What happens if I drive with an expired driving licence ?

Irexit

My driving licence has almost expired.


I'm just wondering what are the consequences if I don't update my licence.



In the 10 years I have been driving I have never once being asked to produce a driving licence.


My car is fully tax and and insured but I don't see much point in updating my licence seeing that I've never needed to use it.

raabbles

The point is it's the law. Aside from that, its a lot less stressful to fill out a renewal form then deal with that one time you need it, followed by your car being taken and court.

Risk/reward is a no brainer here

Samuel T. Cogley

0/10

Fann Linn

Irexit wrote: »

My driving licence has almost expired.


I'm just wondering what are the consequences if I don't update my licence.



In the 10 years I have been driving I have never once being asked to produce a driving licence.


My car is fully tax and and insured but I don't see much point in updating my licence seeing that I've never needed to use it.

You're not insured if ye haven't got a current licence.

Aint Eazy Being Cheezy

Fann Linn wrote: »

You're not insured if ye haven't got a current licence.

Aaaaaaaand you bit.

Fann Linn

Aint Eazy Being Cheezy wrote: »

Aaaaaaaand you bit.[/quote


I believe it's called 'check'.

Under His Eye

Fann Linn wrote: »

You're not insured if ye haven't got a current licence.

Incorrect.

aaakev

Irexit wrote: »

My driving licence has almost expired.


I'm just wondering what are the consequences if I don't update my licence.



In the 10 years I have been driving I have never once being asked to produce a driving licence.


My car is fully tax and and insured but I don't see much point in updating my licence seeing that I've never needed to use it.

Just get the license ya lazy bastaad


Mod
Warning to aaakev:
Language!

Caranica

1994 Road Traffic Act requires you to carry a valid driving licence. If yours is almost out of date get booking an appointment fast, they book out weeks in advance!

Eggs For Dinner

Fann Linn wrote: »

You're not insured if ye haven't got a current licence.

"Holds a licence, or having held a licence and is not disqualified from holding...."

You are insured with an expired licence

4ensic15

Being discovered not to be carrying a licence may result in a charge and conviction. That will result in penalty point and penalty points may lead to difficulties with insurance.

GM228

4ensic15 wrote: »

Being discovered not to be carrying a licence may result in a charge and conviction. That will result in penalty point and penalty points may lead to difficulties with insurance.

There are no penalty points associated with no driving licence offences.

coylemj

Irexit wrote: »

In the 10 years I have been driving I have never once being asked to produce a driving licence.

Your house probably didn't burn down in that 10 years either but I bet you still pay the insurance.

ezra_

Eggs For Dinner wrote: »

"Holds a licence, or having held a licence and is not disqualified from holding...."

You are insured with an expired licence

I can never understand that clause. Why don't Insurance companies mandate a current licence when getting a policy?

Tacitus Kilgore

ezra_ wrote: »

I can never understand that clause. Why don't Insurance companies mandate a current licence when getting a policy?

Troll thread, but anyway -

Why does it even matter? Not like a renewal comes from the result of a test.

ArrBee

A friend of mine had a license that was 10yrs expired.
Didn't cop until he was asked for it when getting an NCT.

ezra_

Tacitus Kilgore wrote: »

Troll thread, but anyway -

Why does it even matter? Not like a renewal comes from the result of a test.

Licence enforcement in this country isn't great as it is. Having the insurers crack down on at least having a valid licence isn't a bad thing IMO

Tacitus Kilgore

ezra_ wrote: »

Licence enforcement in this country isn't great as it is. Having the insurers crack down on at least having a valid licence isn't a bad thing IMO

Meh, once a driver passes their test and applies for their licence, they are now 'licenced' to drive, the physical document to verify this comes with an expiry - however the driver's licencing does not expire. So it's a waste of time doing this.


Plus, there's already plenty sticks in the bag for beating Irish motorists, why add more?

ayux4rj6zql2ph

Sense of entitlement to not have a licence?

A person can renew their licence/permit 3 months in advance if the expiry date.

Anyone who has a licence that has lapsed, like the nct guy, shouldn’t be left near a motor vehicle.

It takes all of 10 seconds to take the licence/permit out of the wallet/purse/handbag to check the expiration date.

I’ve bern to the NDLS twice in the last 10 days without an appointment, fairly good service.

Is the fear of renewing the licence/permit the new fear of taking a test?

Tacitus Kilgore

Entitlement yeah :rolleyes:

An expiry date has nothing to do with the ability to drive a motor vehicle. Hell a lot of licenced drivers have never even spent the 20 minutes demonstrating that they can actually drive a motor vehicle in the first place. The ability to walk into a NDLS office doesn't demonstrate it either.

It's a box ticking exercise in bureaucracy, that's all.

ArrBee

Tacitus Kilgore wrote: »

...however the driver's licencing does not expire...

Not sure the above is correct.
After the document is expired there is a grace period to get it renewed, but after that you are no longer licensed to drive.

