Brexit and driving licence

whomitconcerns

So I have an Irish driving licence but live in UK just over 3 years. My understanding is that from march 29th I will need a uk driving licence.

As they will be non EU I should be able to have both uk and Irish driving licences?

Assuming that's the case, how do I retain my Irish DL when I have to send that in to get the UK DL. (I can't be a###ed doing a uk test...

TopTec

This...


For visitors, with driving licences from EU or non-EU countries like the USA, Canada, Serbia, Japan and New Zealand will enjoy the same arrangements as today. The UK does not require visiting motorists, for example those coming to the UK on holiday or who wish to drive on business, to hold a separate IDP to guarantee the recognition of their driving licence.

When non-EU licence holders come to live in the UK on a temporary basis, we would continue to recognise their licence for a period of 12 months, before requiring the holder to either exchange their licence, where agreements exist, or to take a driving test.

EU licence holders can drive on their EU licence until it expires, or until they reach the age of 70, or until 3 years after coming to live in the UK. For EU licence holders who passed their test in the EU or EEA, the UK would continue to exchange their licence as we do currently.


is from here... https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/driving-in-the-eu-if-theres-no-brexit-deal/driving-in-the-eu-if-theres-no-brexit-deal


it might pay you to consider doing a licence exchange, for a UK one. I am in the same boat but a UK licence in Ireland.


TT

whomitconcerns

TopTec wrote: »

This...


For visitors, with driving licences from EU or non-EU countries like the USA, Canada, Serbia, Japan and New Zealand will enjoy the same arrangements as today. The UK does not require visiting motorists, for example those coming to the UK on holiday or who wish to drive on business, to hold a separate IDP to guarantee the recognition of their driving licence.

When non-EU licence holders come to live in the UK on a temporary basis, we would continue to recognise their licence for a period of 12 months, before requiring the holder to either exchange their licence, where agreements exist, or to take a driving test.

EU licence holders can drive on their EU licence until it expires, or until they reach the age of 70, or until 3 years after coming to live in the UK. For EU licence holders who passed their test in the EU or EEA, the UK would continue to exchange their licence as we do currently.


is from here... https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/driving-in-the-eu-if-theres-no-brexit-deal/driving-in-the-eu-if-theres-no-brexit-deal


it might pay you to consider doing a licence exchange, for a UK one. I am in the same boat but a UK licence in Ireland.


TT

Thanks tt, I had read this.. But where my confusion arrives is that I am already in the UK more than 12 months. So they are not clear if a 12 month period starts from march 30th or if automatically I (we) would be in beach of the rules as being here over 12 months as of that day.

Anyway I heard if you "lose" your Irish licence at the same time you return it to the DVLA. And then request a replacement in Ireland, that you could retain both licences...

Bottom line is I would like to retain my Irish licence also if at all possible....

MaryBrosnan

This kind of problem will stop Brexit.

Peregrinus

whomitconcerns wrote: »

Thanks tt, I had read this.. But where my confusion arrives is that I am already in the UK more than 12 months. So they are not clear if a 12 month period starts from march 30th or if automatically I (we) would be in beach of the rules as being here over 12 months as of that day.

From the OP, you're already in the UK for more than three years, so even as a migrant from an EU country you should already have changed your licence. I don't think you'll get an extra 12 months to do so as a result of Brexit.

whomitconcerns

Peregrinus wrote: »

From the OP, you're already in the UK for more than three years, so even as a migrant from an EU country you should already have changed your licence. I don't think you'll get an extra 12 months to do so as a result of Brexit.

That not the case. You can use your EU licence up till it's expiry, in any other country in the EU regardless of how long you are there.

Normally When my Irish licence expires I would have to get a UK licence.

oceanman

MaryBrosnan wrote: »

This kind of problem will stop Brexit.

very much doubt that...

Peregrinus

whomitconcerns wrote: »

That not the case. You can use your EU licence up till it's expiry, in any other country in the EU regardless of how long you are there.

That doesn't appear to be the position of the UK government, at least in the Brexit context, as appears from the quote in TopTec's post#2 in this thread:

"EU licence holders can drive on their EU licence until it expires, or until they reach the age of 70, or until 3 years after coming to live in the UK. For EU licence holders who passed their test in the EU or EEA, the UK would continue to exchange their licence as we do currently."

