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Italy vs Ireland match thread, 24-2-2019.

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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,749 ✭✭✭accensi0n


    Larbre34 wrote: »
    We must slaughter the sacred cows. We play a re-energised France in two weeks, our midfield must read Cooney, Carbery, Henshaw, Farrell. Also Healy, James Ryan and Rhys Ruddock.

    That's a lot of players in the midfield.


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,199 ✭✭✭troyzer


    Any idea how many times Murray box kicked in this game? Was noticeable a few times when clearing our lines he was passing back for the clearance kick rather than box kick.

    I don't remember a box kick until the second half, maybe three in total and Cooney had another one?


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,199 ✭✭✭troyzer


    Wegians89 wrote: »
    Marion will be back for the French match, he’s the only one who has any real chance of starting ahead of Murray. But Murray will be kept in the starting team

    He shouldn't be.


  • Registered Users Posts: 10,744 ✭✭✭✭martingriff


    Strazdas wrote: »
    On the other hand, if we're going to have a slump, now is the time to do it.

    If we'd had an impressive 6N, there would always be the fear we couldn't sustain it into the WC. There's definitely cause for concern but I'm not sure the 6N is all that good a form guide one way or the other.

    The problem is getting the mojo back sometimes it aint that easy. Not saying Ireland can't do it but I am a bit worried. We do have a manager that can do it which helps. May have to make some unpalatable decisions in his line up and players to pick


  • Registered Users Posts: 10,171 ✭✭✭✭Hurrache


    Dunno, I don't think POM deserved MOTM, Italian 9 I think deserved it more.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 22,324 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    Basil3 wrote: »
    Could only catch the very end of the match, but looking at the stats, I was pretty surprised that Ireland didn't score more considering Italy missed 28 tackles.

    Its hard to score tries when you drop the ball every time you get over the gain line

    The team didn't play well, but on the positive side, individual errors cost us but these come down to attitude and form on the day.

    We know that Ireland are capable of playing with accuracy and stringing together dozens of phases without handling errors on their day.

    There have been a lot of changes in the squad which seems to be affecting their communication and their cohesion.

    Aki going off was a big blow. Earls had a brilliant game, but it meant Farrell and Earls had to play out of their best position from Early in the game.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,033 ✭✭✭joseywhales


    is_that_so wrote: »
    He's not at his best, and that best seems to have gone. VDF is a better option.

    Why do you think his best is gone? He returned from injury when? January?

    I feel like he was more effective than Murphy for example today. Even if he doesn't make 20 metre carries multiple times per game, does he have to, to be the best option available? He is a bit rusty, the poor pass and the penalty in the first half but I still see turnovers and clearouts, he is probably primed to peak in October.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,261 ✭✭✭Thrashssacre


    How does everyone else rate Farrell’s game? Seemed very settled and done the basics right, not as explosive in the carry as he can be but he seems to be developing into a safe pair of hands to have on the bench


  • Registered Users Posts: 32,136 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    Thought Cronin had a very bad game despite one or two of those galloping runs. Couldn't hit himself with the ball at the lineout.


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,199 ✭✭✭troyzer


    is_that_so wrote: »
    Thought Cronin had a very bad game despite one or two of those galloping runs. Couldn't hit himself with the ball at the lineout.

    He missed 3 in 50 minutes. Scannell missed 2 in 30 minutes.

    It's not all Cronin.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 4,033 ✭✭✭joseywhales


    How does everyone else rate Farrell’s game? Seemed very settled and done the basics right, not as explosive in the carry as he can be but he seems to be developing into a safe pair of hands to have on the bench

    I did think he could pass or offload more, I just saw him run directly into his opposite defender all day. Maybe that was his job, to secure possession.


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,886 ✭✭✭Christy42


    troyzer wrote: »
    Larbre34 wrote: »
    We must slaughter the sacred cows. We play a re-energised France in two weeks, our midfield must read Cooney, Carbery, Henshaw, Farrell. Also Healy, James Ryan and Rhys Ruddock.

    Are you insane? Don't select Ringrose?

    Every minute he's not playing his stock rises. He's so important to us.
    He is also leaving off Aki who was actually good today before he went off.

    Not sure what Marmion has done wrong either since he should be back by the next match.

    I don't know who Rhys Ruddock is meant to be replacing either.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 501 ✭✭✭squawker


    well that is a match I will never watch again

    Ireland need some serious reflection over the next couple of weeks


  • Registered Users Posts: 32,136 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    Why do you think his best is gone? He returned from injury when? January?

    I feel like he was more effective than Murphy for example today. Even if he doesn't make 20 metre carries multiple times per game, does he have to, to be the best option available? He is a bit rusty, the poor pass and the penalty in the first half but I still see turnovers and clearouts, he is probably primed to peak in October.
    I think Murphy is a good second tier player but no real time left for O'Brien, apart from Leinster. I don't see that rampaging O'Brien returning. Call it effect on the body from all the hits or just age. We going to lose him internationally in a few weeks anyway once he goes to London Irish so we should be looking past him.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,261 ✭✭✭Thrashssacre


    He does seem to be a bit of a battering ram sometimes I do think he’s there to make yards in contact but he has good hands showed it when he set earles off through the middle


  • Registered Users Posts: 14,967 ✭✭✭✭The Lost Sheep


    He's not only working with the national team, he's doing quite a lot of work at grassroots level, alongside the club teams.

