Diesel auto options

lausp

Hello all, hoping I can get some opinions on my considerations for a new (to me) car.

Firstly, my requirements.

180bhp+, 0-60 < 8 seconds, auto, leather, saloon. Preferably Android Auto.

I do a 40km commute with approx 60% of that motorway.

I have a 2011 320d and have been to a couple of dealers where they seem to be allowing me 6-7k for it. It has 136k miles.

I'd be putting 15-16k with this max.

My considerations to date have been:

B47 engined 2015/2016 320d (sport or msport) or 2015 520d (preferably msport but most likely se). - Driving BMWs for a while now and I like the look and the drive of them. Feel like the 5 is a step up in quality but the F30 is a fresher design.

Audi A6 190bhp. - A4 does nothing for me, A6 I think looks good from facelift in 2015.

Merc C220/C250 or E220. - Curve ball, interior seems the best but never driven one and styling on the rear is questionable.

Briefly looked at 330e and Jag XE also but not sure on those. 330e seems a bit of a faff to barely get diesel economy and XE reliability is a but suspect.

All of these cars are beginning to fall in to the 22-23k price bracket with less than 50k miles.

Ignoring the fact that driving dynamics are different not to mention the sizes, which one of the above is

- best value for money at this price point
- best to live with
- best to drive

Are there any other suggestions that might be worthwhile?

As you probably can guess I'm not particularly into Japanese cars but I did look at the IS300h. The motorway economy put me off a bit as well as the reviews of the gearbox.

Duke O Smiley

What about an A7? You’ll get an an 11/12/maybe 13 for low-to-mid 20s

Lot of car for the money. Everything an A6 has and more.

lausp

Duke O Smiley wrote: »

What about an A7? You’ll get an an 11/12/maybe 13 for low-to-mid 20s

Lot of car for the money. Everything an A6 has and more.

Well I have a 2011 now. I should of mentioned I'd really like to get into a 2015 and preferably a 2016.

A7 looks interesting but they are big money.

Duke O Smiley

I get you. Facelift A7 came in around 2015 and they still command big money alright.

There’s great value to be had in slightly older but bigger engine cars, 5 or 730, 3.0 A6, A7 or even A8. Have you considered an SUV at all? New X5, Touareg etc.

Sorry, probably not what you want to hear. Just thinking about what I’d do in your shoes!

lausp

I did briefly consider an SUV but I think I would miss the handling of a saloon. I don't really care about high driving position.

Maintenance costs on an X5 or Touraeg scare me also.

My 320d had been very cheap to run and part costs are generally very reasonable for it.

Duke O Smiley

Understandable. I went from an A6 to a 730d last year; tyres are sore but otherwise there’s not been much at all to contend with on that front. With a budget like yours too tax on a bigger engine is still reasonable with low-ish Co2 levels, which is nice. I’d be taking advantage of that.

What about a new model CLS? 2.1 diesel, auto, leather and all that nice stuff. Very nice cars and a bit more flash (and comfort) than a 3 or even 5 series. I’m on mobile so can’t link but Evra Motors on Donedeal have a nice 2015 for 24k currently.

All things considered I tho k you’ve covered and considered most bases in your OP. An F30 3 series would probably be your safest bet and will likely hold its value better than any of the others

Shefwedfan

Ignoring the fact that driving dynamics are different not to mention the sizes, which one of the above is

- best value for money at this price point
- best to live with
- best to drive

I don't really understand why you are looking at a diesel. If you look at all of the above petrol will be far better than a diesel.

Then take into consideration the small commute you don't need a diesel.

You refer to take off speed and then say the 330e is a bit faff? why? the quickest acceleration from standing point is electric, back that up with a petrol engine and great combination.

It just seems an odd combination of requirement. You want speed, good driving etc and then ask for a diesel?

Personally if it was me and 3 series was perfect then move to330e, if you want a change then look at the Merc or 5 series hybrids

Duke O Smiley

There is a regular poster on the motors forum with a 330e and as far as I know he is not very happy with the fuel consumption. Similarly I know someone who recently imported a PHEV Range Rover and they say the fuel consumption is diabolical.

Those E Class hybrids were a disaster for Merc too. A few years ago when they were new Merc dealers in the UK didn’t even have the equipment or know how to work on them, people were just given refunds instead.

There’s a long way to go yet before hybrids like these are a really good idea IMO

Shefwedfan

Duke O Smiley wrote: »

There is a regular poster on the motors forum with a 330e and as far as I know he is not very happy with the fuel consumption. Similarly I know someone who recently imported a PHEV Range Rover and they say the fuel consumption is diabolical.

Those E Class hybrids were a disaster for Merc too. A few years ago when they were new Merc dealers in the UK didn’t even have the equipment or know how to work on them, people were just given refunds instead.

