oil boiler expansion vessel change and service cost ?

galaxy12

Just got our oil boiler serviced. Plumber recommends new expansion vessel and new bottle inhibitor to be used. He mentioned that the system will need to be drained to do this work .
The current expansion vessel is inside the boiler room .

Wanted to get an idea on how much should this work typically cost as I have no clues ..?

_______

I have the below flue gas analysis if that gives an idea ?
O2 % 4.7
CO ppm 33
CO2 % 12.0
Ratio 0.0003
Temp net 18
Temp Flue 33
Eff net % 99.2
XS Air 29.1
Its a Firebird Environmax and its around 3 1/2 years old

During service I can see a new nozzle was put in as well ..

Wearb

Do you have nozzle size and pump pressure?
How long was it left running before it was tested?
When was the test done?

galaxy12

Wearb wrote: »

Do you have nozzle size and pump pressure?
How long was it left running before it was tested?
When was the test done?

The boiler was kept running for around half an hour or so . Test done today.
I dont have nozzle size or pump pressure .
Upstairs I can see the pressure at 1 bar .

Wearb

Most of those readings are close enough but I’d do it a little differently. Strange that nozzle size and pressure wasn’t written down on service report. Previously to the service, when had the boiler been running. I ask because those temperatures seem too low. Usually caused by boiler not up to temperature or too small nozzle or pump pressure.
This isn’t the same as the 1 bar pressure you mentioned.

galaxy12

Wearb wrote: »

Do you have nozzle size and pump pressure?
How long was it left running before it was tested?
When was the test done?

I just checked the boiler and if I read the pressure correctly from the gauge , then its at around 2.9 bars..Does that make sense ?

Wearb

galaxy12 wrote: »

I just checked the boiler and if I read the pressure correctly from the gauge , then its at around 2.9 bars..Does that make sense ?

Not the pressure that mentioned. That is the system water pressure you are reading. I am talking oil burner pump pressure. There isn't a gauge on it. The service man would put a gauge on it for testing and then remove it.



2.9 bars is too high, hence the need for the vessel to be changed.

galaxy12

Wearb wrote: »

Not the pressure that mentioned. That is the system water pressure you are reading. I am talking oil burner pump pressure. There isn't a gauge on it. The service man would put a gauge on it for testing and then remove it.



2.9 bars is too high, hence the need for the vessel to be changed.

ok. I think I understand it a bit better now .
I dont have the oil burner pump pressure reading he would have taken at the time of service .The service call off sheet is only comments Ive mentioned here and the flue analysis Ive stated.

The boiler is in use and the heating is on daily but we had not turned it on since yesterday evening as house was warm enough .The heating is timed to go on every evening for 2 hours and an hour in the morning but I would say its used only 50 % of the time and then the thermostat and the individual TRV's kick in ..

The plumber did mention that the vessel has a unit which takes in the pressure of the water and if not changed/services then the system has a tendency of failing at the weakest point . He also did mention that he could increase the pressure but that wont be the right thing to do and that the best thing would be to change the vessel and to use bottle inhibitor /drain the system . Dont have a quote yet .
many thanks

agusta

If the boiler was running for 30 mins the flue temp should be higher.At least 65 degrees plus.Simple test.When the heating system is cold.Turn on zones and see how many minutes it take for the boiler to cut out on temperature.Ballpark for 25 litre vessel/inhibitor fitted 150 euro seeing as he serviced the boiler

agusta

galaxy12 wrote: »

I just checked the boiler and if I read the pressure correctly from the gauge , then its at around 2.9 bars..Does that make sense ?

Yes,it went from 1 bar to 2.9 bar,When it goes to 3 bar it will leave water out the pressure relief valve.new expansion vessel.sooner rather than later

galaxy12

agusta wrote: »

If the boiler was running for 30 mins the flue temp should be higher.At least 65 degrees plus.Simple test.When the heating system is cold.Turn on zones and see how many minutes it take for the boiler to cut out on temperature.Ballpark for 25 litre vessel/inhibitor fitted 150 euro seeing as he serviced the boiler

With the heating on from cold and I turn on the 2 zones , it takes around 10 minutes or so before the boiler cuts out . I can see it comes back again after the heating falls below 21 .I also see that all rads heat up to around 60/70 degrees quite evenly and the rooms stats read around 20.5 when the boiler had cut out .

