sure she had a bank account at some point too so would have an address and an account into which it could be paid.

Guffy either she’s winding you up or your winding us up.
In order to get CB automatically the children needed to be born in an Irish hospital.
If they weren’t born in an Irish hospital then she would have had to fill this in.
Please.
http://www.welfare.ie/en/pdf/CB1.pdf

Guffy

Redneck Reject wrote: »

As an American living in Ireland for the last ten years, I'm sickened by this. And I hope they get caught for fraud. Chances are they are from the North US.Damn Yankees think they are entitled to everything.

Sorry if i was unclear,

She is Irish born and moved to the States in the late 80's. Has been there since. Came home twice before 2012 when she came back for her fathers funeral. Since then she has been coming once a year for 1-2 months and maybe a second holiday for a couple of weeks at christmas or easter. Has definitely been signed up for the CA since 2012 at least with mail being addressed to her at her mothers house. Her children were born in the US and come back with her for the holiday period.

Or CB not sure what its called now.

Guffy

splinter65 wrote: »

Guffy either she’s winding you up or your winding us up.
In order to get CB automatically the children needed to be born in an Irish hospital.
If they weren’t born in an Irish hospital then she would have had to fill this in.
Please.
http://www.welfare.ie/en/pdf/CB1.pdf

O i know for a fact its happening, i just wasn't sure if it was allowed hence the op.

hawthorne

Guffy wrote: »

Sorry if i was unclear,

She is Irish born and moved to the States in the late 80's. Has been there since. Came home twice before 2012 when she came back for her fathers funeral. Since then she has been coming once a year for 1-2 months and maybe a second holiday for a couple of weeks at christmas or easter. Has definitely been signed up for the CA since 2012 at least with mail being addressed to her at her mothers house. Her children were born in the US and come back with her for the holiday period.

Child Benefit...CB.
There is no such thing as a single child allowance payment on its own.

Guffy

hawthorne wrote: »

Child Benefit...CB.
There is no such thing as a single child allowance payment on its own.

Yes had already edited for that, cheers

Redneck Reject

Guffy wrote: »

Sorry if i was unclear,

She is Irish born and moved to the States in the late 80's. Has been there since. Came home twice before 2012 when she came back for her fathers funeral. Since then she has been coming once a year for 1-2 months and maybe a second holiday for a couple of weeks at christmas or easter. Has definitely been signed up for the CA since 2012 at least with mail being addressed to her at her mothers house. Her children were born in the US and come back with her for the holiday period.

Or CB not sure what its called now.

Yeah she is scamming the system, which unfortunately is easy to do here. she should be ashamed of herself.

Guffy

Guffy wrote: »

Unfortunately its not a wind up. She's been claiming it since she came back for her father's funeral in 2012. I only learned about this last week. I rang the reporting a fraud number today, before the posts started coming in, and said I'd like to report possible fraud. He asked for their name and i asked if someone living in the US who was only here a month or two in the year could claim child benefit (or allowance, not sure what term i used) he said they could so I hung up.

Will follow up on this again tomorrow thanks to the info provided, might actually wait till she fecks off back to the states again so she can't lie her way out of it. Imagine she'll be gone in the next week or so. She's been her for 2 and a bit weeks now and the kids will have to go back to school.

If you suspect fraud, then make a report, online form here: https://m.welfare.ie/en/Pages/secure/ReportFraud.aspx and be done with it. Shameful to see this site descend into name calling and accusations. Report it and get on with your life.

splinter65

Guffy wrote: »

O i know for a fact its happening, i just wasn't sure if it was allowed hence the op.

How did she get a letter from a school here in Ireland to say that the kids were enrolled in the school?
Or a letter from a GP to say that the child was on their register?

hawthorne

Excellent questions!

Both letters have to be attached to the above mentioned SW CB application form.
No letters- no money!

I wonder how this lady in question got around this one.

This is surely a wind up!

Guffy

splinter65 wrote: »

How did she get a letter from a school here in Ireland to say that the kids were enrolled in the school?
Or a letter from a GP to say that the child was on their register?