    Before COS, Italy had a couple of token wins back in 2013, Ireland and France (who got the wooden spoon), and Scotland the year before (who got the spoon that year).

    He hasn't exactly got a lot to work with also.
    Is he though? He's brought Aboud from IRFU to be head of technical direction and its as more him doing the work with the two pro14 sides and the sides in the eccellenza.
    Their underage and club games are starting to pur with his involvement.
    This may be a results game but Italy are playing better year on year and showing consistant improvements in most areas.

    They are a better team than the one before COS took over, plucky irregular win regardless
    How much is the non italy senior side stuff directly related to COS though?


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,788 ✭✭✭ionadnapokot


    Fair play to Joe. Just talking sense.
    However We know Murray will start v France. So I don’t see them reversing the crisis of confidence.
    I think Beirne and Henderson should start. Beirne can bring those big turnovers and inject some much needed confidence boosters.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,033 ✭✭✭joseywhales


    is_that_so wrote: »
    I think Murphy is a good second tier player but no real time left for O'Brien, apart from Leinster. I don't see that rampaging O'Brien returning. Call it effect on the body from all the hits or just age. We going to lose him internationally in a few weeks anyway once he goes to London Irish so we should be looking past him.

    A few weeks? He is contracted until after the world cup. As I say he doesn't need to be as good as he was to be the best seven. Not that the alternative aren't good but I still think he is better. We are building for the 2019 world cup not 2023.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,288 ✭✭✭Wheres Me Jumper?


    squawker wrote: »
    well that is a match I will never watch again

    Ireland need some serious reflection over the next couple of weeks

    one of the most forgettable games in quite some time, which is probably exactly what they should do, and move on.


  • Registered Users Posts: 13,048 ✭✭✭✭Losty Dublin


    troyzer wrote: »
    He missed 3 in 50 minutes. Scannell missed 2 in 30 minutes.

    It's not all Cronin.

    Certainly two of Cronin's missed were when he threw and the lift was in a totally different places. If Scannell was missing throws on the same basis then it's the caller who's at fault here, not the thrower.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 6,199 ✭✭✭troyzer


    Fair play to Joe. Just talking sense.
    However We know Murray will start v France. So I don’t see them reversing the crisis of confidence.
    I think Beirne and Henderson should start. Beirne can bring those big turnovers and inject some much needed confidence boosters.

    So leave one of the best locks in the world out of the 15?

    Right...


  • Registered Users Posts: 13,048 ✭✭✭✭Losty Dublin


    one of the most forgettable games in quite some time, which is probably exactly what they should do, and move on.

    Look on the bright side. It's made you forget about the Scotland-France game from yesterday :)


  • Registered Users Posts: 23 M50Jct15


    Well...that was not exactly according to plan...though bonus point and win were necessary and achieved.


  • Registered Users Posts: 32,136 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    troyzer wrote: »
    He missed 3 in 50 minutes. Scannell missed 2 in 30 minutes.

    It's not all Cronin.

    Haven't seem much of Scannell at this level but Cronin is really not the best thrower. With the talent at Leinster and Ireland he's got away with it. He's on the pitch for other reasons, particularly that barracking run he does so well. Outside of Best , who do we have who can throw reliably?


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,199 ✭✭✭troyzer


    is_that_so wrote: »
    troyzer wrote: »
    He missed 3 in 50 minutes. Scannell missed 2 in 30 minutes.

    It's not all Cronin.

    Haven't seem much of Scannell at this level but Cronin is really not the best thrower. With the talent at Leinster and Ireland he's got away with it. He's on the pitch for other reasons, particularly that barracking run he does so well. Outside of Best , who do we have who can throw reliably?

    I'm not saying that Cronin is a great thrower but it wasn't his fault today. The calls were all over the place.


  • Registered Users Posts: 22,324 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    Certainly two of Cronin's missed were when he threw and the lift was in a totally different places. If Scannell was missing throws on the same basis then it's the caller who's at fault here, not the thrower.

    It could be the thrower not knowing his calls


  • Registered Users Posts: 32,136 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    A few weeks? He is contracted until after the world cup. As I say he doesn't need to be as good as he was to be the best seven. Not that the alternative aren't good but I still think he is better. We are building for the 2019 world cup not 2023.
    Was under the impression he was off post-haste. I'd have him in 23 rather than on the pitch.


  • Registered Users Posts: 32,136 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    troyzer wrote: »
    I'm not saying that Cronin is a great thrower but it wasn't his fault today. The calls were all over the place.
    I'd say it was a collective screwup but he's not the greatest at all.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 197 ✭✭Stone Gossard


    troyzer wrote: »
    Leavy is injured. Conan's best chance is to become the starting 8 and push Stander to the bench. It's unlikely but still possible.

    Yeah, of course it is ..in the same way that Sexton will be dropped for Tyler Bleyndahl


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  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 25,836 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    troyzer wrote: »
    Furlong, SOB, POM, Murray, Sexton, Earls, Kearney, Stockdale and Aki all started. That's 9 players who are Ireland starters at full strength.

    Wales had 3: Navidi, Adams (debatable) and Davies.

    I think we can discount Aki from that - so basically half a team of changes. That is a huge amount. Particularly having 5 of 8 of the pack changing.

    The performance was crap, I'm not really arguing that - but it was far from Ireland's "first-choice" team.


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