I will check with the plumber once he is back on the temp and see why is it 18 deg on the reading. May be it wasn't on for half an hour , but even then the temp should read higher as I see mentioned here ...

thanks for sharing the ballpark figures...

jimf

galaxy12 wrote: »

Just got our oil boiler serviced. Plumber recommends new expansion vessel and new bottle inhibitor to be used. He mentioned that the system will need to be drained to do this work .
The current expansion vessel is inside the boiler room .

Wanted to get an idea on how much should this work typically cost as I have no clues ..?

_______

I have the below flue gas analysis if that gives an idea ?
O2 % 4.7
CO ppm 33
CO2 % 12.0
Ratio 0.0003
Temp net 18
Temp Flue 33
Eff net % 99.2
XS Air 29.1
Its a Firebird Environmax and its around 3 1/2 years old

During service I can see a new nozzle was put in as well ..

id be a little concerned with the flugas temp as well

when the boiler reaches its operational temp your co2 will be nearer 12.3 which is way too high for this particular boiler


danger of soot up

galaxy12

jimf wrote: »

id be a little concerned with the flugas temp as well

when the boiler reaches its operational temp your co2 will be nearer 12.3 which is way too high for this particular boiler


danger of soot up

Thanks. I need to clarify this with the plumber then.

galaxy12

checked with the plumber and he thinks the boiler temp was low because it wasn't run for a long time . So he didn't run it as long as I though he did

I also have a quote of 300 for replacing the vessel, draining all the water and then putting in an inhibitor . He said its 3 hours of work ..

jimf

regardless of how long it takes boiler has to be up to operational temp before flugas analysis is accurate

Wearb

jimf wrote: »

regardless of how long it takes boiler has to be up to operational temp before flugas analysis is accurate

I must agree with jimf. Why did he bother doing it at all if he couldn't wait to get it up to temperature. There are ways of achieving this quickly if needed.


btw did you ask him for pump pressure and nozzle size?

agusta

galaxy12 wrote: »

checked with the plumber and he thinks the boiler temp was low because it wasn't run for a long time . So he didn't run it as long as I though he did

I also have a quote of 300 for replacing the vessel, draining all the water and then putting in an inhibitor . He said its 3 hours of work ..

What price did the boiler service cost?,what size boiler and what size expansion vessel?, 300 euro does not sound right.

galaxy12

agusta wrote: »

What price did the boiler service cost?,what size boiler and what size expansion vessel?, 300 euro does not sound right.

The service costed 110 incl Vat .
The quote for 300 was for the vessel , inhibitor and a new ballcock and float for storage tank ( I had a noisy pipe up in the attic when running cold water)

went back to the boiler and here are some details
Boiler is firebird Environmax popular 26 KW . The old nozzle which I see kept there is Danfoss Oil Nozzle, 0.65 x 60° H. As this was changed I am assuming that the same nozzle has been used ..
The expansion vessel is 18 ltr Elbi . This must be around 7 years old as it looks like the boiler was installed in 2011 ( by previous owners)

Ive included pics of the boiler .

meanwhile attempts since yesterday to get in touch again with the plumber are all in vain ...

jimf

that boiler should have a .65x80es nozzle fitted as per manf spec

flexi oil line also looks like it needs changing

galaxy12

jimf wrote: »

that boiler should have a .65x80es nozzle fitted as per manf spec

flexi oil line also looks like it needs changing

Thanks jimf! I checked the old nozzle again after your post and the old one it is 0.65x80 es . I am hoping he has put the same one in ..

jimf

is that the little container the nozzle came in you see .65x60h


my guess is that's the nozzle now fitted in your boiler



unless he is servicing boilers everyday theres a good chance he wont have the es eh range of nozzles in his van

galaxy12

jimf wrote: »

is that the little container the nozzle came in you see .65x60h


my guess is that's the nozzle now fitted in your boiler


unless he is servicing boilers everyday theres a good chance he wont have the es eh range of nozzles in his van

Thanks jimf. I small container has no markings other than made in Denmark
I would give him another day to see is he returns meanwhile any pm's for a good plumber who can sort this out and possibly review would be great !

jimf

what area

galaxy12

Dublin 15,castleknock

agusta

To change the expansion vessel it only requires a partial drain down of the system.It not a big job to change it

agusta

jimf wrote: »

what area

It outside your 100 mile radius:)

galaxy12

agusta wrote: »

It outside your 100 mile radius:)

jimf wrote: »

what area

Thanks anyways for your tips !