Informal Hill Climb TT - Ticknock Sunday 24 February

Sunsets On Tuesday

Hi boardsies,
I, through the Trinity College Cycling Club, am organising a Hill Climb TT up Ticknock on the 24th of February, which is the Sunday of the weekend after next. This will be an informal, just-for-fun event.
You can do the climb at any time you wish during that day, but there'll be a group of us at the biking.ie shed from 9:30-11:30, so come then for a more social aspect.
Segment we're using is the following (basically from the Biking.ie shed to the masts).
https://www.strava.com/segments/8125228

We've also created a facebook event where you can get more information, and let us know that you're coming.
https://www.facebook.com/events/257041655016843/

Hope to see a few of you guys and gals there, obviously it's weather dependent but it'll likely be a good bit of craic!

C3PO

Not wishing to "rain on your parade" but is it a good idea to hold an event (formal or otherwise) on a Sunday in Ticknock? If the weather is even half decent the place will be mobbed with walkers, mtbers etc! Believe me I am not one for unnecessary rule adherence .....

godtabh

I was up there two weeks ago when it was snowing. Couldnt get a spot to park the car. What will it be like on a decent sunday?

Hurrache

It'll be jammers on a weekend, madness to organise a hill climb TT up there. The place just gets so busy from the car park to the top with kids, young, old, dogs, prams, buggies.

Taxuser1

Great lil burn a week out from the start of the season.

Wouldn't be worried about the hikers/walkers/mountain bikers. Everyone is crawling upwards at the same pace.

Fastest time - Eoin Byrne, odds on favourite.

CramCycle

A great idea only for the timing. Run it earlier in the day, no joking, between 7am and 10am or run it on an evening

Sunsets On Tuesday

Cheers for the feeback all. I think we will start it a bit earlier, probably running from 8-10 instead. While I understand it can get quite busy, I don't think it'll be that bad on a Sunday morning at that time (I've been up there quite a bit at the weekends and it's never too bad - it's busy but you'd rarely be held up). Also it's naturally busier in snowy weather, especially when the snow is only up high!
I guess it's finding the balance between a socially accepted time to cycle on a Sunday morning, and not having it too busy. At the above time (8-10) I think we'll be good. Obviously you can do it anytime during the day, but I thought the social aspect would really add to it :-)

CramCycle

I'll try my best to be there, DUCC used to run some good events when I was in college between the college league, hill climb and track days.

irishrover99

godtabh wrote: »

I was up there two weeks ago when it was snowing. Couldnt get a spot to park the car. What will it be like on a decent sunday?

It will be empty.
People were only up there for the snow.

irishrover99

I don't see the problem with Ticknock as a venue for this.
We are allowed to cycle up there and all it takes is a bit of a yell for people to move to one side.
You are going that slow up anyway that they have plenty of time to move out of the way.

I wound't make it the Sunday but i'd do my time on the Friday as weekends are a no go for me.

buffalo

irishrover99 wrote: »

I don't see the problem with Ticknock as a venue for this.
We are allowed to cycle up there and all it takes is a bit of a yell for people to move to one side.

Imagine you head out for a peaceful walk in the forested hills of Dublin. But every minute or so somebody on a bike comes up behind you yelling to move over.

Nope, no problem there.

C3PO

irishrover99 wrote:

I don't see the problem with Ticknock as a venue for this.
We are allowed to cycle up there and all it takes is a bit of a yell for people to move to one side.
You are going that slow up anyway that they have plenty of time to move out of the way.

What planet are you living on? As cyclists we are unpopular enough without "yelling" at people to get them out of your way in order that you can record a faster time up a hill!! I'm genuinely gobsmacked!

irishrover99

C3PO wrote: »

What planet are you living on? As cyclists we are unpopular enough without "yelling" at people to get them out of your way in order that you can record a faster time up a hill!! I'm genuinely gobsmacked!

Kop on will ya.
I said a bit of a yell.
I didn't say scream at them.
Should i have said yell tally ho at them.

irishrover99

buffalo wrote: »

Imagine you head out for a peaceful walk in the forested hills of Dublin. But every minute or so somebody on a bike comes up behind you yelling to move over.

