Local Elections 2019

Topgear on Dave

Former councillor Sinead Burke (SF Navan) has discovered that she is not entitled to unemployment assistance.

https://www.lmfm.ie/news/calls-for-aftercare-support-for-former-councillors/

I didnt think being a local councillor was classed as a full time job? If they are getting paid is the PRSI not paid too??

Seth Brundle

Topgear on Dave wrote: »

Former councillor Sinead Burke (SF Navan) has discovered that she is not entitled to unemployment assistance.

https://www.lmfm.ie/news/calls-for-aftercare-support-for-former-councillors/

I didnt think being a local councillor was classed as a full time job? If they are getting paid is the PRSI not paid too??

Presumably Jeff Rudd has breathed a huge sigh of relief that next to nobody votes for him!

washiskin

CrabRevolution wrote: »

As an update on Sharon Keogan, who has been mentioned on this thread before. She's the independent who was elected in 2 different electoral areas in Meath and was insistent that she'd be doing both jobs. It seems she's barred from holding both seats at once, and has said she won't challenge the rules in court "on cost grounds".

She staying in the Laytown seat she defended, and the Ashbourne seat is to be immediately co-opted, with Keogan wanting to be able to choose the new councilor herself, saying she won the seat and is entitled to do as she pleases with it. It's a bit up in the air though as the entire council have to vote on who gets the seat, and there's talk of a FG/FF carve up, where a failed FF candidate from this election will get the seat in return for FG getting more shakes at the Cathaoirleach position over the next 5 years.

The arrogance of that woman knows no bounds...... she tried to be co-opted in before when her former partner gave up his seat, only to be overruled. Then her son took it, who was a complete unknown in the area and kept it warm for the next election. The fact that she thinks it's her seat and she's "entitled" to do as she pleases with ut speaks volumes.

L1011

Renua have gone from 1 seat to 0 seats now. Leahy has resigned entirely*

He was paid as leader, they have 200k a year or so in state funding so it'll be interesting to see who they install to burn it

*As leader / from the party - suspect it's a precursor to joining FF

L1011

Topgear on Dave wrote: »

Former councillor Sinead Burke (SF Navan) has discovered that she is not entitled to unemployment assistance.

https://www.lmfm.ie/news/calls-for-aftercare-support-for-former-councillors/

I didnt think being a local councillor was classed as a full time job? If they are getting paid is the PRSI not paid too??

SF sub their councillors where possible from the money they levy off TDs, MEPs etc that give the difference between the not-actually-average-wage and their salary to the party

This was to try build up a solid base for the future and get TDs in in those areas, but it hasn't worked at all - plenty of those councillors were voted out.

blackwhite

L1011 wrote: »

SF sub their councillors where possible from the money they levy off TDs, MEPs etc that give the difference between the not-actually-average-wage and their salary to the party

This was to try build up a solid base for the future and get TDs in in those areas, but it hasn't worked at all - plenty of those councillors were voted out.

Always wondered how SF were allowed to take this money from their MEPs/TDs.

Have they been given a special exemption from the limits on donations by individuals to political parties?

For Forks Sake

L1011 wrote: »

Renua have gone from 1 seat to 0 seats now. Leahy has resigned entirely*

He was paid as leader, they have 200k a year or so in state funding so it'll be interesting to see who they install to burn it

*As leader / from the party - suspect it's a precursor to joining FF

Apparently according to Renuas internal structures, the leader needs to be an elected representative, so that's going to be a challenge

RainNeverBow

For Forks Sake wrote: »

Apparently according to Renuas internal structures, the leader needs to be an elected representative, so that's going to be a challenge

So LE19 killed Renua. That's one good outcome at least

L1011

blackwhite wrote: »

Always wondered how SF were allowed to take this money from their MEPs/TDs.

Have they been given a special exemption from the limits on donations by individuals to political parties?

There has to be a way around it - the SocDems were heavily funded by James Heffernan before he lost his seat and they got state funding, so it's not just SF doing it.

Labour also require a "donation" from elected reps, vastly lower though. It's 1k a year from councillors from their 17k and I believe proportionally more from TDs and Senators

expectationlost

CrabRevolution wrote: »

As an update on Sharon Keogan, who has been mentioned on this thread before. She's the independent who was elected in 2 different electoral areas in Meath and was insistent that she'd be doing both jobs. It seems she's barred from holding both seats at once, and has said she won't challenge the rules in court "on cost grounds".

