Energy infrastructure

howsshenow

Intelligent presentation here on energy storage, Battery metals and designs etc

https://youtu.be/P3xCc0tx55w?si=bGHYLqel8EhcEPut

gjim

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123289514#Comment_123289514

Of course my suggestion is absurd. That was the entire point?

It was the logical conclusion to your absurd assertion that "Ireland would have no problems with Energy infrastructure if the Data Centres weren't soaking up renewable electricity".

If you want to have an "honest" discussion, then this sort of daft claim isn't the way to start one.

gjim

I dismantle way more cores in our various Hyperscaler projects each and every month than you used on-premise for your simulations which you mentioned last year.

That's cool - happy for you and all but this is supposed to be a thread about energy infrastructure - could you start a separate thread maybe titled "I'm a big swinging dick" somewhere else? Cheers.

Busman Paddy Lasty

Well at least we can agree on the need to expand our renewable energy infrastructure.

We can have nice modern things once powered by a more sustainable renewable footprint.

Capt'n Midnight

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123302009#Comment_123302009

That link says while demand will go up 45% peak demand will only go up 24%. It means the transmission infrastructure will have a higher capacity factor. It means more demand during off peak , so data centers should be effectively subsidising grid upgrades.

Data centers can do demand shedding, some can also send power back into the grid.

Birdnuts

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123298912#Comment_123298912

Simplistic BS - in reality it means more fossil back up and higher energy prices. Wind powered spoofers like SSE etc. already signalling steep price rises over the coming months

Busman Paddy Lasty

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123302264#Comment_123302264

Fossil backup is better than a 100% gas grid. A country of 5.5 million relying on gas use will raise electricity prices. Guaranteed.

I never mentioned wind by the way. Your whiskey fuelled anti wind rants are predictable and meaningless.

cnocbui

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123307080#Comment_123307080

France has achieved a zero CO2 grid and their electricity prices are 43% lower than ours, so your claim is fallacious.

The average price per kWh, including tax, is 0.2016€ in January of 2024

Ireland:

In March 2025, the average price of electricity in Ireland per unit is 34.38c per kWh.

AlmightyCushion

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123307168#Comment_123307168

France doesn't have a zero co2 grid. Carbon emissions from their grid is low but it isn't zero.

cnocbui

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123307249#Comment_123307249

In 2023, France produced more zero carbon electricity than the total amount of electricity France consumed. That fits my definition of a zero CO2 grid.

millb

UK grid this afternoon - massive PV - also importing a good bit

low Gas compared to our 62% gas. I saw that Pakistan put in 22 GW of new solar last year.

cnocbui

Meanwhile, somewhere more relevant… Burn that gas, baby. Solar is a risible 11% capacity factor in this country.

bk

NA

josip

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123335197#Comment_123335197

Careful cnocbui, someone might mistake your post as being in favour of solar 🙂

MichelDixNeuf

Someone is in favour of more solar…there is money to be made.

https://www.independent.ie/farming/news/it-could-lead-to-devastating-consequences-for-the-dairy-industry-massive-cork-solar-farm-on-top-dairy-site-criticised-by-local-td/a1229256620.html

https://www.independent.ie/farming/news/it-could-lead-to-devastating-consequences-for-the-dairy-industry-massive-cork-solar-farm-on-top-dairy-site-criticised-by-local-td/a1229256620.html

Apogee

Looks like Sceirde Rocks project is dead

The news website The Currency reported that sources close to Corio Generation had indicated recent survey work had meant it was not in a position to proceed.

The company, owned by Macquarie Asset Management, has not responded to a request for confirmation from The Irish Times but it is understood that Corio has been in contact with the Government to confirm it is not going ahead.

https://www.irishtimes.com/environment/2025/04/11/connemara-offshore-wind-farm-will-not-go-ahead-dealing-blow-to-governments-climate-targets/

tphase

Lots of happy people in the Carna region tonight....

josip

They might not have pulled out for the reasons given. A bit like someone who agrees to buy a house, can't secure finance and then uses things discovered during an engineer's inspection to justify the withdrawl rather than advertise they couldn't get the money.

"Corio Generation said it plans to restructure its offshore wind development business to focus on a smaller portfolio of projects."

"Last year, Macquarie started looking for buyers for Corio Generation. In December, Corio announced job cuts globally but these did not affect the Ireland-based staff.