Nope, no problem there.

Exaggerating a bit their lad :rolleyes:

irishrover99

And if its run early in the morning it ill be quiet up there.
I've been there plenty of Sunday mornings and had the place to myself.

godtabh

CramCycle wrote: »

I'll try my best to be there, DUCC used to run some good events when I was in college between the college league, hill climb and track days.

I never even heard of them when I was there which was a pity!

Sunsets On Tuesday

irishrover99 wrote: »

And if its run early in the morning it ill be quiet up there.
I've been there plenty of Sunday mornings and had the place to myself.

Agreed. I value the advice, but I think it's not nearly as bad as what people think. At that time on a Sunday, we'll be good.

Thud

...."I could have won this if it wasn't for those pesky walkers getting in my way and adding 5 minutes to my time"

Hurrache

irishrover99 wrote: »

I don't see the problem with Ticknock as a venue for this.........all it takes is a bit of a yell for people to move to one side.

Well that's the problem right there.

irishrover99

I'm beginning to wonder if any of you's have ever been up Ticknock.
It does not be busy on a Sunday morning at 9 am especially in February.


Alek done nearly 16 hours up there on a Friday in the middle of summer and their was no issues with walkers,dogs or any other group that like to venture into the hills and their was about 5-6 other cyclists with him at one stage.

daragh_

irishrover99 wrote: »

I'm beginning to wonder if any of you's have ever been up Ticknock.
It does not be busy on a Sunday morning at 9 am especially in February.


Alek done nearly 16 hours up there on a Friday in the middle of summer and their was no issues with walkers,dogs or any other group that like to venture into the hills and their was about 5-6 other cyclists with him at one stage.

I think there's a difference tbh. Despite being advertised as 'informal' everyone there will treat this as a competitive time-trial. If you are doing it right you will be pushing to the limit and going full gas.

Could be problematic in a space shared with walkers etc. Assume there will be people marshalling, warning the public etc?

irishrover99

daragh_ wrote: »

I think there's a difference tbh. Despite being advertised as 'informal' everyone there will treat this as a competitive time-trial. If you are doing it right you will be pushing to the limit and going full gas.

Could be problematic a space shared with walkers etc. Assume there will be people marshalling, warning the public etc?

You'll have to ask the OP that but i doubt as he says in the title,informal.
I also wonder if their will be medals :pac:

Anyway i don't mind, i'll give it a go no matter where it is.

irishrover99

Weepsie wrote: »

You're probably right that, it wont be much of an issue that early, and it may not be an issue whatsoever depending on the weather.

Friday is a work day however for most, so not really a day that I would expect it to be busy. Sunday is when you're likely to get the most casual of walkers, familys, kids, dogs etc just because it's a thing to do.

Plus, the Boards TT was up Howth last year, not exactly quiet on a Sunday morning, albeit there are paths there.

I'm just back from a spin and encountered people walking in the cycle lanes so you can't win either way.

detones

Best of luck with your event Sunset, to be honest I'd run it how you want and when you want. As you have stated its an Informal TT just for a bit of fun.

C3PO

irishrover99 wrote:

I'm beginning to wonder if any of you's have ever been up Ticknock.

Funny ... I was wondering the same thing about you!

The Noble Nudge

C3PO wrote: »

Funny ... I was wondering the same thing about you!

Ive seen him with a sweeping brush up there!
Its still in the back of my wagon btw

I was up there Saturday morning a lot of debris on the ground...
(so watch for storms the day before)

Sunsets On Tuesday

daragh_ wrote: »

I think there's a difference tbh. Despite being advertised as 'informal' everyone there will treat this as a competitive time-trial. If you are doing it right you will be pushing to the limit and going full gas.

Could be problematic in a space shared with walkers etc. Assume there will be people marshalling, warning the public etc?

We're making it very clear that it's informal so that people don't expect anything from us as a very small cycling club. We are simply setting a date and time to be there, the rest is up to the people who wish to be there at those times.

