L-plate drivers. Unaccompanied.

Krasava

Unfortunately the problem is that I hold a learners permit for the moment. I own a car that I bought, insured, taxed and L plates are on display. I live in a region with not so great transportation system. 12 driving lessons are done, exam is booked in a month time (huge, long queues), so everything is organised and lawful.

The the problem is that I need to do a certain mileage each month for my insurance company, and there is no one with full driving licence who can accompanied me with driving. I'm not sure what can I do, I need to do my mileage, need to travel to work/shops for the next month. I'm trying to be lawfully and correct but this new laws have pushed me to despair, and long huge queues for the actual test.

I would like to understand and see your experiences and recommendation on what can I do in my situation, as my car will be parked for a month without usage and I don't want to be fined or my car to be seized. I need to use my car my insurance, but I can't by law. So what can I do ?

whomitconcerns

Krasava wrote: »

Unfortunately the problem is that I hold a learners permit for the moment. I own a car that I bought, insured, taxed and L plates are on display. I live in a region with not so great transportation system. 12 driving lessons are done, exam is booked in a month time (huge, long queues), so everything is organised and lawful.

The the problem is that I need to do a certain mileage each month for my insurance company, and there is no one with full driving licence who can accompanied me with driving. I'm not sure what can I do, I need to do my mileage, need to travel to work/shops for the next month. I'm trying to be lawfully and correct but this new laws have pushed me to despair, and long huge queues for the actual test.

I would like to understand and see your experiences and recommendation on what can I do in my situation, as my car will be parked for a month without usage and I don't want to be fined or my car to be seized. I need to use my car my insurance, but I can't by law. So what can I do ?

There's only one official answer. You can't use your car unaccompanied. Past experience is a lot of us did. New laws make it prohibitively not worth it anymore.

3putt

The Law has always been the same. You shouldn't be driving on your own with a learners permit,

Why do you need to do miles for your insurance????

Krasava

The insurance company need to monitor my driving, based on my monthly trips that consists a specific mileage.

This influences my insurance premium on how well i perform.

LollipopJimmy

Do insurance companies require a minimum mileage?

Anyway, I am of the opinion that drivers need to be fully licensed and compliant, these laws have been in place for years (there was a time you could drive unaccompanied on your 2nd provisional but had to be accompanied on your first and third+)

You need to grin and bear it for the month and hopefully you will pass your test then.

SteM

Maybe contact your insurance company to see what they say, perhaps they could switch you over to another policy that doesn’t require you to do certain mileage?

I didn't drive alone before I got my full license, didn't feel the need to but knowing how getting caught could effect my insurance going forward I wouldn't chance it now.

Nickindublin

I noticed on my new policy book that came with my insurance renewal that the insurance company will not cover anyone driving with a learner permit unaccompanied.

Henry Ford III

Explain your circumstances to your insurer OP. They won't insist on you doing minimum miles solo.

p.s. Good luck with your test, but please resist the temptation to drive alone before then - because if you get done you're toast.

corks finest

whomitconcerns wrote: »

Krasava wrote: »

Unfortunately the problem is that I hold a learners permit for the moment. I own a car that I bought, insured, taxed and L plates are on display. I live in a region with not so great transportation system. 12 driving lessons are done, exam is booked in a month time (huge, long queues), so everything is organised and lawful.

The the problem is that I need to do a certain mileage each month for my insurance company, and there is no one with full driving licence who can accompanied me with driving. I'm not sure what can I do, I need to do my mileage, need to travel to work/shops for the next month. I'm trying to be lawfully and correct but this new laws have pushed me to despair, and long huge queues for the actual test.

I would like to understand and see your experiences and recommendation on what can I do in my situation, as my car will be parked for a month without usage and I don't want to be fined or my car to be seized. I need to use my car my insurance, but I can't by law. So what can I do ?

There's only one official answer. You can't use your car unaccompanied. Past experience is a lot of us did. New laws make it prohibitively not worth it anymore.

Correct

Krasava

Thank you all for being honest and fair, but why are the queues for the driving test is ridiculous long ?

It feels like a lot of people drive without L Plates, how else can you explain the constant demand for the driving test.

Logically, if there were no or little demand for driving test centers, especially in Dublin then there be small queues with few instructors.

TeaBagMania

Ah just put your car up on jack stands in the drive way and let it run in fifth gear for awhile, see what the insurance monitor makes of that

ayux4rj6zql2ph

How can they monitor your mileage? Have you a tracking device fitted by them?

