Gender pay gap

rob316

As its national womens days I saw a topic of women walking out of their jobs today for equality.

Is there really a gender pay gap?

MayoSalmon

Myth

Assetbacked

There is a rich v poor gap with the astounding inequality needing a correction.

The gender pay gap is a clever tool for women to climb the corporate ladder and step over their peers.

KilOit

rob316 wrote: »

As its national womens days I saw a topic of women walking out of their jobs today for equality.

Is there really a gender pay gap?

No, not really. Maybe very high level jobs in finance etc but STEM, teaching and retail are all same pay. My place of work is mostly women in the top jobs

crossman47

There is but, for the most part, not for the reasons feminists claim. It is a function of the occupations and industries women choose as well as working shorter hours.

As an example, consider teaching. Everyone agrees male and female teachers receive equal pay for the same job. However, there is a gender pay gap because a greater proportion of men are principals. This is mainly because women do not compete for this more time consuming role. Many women will argue this is because of family responsibilities and this may be true but it is a cause of a gender pay gap.

Fr_Dougal

rob316 wrote: »

As its national womens days I saw a topic of women walking out of their jobs today for equality.

Is there really a gender pay gap?

There’s a massive pay gap. That’s why organisations are mostly hiring women these days, cheap labour.

Sirsok

How can there be a gender pay gap if there is no such thing as gender....like come on op

Yurt2

The old feminism seems to be a bit more measured of late - perhaps as many in the public at large finally started challenging some of its claims over the past couple of years, such as the 'pay gap.'

No harm; feminism at its' core is a political movement and all political movements need to be interrogated and challenged.

Seth Brundle

Fr_Dougal wrote: »

There’s a massive pay gap. That’s why organisations are mostly hiring women these days, cheap labour.

If that was the case, then you would think that the money grabbing Roman Catholic Church would he hiring them as priests?

rob316

Its distorted, they survey 100 men and 100 women and work out the average and call it a pay gap if the female salary is lower. Doesn't take into account the actual professions of each.

orourkeda1977

Sirsok wrote: »

How can there be a gender pay gap if there is no such thing as gender....like come on op

They identify as women on pay day

sydthebeat

If comparing like with like, then there is no pay gap....

If comparing like with acorns, then anything is possible

Ush1

Fr_Dougal wrote: »

There’s a massive pay gap. That’s why organisations are mostly hiring women these days, cheap labour.

Not cheap when they go on maternity leave.

Fr_Dougal

Seth Brundle wrote: »

If that was the case, then you would think that the money grabbing Roman Catholic Church would he hiring them as priests?

Or nuns?

Sonics2k

Why must we do the same damn threads every few weeks?

Yurt2

rob316 wrote: »

Its distorted, they survey 100 men and 100 women and work out the average and call it a pay gap if the female salary is lower. Doesn't take into account the actual professions of each.

I think most feminists have retreated from the gender pay gap stuff lately, and with good reason - it doesn't hold up to meaningful scrutiny.


I know that many call him a 'charlatan' and a 'pseudo-intellectual,' (I'm not entirely uncritical of him myself, but I'm generally favourably disposed towards him) but there is no doubt that Jordan Peterson intellectually battered the feminist movement over the course of his rise to prominence the last few years. Many thought what he was thinking, but there was zero window in popular media to express it; then he came along like a grenade and put it all together in an extremely articulate way. He was and is a dangerous individual to the extreme wing that had co-opted the movement.


Hopefully sane gender relations can get on track soon enough.

Sirsok

Sonics2k wrote: »

Why must we do the same damn threads every few weeks?

Cause the damn pay gap issue doesn't get resolved

dudara

There is a pay gap, but it’s becuse of the weighting of males in the highest paying jobs. It’s a more complex metric than just comparing two people at the same grade.

Ultimately, it’s not about pay, but about balance of women at all levels.

Yurt2

dudara wrote: »

Ultimately, it’s not about pay, but about balance of women at all levels.

Which will never change until women change. The distribution of females in various industries and grades is almost 100% down to female choices. Time to stop giving males a kicking and start looking at why females make the choices they do.

Outlaw Pete

dudara wrote: »

Ultimately, it’s not about pay, but about balance of women at all levels.

All levels? Ah come on. It's the lucrative high power positions that "balance" is being sought in. Let's be honest.

conorhal

The wage gap is real and at least progressive companies like google are willing to acknowledge and address it!

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/03/04/technology/google-gender-pay-gap.html

"SAN FRANCISCO — When Google conducted a study recently to determine whether the company was underpaying women and members of minority groups, it found, to the surprise of just about everyone, that men were paid less money than women for doing similar work."

Google immediately acted to rightly ensure that men and women fulfilling the same role recieved equal pay and promptly gave those underpaid men a raise......
I think you can guess the entirely predictable reaction to that from certian quarters.... which tells you all you need to know about what the campaigners on this issue really mean when they say 'equality'.

5starpool

In most private companies people's pay operates within a band for particular grades, but could be different for people because of their haggling skills, their ability to sell themselves, etc. I would doubt that too much of it is because of what is or isn't between the legs, but who knows.

Obviously work salaries should be paid on the basis of the competency of the worker, their experience, commitment, and ability to improve. If it is anything else it is wrong. People being promoted or given a raise at the expense of others because of gender, nepotism, or similar are things that should be eradicated, but if there are actual real, valid reasons for gaps existing, one way or another, then this should not be forced to be rectified in misguided name of equality.

VinLieger

Theres definitely an earnings gap because more women choose to do specific jobs that happen to pay less but the gender pay gap is a complete myth.

VinLieger

dudara wrote: »

There is a pay gap, but it’s becuse of the weighting of males in the highest paying jobs. It’s a more complex metric than just comparing two people at the same grade.