Obviously we're under no illusions that people will be taking this seriously.. who does any timed cycling challenge without giving it their all?

We will see how busy it is on the day, but I believe at the times we're doing it we'll have no issues at all. If it is crazy busy at 8:30am on Sunday morning in February (which I think is highly unlikely) we will probably have a few guys standing at the "crunch points". But again, we're a small club, with relatively small resources and manpower.

Best to assume that we can offer you nothing other than a warm welcome!

Alek

How do you plan to tackle the barrier mid-way? If you can't get it open there will be a lot of frustration trying to negotiate around it on a road bike, especially if a walker will be standing there. How about starting just past it?

CramCycle

Alek wrote: »

How do you plan to tackle the barrier mid-way? If you can't get it open there will be a lot of frustration trying to negotiate around it on a road bike, especially if a walker will be standing there. How about starting just past it?

I plan to hop off , bike on shoulder and hop over like a 80s TV cop sliding over a car bonnet

Alek

I'll be there to apply special points for the style, and you're winning already Sir.

Sunsets On Tuesday

Alek wrote: »

How do you plan to tackle the barrier mid-way? If you can't get it open there will be a lot of frustration trying to negotiate around it on a road bike, especially if a walker will be standing there. How about starting just past it?

I think where we're starting is okay, it's just the one barrier and getting passed it is usually grand. At that time it won't be too busy either - most you'll be losing is a few seconds, but it all balances out :-)

saccades

Having helped run competitive events including the route you are talking about, i presume you have had a chat with coilte?

There are 3 points that need marshalls for uphill as a minimum.

I'd advise some polite "race" signs at the main intersections and temporary marking/tape to separate the tarmac.

99.99% of everyone is sound up there as its people well aware of ticknoc as an outside resource. However coilte are not sound, please think about other clubs wanting to run events after you.

Proper national events have had to be cancelled after coilte took offense at half arsed stuff.

Sunsets On Tuesday

saccades wrote: »

Having helped run competitive events including the route you are talking about, i presume you have had a chat with coilte?

There are 3 points that need marshalls for uphill as a minimum.

I'd advise some polite "race" signs at the main intersections and temporary marking/tape to separate the tarmac.

99.99% of everyone is sound up there as its people well aware of ticknoc as an outside resource. However coilte are not sound, please think about other clubs wanting to run events after you.

Proper national events have had to be cancelled after coilte took offense at half arsed stuff.

Again, it's an informal "event". Be there at the time we advised if you wish, do the climb later in the day, or don't do it at all. As I've posted previously, don't expect anything from us at all other than a nice welcome. We've not contacted coillte, nor arranged marshalls, nor organised time keeping or anything.

Bottom line, it's a simple event where you climb, you chat if you wish and that's that. Nothing more, nothing less.

CramCycle

Is there anyone taking times at all? It sounds like your just planning a meet up, not a TT. We have had a few informal TTs via posts here before, where someone gave you a time to set of, and someone else recorded the time you went past the top at. That is an informal TT. Anything less than that and you are just asking people to turn up not to do anything, it would be very weird as the organising club if you didn't have someone at the top to take a finish time or at least say congratulations. At the very least, a person at the bottom, one at the top and one at the barrier, anything less and it makes your club look bad more than anything else.

Sunsets On Tuesday

CramCycle wrote: »

Is there anyone taking times at all? It sounds like your just planning a meet up, not a TT. We have had a few informal TTs via posts here before, where someone gave you a time to set of, and someone else recorded the time you went past the top at. That is an informal TT. Anything less than that and you are just asking people to turn up not to do anything, it would be very weird as the organising club if you didn't have someone at the top to take a finish time or at least say congratulations. At the very least, a person at the bottom, one at the top and one at the barrier, anything less and it makes your club look bad more than anything else.

Yes. If you wish to get bogged down in the semantics of what we decided to call this, then it's a meet up as opposed to an informal Hill Climb. Any Hill Climb I've done with Boards has been done solely through Strava, and I think that has worked well in the past.