Henry Ford III

Krasava wrote: »

Thank you all for being honest and fair, but why are the queues for the driving test is ridiculous long ?

It feels like a lot of people drive without L Plates, how else can you explain the constant demand for the driving test.

Logically, if there were no or little demand for driving test centers, especially in Dublin then there be small queues with few instructors.

Supply and demand explains the long queues. Folk didn't bother with the test until now as they were allowed drive solo and the old rules weren't enforced.

The Clancy amendment changed all that.

seamus

Krasava wrote: »

Thank you all for being honest and fair, but why are the queues for the driving test is ridiculous long ?

It feels like a lot of people drive without L Plates, how else can you explain the constant demand for the driving test.

Logically, if there were no or little demand for driving test centers, especially in Dublin then there be small queues with few instructors.

Mainly because it's not a matter of just processing the queue. 50% of people fail. So if they can test 20,000 people a year (for example), then 10,000 of those people will be back again next year. So while your test capacity is 20,000, you can only accommodate 10,000 new applications in any given year.

There aren't enough testers, is the simple answer. There's no issue with queues at NCT centres, so there's no reason why there should be queues at driving test centres.

This isn't a new problem. When I did my tests between 2001 and 2003, the average wait time for a test in Dublin was 6 months. Some centres had a queue 40 weeks long at one point.

Henry Ford III

The Driver Testing recruitment thing was a bit of a farce too tbh. So no real improvement from that end either.

extra-ordinary_

Contact your insurance company requesting they suspend your insurance for one month.

Krasava

In my opinion people still do drive with years of experience with learners permit and unaccompanied, especially in rural areas due to the queues for the actual test, not only that but driving without L Plates. This statement is only based on my opinion and only my observations.

So I though that I can do the same as others, till my driving test is completed and passed.

loyatemu

Krasava wrote: »

In my opinion people still do drive with years of experience with learners permit and unaccompanied, especially in rural areas due to the queues for the actual test, not only that but driving without L Plates. This statement is only based on my opinion and only my observations.

So I though that I can do the same as others, till my driving test is completed and passed.

I'm sure they are, people have always done it. But previously enforcement was fairly lax, whereas now they can seize your car. Do you really not know anyone with a full license who will sit in the car for a while each week until the test date arrives?

I wouldn't advise not driving at all between now and then, you'll be rusty and nervous and probably fail - either find a volunteer, pay someone or take a few extra lessons.

TheChizler

Do more lessons? You'll do your minimum mileage, which I've never heard of btw, and be more likely to pass the test first time.

Henry Ford III

Krasava wrote: »

In my opinion people still do drive with years of experience with learners permit and unaccompanied, especially in rural areas due to the queues for the actual test, not only that but driving without L Plates. This statement is only based on my opinion and only my observations.

So I though that I can do the same as others, till my driving test is completed and passed.

I can appreciate your view, but to deliberately break the law still isn't a good idea, and the penalty should you get caught doing so will be severe.

So don't do it.

biko

There is nothing you can do.
If you get nabbed while driving unaccompanied then the car could be taken away from you, and you will be in an even worse situation than you are now.
Ring the insurer and explain that for the next month you cannot do the required mileage, I am sure they will understand.

It sucks, but there you are. It's "only" a month.

LollipopJimmy

What happens if you go on holiday for 2 weeks of the month? Do you have to do more mileage to make up for it? Still finding that aspect very odd.

Isambard

when I learned to drive I booked my test on my very first lesson.

chancer12

seamus wrote: »

Mainly because it's not a matter of just processing the queue. 50% of people fail. So if they can test 20,000 people a year (for example), then 10,000 of those people will be back again next year. So while your test capacity is 20,000, you can only accommodate 10,000 new applications in any given year.

There aren't enough testers, is the simple answer. There's no issue with queues at NCT centres, so there's no reason why there should be queues at driving test centres.

This isn't a new problem. When I did my tests between 2001 and 2003, the average wait time for a test in Dublin was 6 months. Some centres had a queue 40 weeks long at one point.

Ring for a cancellation, they generally have several each week. If you are willing to go to any test centre you have a better option. Also, if you are in Dublin there is a new test centre opening on Pottery Road, best of luck

ayux4rj6zql2ph

As i have been saying to people of late, the moment they receive the learner permit for a car or bike book the test immediately, you can select dates you are unavailable until such as the 1st day after the 6th month of issue. That way you will probably be called for your test just when the 6 months are up.