As mentioned above a friend had this happen recently.
They had to start again as if the were applying for a new license.


But, I do agree the insurance companies should not be policing this.

Tacitus Kilgore

ArrBee wrote: »

Not sure the above is correct.
After the document is expired there is a grace period to get it renewed, but after that you are no longer licensed to drive.

As mentioned above a friend had this happen recently.
They had to start again as if the were applying for a new license.

That would be news to me, I'm happy to be wrong if I can see something to confirm

ayux4rj6zql2ph

Tacitus Kilgore wrote: »

Entitlement yeah :rolleyes:

An expiry date has nothing to do with the ability to drive a motor vehicle. Hell a lot of licenced drivers have never even spent the 20 minutes demonstrating that they can actually drive a motor vehicle in the first place. The ability to walk into a NDLS office doesn't demonstrate it either.

It's a box ticking exercise in bureaucracy, that's all.

Follow the UK so and issue until 70 years old is it with no renewal until then, not a chance in this great country :rolleyes:

ArthurG

Why on earth would you want to take the risk?

splinter65

Irexit wrote: »

My driving licence has almost expired.


I'm just wondering what are the consequences if I don't update my licence.



In the 10 years I have been driving I have never once being asked to produce a driving licence.


My car is fully tax and and insured but I don't see much point in updating my licence seeing that I've never needed to use it.

Your insurance is invalid if you don’t have an up to date licence.

Tacitus Kilgore

splinter65 wrote: »

Your insurance is invalid if you don’t have an up to date licence.

That's already been debunked. In the thread.

ayux4rj6zql2ph

splinter65 wrote: »

Your insurance is invalid if you don’t have an up to date licence.

They’ll only pay out for third parties I believe but have a right of recovery

coylemj

Tacitus Kilgore wrote: »

Meh, once a driver passes their test and applies for their licence, they are now 'licenced' to drive, the physical document to verify this comes with an expiry - however the driver's licencing does not expire.

This is nonsense. When your driving licence expires, you are no longer licensed to drive.

Tacitus Kilgore wrote: »

That would be news to me, I'm happy to be wrong if I can see something to confirm

38.—(1) A person shall not drive a mechanically propelled vehicle in a public place unless he holds a driving licence for the time being having effect and licensing him to drive the vehicle.

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/1961/act/24/section/38/enacted/en/html#sec38

If your licence expired more than 10 years ago and you want to get a new one, you are required to start from scratch - do the theory test, get a learner permit and do the driving test. But during that 10 years (after your licence expires), you are not licensed to drive.

.G.

ArrBee wrote:

A friend of mine had a license that was 10yrs expired. Didn't cop until he was asked for it when getting an NCT.

They would have had to re sit the driving test in that case.

Tacitus Kilgore

Cap in hand, I was way off.

macnug

I havnt been asked for my licence in over ten years until last week when I was asked twice at two different check points, seems to be a bit of a crackdown lately.

ArrBee

superg wrote: »

They would have had to re sit the driving test in that case.

Yes, he did!
It was quite the mix up. Something about it being issued with a very short expiry in the 1st instance then it getting lost and him not bothering to replace it, then the changes in rules coming in for NCT and for the 1st time he was asked to produce the license which he didn't have. When he tried to get it replaced he was told it was expired.... by "just over" the threshold.

Makes for a funny story and a warning to others I reckon.

jimmycrackcorm

Renewed my insurance recently. They wouldn't accept until I sent in a copy of my licence.

I had to pay extra to take the OH off the policy because she misplaced hers

Under His Eye

Lauren Full Recorder wrote: »

They’ll only pay out for third parties I believe but have a right of recovery

Wrong. The conditions of insurance have not been violated.

ayux4rj6zql2ph

Under His Eye wrote: »

Wrong. The conditions of insurance have not been violated.

So if someone has no licence just drive on the insurance is grand?

Under His Eye

If they had a licence and are not disqualified then yes that is grand. Says so on every insurance certificate.

coylemj

Under His Eye wrote: »

If they had a licence and are not disqualified then yes that is grand. Says so on every insurance certificate.

Liberty still insists that the driver holds a 'valid' licence and there is no qualifier along the lines of 'or, having held a licence, is not disqualified...' which you will find in most policy documents.

Under the heading of 'General exceptions which apply to the whole policy', Liberty state the following.....


3. We will not cover the driver unless;

a they hold a valid licence to drive the vehicle; and
b they meet the conditions and any limits of the driving licence.


https://www.libertyinsurance.ie/assets/Uploads/Private-Vehicle-Policy-Booklet.pdf

Though the consensus in multiple discussions on boards is that they would not be able to refuse to pay out based on the driver's licence having simply expired.

Some insurance companies used to insist that the car was taxed as a condition of the policy!

jmreire

Every year when I'm renewing the car insurance, I have to show my driving licence too. Even for a friends car that I'm on the insurance, I have to show the Licence at renewal time. Haven't been asked by a Guard in donkeys years..