We did consider timing it in a way that you said, but firstly we are a small club, and secondly, it would be too complicated if there are multiple cyclists performing at the same time, with overtaking and the like.
You are more than welcome to time people in that manner if you'd like, but again;

Don't expect ANYTHING from us other than a warm welcome.

These sort of expectations are what put people off organising more cycling events in Dublin I believe. I don't think we'll be doing it again anyways..

CramCycle

Sunsets On Tuesday wrote: »

Yes. If you wish to get bogged down in the semantics of what we decided to call this, then it's a meet up as opposed to an informal Hill Climb. Any Hill Climb I've done with Boards has been done solely through Strava, and I think that has worked well in the past.

We did consider timing it in a way that you said, but firstly we are a small club, and secondly, it would be too complicated if there are multiple cyclists performing at the same time, with overtaking and the like.
You are more than welcome to time people in that manner if you'd like, but again;

Don't expect ANYTHING from us other than a warm welcome.

These sort of expectations are what put people off organising more cycling events in Dublin I believe. I don't think we'll be doing it again anyways..

I am trying to be helpful, even if it doesn't seem that way. A small club or not, informal or not, if you organise something and there is nothing at all there, some people will never come back, and others will look at you and laugh. Lets say a few people from TCD see the posters, and think, I like the sound of this, might spin out. They might turn out on MTBs, Hybrids, road bikes, whatever but if there is no one there to even just take a time, you will never see a good chunk of them ever again.

I appreciate your trying to do something but in reality, you appear to be doing nothing except putting up a poster. All you need is three people and you have changed it from nothing into something. Three high vis vests, person at the start with a piece of paper and names and their starting time, a person at the top to write down names and finishing times, it doesn't have to be wildly accurate. A cheap token medal for a fiver and you now have an inaugral event for almost nothing except your time, and something like that gets people interested, and they will come back.

I have been to two boards hill climbs, there was a meeting time, a person at the top and one at the bottom. It was relatively quick but it was an enjoyable morning

Also I know a few people mentioned CI insurance, pretty sure it doesn't cover anyone who is not CI in this case but your college club insurance might, certainly what the college league used to use.

Sunsets On Tuesday

Given the concerns raised by many and the expectations that people have from us from this event, I do not believe we can go ahead with it.

I was simply trying to create a nice meet up for the Dublin Cycling community with a bit of friendly competition involved. I made it clear from the beginning that we could provide nothing but a warm welcome. But perhaps somewhat understandably, people expected more.

Also, the biking.ie guys said they will not open early to cater for the people climbing before 9:30/10, so even the "chat over a coffee" aspect is lost.

I feel that if we were to do anything more than just provide a concept and a time to meet up in a certain place, then it would make sense that people would have certain expectations. But this was never the case and I truly endeavored to make that clear from the offset.
I was basing the idea for this event off previous boards.ie events that I've taken part in and very much enjoyed - things like the evil, weevil, and hill climb TTs, where you understand that it's an informal event and you can expect nothing from the "organisers"

Lastly, I went up Ticknock on Saturday afternoon (when Ticknock would be at its busiest) and it was okay. Busy, but I still got a clear run in. However, a friend of mine went up yesterday at 9:45 and said it was busy with walkers and that he was slowed down somewhat.

I'm disappointed that I have to do this, and somewhat annoyed due to the time I've lost in trying to organise this nice, simple event.

A number of us will still be there on Sunday at around 8:30 to put in an effort. Feel free to put in your own time during the day via Strava, and we can post the top 5 here. But the event in all other respects is cancelled.

secman

To be honest, probably the best approach, set up a segment on Strava and let people simply ride it anytime on Sat or Sun, which ever day is decided on, Simples and nobody responsible for anybody but for yourself.
Best of luck with not running it

mloc123

Sunsets On Tuesday wrote: »

Given the concerns raised by many and the expectations that people have from us from this event, I do not believe we can go ahead with it.

