Oh brother ...what to do for the best

MPFGLB

I live in a major city where one of my brothers also lives (but not with me ) . This brother has never held down a job and he gambles all the time. My other brothers and me have down the years given him money, bought him stuff, etc ..My uncles have given him jobs…All the time he has spent the money on pleasure trips, ran up bills, walked out of jobs, fought with so many. .He seems though to be able to talk his way into things and always has a new acquaintance for awhile but no friends. He has had girlfriends but they all leave him.. He has a massive chip on his shoulder and resents the rest of us. He is now middle aged and has no home and lives in one room in a shared house/hostel .My mother wants him to settle down in rural Ireland where we come from (and will help him get a place ) but he will not leave the bright lights even though he doesn’t work. He hides what he gets up to and can do that best in a city. He tells strangers he is a business man but he is mostly at the betting office

I don’t see him or interact with him.. Its because he is so difficult (just like my father was) He also acts like you should drop everything for him or you are the worst in the world. All my family who live far away from him insist I should be in contact with him.(.even though they are not except my mother )
I am made to feel guilty that I do not see him…I would see him if I could put boundaries around it but knowing him he would come by my house whenever, he wanted, cause a scene, take over as he does at my mothers house etc. I cant cope with him. Yet at the same time I feel sorry for him as he has nothing or no one ..My other brothers don’t contact him either but do interact with him when he is visiting my mother house. I avoid him so I wont be obliged to re start a relationship. I worry about the future and he has no one …If he gets sick like my father did in middle age who will look after him..I don’t want it to be me…So I feel terrible. … He is like a child who like my father and other members of my father’s family expected others to look after them and take no responsibility for anything. I dont even know if i could ahve a conversation with him as I dotn like to do what he wants and I He says we don’t want him which is true in my case because it is so fraught with difficulty…if I gave him access to my house I would be anxious because I know it would end in tears. You cant even have a conversation with him without it ending in a fight as you may ask the wrong question. He blames everyone else for everything and is quite scathing in his condemnation of others ..plus he is so needy as he has no one so if nice to him he would take advantage and then a precedent set on what he expects you to do for him.Even my mother /his mother doesn't want to see him coming as he treats her like a skivvy. I dont even know if I could have a relationship with him as I don't like to do what he wants to do nor listen to him say awful things about our relatives

Any advice on what I should do in this situation would be gratefully received
He is (like me) the product of a truly dreadful childhood and has some personality disorders but again he has done nothing to help himself or indeed be kind to anyone who has . .He lives in so demi world of dishonesty and addition (gambling,running all over the place,etc) and loneliness

Rubberchikken

from your post i fail to see any good in this man. i cant see how or why he should have anyone, and it seems to be you as far as your family are concerned, put themselves out to see he's rehomed in the country and financially rescued.

this man is an adult. he seems to be happy to live the life he's living. yes he's your brother. your mother is understandably worried about him. but until he decides he wants to change things i personally dont see what anyone should or could do.
good luck

amdublin

If I was you I'd continue to do what you're doing, avoid him

SirChenjin

I agree with previous posters. Keep things as they are and steer clear of him.

It's easy for the other members of the family to be insisting on you being in contact with him, while they remain a long distance away from him. Turn that around on them, and tell them to contact him instead, if they are concerned.

You don't need to feel guilty, not in the slightest.

Ghekko

I agree. Steer clear, don't give him money and don't engage in conversations with family who try to guilt you into having a relationship with him. They have a nerve! It's normal to be worried for him but at the end of the day if he is not willing to accept that he needs help and seek it himself, then there's nothing anyone else can do.

MPFGLB

Thank you for replying everyone and for gratefully received your advice

Kevin Finnerty

I've a sister exactly like that only without the gambling issues. We were close growing up and it killed me when I figured out I was just someone to use to her in adulthood.

Best thing I did was cut her from my life completely and haven't looked back. It went totally against all my principle but once I saw the benefits of having no interaction with her the guilt grew less and less of a burden to none very quickly.

Your decision is whether to go down that route, by what you post it seems you should imo.

MPFGLB

Kevin Finnerty wrote: »

I've a sister exactly like that only without the gambling issues. We were close growing up and it killed me when I figured out I was just someone to use to her in adulthood.

Best thing I did was cut her from my life completely and haven't looked back. It went totally against all my principle but once I saw the benefits of having no interaction with her the guilt grew less and less of a burden to none very quickly.

Your decision is whether to go down that route, by what you post it seems you should imo.

