Toll dodgers fined

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https://m.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/eleven-m50-toll-dodgers-fined-total-of-126000-37951448.html

The article says it all.

Eleven motorists who dodged payment of hundreds of tolls on the M50 have been hit with fines totalling more than €126,000.
On top of the fines, which totalled €126,500, each owner was ordered to pay costs.

Claire Burke, of Balbutcher Lane, Ballymun, Dublin, was fined €9,000. Judge Halpin heard she was the registered owner of a car which had a history of 230 journeys and no payments. Some 500 letters were sent to her, said TII witness Sarah Kavanagh.

Marina Stan, of Aulden Grange, Santry, Dublin, had not paid for 215 journeys by her car on the M50, the court heard. For her five sample charges arising from journeys in September, Judge Halpin fined her €12,500.

Danielle Riccardo Muntean, of Castlesize Drive, Sallins, Co Kildare, was the owner of a car that made 284 trips on the M50 and had paid five times and was fined €12,500. Some 1,800 letters were sent out about those unpaid tolls.

David Tyrell, of Fairlawn Road, Finglas, was also fined €12,500.

The court heard his vehicle had a history of 728 passages with no payment.

Some 2,000 letters had also been sent to him with no replies.

sbsquarepants

The article says it all.

Nothing to add so.

Midnight_EG

What a riveting opening post, I feel so well informed

is_that_so

Midnight_EG wrote: »

What a riveting opening post, I feel so well informed

Well it was the article wot dun it!

StereoSound

I like it!

Guy:Incognito

None of them showed up to court? What are the chances this'll be back before the courts when they dont pay the fines?

Isambard

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

None of them showed up to court? What are the chances this'll be back before the courts when they dont pay the fines?

I can't understand how someone could think they'd get away with not paying hundreds of times. With a mindset like that, I'd agree there's little chance they will pay the fines anytime soon.

JustARandomGuy

I still think it's ridiculous that this toll is still in place there. Anyone remember when they said they'd remove the tolls when the road pays for itself?

Pinch Flat

JustARandomGuy wrote: »

I still think it's ridiculous that this toll is still in place there. Anyone remember when they said they'd remove the tolls when the road pays for itself?

Nope, current concession extends to 2042.

https://www.m50concession.com/operation-maintenance/

theteal

JustARandomGuy wrote: »

I still think it's ridiculous that this toll is still in place there. Anyone remember when they said they'd remove the tolls when the road pays for itself?

The toll remains in an effort to manage the traffic. Aren't we to expect more "barriers" in future?

Same thing was said for the Dartford crossing on the M25 near where I live

gmisk

The amount of paper wasted in that story is astonishing!
One of them alone getting 2000 letters!

seamus

gmisk wrote: »

The amount of paper wasted in that story is astonishing!
One of them alone getting 2000 letters!

Yeah, it's pretty mental.

Shannon is now using email and text to communicate with vehicle owners about tax renewals, so I see no reason why they shouldn't open that up to the likes of TII so they can text and email people about tolls rather than send letters.

Have people confirm their contact details every time they renew their tax. Sorted.

Though I suspect most of the people mentioned are probably pretty slow to keep their tax up to date.

Nobody is seeing any of this money, but now at least that prosecutions have been handed out, these people will end up in court one way or another.

Isambard

LIGHTNING wrote: »

Its brilliant logic, built a ring road to take traffic away from the city centre. Then by increasing the tolls people stop using it. Traffic back to the city centre. 4d chess from them

Well the M50 is far too close to the City to be other than an inner ring road. However when it was built, Ireland was a much different place. It really needs a link from the M7 somewhere near Portlaoise to the M1 near Drogheda to start addressing the problems. Ading lanes will just increase the usage.

biko

Added content to OP

kirving

I know this is a Motors forum, with the vast majority of us paying a small fortune to keep our cars legally on the road, but much as I hate the M50 toll, I can totally understand why someone wouldn't / couldn't pay a fine after it got to a certain level.

€12,500 for 284 trips works out €44 per trip, but the maximum possible fine you can get per journey is €148 (3+41.50+103.50) , so you could say that they got a discount.

But €148 is way beyond the level of reasonable, or fair in my book, even for those who don't/won't pay. 1,800 letters is also harassment in my view. If you didn't pay your mortgage the banks aren't allowed do that.

The M50 is a vital piece of national infrastructure, and should be free.

is_that_so

Kevin Irving wrote: »

I know this is a Motors forum, with the vast majority of us paying a small fortune to keep our cars legally on the road, but much as I hate the M50 toll, I can totally understand why someone wouldn't / couldn't pay a fine after it got to a certain level.

€12,500 for 284 trips works out €44 per trip, but the maximum possible fine you can get per journey is €148 (3+41.50+103.50) , so you could say that they got a discount.

But €148 is way beyond the level of reasonable, or fair in my book, even for those who don't/won't pay. 1,800 letters is also harassment in my view. If you didn't pay your mortgage the banks aren't allowed do that.

The M50 is a vital piece of national infrastructure, and should be free.