I was simply trying to create a nice meet up for the Dublin Cycling community with a bit of friendly competition involved. I made it clear from the beginning that we could provide nothing but a warm welcome. But perhaps somewhat understandably, people expected more.

Also, the biking.ie guys said they will not open early to cater for the people climbing before 9:30/10, so even the "chat over a coffee" aspect is lost.

I feel that if we were to do anything more than just provide a concept and a time to meet up in a certain place, then it would make sense that people would have certain expectations. But this was never the case and I truly endeavored to make that clear from the offset.
I was basing the idea for this event off previous boards.ie events that I've taken part in and very much enjoyed - things like the evil, weevil, and hill climb TTs, where you understand that it's an informal event and you can expect nothing from the "organisers"

Lastly, I went up Ticknock on Saturday afternoon (when Ticknock would be at its busiest) and it was okay. Busy, but I still got a clear run in. However, a friend of mine went up yesterday at 9:45 and said it was busy with walkers and that he was slowed down somewhat.

I'm disappointed that I have to do this, and somewhat annoyed due to the time I've lost in trying to organise this nice, simple event.

A number of us will still be there on Sunday at around 8:30 to put in an effort. Feel free to put in your own time during the day via Strava, and we can post the top 5 here. But the event in all other respects is cancelled.

I bet you regret ever posting at this stage... trial by boards

Taxuser1

nothing stopping everyone here doing the segment sometime over the weekend and talking about it monday. i'm not exactly certain what has happened to the basic premise here. ride the climb and let's see who has the best excuses afterwards.

mloc123

Taxuser1 wrote: »

nothing stopping everyone here doing the segment sometime over the weekend and talking about it monday. i'm not exactly certain what has happened to the basic premise here. ride the climb and let's see who has the best excuses afterwards.

Which is how I read the original idea... go, cycle the Strava segment on the same day... maybe tag it as Ticknock TT. If a bunch of people show up at the same time have a chat and a coffee... sounds like a very simple setup.

Somehow that has turned into some big drama. Getting sign off from Coilte, needing marshalls, official time sheets.... probably need medals and prizes at this stage.

Fighting Tao

mloc123 wrote: »

Which is how I read the original idea... go, cycle the Strava segment on the same day... maybe tag it as Ticknock TT. If a bunch of people show up at the same time have a chat and a coffee... sounds like a very simple setup.

Somehow that has turned into some big drama. Getting sign off from Coilte, needing marshalls, official time sheets.... probably need medals and prizes at this stage.

Don’t forget the podium and bubbly.

It has gotten ridiculous!

CramCycle

I'm still gonna do it. And the previous posters are all right in this regard, I imagine I was overthinking it.
The issue was more that it sounded like an official club event, which has several issues if someone turns up, falls or injures another person and then decides to take the club to task over it. Highly unlikely but CI won't stand behind them on this, their college insurance might but the club would be shut.
Might try and set the standard to beat on Friday night for convenience.

Fighting Tao

CramCycle wrote: »

I'm still gonna do it. And the previous posters are all right in this regard, I imagine I was overthinking it.
The issue was more that it sounded like an official club event, which has several issues if someone turns up, falls or injures another person and then decides to take the club to task over it. Highly unlikely but CI won't stand behind them on this, their college insurance might but the club would be shut.
Might try and set the standard to beat on Friday night for convenience.

To me, It’s just a hi from the people in the club. It’s small and just to let people know that they are about even though they are never mentioned. Everyone has a bit of craic. Group of friends heading for a spin together type thing.

The club does have some alumni members so if you attended TCD you could join for a pittance.

irishrover99

Ill give it a go on Friday(weather dependent) and post my time here.
It will be a good way to blow off the cobwebs.

But honestly, if someone crashes into a walker while going uphill at about 14kph, they shouldn't be cycling.

CramCycle

irishrover99 wrote: »

Ill give it a go on Friday(weather dependent) and post my time here.
It will be a good way to blow off the cobwebs.

But honestly, if someone crashes into a walker while going uphill at about 14kph, they shouldn't be cycling.