She staying in the Laytown seat she defended, and the Ashbourne seat is to be immediately co-opted, with Keogan wanting to be able to choose the new councilor herself, saying she won the seat and is entitled to do as she pleases with it. It's a bit up in the air though as the entire council have to vote on who gets the seat, and there's talk of a FG/FF carve up, where a failed FF candidate from this election will get the seat in return for FG getting more shakes at the Cathaoirleach position over the next 5 years.

from last week person making the distinction between vacated co-option and a unfilled seat https://twitter.com/Keogan4Meath/status/1137084351760519170
but
https://www.dlrcoco.ie/sites/default/files/atoms/files/how_members_of_local_authorities_are_elected_-_english_media10435en.pdf

If a candidate has been elected as a member in more than one electoral area, they must, within three days ofthe public notice of the results, declare in writing which area they wish to represent. Consequential vacancies are treated as casual vacancies

1415.Casual VacanciesCasual vacancies arising in the membership of elected local authorities are filled by co-option by the authority concerned. The co-opted member holds the seat until the next election under the same conditions as elected councillors.

casual vacancies s19 http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/2001/act/37/enacted/en/print#sec19

19.—(1) A casual vacancy in the membership of a local authority occurs—


(a) where section 16 (1) applies,


(b) upon the death or resignation (including deemed resignation by virtue of section 18 (4)) of a member of a local authority,


(c) in such circumstances as are set out in Articles 25, 28 and 124 of the Local Elections Regulations, 1995 ( S.I. No. 297 of 1995 ),


(d) in such circumstances as may be prescribed by regulations made by the Minister under section 27 , or http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/2001/act/37/enacted/en/print#sec27


(e) in such circumstances as are referred to in section 15(1) of the Local Elections (Petitions and Disqualifications) Act, 1974 .


(2) It is the duty of the meetings administrator to notify the members of the local authority in writing on becoming aware that a casual vacancy has or may have occurred.


(3) (a) A casual vacancy shall be filled by the co-option by the local authority of a person to fill the vacancy and except where paragraph (c) or (d) or (e) of subsection (1) apply, subject to such person being nominated by the same registered political party who nominated for election or co-option the member who caused the casual vacancy.


(b) Where the person causing the casual vacancy was a non-party candidate at his or her election to the local authority, the vacancy shall be filled by the co-option by the local authority of a person to fill the vacancy (except where paragraph (c) or (d) or (e) of subsection (1) apply) in accordance with such requirements and procedures as may be set out in its standing orders.


(c) A local authority shall in making standing orders consider the inclusion of provisions for the purposes of paragraph (b).


(4) (a) A co-option shall be made, after due notice, at the next meeting of the local authority after the expiration of 14 days from the occurrence of the vacancy or as soon after the expiration of the 14 days as circumstances permit.


(b) In this subsection “due notice” means not less than 3 clear days' notice given in writing to every member of the local authority.


(5) A person is not to be proposed at a meeting of the local authority for co-option without his or her prior written consent.


(6) A person co-opted to fill a casual vacancy shall be a member of the local authority until the next ordinary day of retirement of members of that local authority unless he or she sooner ceases to be a member.

(d) applies in this case, but it doesn't explain how their seat is filled
s124 http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/1995/si/297/made/en/print

124 Person elected for more than one local electoral area.


124. (1) Where, at an election, a person is elected as a member of the same local authority for two or more local electoral areas, the person shall, within the period of three days after the return is made of persons elected to be members of the local authority, by writing signed by the person and delivered to the clerk or secretary of such local authority, declare which one of those areas the person chooses to represent, and if such declaration is not so delivered within the said period, the person shall, at the end of the said period, be deemed to have chosen to represent the local electoral area in respect of which the person received the greatest number of first preference votes.


(2) Where, in pursuance of this article, a person chooses, or is deemed to have chosen, to represent a particular local electoral area of a local authority the person shall be deemed not to have been elected for any other local electoral area of the said local authority and the consequential vacancy or vacancies in the membership of the local authority shall be regarded as casual vacancies occurring on the day on which the newly-elected members come into office under section 9 of the Act of 1994 and shall be filled accordingly.

meath council standing orders?

Kevin Callan won two in Louth and has nominated somebody https://www.lmfm.ie/news/callan-to-nominate-former-ff-candidate-declan-powe/#.XQChhQ7H7PM.twitter

expectationlost

blackwhite wrote: »

Always wondered how SF were allowed to take this money from their MEPs/TDs.

Have they been given a special exemption from the limits on donations by individuals to political parties?

they say its not going to the party but the constituency organisation, SIPO won't tackle it.

CrabRevolution

expectationlost wrote: »

from last week person making the distinction between vacated co-option and a unfilled seat https://twitter.com/Keogan4Meath/status/1137084351760519170

It's a bizarre stance from Keogan TBH; "Please place my pal on the council. She's the perfect fit for the job despite not even running in the election held only 2 weeks ago".

She came close to winning 2 seats five years ago too, and many people commented that she wouldn't be able to take both seats. The fact she went an tried again must mean either:

1. She didn't bother looking up the law on the matter at any stage in the last 5 years, or

2. She did find out she couldn't hold 2 seats, but reckoned it is an acceptable way to get your friend elected anyway.

James Brown

Topgear on Dave wrote: »

Former councillor Sinead Burke (SF Navan) has discovered that she is not entitled to unemployment assistance.

https://www.lmfm.ie/news/calls-for-aftercare-support-for-former-councillors/

I didnt think being a local councillor was classed as a full time job? If they are getting paid is the PRSI not paid too??