On April 8th, Reuters reported that Macquarie had cancelled the sale due to lack of interest from the market."

I don't think there's anything unsurprising or insurmountable about the Atlantic around Sceirde Rocks. I just think it will take someone with deeper pockets than Corio to develop it and it won't happen before 2030.

cnocbui

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123350139#Comment_123350139

I think storm Eoin and it's 190 kph winds put paid to OSW off the west coast, particularly since the models were thinking 230 kph might be reached. Eoin really put the wind up them, you might say.

Any OSW off the west coast is likely to experience the sort of winds and sea conditions - possibly worse - that the floating OSW farms off Scotland experienced. Those were engineering disasters and proved existing turbines are not up to it.

Grassy Knoll

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123351505#Comment_123351505

a fair summary, west coast off shore wind energy seems finished as I see it.

Apogee

Two different reports on Sceirde Rocks, citing a combination of engineering and financial constraints. Is there a facility under ORESS1 for either Arklow Banks 2 or Oriel to reapply if an approved project withdraws?

Sunday Times

Renews:

The site investigations are understood to show that the project, which already features tough rocky seabed conditions, is also affected by severe wave and currents.

Sources pointed out to reNEWS that many of the challenges were known for what is considered the toughest of the Phase 1 schemes.

Corio had been exploring gravity base foundations, similar to the ones at the Fecamp project off France (pictured), to unlock the project. It also holds an ORESS 1 contract.

https://renews.biz/100032/corio-shelves-450mw-sceirde-rocks/

SBP report on potential changes to stage 2 process

https://puc.ie/papers361/

machiavellianme

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123352113#Comment_123352113

I think both Arklow and Oriel signed PPAs with data centres so don't need ORESS1 anymore. Though Oriel has been around since Gate 3 back in 2008 and never progressed, so who knows?

tphase

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123357625#Comment_123357625

One of many

Rain from the West

The Greenlink interconnector between Ireland and Wales is now online.

https://www.rte.ie/news/ireland/2025/0416/1507996-ireland-wales-electricity-interconnector/

Apogee

An update of sorts on planning for Oriel, NISA and Arklow Banks. Lots of 'Further Information' requests on potential enviromental impacts

They must address in more detail concerns raised by the National Parks and Wildlife Service about the potential impacts on birds such as the roseate tern, red-throated diver, guillemot, shag, gannet, kittiwake and sandpiper.

Particular concerns have been raised about the effect of Oriel on the annual brent geese migration.

A concern specific to the Arklow Bank is the potential impact of the existing small seven-turbine wind farm nearby – the country’s first and only offshore wind farm – in conjunction with the towering new installation.

SSE, developer of Arklow Bank, has been told to examine the collision risks posed by two clusters of turbines of differing heights.

Greater detail is also sought from all three projects on the likely impacts on seals and dolphins, fish and bats.

The planners want more clarity on how the companies plan to manage underwater and airborne noise.

[…]

Submissions from the Department of Transport raise concerns about ­access routes for the Irish Coast Guard’s search-and-rescue vehicles.

Dublin Airport and the Air Corps are also seeking assurances around interference with flight paths and radar from the giant cranes that will be used during construction, and from the turbines which will reach 300-metres high when in operation.

Meath and Wexford County Councils and Fáilte Ireland are worried about tourism, specifically the visual impact on Meath’s Brú na Bóinne world heritage site and Wexford’s renowned beaches. Wexford County Council has also raised “the potential impact on population mental health and well-being” from the “significant visual impact” on the landscape and seascape.

The planning authority also wants more detail on the impact of onshore construction works on coastal erosion.

Other issues include the effects on commercial fisheries, the Ireland-Scotland undersea gas interconnector and onshore traffic during construction. The companies must also address submissions from the Isle of Man, which has raised concerns about bird and fish life.

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/offshore-wind-farm-rulings-on-hold-as-planners-request-further-information-on-impact/a1077117662.html

Apparently ABP say the Sceirde Rocks application hasn't yet been formally withdrawn.

fael

A little bit of good news about off shore wind farms… Normally the consensus (certainly if you look at the planning appeals for wind farms) seems to be that off shore wind farms are to be devoid of live and a disaster for the environment. The reality is that there isn't a massive amount of research about it. Recently research came out where they sample the water around wind farms and extract DNA from the particles. This shows which animals are active. It appears to be good habitat for sharks and rays. And it seems that the main reason is that off shore wind farms are exclusion zones for fishing. It can still certainly be the case that wind farms have negative effects, but perhaps that is outweighed by the positives for at least some species.