If many people are doing over 14kmph I will be surprised :pac:

irishrover99

CramCycle wrote: »

If many people are doing over 14kmph I will be surprised :pac:

I'm 24th overall on the segment with an average of 14.8 kph so i think these days ill be lucky to manage 13 kph.
I also seen that their will be a strong head wind on Friday:pac:

Sunsets On Tuesday

mloc123 wrote: »

Which is how I read the original idea... go, cycle the Strava segment on the same day... maybe tag it as Ticknock TT. If a bunch of people show up at the same time have a chat and a coffee... sounds like a very simple setup.

Somehow that has turned into some big drama. Getting sign off from Coilte, needing marshalls, official time sheets.... probably need medals and prizes at this stage.

My thoughts exactly. I believe the fact that there was a cycling club's name attached to the event made people have different expectations. I'll know for future to just say it's myself organising it, and some of my club members will be there.
Trial by Boards indeed!

route66

CramCycle wrote: »

I'm still gonna do it. And the previous posters are all right in this regard, I imagine I was overthinking it.

Yes, you were.

CramCycle wrote: »

The issue was more that it sounded like an official club event, which has several issues if someone turns up, falls or injures another person and then decides to take the club to task over it. Highly unlikely but CI won't stand behind them on this, their college insurance might but the club would be shut.
Might try and set the standard to beat on Friday night for convenience.

WTF?


Who mentioned insurance? Seriously, can anything in this country be done without worrying about insurance? I know a bit about insurance but just what part of "informal, just-for-fun event." do you not understand? If you meet your friends for a few pints - something that could be described as an "informal, just-for-fun event." - would you look for compo if you drank too much and tripped over?


I'm actually angry now.

CramCycle

route66 wrote: »

Who mentioned insurance? Seriously, can anything in this country be done without worrying about insurance? I know a bit about insurance but just what part of "informal, just-for-fun event." do you not understand? If you meet your friends for a few pints - something that could be described as an "informal, just-for-fun event." - would you look for compo if you drank too much and tripped over?


I'm actually angry now.

You may be angry, and it is undoubtedly in most scenarios a non issue but the truth of the matter is the clubs name is attached, it is an event, and if someone hurt themselves taking part in it, there is a limited but nonetheless potential risk they would point the finger at the organiser. Realistically, this will never happen but once you put the clubs name to it, you have to be wary that there are a number of legal scumbags that fester in modern society who'd be willing to sue Coillte for falling on a wooden path for 60k for a sprained ankle, you can be sure there is a small but nonetheless real risk some prick would take DUCC to task over it. I mean, they wouldn't get anything out of it but they might chance their arm.

I wouldn't, if I fell, it would be my own fault but there a number of people who are not as normal as you or I.

And also, like I said, it is so unlikely, it probably was not worth mentioning it.

Sunsets On Tuesday

CramCycle wrote: »

You may be angry, and it is undoubtedly in most scenarios a non issue but the truth of the matter is the clubs name is attached, it is an event, and if someone hurt themselves taking part in it, there is a limited but nonetheless potential risk they would point the finger at the organiser. Realistically, this will never happen but once you put the clubs name to it, you have to be wary that there are a number of legal scumbags that fester in modern society who'd be willing to sue Coillte for falling on a wooden path for 60k for a sprained ankle, you can be sure there is a small but nonetheless real risk some prick would take DUCC to task over it. I mean, they wouldn't get anything out of it but they might chance their arm.

I wouldn't, if I fell, it would be my own fault but there a number of people who are not as normal as you or I.

And also, like I said, it is so unlikely, it probably was not worth mentioning it.

I think you have a good point - unfortunately the way things are, if the club does attach it's name to an event, even if it's explicitly informal and the like, then there's no stopping some parasite from trying to sue if they fall or whatever. As you said, if someone is willing to do it to the national parks service because they tripped on a wooden path, then the sky is the limit.
It's a sorry situation we live in, but I appreciate where you are coming from. As was said, it's highly unlikely that such a thing would occur, but you can never be too certain. That wouldn't stop me from running events, just make me more careful about the organisation and who it's open to.