I think I may be wrong in saying that you should already have exchanged your licence but the notice seems to me to say that, following a no-deal Brexit, a UK resident can only drive on an EU licence until the earlier of (a) expiry of the licence, or (b) reaching age 70, or (c) three years after coming to live in the UK. In your case, that third date will already have passed, so it seems you should exchange your licence immediately upon a no-deal Brexit.

whomitconcerns

Peregrinus wrote: »

That doesn't appear to be the position of the UK government, at least in the Brexit context, as appears from the quote in TopTec's post#2 in this thread:

"EU licence holders can drive on their EU licence until it expires, or until they reach the age of 70, or until 3 years after coming to live in the UK. For EU licence holders who passed their test in the EU or EEA, the UK would continue to exchange their licence as we do currently."

I think I may be wrong in saying that you should already have exchanged your licence but the notice seems to me to say that, following a no-deal Brexit, a UK resident can only drive on an EU licence until the earlier of (a) expiry of the licence, or (b) reaching age 70, or (c) three years after coming to live in the UK. In your case, that third date will already have passed, so it seems you should exchange your licence immediately upon a no-deal Brexit.

Indeed. But as it stands right now. I can drive here till I'm 70 as long as on a valid EU licence.

Hence the quandary... So to follow what you say (and my understanding also) I would immediately require a licence at the end of march.

My question remains though. Should this not mean I can possess a UK and an Irish licence simultaneously.

GM228

The reality is deal or no deal the licensing requirements in the UK will not change overnight irrespective of what is stated in the UK Gov link.

Recognition of EU licences in the UK is afforded by UK legislation under the Motor Vehicles (Driving Licences) Regulations 1999 and unless they actually amend their legislation leaving the EU will not change the legal status of an EU licence.

Many seem to think that leaving the EU will automatically unwind any EU related law in the UK, that is simply not true, only specific changes to their laws will do that and it would also take time if or when they go down that route.

The only laws that technically would end overnight are EU Regulations which have not had any associated domestic legislation enacted, however despite having Direct Effect most Regulations usually have related domestic legislation enabling or furthering the provisions of the Regulation.

Peregrinus

GM228 wrote: »

The reality is deal or no deal the licensing requirements in the UK will not change overnight irrespective of what is stated in the UK Gov link.

Recognition of EU licences in the UK is afforded by UK legislation under the Motor Vehicles (Driving Licences) Regulations 1999 and unless they actually amend their legislation leaving the EU will not change the legal status of an EU licence.

Many seem to think that leaving the EU will automatically unwind any EU related law in the UK, that is simply not true, only specific changes to their laws will do that and it would also take time if or when they go down that route.

The only laws that technically would end overnight are EU Regulations which have not had any associated domestic legislation enacted, however despite having Direct Effect most Regulations usually have related domestic legislation enabling or furthering the provisions of the Regulation.

Yes, but the UK have established a mechanism under which domestic UK law which gives effect to EU obligations will be reviewed and can be changed. And we can probably treat the UK government's own notice on the subject as a reasonable indicator of how they propose to change this particular law.

I agree, they're unlikely to do it with immediate effect from midnight on 29 March, so there probably will be a grace period during which the current state4 of affairs will prevail. But the notice doesn't commit to providing any grace period and, even if if there is a grace period, there is no commitment as to how long it will be and (presumably) it could be ended at any time without notice.

Peregrinus

whomitconcerns wrote: »

My question remains though. Should this not mean I can possess a UK and an Irish licence simultaneously.

Possibly. But if you obtain your UK licence by exchanging your Irish licence you won't acheive this (obviously). And to obtain a UK licence without exchanging your Irish licence you'd need to sit the UK test, which you say in post #1 you are not minded to do.

Scaltan

See below from Department of Transport Website

UK Driving Licences
The Department of Transport, Tourism and Sport is planning to put in place appropriate arrangements that will allow for the exchange of a UK driving licence for an Irish driving licence following Brexit.

Esel

There is a current thread in Motors on this topic for anyone interested.