Part of the assumption on the part of those not paying is that by ignoring it, it will go away. I don't accept the can't afford it claim either. Some of them were commercial.

It needs to be maintained and that costs money but if you're a central taxation for everything fan then I guess it's OK we can scrap it.

StereoSound

The M50 will never be free... people are using it and mostly happy to pay for it so why would the state cripple a source of revenue and make it free ? I never go through the toll point, I always turn off at chapelizod or Liffey Valley to avoid it, I don't mind at all loosing some time doing that since I enjoy zipping up the back roads.

amcalester

Kevin Irving wrote: »

I know this is a Motors forum, with the vast majority of us paying a small fortune to keep our cars legally on the road, but much as I hate the M50 toll, I can totally understand why someone wouldn't / couldn't pay a fine after it got to a certain level.

€12,500 for 284 trips works out €44 per trip, but the maximum possible fine you can get per journey is €148 (3+41.50+103.50) , so you could say that they got a discount.

But €148 is way beyond the level of reasonable, or fair in my book, even for those who don't/won't pay. 1,800 letters is also harassment in my view. If you didn't pay your mortgage the banks aren't allowed do that.

The M50 is a vital piece of national infrastructure, and should be free.

I think the fines imposed were for 5 sample charges on each person not for all 284 trips, or whatever number of trips.

It was 1500 letters for 284 journeys, that’s about 6 letters per trip. My issue isn’t with the number of letters but that someone can rack up that number of unpaid tolls before being brought to court.

Hector Savage

JustARandomGuy wrote: »

I still think it's ridiculous that this toll is still in place there. Anyone remember when they said they'd remove the tolls when the road pays for itself?

Exactly, it paid for itself more than 10 years ago, ****ing joke.
Robbing bastards.

fxotoole

Vincenzo White Sandlot wrote: »

https://m.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/eleven-m50-toll-dodgers-fined-total-of-126000-37951448.html

The article says it all.

Scarleh for them. Proper fükking order.

fxotoole

Kevin Irving wrote: »

I know this is a Motors forum, with the vast majority of us paying a small fortune to keep our cars legally on the road, but much as I hate the M50 toll, I can totally understand why someone wouldn't / couldn't pay a fine after it got to a certain level.

€12,500 for 284 trips works out €44 per trip, but the maximum possible fine you can get per journey is €148 (3+41.50+103.50) , so you could say that they got a discount.

But €148 is way beyond the level of reasonable, or fair in my book, even for those who don't/won't pay. 1,800 letters is also harassment in my view. If you didn't pay your mortgage the banks aren't allowed do that.

The M50 is a vital piece of national infrastructure, and should be free.

Ok so how much more motor tax are you willing to pay in order to make the M50 free?

Isambard

fxotoole wrote: »

Ok so how much more motor tax are you willing to pay in order to make the M50 free?

you'll get nothing from me, only use it a handful of times a year.

kirving

fxotoole wrote: »

Ok so how much more motor tax are you willing to pay in order to make the M50 free?

That isn't the point. Of all roads, I just don't think that an absolutely vital ring road around our primate capital city should have a toll on it.

Over the past 5 years I've paid around €3000 in Motor tax, and (back of an envelope calculation), around €11,000 on taxes linked to fuel. I know some people here pay far more.

I don't have issues with tolls in general, and am lucky enough to not commute across the M50 daily, but I still average about €50 per month on toll charges.

This isn't to do with overall funds, it's because the government see a car as a luxury when it is fact a necessity in a sparsely populated country with inadequate public transport infrastructure.

If I had my way, I wouldn't have to commute in the car. I'd much prefer to take a combination of train and cycle and just use the car for weekends.

i57dwun4yb1pt8

daniele riccardo , f**k in hell the cheeky b@stard

Cabaal

Isambard wrote: »

you'll get nothing from me, only use it a handful of times a year.

That's not how taxation works.

if people want a "free" M50 everyone would have to pay towards it from another tax source. The fairest would be motor tax since the M50 is a road and any works on it or expansions are due to motor use.

Isambard

Cabaal wrote: »

That's not how taxation works.

if people want a "free" M50 everyone would have to pay towards it from another tax source. The fairest would be motor tax since the M50 is a road and any works on it or expansions are due to motor use.

what was being suggested was taxing everyone rather than taxing the users. Patently unfair.

kirving

Isambard wrote: »

what was being suggested was taxing everyone rather than taxing the users. Patently unfair.

"I don't have kids, so why should I pay for children's Allowance, or schools, or free GP card, or the children's hospital."

That argument doesn't stand up, and the reason being that the entire country benefits from having excellent transport infrastructure. There would be no money to pay for road upgrades in Donegal if it wasn't for wealth generated and taxes paid in Dublin (and other cities)

ExoPolitic

fxotoole wrote: »

Ok so how much more motor tax are you willing to pay in order to make the M50 free?

We dont pay motor tax, we pay an emissions based tax. Which brings me on to another quagmire, why the hell do they want to create another CO2 based tax and apply it to fuel, over what we already pay?!