There’s a long way to go yet before hybrids like these are a really good idea IMO

A Range Rover and good fuel comsumption?? :P why would you buy a Range Rover and then worry about fuel comsumption? that a small bit silly



Even if you are not talking about hybrid the OP commute of 40km is hardly diesel territory. A straight petrol would be more econimical, better to drive, faster and smoother than a diesel



I think the 330e will do at least worst case 20km on battery alone before petrol kicks in, probably more if in traffic and then will run in hybrid mode. So will be better to a straight petrol...


I had A6, lovely car, was beautiful to drive and so comfy. It was brill when I done a 100km each way commute. I moved, probably 40km each way commute with traffic and it was running at 14ltr/100km....some days better but it was drinking diesel. I switched.



I have no idea about the comment in regards to Merc giving refunds, sounds like a bar stool story. Any of these car garages get certifications before they can sell hybrids/electric etc. So if they sold it they can service it. VW/Merc/Audi/BMW are all the same. So why would they give money back? also what is the different in serving a hybrid to electric? what equipment did they need? Just out of interest.

Duke O Smiley

Land Rover claim something like 80-odd MPG but in reality (so far) its been less than half that. You’re solely using the petrol engine for a massive portion of your time behind the wheel, and a 2.0 4 banger at that so it’s going to be poor.

Like I said as well, re the 330e, I only remember a poster from here posting about how bad his 330e was on fuel. I think I’d be a bit miffed if I had bought a hybrid and it turned out to be no better on fuel than a regular petrol car, I’d be expecting substantial savings to be honest.

Regarding the Mercs, they were rated the worst car for complaints and call backs in the UK in 2014. Forums are strewn with horror stories, especially of dealers being unable to fix various things. I read them myself, some people rejected them and received their money back. Stories are even on piston heads

I’d steer clear of a hybrid that isn’t a Prius or IMA Honda to be honest. I think they need a lot of improvement before they are viable

lausp

Shefwedfan wrote: »

I don't really understand why you are looking at a diesel. If you look at all of the above petrol will be far better than a diesel.

Then take into consideration the small commute you don't need a diesel.

You refer to take off speed and then say the 330e is a bit faff? why? the quickest acceleration from standing point is electric, back that up with a petrol engine and great combination.

Firstly, my commute is 40km each way, i.e 80km per day. Add in another 100km at the weekend and we are at 26k km a year. I would regard this as diesel territory.

There are no petrol options available in the cars I outlined apart from a few 330es. Yes I like the performance figures of it but it is a bit of a faff.

Here's why.

Let's say I plug it in at home and can't charge at work. I get 20km out of this. It has an 8Kw battery roughly at 15c
per Kw to charge. I will not be getting a night rate meter because of my usage patterns. So costs 1.20 to charge. To keep figures easy, 12 miles on electric. The worst diesel will do 48mpg, meaning I need quarter of a gallon to get those 12 miles. A quarter of a gallon of diesel is 1.135 litres of diesel which costs roughly 1.50. The remainder of this journey will be on petrol/hybrid power where the average appears to be 40mpg or so. The fuel is also 7c per litre more expensive than diesel.

So I save myself 30 cents in fuel each time I plug in vs the diesel cost for that 20km, but get worse economy and use more expensive fuel for the rest of the journey.

I also still have all the negatives associated with an ICE in terms of servicing etc and reduced boot space.

I'm happy to be corrected but it doesn't seem to make sense to plug in every time I park it to save 30 cents.

Shefwedfan

Your overall total mileage per year is not a good figure to use for picking fuel. You should pick on what is your regular trip. You mention 40km so that would be best achieved in petrol. The hybrid will just mean you get better MPG compared to petrol. Even when not running in full battery mode you will be in hybrid so will get additional savings....diesel would be a consideration if you did 80km to work and 80km back....

I originally suggested petrol because of your other requirements as well. You asked for a fast car/best to drive which is not diesel. A petrol engine will always be better than diesel.

Of course your choice but as I said originally it seems a strange combination of requirements for a diesel car.

Have you test drove the 330e or a petrol BMW?

lausp

It's not 40km though. It's an 80km round trip with 60% of that on the motorway.

Every review I've read from owners says the economy in the 330e is crap on the motorway.

I don't see the point of saving 30 cents for the hassle to plug in, and I don't want to compromise by driving slower than I normally would just to try and get close to the economy that a diesel would do easily at way over the speed limit.

Of course a petrol is nicer to drive than a diesel but no petrol with 180+ bhp can do anything remotely close to 50mpg.

I have not driven the 330e. I have gone and viewed a couple but I still can't justify the figures I already outlined. The car doesn't make any sense to me. It might be fine if you only ever did short journey's but then what's the point of having a 250bhp car?