Research was done in Dutch wind farms in the North sea. They even found evidence of basking sharks, which are very rarely sighted there.

As always with a good research paper more research is required… link below:

Elasmobranchs in offshore wind farms - ScienceDirect

The 1922 Committee

The economics of offshore are challenging even if you have a CFD in your pocket.

Hornsea 4 off the coast from Hull has been abandoned. It doesn't bode well for future offshore in Ireland.

https://energydigital.com/articles/offshore-wind-why-has-orsted-scrapped-hornsea-4

gjim

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123434493#Comment_123434493

Yes the economics of offshore are very challenging if you've bid for a CfD at a price based on the expectation of low interest rates, low inflation, economic stability and growing demand.

But this looks to me like a flaw in the CfD auction process as it allows bidders to bid extremely aggressively/low (driving out competition) but afterwards they have the option to not proceed. The auction process needs tweaking here.

I'm not sure that having a CfD is the huge benefit people think it is - during the 2022 energy crisis, the wind generation companies were all hit with huge rebate bills as wholesale prices often exceeded strike prices. It's really a mechanism to reduce revenue volatility, not to increase profits. There are two OSW projects in Ireland currently in planning which bypassed the ORESS process entirely - they're happy to go it alone - and take the risk that there's more money to made on the upside - during wholesale price spikes - than there is to be lost during the downside when wholesale prices are below the strike.

There's no question about the future of offshore - the rate of new offshore deployment is still growing globally - albeit the rate of increase are "only" 10/15% year-on-year unlike the astounding growth of solar.

The 1922 Committee

The CFD price for Hornsea 4 was much lower than struck for ORESS which probably explains why they backed out.

I would be of the opinion that those who aren't supplying to the grid consumed by citizens of the Republic aren't serving the public interest and should fail on that point during the MAC application process and their allocations be clawed back. The Maritime Regulator acknowledges Ireland's offshore is a scarce resource. I am of the opinion it is scarcer than most realize as the bathymetry maps show the trough in the Irish Sea is more so off the Irish Coast than the Welsh and English coast. To make a project economic proposers are seeking to install ever taller turbines. Even 5km off shore the large turbines are unpleasant to the eye so the people of Ireland should be deriving meaningful value from them if they suffer the loss of visual amenity. It is only fair.

There is an asset grab ongoing for a scarce resource. It should be to the benefit of the Public.

gjim

I would be of the opinion that those who aren't supplying to the grid consumed by citizens of the Republic aren't serving the public interest and should fail on that point during the MAC application process and their allocations be clawed back

I don't get what you mean here. What would be "clawed back"? RESS/ORESS contracts expire in 6 years or something like that if they're not supplying electricity to the grid.

Even 5km off shore the large turbines are unpleasant to the eye so the people of Ireland should be deriving meaningful value from them if they suffer the loss of visual amenity. It is only fair.

That's a subjective opinion - I don't find them at all unpleasant to the eye, certainly no more so than any other modern piece of infrastructure. Sounds like a manifesto for extreme NIMBYism to be honest - "I don't like the look of them so they shouldn't be built". And it's a weird version of NIMBYism as these locations are not in anyone's "back yard" by any stretch of the definition.

Even if all the current OSW projects are completed, I would imagine that the majority of the population could go their entire lives without every laying eyes on an off-shore turbine. While pylons, factories, motorways, apartment buildings, one-off houses, port infrastructure, etc. are all far more visually intrusive and affects everyone's lives on a daily basis. We "put up" with the visual intrusion because we want to live in a modern state.

There is an asset grab ongoing for a scarce resource.

It's only a "resource" if someone builds OSW farms - it's not a "resource" if it's not exploited. It's a resource because of the very existence of this technology and the willingness of people to invest in OSW.

Because of recent technology developments, Ireland - historically an energy starved country - finds itself in the fortunate position of having a potentially huge natural energy resource and could easily become a net exporter of energy.

I find the push back weird to be honest. Technology developments mean that the country has won the energy lottery after years of relying on fossil fuel imports for 90%+ of its energy needs and yet there are people who argue we should just throw away the winning ticket.