The thing with family I find is it is nigh impossible to be completely free ...I see my brother at funerals and weddings where he turns up and my mother has to find him a suit (according to herself) or give him money to get a present . This is a man in his forties !! There is so much keeping up appearances or illusion in families...and in ours there is an unwritten rule that certain people are 'looked after' no matter how awful. My father was the same ..he was like a petulant angry child all the time, he gambled and he never worked nor was he ever a father but he was 'looked after'

I admire your stance . For me the trial will come when he gets older or ill or both...He will be completely alone in a hostel because he will never change..

Defunkd

Keep some channel of communication open/available just in case of emergency or real need.
I used get the 'why don't you call to X?' from those who wouldn't bother their hole to call to X or make any effort: it is very annoying!
You're not responsible for your brother. Let him live his life as he sees fit and you live yours. Even if it means his life is a facade or crap or lonely. He's a grown man and chooses this way.

Neyite

MPFGLB wrote: »

The thing with family I find is it is nigh impossible to be completely free ...I see my brother at funerals and weddings where he turns up and my mother has to find him a suit (according to herself) or give him money to get a present . This is a man in his forties !! There is so much keeping up appearances or illusion in families...and in ours there is an unwritten rule that certain people are 'looked after' no matter how awful. My father was the same ..he was like a petulant angry child all the time, he gambled and he never worked nor was he ever a father but he was 'looked after'

I admire your stance . For me the trial will come when he gets older or ill or both...He will be completely alone in a hostel because he will never change..

Some people can't be helped though. He's an addict by the sounds of it, and many just don't want to stop living their lives the way they are living them. Your mother is an enabler and you are likely right in that when she is gone it will get worse for him - it still may not be enough to turn his life around in the way she would have wanted though.



So what do you do when that happens? You text occasionally. The odd coffee or visit. You keep a suit at your house for him for the likes of funerals and all that. You'll end up giving him good clothes belonging to your husband or a warm coat or boots and the next time you see him he will have sold them to feed his addictions. You may give him a few quid here and there but don't give more than you can afford to never see again. That's all you can do really. But one thing you can't do is feel guilty yourself for his choices or for the way his life turned out. Or feel guilty if you lose touch with him.

artvanderlay

He sounds toxic. Keep your distance. You can only help those who want to help themselves...I learned this from bitter experience. Don't let him drag you down. If something happens to him, there are services available to him: he's not your responsibility to look after, so forget that and forget about any guilt, the most worthless emotion. Get on with your own life, and enjoy it.



Your mother has a different relationship with him; she is his mother. You are not. She chooses to indulge him, when maybe a bit of tough love could have been the best thing for this guy. Some people are energy vampires and toxic, and they latch on to good people and drain them. Put a stop to it now. You are a kind, decent person...give your energy to similar people, not parasites.

.......

You cant ever change someone elses behaviour, only your own.

So you have no need whatsoever to feel guilty about how he lives his life, its not your responsibility.

Your mother enables him - this is her choice.

As for the relations who tell you you should be in touch with him, turn it back onto them, ask them why they dont contact him if they are so worried? They try to put this onto you to clear their own guilt, dont let them. My father was an alcoholic and I cut him out and his sisters used to phone me and tell me I was a terrible person and why wasnt I helping my own father? I told them all where to get off. I didnt see them lifting a finger to help.

I would advise you to talk to a professional if you are feeling guilty, talk it out, really accept that you are not doing anything wrong.

Because you are not doing anything wrong.

LegacyUser

All those people who insist you should be in touch with him are just trying to absolve themselves of the guilt and responsibility of having to do anything about it themselves by making it your problem.
Anyway, he needs nothing from you, he's not ill, or disabled or let down by a partner or had life stolen from him or anything like that, he's just feckless and that's his problem, not yours.

ChrissieH

Completely agree with all the posters here, and I really feel bad for you, you're in a crap position - just because of geography, you're an easy target for everyone else to offload this burden onto you. If he moved to where some of your brothers lived, I highly doubt they'd all suddenly start rushing to hang out with him.
It sounds like he has reacted to your tough childhood situation in a different way to how you did, and that's normal and understandable - gambling is a really common way for men to try to distract themselves from reality. When you say he has a chip on his shoulder and is basically completely irresponsible, it sounds like he really is suffering the long-term effects of whatever traumatic situation he was in as a child, he seems to feel hard-done-by and that the world owes him a living now in return for the bad treatment he received in childhood.

All quite common in people who have suffered childhood trauma, it's sad but unless he realises that this is what's going on within him, he's not going to change. He needs therapy, not enabling, but there's nothing you can do about his situation and you're doing the right thing by protecting yourself - from how you described him, it doesn't sound like he'd be open to taking advice from you and you said he lives in loneliness so I'm assuming he doesn't have anyone close to him that he would take advice from, but in all honesty, it sounds like he's in an awful state, mentally, and really does need help .. would there be any possibility of your family staging an "intervention" where everyone meets him together (so that it's not left to any 1 person) with a few gentle suggestions of therapists or centres, or even just to start with GA meetings.. I know it's not a nice thing to have to do, but if you're posting here, you're obviously worried to a certain extent, and the last thing you want is to feel guilty and end up trying to help him, only for him to drag you down.
Best of luck, it's a really tough predicament you're in and I'm sure you're one of many in this situation - addiction is just such a terrible thing for family members to live with.