GM228

coylemj wrote: »

Liberty still insists that the driver holds a 'valid' licence and there is no qualifier along the lines of 'or, having held a licence, is not disqualified...' which you will find in most policy documents.

Under the heading of 'General exceptions which apply to the whole policy', Liberty state the following.....


3. We will not cover the driver unless;

a they hold a valid licence to drive the vehicle; and
b they meet the conditions and any limits of the driving licence.


https://www.libertyinsurance.ie/assets/Uploads/Private-Vehicle-Policy-Booklet.pdf

Though the consensus in multiple discussions on boards is that they would not be able to refuse to pay out based on the driver's licence having simply expired.

Some insurance companies used to insist that the car was taxed as a condition of the policy!

It's interesting to note the wording, "we will not cover the driver", this may not create a right of recovery in itself against the policy holder as you still hold a valid policy open to claims made by a third party. It is also interesting to note that most exclusions apply to the "insured person", this clause specifically applies to the "driver" and the policy is held by the policy holder, not the driver nor the insured person.

As such I think such a policy clause only applies to a claim made by the driver in that capacity as opposed to the insured or a third party, contra proferentem may apply here also? So whilst the driver may not be covered themselves the policyholder still holds a valid policy.

Under His Eye

It would be interesting to see if the Gardaí would even attempt a prosecution based on some obscure policy wording.

coylemj

Under His Eye wrote: »

It would be interesting to see if the Gardaí would even attempt a prosecution based on some obscure policy wording.

Unless you're seriously pushing the boat out like running an illegal taxi service, the Gardai take the view that as long as you are not disqualified and can produce an insurance cert., you are insured to drive.

4ensic15

Under His Eye wrote: »

It would be interesting to see if the Gardaí would even attempt a prosecution based on some obscure policy wording.

There are good reasons why not. Once a policy is issued on a vehicle any injured party is indemnified under the policy. That is the basic purpose of compulsory insurance. If the policyholder has breached a condition of the policy the insurer must pay the injured party but can sue their own policyholder. Under the EU insurance directives, cover can't be avoided because of the driver lacking a licence.

jmreire

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

Renewed my insurance recently. They wouldn't accept until I sent in a copy of my licence.

I had to pay extra to take the OH off the policy because she misplaced hers

I'm pretty sure that there is a procedure for replacing lost licences? And also for replacing out-of-date licences? Just depends on how long out of date they are.

Little Less Conversation

My renewal was up last year. I have never been stopped but I didn't want it expiring. Thought with an expired license you would have to go through the learning process again. Sure in hell, I won't be doing that.

Actually, what actually happens if you did let it expire.

ayux4rj6zql2ph

Little Less Conversation wrote: »

My renewal was up last year. I have never been stopped but I didn't want it expiring. Thought with an expired license you would have to go through the learning process again. Sure in hell, I won't be doing that.

Actually, what actually happens if you did let it expire.

If a full licence is out of date 10 years then you start from the beginning, theory test, mandatory lessons etc, for a learner permit it’s 5 years.

Little Less Conversation

Little Less Conversation wrote: »

My renewal was up last year. I have never been stopped but I didn't want it expiring. Thought with an expired license you would have to go through the learning process again. Sure in hell, I won't be doing that.

Actually, what actually happens if you did let it expire.

Just a quick Google and after 10 years without a renewal and you do have to go through the whole learning process again. I did that once. Won't be doing it again. It's way cheaper just to renew the license instead of the driver theory, 12 lessons and 6 month wait before applying for the test.

UrbanFret

If you live close to the border then you'll be asked for it regular on both sides. Anyway in this day and age you would think you could have a digital copy on your phone,

GM228

4ensic15 wrote: »

There are good reasons why not. Once a policy is issued on a vehicle any injured party is indemnified under the policy. That is the basic purpose of compulsory insurance. If the policyholder has breached a condition of the policy the insurer must pay the injured party but can sue their own policyholder. Under the EU insurance directives, cover can't be avoided because of the driver lacking a licence.

Claims by a third party can't be avoided, but "cover" for the policy holder can be if they so wish to have such a policy.

ayux4rj6zql2ph

UrbanFret wrote: »

If you live close to the border then you'll be asked for it regular on both sides. Anyway in this day and age you would think you could have a digital copy on your phone,

Could a digital copy not be easier to alter? Is that not why these microchips are in the new credit card style licence/permit?

tuxy

GM228 wrote: »

Claims by a third party can't be avoided, but "cover" for the policy holder can be if they so wish to have such a policy.

This is it exactly.
You are still covered 3rd party once you took out the policy legally.(ie. had a licence at that time)

This 3rd party cover is still in place even if you are pissed drunk, out of your mind on drugs, have an expired licence or are driving like a complete maniac.

ayux4rj6zql2ph wrote: »

Could a digital copy not be easier to alter? Is that not why these microchips are in the new credit card style licence/permit?

This is fraud and you can not take out a policy legally using fraud. Not having a licence would be the least of your troubles if you were caught doing this.