I hope she can show she looked for employment and didn't just stroll in looking for money.
Do they call it 'assistance' after you paid tax/stamps?

expectationlost

expectationlost wrote: »

from last week person making the distinction between vacated co-option and a unfilled seat https://twitter.com/Keogan4Meath/status/1137084351760519170
but
https://www.dlrcoco.ie/sites/default/files/atoms/files/how_members_of_local_authorities_are_elected_-_english_media10435en.pdf
casual vacancies s19 http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/2001/act/37/enacted/en/print#sec19


(d) applies in this case, but it doesn't explain how their seat is filled
s124 http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/1995/si/297/made/en/print

meath council standing orders?

Kevin Callan won two in Louth and has nominated somebody https://www.lmfm.ie/news/callan-to-nominate-former-ff-candidate-declan-powe/#.XQChhQ7H7PM.twitter

MCC standing order for casual vacancies https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B6AEiinGYynONTNVaHNRSFN1TEdJdjhkT2szMnNvOGNzdlZN/view?usp=sharing

Casual Vacancy 88. A casual vacancy shall be filled in accordance with Section 19 of the Local Government Act, 2001. The following procedures shall apply when a casual vacancy arises in the membership of the Council in respect of a non-party Councillor: a) Following an election at any time during the life of that Council, each Councillor elected as a non-party Councillor shall lodge with the Meetings’ Administrator a sealed envelope (signed and dated by September, 2014 18 the Councillor concerned) containing a list of up to six names who shall be entitled to be co-opted to the Council in the event of a casual vacancy caused by that Councillor. The list of names shall show a clear preference for the order of nomination, i.e., 1, 2, 3 etc. The envelope shall also contain a signed form of consent to the nomination from each person so nominated and a declaration from each person so nominated that they were not, at the time of the election, and are not at the time of nomination a member of any registered political party. The nomination date shall be the date on which the sealed envelope is received by the Meetings’ Administrator and said date will be marked on the sealed envelope by the Meetings’ Administrator. A person shall not be a valid nominee if their consent and declaration is not provided in the sealed envelope at the date of nomination. b) Each elected non-party Councillor shall be entitled, having made an initial nomination as referred to in (a) above, to submit revised nominations at any time during the life of the Council and any such revisions must be notified in writing to the Meetings’ Administrator and a fresh sealed envelope, signed by the Councillor concerned (to include the signed form of consent and declaration of the nominees) and clearly dated shall be lodged with the Meetings’ Administrator. The envelope containing the previous nomination(s) shall be returned to the Councillor concerned by the Meetings’ Administrator. Once revised nomin September, 2014 19 vacancy. A nominated person shall not be eligible for consideration to fill a casual vacancy unless (on or after the date of the casual vacancy arising) he/she has submitted his/her consent in writing to being co-opted to fill the casual vacancy and submitted a declaration that he/she has not been at the election date and nomination date a member of a registered political party and that he/she meets the above eligibility requirements. d) The person proposed for co-option to fill the casual vacancy shall be the first valid nominee so nominated in the order of preference appearing on the list of nominee(s) contained in the sealed envelope submitted by the elected non-party Councillor, who has furnished the consent and statutory declaration referred to in ( c ) above. e) In the event of a casual vacancy arising in respect of a person coopted in accordance with the above procedure the vacancy shall be filled by selecting the next valid nominee in the order of preference appearing on the list of nominee(s) contained in the most recent sealed envelope provided to the Meetings’ Administrator by the elected non-party Councillor prior to the casual vacancy arising. f) In the event of an elected non-party Councillor failing or refusing to submit nomination(s) in accordance with this Standing Order or where there are no remaining valid nominees of said elected nonparty Councillor, as referred to at (c) above, a casual vacancy arising shall be filled by resolution of the Council from amongst persons meeting the requirements to be a valid nominee as set out at (c) above. In the event of two or more valid nominees being proposed and seconded the selection of the person to be co-opted shall be in the same manner as the method used for the election of Cathaoirleach as set out in Section 37 Local Government Act 2001. The provisions in paragraphs (a) to (f) above shall apply regardless of whether or not a Councillor elected as a non-party Councillor has affiliated to a registered political party since the date of his/her election.

its quite detailed but still doesn't explicitly refer to the situation of person elected to two seats, I still don't know whether it actually meets the criteria of casual vacancy, in order for the above to go into effect.

expectationlost

so Keogan got her candidate in based on council vote https://twitter.com/meathchronicle/status/1145705847051509760 FF councillors voted against an FF candidate Mellor due to council pact https://www.lmfm.ie/news/amanda-smith-co-opted-onto-meath-county-council/ https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/local-elections/local-elections-results/meath-county-council-star-of-gogglebox-takes-seat-in-navan-1.3890465