I was waiting 3 months for the bike test, permit issued in June, booked test in October and sat it at the start of this month.

Can i ask a question with an honest answer? Do you feel you have an entitlement to drive alone pending your test? The laws aside i want your own personal opinion?

Is car insurance validated without having EDT done? My bike insurance wasn't without IBT

Krasava

I would be confident and competent to do so. But no one is "entitled" to break the law.

ohnonotgmail

3putt wrote: »

The Law has always been the same. You shouldn't be driving on your own with a learners permit,

Why do you need to do miles for your insurance????

It may be the same since they started calling them learners permits but prior to that learner drivers on their second provisional licence could legally drive unaccompanied.

GBX

How are the insurance company planning on monitoring your mileage? Are you expected to submit information to them? or is the accompanying driver to this on your behalf?

Thoie

Your insurance company can't "force" you to drive a minimum mileage each month - what if you were away on business, or sick, or your car was in the garage?

Step 1: Apply for a cancellation slot for your driving test if you could be available at short notice.
Step 2: Talk to your insurance company and find out what happens if you can't drive for a month.


Are there any elderly people nearby who may have a full license, but not be comfortable driving? Maybe you could go shopping together?
Can you ask a colleague for a lift to work (or to car pool with you) in the short term? Maybe they could drive to your house, leave their car there, and you'd drive to and from work.

ayux4rj6zql2ph

Krasava wrote: »

I would be confident and competent to do so. But no one is "entitled" to break the law.

This is where the confused is, you can only be deemed competent to drive by an RSA driver tester, self competence doesn't come into it, even those who fail a driving test believe they are competent but they have been deemed not to be for good reason.

And you are indeed correct that no one is 'entitled' to break the law, many don't see the law as applying to them as even though they are on a permit they think they are competent.

I wish you every success in your test and hope to see you posting in the 'Successful' thread soon.

MascotDec85

Axa require a minimum amount of KMs to be driven in a month. They contacted one of my former pupils saying she wasn’t logging into their app, which tracks the driving. She said she was, every single time but that she was finding it hard to get someone to accompany her. The person on the phone was almost amazed she was sticking to the rules and asked for an improvement in the distance covered.

ayux4rj6zql2ph

MascotDec85 wrote: »

Axa require a minimum amount of KMs to be driven in a month. They contacted one of my former pupils saying she wasn’t logging into their app, which tracks the driving. She said she was, every single time but that she was finding it hard to get someone to accompany her. The person on the phone was almost amazed she was sticking to the rules and asked for an improvement in the distance covered.

How are AXA monitoring it? Does the Tracksure system still exist?

Even if an insurance company tell a person on a learner permit to up the mileage that’s all well and good, if in a crash while driving unaccompanied will they cover the learner for damages if a comprehensive policy is in force?

ohnonotgmail

Kaleb Great Lumbar wrote: »

How are AXA monitoring it? Does the Tracksure system still exist?

Even if an insurance company tell a person on a learner permit to up the mileage that’s all well and good, if in a crash while driving unaccompanied will they cover the learner for damages if a comprehensive policy is in force?

They will cover third party costs because they have to.

MascotDec85

Kaleb Great Lumbar wrote: »

How are AXA monitoring it? Does the Tracksure system still exist?

Even if an insurance company tell a person on a learner permit to up the mileage that’s all well and good, if in a crash while driving unaccompanied will they cover the learner for damages if a comprehensive policy is in force?

They record every journey on an app. The person accepted what she said but asked her to try and increase the overall driving with a sponsor, not unaccompanied.

ayux4rj6zql2ph

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

They will cover third party costs because they have to.

Yes I’m aware of third party, have they paid out for an unaccompanied drivers own damage?

ayux4rj6zql2ph

MascotDec85 wrote: »

They record every journey on an app. The person accepted what she said but asked her to try and increase the overall driving with a sponsor, not unaccompanied.

I’ve never been in this position of needing a sponsor but have been one, it can be tough to make yourself available at the drop of a hat

Dravokivich

Krasava wrote: »

Thank you all for being honest and fair, but why are the queues for the driving test is ridiculous long ?

It feels like a lot of people drive without L Plates, how else can you explain the constant demand for the driving test.

Logically, if there were no or little demand for driving test centers, especially in Dublin then there be small queues with few instructors.

I'm not sure where you get this logic?