MPFGLB

ChrissieH wrote: »

Completely agree with all the posters here, and I really feel bad for you, you're in a crap position - just because of geography, you're an easy target for everyone else to offload this burden onto you. If he moved to where some of your brothers lived, I highly doubt they'd all suddenly start rushing to hang out with him.
It sounds like he has reacted to your tough childhood situation in a different way to how you did, and that's normal and understandable - gambling is a really common way for men to try to distract themselves from reality. When you say he has a chip on his shoulder and is basically completely irresponsible, it sounds like he really is suffering the long-term effects of whatever traumatic situation he was in as a child, he seems to feel hard-done-by and that the world owes him a living now in return for the bad treatment he received in childhood.

All quite common in people who have suffered childhood trauma, it's sad but unless he realises that this is what's going on within him, he's not going to change. He needs therapy, not enabling, but there's nothing you can do about his situation and you're doing the right thing by protecting yourself - from how you described him, it doesn't sound like he'd be open to taking advice from you and you said he lives in loneliness so I'm assuming he doesn't have anyone close to him that he would take advice from, but in all honesty, it sounds like he's in an awful state, mentally, and really does need help .. would there be any possibility of your family staging an "intervention" where everyone meets him together (so that it's not left to any 1 person) with a few gentle suggestions of therapists or centres, or even just to start with GA meetings.. I know it's not a nice thing to have to do, but if you're posting here, you're obviously worried to a certain extent, and the last thing you want is to feel guilty and end up trying to help him, only for him to drag you down.
Best of luck, it's a really tough predicament you're in and I'm sure you're one of many in this situation - addiction is just such a terrible thing for family members to live with.

Thank you for your post
The thing is therapy will only work if someone is open to it.Yes he has an addiction to gambling and eating but he has never had a job...lots of people gamble and/or over eat but they have jobs....He will not work.he is lazy.My other brothers and I had the same child hood but we work and pay our way.
My biggest problem with my brother is not his gambling or not working or his taking 100s of pounds and squandering it. Its that he is the re incarnation of my father right down to the nasty selfish aggressive attitude and belief that some people (well my mother and me ) should be bullied into looking after him as if he is a child and not an adult. . This is a grown man who took £800 from me to rent a flat a few years back and went to US on holiday with it....Rang me 3/4 times a day until he got the money and then nada ...Never explained or said sorry or anything .When I complained to my mother he called me every name going the road down the phone... The truth is I cannot bear to be around him as he reminds me of the dreadful childhood I had with my father who was a bully, a tyrant and selfish ... He is so like him

ChrissieH

God... with your added information there, it really does sound like he's more of a bad egg than a hopeless addict, as I'd originally presumed.
That's shocking behaviour. Your mother must be at her wits end, to have had a husband and now a son bullying her all this time, it's a crap situation.

You're dead right of course: nobody will get the benefits of addiction (or any other) therapy if they're not there willingly, although having said that, some people do believe that even if people attend somewhat against their will, they just might soak up enough of the ethos to at least change a small bit but it sounds like your brother is a bit of a lost cause when it comes to improvement. Such a pity and such a fecking ball and chain, weighing ye down.

It really does sound like the only thing you can do is what you have been doing; keep your distance and try not to let other people guilt you into having contact with him. He sounds so toxic, there's absolutely no reason why anyone should have to have a relationship with someone just because they're related to them.

seamus

My mother struggled for years with a family member a bit like this. Always the centre of a drama, always looking for help and getting insanely angry when help wasn't forthcoming. Would tend to ignore contact unless she needed something, and if she got in touch, it was always because she needed something.

Same nonsense, pressure from other family members to keep her in the loop, made to feel guilty for not keeping in touch, blah blah.

Fact is, when you have someone so self-involved, it will never be a two-way relationship. An appropriate quote I was reminded of today, "Never set yourself on fire to try and keep someone else warm". If a relationship causes you nothing but pain, then you should not feel guilty about letting it go.

Your mother, as the parent, probably feels a lifelong sense of responsibility for your brother's well-being. But you're a sibling, not a parent. You didn't ask for him, you were stuck with him. He is not your responsibility unless you want him to be. If other people in your family feel guilty that they're not helping him, that's their problem. Don't allow them offload their guilt onto you. You've done your part, and you've been burned. You have no reason to do any more.