2Mad2BeMad

I pay about 100 a month on tolls.
Majority is m50 if I could avoid it I would.
I go northbound every morning but if I had to go southbound every morning I'd probably look for a new job.
That Southbound traffic in the morning and northbound in the evening is horrific.
I couldn't justify paying a toll to sit in traffic every single morning and then evening on the way home.
At least the opposite direction has a good flow most of the time.

Caliden

The east link toll remains despite being paid for.

No way the m50 one goes.

As for them adding more tolls, the majority of people will just go back to using the back roads if that's the case.

Scottie99

I pay my tolls but a colleague claims he writes Return to Sender when the fine appears. He’s never had an issue.

AndrewJRenko

Scottie99 wrote: »

I pay my tolls but a colleague claims he writes Return to Sender when the fine appears. He’s never had an issue.

Do you believe everything he tells you?

Scottie99

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Do you believe everything he tells you?

I’ve no reason not to..
Why clearly you don’t believe him..

donkey balls

I have being using the M50 on a regular basis(monthly) the last few years having changed jobs from the north side to the south side, I have the car registered just in case I forgot to pay the toll.

I only use it now and again when in a hurry other than that I have an alternative route that I take, Another lad in the job uses it on a daily basis he reckons he spends about 1300e.

Every road out of Dublin has a toll on it with three of them being in Meath, I use to drive to London and not see one toll, In fact you can drive London to Glasgow and not go through a toll.

And the best one is that the PPP that built the roads hold all the aces so if a consortium running the toll don't make ex amount off profit/ traffic using the toll, The government will pay the difference yet if the company makes a profit they get to keep the lot.

ExoPolitic

theres a toll bridge in Waterford, saves 5 minutes of journey time for 3.10 per trip...an expensive 5 minutes! Don't use it, ever...

Isambard

ExoPolitic wrote: »

theres a toll bridge in Waterford, saves 5 minutes of journey time for 3.10 per trip...an expensive 5 minutes! Don't use it, ever...

I don't know what journey you are making, but pre-toll bridge it used to take longer than 5 minutes to pass through the City, a lot longer sometimes. I'd hazzard a guess it saves about 20 minutes

blackwhite

donkey balls wrote: »

I have being using the M50 on a regular basis(monthly) the last few years having changed jobs from the north side to the south side, I have the car registered just in case I forgot to pay the toll.

I only use it now and again when in a hurry other than that I have an alternative route that I take, Another lad in the job uses it on a daily basis he reckons he spends about 1300e.

Every road out of Dublin has a toll on it with three of them being in Meath, I use to drive to London and not see one toll, In fact you can drive London to Glasgow and not go through a toll.

And the best one is that the PPP that built the roads hold all the aces so if a consortium running the toll don't make ex amount off profit/ traffic using the toll, The government will pay the difference yet if the company makes a profit they get to keep the lot.

Dublin-Waterford, Blessington Road, and M11 - where's the tolls on those?

Even on the Cork/Limerick you've to pass Portlaoise before there's a toll!

spurious

I'd be checking them for tax and insurance as well. Big bang of 'it doesn't apply to me' there.

jelutong

ExoPolitic wrote: »

theres a toll bridge in Waterford, saves 5 minutes of journey time for 3.10 per trip...an expensive 5 minutes! Don't use it, ever...

Car toll is €1.90 per trip.

is_that_so

Scottie99 wrote: »

I’ve no reason not to..
Why clearly you don’t believe him..

By the looks of what's been reported on this thread they eventually roll it all up together in a prosecution. His address is known.

blackwhite

blackwhite wrote: »

Dublin-Waterford, Blessington Road, and M11 - where's the tolls on those?

Even on the Cork/Limerick you've to pass Portlaoise before there's a toll!

The only toll I totally hate is the Fermoy toll. The put the toll booth at Watergrasshill.
It drives heavy goods traffic through Watergrasshill, Rathcormac, and Fermoy while being a direct commuter tax from Fermoy (so also driving commuter traffic through the above also)

The road's purpose was to remove Dublin bound goods from Fermoy. The booth placed immediately north of Fermoy would have accomplished this, while taking dangerous traffic out of sleepy rural villages and Fermoy.

But nope, must grab money over safety.

Isambard

Deleted User wrote: »

The only toll I totally hate is the Fermoy toll. The put the toll booth at Watergrasshill.
It drives heavy goods traffic through Watergrasshill, Rathcormac, and Fermoy while being a direct commuter tax from Fermoy (so also driving commuter traffic through the above also)

The roads purpose was to remove Dublin bound goods from Fermoy. The booth placed immediately north of Fermoy would have accomplished this, while taking dangerous traffic out of sleepy rural villages and Fermoy.

But nope, must grab money over safety.

Yes it's ridiculous to have an alternative route that runs through the bottleneck the bypass was designed to remove. Alternative route on the old N8 from Fermoy to Mitch would have been possible.

Isambard

Isambard wrote: »

Yes it's ridiculous to have an alternative route that runs through the bottleneck the bypass was designed to remove. Alternative route on the old N8 from Fermoy to Mitch would have been possible.

There have been several fatal/serious RTAs because of the level (and type) of traffic going through the villages.