No idea, i wasn't involved in the application process.


Would the kids being irish passport holders matter anything? Going to report it tomorrow anyway, thanks for all the info.

wifey28

Would the kids being irish passport holders matter anything? Going to report it tomorrow anyway, thanks for all the info.[/QUOTE]


No it wouldnt, you have to prove the kids were either born here and/or are registered in school if school going age,and also registered with a gp

Guffy

wifey28 wrote: »

Would the kids being irish passport holders matter anything? Going to report it tomorrow anyway, thanks for all the info.

No it wouldnt, you have to prove the kids were either born here and/or are registered in school if school going age,and also registered with a gp[/quote]

Well they are registered with the family gp.

splinter65

Guffy wrote: »

No idea, i wasn't involved in the application process.


Would the kids being irish passport holders matter anything? Going to report it tomorrow anyway, thanks for all the info.

In order to claim child benefit she had to complete the 16 page long application form and supply them with all the supporting evidential documents listed on page 16.
For someone genuinely living here and working here or in receipt of a SW payment here it’s quite straightforward to complete the form and supply the documentary evidence.
If your not living here then it’s impossible.
Tomorrow you can call CB on 1890400400 follow the links to CB and give them all the details you can about her.

K.Flyer

hawthorne wrote: »

Excellent questions!

Both letters have to be attached to the above mentioned SW CB application form.
No letters- no money!

I wonder how this lady in question got around this one.

This is surely a wind up!

To be honest I don't think it's a wind up.
There are thousands of people living around the world claiming / receiving Irish Welfare payments, some of them probably never having set foot in the country.
If I remember correctly there was an article some years back about a non E.U. person working in Ireland claiming children's benefit for his several children back in his home country.
I'll try find the item, but here is something in relation to the topic..

60,000 People Claiming Welfare Abroad

Nearly 60,000 people living overseas claim Irish welfare payments from destinations as far flung as the Cayman Islands, Iran and Morocco.

The total bill for sending pensions, child benefits, disability allowances, carer payments, jobseeker's and maternity benefits to countries around the world last year was nearly 300 million euros.
Around €13.3m was paid out for child benefit alone.

splinter65

K.Flyer wrote: »

To be honest I don't think it's a wind up.
There are thousands of people living around the world claiming / receiving Irish Welfare payments, some of them probably never having set foot in the country.
If I remember correctly there was an article some years back about a non E.U. person working in Ireland claiming children's benefit for his several children back in his home country.
I'll try find the item, but here is something in relation to the topic..

60,000 People Claiming Welfare Abroad

All of those people claiming those payments in that article are perfectly entitled to claim the payments they are getting.
You need to actually read the article.
All of those payments are PRSI based. They wouldn’t be getting benefit if they never set foot in the country.
If you have paid the required amount of PRSI then you are entitled to the benefit, irregardless of where you live.
My mother living here has been getting a widows pension from England for 39 years.

Guffy

splinter65 wrote: »

In order to claim child benefit she had to complete the 16 page long application form and supply them with all the supporting evidential documents listed on page 16.
For someone genuinely living here and working here or in receipt of a SW payment here it’s quite straightforward to complete the form and supply the documentary evidence.
If your not living here then it’s impossible.
Tomorrow you can call CB on 1890400400 follow the links to CB and give them all the details you can about her.

She has an address at which she gets mail and she has a mobile phone bill being paid to that address.

I will be doing so on lunch tomorrow!!

And its not a wind up, yes I could be wrong of course, but from talking to very close sources i don'tthink so.

splinter65

Guffy wrote: »

She has an address at which she gets mail and she has a mobile phone bill being paid to that address.

I will be doing so on lunch tomorrow!!

If the children aren’t registered to a school here or a GP here if they’re not school age then she’s not getting CB but ring them anyway.

Guffy

splinter65 wrote: »

If the children aren’t registered to a school here or a GP here if they’re not school age then she’s not getting CB but ring them anyway.

I told you they are registered to a gp.

splinter65

Guffy wrote: »

I told you they are registered to a gp.

I see. So neither kids are school going age?