But the queue isn't just for people learning to drive a car. There's motorbikes and all manners of trucks and buses too.

There will always be high demand with the next generation coming of age, or peoples needs changing to require their own transport.

TeaBagMania

Isambard wrote: »

when I learned to drive I booked my test on my very first lesson.

This, i dont know why so many people procrastinate, book it, get it done, reap the insurance rewards, move on with life

Eggs For Dinner

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

They will cover third party costs because they have to.

Always need to remember that the insurer's obligation to pay a 3rd party does not mean you have cover under your policy for the accident. If you breach your policy conditions, insurers can pursue you to recover their outlay

galwaytt

Kaleb Great Lumbar wrote: »

As i have been saying to people of late, the moment they receive the learner permit for a car or bike book the test immediately, you can select dates you are unavailable until such as the 1st day after the 6th month of issue. That way you will probably be called for your test just when the 6 months are up.

I was waiting 3 months for the bike test, permit issued in June, booked test in October and sat it at the start of this month.

Can i ask a question with an honest answer? Do you feel you have an entitlement to drive alone pending your test? The laws aside i want your own personal opinion?

Is car insurance validated without having EDT done? My bike insurance wasn't without IBT

I don't understand why you can't do that either, but the law says you can't these days. You have to have held the permit for at least 6 months AND have your EDT completed before you can even apply .

ayux4rj6zql2ph

galwaytt wrote: »

I don't understand why you can't do that either, but the law says you can't these days. You have to have held the permit for at least 6 months AND have your EDT completed before you can even apply .

Has to be done before you can apply Jasus

Is it a case that the system won't allow one to apply for a test until EDT is logged on their system.

galwaytt

Kaleb Great Lumbar wrote: »

Has to be done before you can apply Jasus

Is it a case that the system won't allow one to apply for a test until EDT is logged on their system.

Thats my understanding, yes. EDT or IBT completed, permit held for 6 months... only then can you apply

wirelessdude01

3putt wrote:

Why do you need to do miles for your insurance????

Have never heard this before. If anything less milage means a lower premium.

ayux4rj6zql2ph

galwaytt wrote: »

Thats my understanding, yes. EDT or IBT completed, permit held for 6 months... only then can you apply

I applied for the test when my LP was only 4 months issued/3 months after IBT.

Passed my test 6 and a half months after the LP was issued and 3 days shy of 6 months since doing IBT.

I was never once asked by anyone for my IBT cert bar the initial setting up of my insurance , I still have it though despite no longer needing it.

Just checked the dates there:

LP issued on 15/06/2018
IBT completed on 06/07/2018
Applied for test on 03/10/2018
Passed test on 03/01/2019

ayux4rj6zql2ph

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

Have never heard this before. If anything less milage means a lower premium.

Without a tracking device/app surely there is no way of monitoring it?

When I took out my bike insurance I told them I’d be doing no more than 3000kms, that was last July, to date I’ve done just shy of 1000, I’ll have to revise it down at the renewal.

I passed my test on my 2nd attempt a few months back. The whole system is a bit of a joke to be honest.
The pass rates in Dublin are disgraceful. Obviously the mandatory lessons are not helpful enough.
You hear about people failing the test for very silly reasons all the time.

Then you pass and are free to drive on any motorway in the country without any training or assessment.

ayux4rj6zql2ph

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I passed my test on my 2nd attempt a few months back. The whole system is a bit of a joke to be honest.
The pass rates in Dublin are disgraceful. Obviously the mandatory lessons are not helpful enough.
You hear about people failing the test for very silly reasons all the time.

Then you pass and are free to drive on any motorway in the country without any training or assessment.

Are N plated drivers not prevented from driving on a motorway for the first 2 years?

BuzzMcdonnell

Kaleb Great Lumbar wrote: »

Are N plated drivers not prevented from driving on a motorway for the first 2 years?

Nope

ayux4rj6zql2ph

BuzzMcdonnell wrote: »

Nope

Hhhmm

Only restriction appears to be that they can’t act as an accompanying driver for the first 2 years.

BuzzMcdonnell

Kaleb Great Lumbar wrote: »

Hhhmm

Only restriction appears to be that they can’t act as an accompanying driver for the first 2 years.

They also are still only allowed to get 6 penalty points.

ayux4rj6zql2ph

BuzzMcdonnell wrote: »

They also are still only allowed to get 6 penalty points.

And an offence not to display said plate.