Ultimately, it’s not about pay, but about balance of women at all levels.

Then that's not a pay gap that's an earnings gap. Continuing to lie about the problem by calling it a pay gap is not helping the problem.

HappyAsLarE

Of course there is a gap.

Women take months off each time they have a baby. This hurts their progression naturally.

They also don’t do jobs that are skilled trades - mechanics, plumbers, etc.

This gap is not a problem that needs to be fixed. It is more important that women look after their children. Men aren’t gonna.

Gimme A Pound

There is a pay gap in terms of overall earnings (for obvious reasons - maternity, less inclination to do higher paid jobs) but it is grossly misrepresented as a pay *rate* gap.

Lee Modern Shrimp

Lee Modern Shrimp wrote: »

There is a pay gap in terms of overall earnings (for obvious reasons - maternity, less inclination to do higher paid jobs) but it is grossly misrepresented as a pay *rate* gap.

Less hours too but feminists will not believe that ....has Louise o Neil burned the place down yet or is she too busy with appointments

https://www.irishtimes.com/life-and-style/people/stop-saying-you-don-t-like-condoms-and-29-other-ways-men-can-make-women-s-lives-easier-1.3817577

Eye rolling - more expect this from the Journal, but not surprised from the paper Which employs fintan o tool, Gannon, mullaly and that Kitty wan....complains about women being ‘policed’ how they talk and the polices how she thinks men Should talk

JohnnyFlash

There's a few other reasons that women might not be paid as much - one is that a decent percentage of women tend to get hysterical and stroppy under pressure, and therefore are fundamentally unsuited to high-stress and strategic roles in upper management. Obviously this doesn't apply to all women - see Margaret Thatcher, Catherine the Great, Angela Merkel etc. But some of them are just too driven by their emotions and 'feelings' instead of using logic and insight.

Your Face

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

There's a few other reasons that women might not be paid as much - one is that a decent percentage of women tend to get hysterical and stroppy under pressure, and therefore are fundamentally unsuited to high-stress and strategic roles in upper management.

You've obviously never dealt with upper management.

Ted Johnson

Where I work the majority of managers are women. Perhaps I should be promoted in the interest of equality?

EmmetSpiceland

Ted Johnson wrote: »

Where I work the majority of managers are women. Perhaps I should be promoted in the interest of equality?

Think that’s part of the problem, Ted.
In any of the financial institutions I’ve worked in you’d have a number of women managers but not many of them have any interest in going any higher up on the corporate ladder.

Another part would be that the ones promoted to these positions don’t tend to be the best women candidates, they tend to be the shrill aggressive bullying type that seem to get the jobs because their own managers want to keep them sweet lest their ire turn on them for not promoting them.

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts

Fr_Dougal wrote: »

There’s a massive pay gap. That’s why organisations are mostly hiring women these days, cheap labour.

Looking at all that I’ve read on the topic, there appears to be no pay gap. There are so many factors that at a surface level make it seem like there’s a gap when there isn’t.

But for people who think the pay gap exists, isn’t their argument that men are paid more because organisations think they are worth the extra money? That they have attributes that boost the company more or contribute more to the bottom line than someone in the same job who is paid less? I always thought that was the angle.

kowloon

Fr_Dougal wrote: »

There’s a massive pay gap. That’s why organisations are mostly hiring women these days, cheap labour.

Are they? Is this one particular industry?

crossman47 wrote: »

As an example, consider teaching. Everyone agrees male and female teachers receive equal pay for the same job. However, there is a gender pay gap because a greater proportion of men are principals. This is mainly because women do not compete for this more time consuming role. Many women will argue this is because of family responsibilities and this may be true but it is a cause of a gender pay gap.

Know a guy who is a primary school teacher who reckons he's on the fast track for principal. Funny thing is that he's a single parent so the family time argument isn't as much of a factor. I'm guessing primary teachers, in general, are more likely to want a family.

y0ssar1an22

is this discrimination based upon gender, or simply down to how much revenue you bring in? I think they did something similar in tennis, but the viewership in that seems a lot more equal (dont know).

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/03/08/sports/womens-soccer-team-lawsuit-gender-discrimination.html

few snippets:

All 28 members of the world champion United States women’s national team filed a gender discrimination lawsuit against the United States Soccer Federation on Friday

the 28 players accused the federation of engaging in “institutionalized gender discrimination.”

It is the same job at the end of the day - but there's more to it than the same job IMO. To me, a simple solution would be to pay the players commission based on revenue generated. You dont see a bad salesperson complaining that a better one gets more money.

Rodin

Working for free from today apparently.
Such nonsense

Rodin

Rodin wrote: »

Working for free from today apparently.
Such nonsense

I've been working for free for the last few months since I make less than the average male. Where's my justice?

Rodin

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I've been working for free for the last few months since I make less than the average male. Where's my justice?

I very much doubt you make less than a man doing the exact same job with same working hours and equal experience and responsibility.

For that is the only valid comparison worth talking about.

Silentcorner

The problem with this wave of feminism is you have to turn off your ability to apply logic and reason, that is if you have those abilities in the first place.

This was on the Niall Boylan show this morning, there were two female contributors, one (whose name I cannot recall) was of the firm belief that women are being paid 30% less than men for the exact same work in the same firms, she was incapable of producing one example....interestingly, she refused to go on the show at the same time as Larrissa Nolan, a rather peculiar request.

Larrissa Nolan destroyed the myth and called it dangerous, citing examples and other studies....making a very pertinent point that according to one study of over 218,000 women, two thirds would rather stay at home and raise their kids if they could afford it, women derive a lot of fulfillment from motherhood and not their careers and tend to have a more balanced work life balance.

Feminism is making idiots out of otherwise smart people!