Guffy

splinter65 wrote: »

I see. So neither kids are school going age?

Not when the cb would have been applied for no.

Darc19

When she gets caught and convicted, she will be probably have her American visa rescinded.

As for the "Child benefit" "Children's Allowance" argument, many people still call it children's allowance, just like many people call suv's Jerps, vacuum cleaners hoovers etc etc.

hawthorne

K.Flyer wrote: »

To be honest I don't think it's a wind up.
There are thousands of people living around the world claiming / receiving Irish Welfare payments, some of them probably never having set foot in the country.
If I remember correctly there was an article some years back about a non E.U. person working in Ireland claiming children's benefit for his several children back in his home country.
I'll try find the item, but here is something in relation to the topic..

60,000 People Claiming Welfare Abroad

I will be claiming a good part of a German state pension in a short number of years and will still live here. Frau Merkel will sent me a big check every month!
How about that?

Bob the Seducer

Guffy wrote: »

Unfortunately its not a wind up. She's been claiming it since she came back for her father's funeral in 2012. I only learned about this last week.

My suspicion is that there are a few more layers of untruths being told by her if this particular scenario is playing out.

Thinking about the various rules for child benefit, there are a number of scenarios where the children wouldn't need to be living with her in Ireland.

Could she be representing as being resident here and 'employed' by a family (or friend's) business (thus paying PRSI contributions) while using her mother's address for post?

The second stage, if she's doing something like this would be passing off the husband as being resident abroad with the children (and I think they'd need to be 'living' in another EU member state) with him being declared as unemployed there (so there's no entitlement to an equivalent benefit on that end).

decky1

do you know what i would'nt be supprised if they were , cos it's a great country for this sort of thing,

ted1

hawthorne wrote: »

It is most likely a wind up.
First- it is not called child allowance- it is named child benefit.
Child allowance is something entirely different. This is paid out if you are on a jobseekers payment- but to get that you have to live in Ireland and sign on on a regular basis. Impossible to do that when you live in the States.
Secondly - CB is paid in the post office with the help of a little book you get from the department every year. Each month has a voucher type page in the book. Nobody can just go in and cash in 6 months worth of CB.
Books are sent out every year to your Irish address.You get also spot checks from time to time to validate your claim and your presence in Ireland. My wife got checked 5 times in 18 years.
I'd safely say that SW passes on the CB data to the Irish revenue. Any irregularities there would quickly be reported back to them.

My wife gets it put into her bank account. Never has to collect it.

ted1

Bob the Seducer wrote: »

My suspicion is that there are a few more layers of untruths being told by her if this particular scenario is playing out.

Thinking about the various rules for child benefit, there are a number of scenarios where the children wouldn't need to be living with her in Ireland.

Could she be representing as being resident here and 'employed' by a family (or friend's) business (thus paying PRSI contributions) while using her mother's address for post?

The second stage, if she's doing something like this would be passing off the husband as being resident abroad with the children (and I think they'd need to be 'living' in another EU member state) with him being declared as unemployed there (so there's no entitlement to an equivalent benefit on that end).

I dint think you need to pay PRSI for the child benefits, my wife is a stay at home mum and gets it. I never had to sign anything, dint even know how much it is.

Bob the Seducer

ted1 wrote: »

I dint think you need to pay PRSI for the child benefits, my wife is a stay at home mum and gets it. I never had to sign anything, dint even know how much it is.

There are a few different ways of qualifying for Child Benefit, the one I'm referring to is:

"You should apply for Child Benefit within 12 months of:

The date you started working in Ireland if your child(ren) are living in another EU country"

Your wife's CB would be on the more usual basis of the family being resident here with the children born in Ireland (I'm guessing)

hawthorne

Suddenly very quite here...

Guffy

hawthorne wrote: »

Suddenly very quite here...

Suddenly, it was a one day conversation. Are you expecting and update from sw?

splinter65

Guffy wrote: »

Suddenly, it was a one day conversation. Are you expecting and update from sw?

You’ve not told us how you got on with reporting this lady to SW. You don’t have to of course but you have to understand that that it’s human nature to be curious.