Cities around the world that are reducing car access

Citizen Six

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120105428#Comment_120105428

I'm 12.5c per km on a tank average. In a 15 year old diesel.

But I totally get your point. Sure the amount of people who just idle their cars for no reason is unreal. Passed a building site at the end of my road this week, at lunch time. Six of the workers in their vehicles, eating lunch, with the engines going.

Sam Russell

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120106732#Comment_120106732

It is the sunk cost of owning a car that causes many owners to use the car unnecessarily for short journeys that might be made more appropriately by walking or by bike.

When I pass a marina full of very expensive yachts that are tied up 90% to 100% of the time, I think of the waste of assets for 15 minutes of sailing time per day if actual sailing time was spread out over the year. It is like owning a holiday home so you can visit it for the month of August.

People do not understand their effect on other people, and that they can be their own worst enemy.

Thelonious Monk

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2023/jan/19/low-traffic-neighbourhoods-boundary-roads-london

lots of these around where i live in hackney. cars have absolutely destroyed where i grew up in dublin and where my parents live now, kids cant play outside any more and there are traffic jams on a tiny residential street. despite all this i could never see ltns being tolerated much in dublin as people are so brainwashed by cars and the mere thought of reducing car use seems to be ridiculed by everyone over there. that's not to say there's a loud minority here, black cab drivers etc., but councils seem to mostly ignore them.

after the salthill and sandymount debacle i don't have much hope for dublin.

Peregrine

https://twitter.com/_BrianMahon_/status/1618214659341053952

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p_haugh

https://twitter.com/DublinCommuters/status/1618688907666952192

Works have started on the Liffey Street upgrade! Upper Liffey Street has been in need of a refresh for a while now.

magicbastarder

there's a section in here about stroads, and quite aptly i was listening to it while driving up through ballymun; if ever there was a dublin example of a stroad, i'd say the main road through ballymun is a classic.

https://99percentinvisible.org/episode/mini-stories-volume-16/

bb1234567

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120128126#Comment_120128126

They faced backlash in London too though and the only reason most were built was under the cover of smoke during COVID when nobody was taking much notice. As usual nobody actually minds as much as they think they will once it's actually all said and done.

I live in similar type of neighbourhoods with these interventions near Brixton, but today post covid when new cycle lanes, pedestrianisation or traffic calming are proposed there's 'community outcry' from the usual loud mouths. There's literally a group called 'save herne hill' who protest here and put up flyers because the council want to reduce a 3 lane one way road down to two to put in cycle lanes. Deep second hang cringe on behalf of that group when I realised what they were 'fighting for'. JFC.

Thelonious Monk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120164005#Comment_120164005

I lived around that way 10 years ago or so and I don't think anyone even knew what an LTN was. Where in Herne Hill are they doing this? Used to drink in the Prince Regent by the Lido! Lovely place.

bb1234567

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120164245#Comment_120164245

Yes it's lovely! But the junction by the Half moon pub could do with some more pedestrian friendly measures.

This is the road which is proposed to be made two lane. https://www.google.com/maps/@51.4520672,-0.1013699,3a,75y,354.63h,80.72t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1shKfK-FMOwEjysZDphBEdWQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

Additionally they want to pedestrianise this road by the station.

https://www.google.com/maps/@51.4528582,-0.1012471,3a,75y,323.82h,80.86t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1slf1hVHiroOVZ4IGkyCvXQA!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

It all sounds great to me , and there are other proposed measures, some streets in the area also being made closed to through traffic I think.

Thelonious Monk

https://twitter.com/OverheardDublin/status/1619052589513072641

vaguely related to this thread but it's actually pretty hilarious, I wonder how many people have paid heed to that sign over the years, i'd go out on a limb and say zero. we need a guerilla sign removing team at night like the tire extinguishers.

cgcsb

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120168144#Comment_120168144

Dublin is full of silly amounts of signage and associated poles with no rational explanation. If you're depending on signs to reach the m50 from South William St you'll be very lost.

magicbastarder

IIRC when they put up a standard sign showing motorists there's a public car park ahead, they're not allowed 'advertise' the car park by naming it.

so they put up a second sign with the name of the car park, in case people are looking for a specific one. so you end up with two signs each time, letting motorists know where the car park is.

McGrath5

Did anyone see the incredible bike parking facility recently opened in Amsterdam? I know its the Netherlands and how they do cycling infrastructure but this on another level.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EqwasBTzZS8

cgcsb

https://irishcycle.com/2023/02/11/two-way-cycle-path-planned-on-south-quays-between-hapenny-bridge-and-docklands/

an ambitious plan for the south quays. Hopefully DCC have the nerve to get it done.

Seth Brundle

This is an interesting Twiter thread regarding a survey on cultural blind spots - how we as a society allow certain bad behaviour (in this case by drivers) whereas we don't accept somewhat similar behaviour by similar but non-driving related scenarios...

https://twitter.com/ianwalker/status/1615248156186247169

The responses to the survey...

Thelonious Monk

https://twitter.com/MartynBrunt/status/1625161983619174401

this is a great thread. actually where I'm from in Dublin has plenty of shops but the greengrocers and butchers are all gone due to supermarket influx, but there are plenty of supermarkets within a 15 minute walk.

what worries me are the swathes of new apartments and houses being built in places like clongriffin and elsewhere that don't seem to have any amenities whatsoever nearby. no pubs or cafes, nothing.

what's the solution to this? should councils be subsidising businesses to start in these areas? the overheads are so expensive in ireland now that no one is going to risk competing against the supermarkets everyone will drive to.

also it's funny how this 15 minute city thing is being hijacked by the loonies as some kind of communist credit scheme, or something.

CatInABox

I have been looking for to seeing this case come back up. The Strand Road Trial is back in the courts, with the council rightly appealing the original decision. At the time, I and others were astonished at the judgment, with the judge seemingly ignoring all the evidence that the works were to be a time limited trial, and that the council had the right to do so. I have zero legal knowledge, but I knew enough that the decision was extremely weird, and it seems that the President of the High Court, along with a member of the Supreme Court and another high court judge, agrees.

They haven't made a judgement themselves yet, but from this article, they are not pleased with the High Courts behaviour or judgement in this case at all. Check this out:

Referring to Browne’s outline of the High Court judgment that planning permission was required, Justice Collins said that the “conclusion is wrong”. He said it was an “explicit statement” that appears intended to “bind the council in the future”.

Justice Collins said that if the High Court decision was incorrect that needs to be corrected rather than letting such a precedent stand. He said that it would be wrong to let a judgment stand that implies virtually any form of traffic calming requires planning permission.

These are not the words of people willing to let the current decision stand.

https://twitter.com/IrishCycle/status/1625675604153536513

noelfirl

Fingers crossed from that initial sounding for a reversal of the decision.

But presumably then to the Supreme Court for the burghers and denizens of Sandymount, and their feckless councillor enablers? After all, this is a case of national and indeed constitutional importance... 😁

DaCor

I can't see Mannix et al taking this to the SC

cgcsb

Are they not at all concerned about the 'mortification'? Or is that a working class concern.

Sam Russell

It is ironic that currently Strand Road is closed for Northbound traffic from Merrion Gates, so the problem with traffic so complained about by the residents of Sandymount appears to be OK as no-one is complaining. I have noticed that the Merrion Road has much heavier traffic of late.

[I think there is a major water pipe going in along Strand Road which is why the road is closed.]

p_haugh

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120244843#Comment_120244843

It seems more congested yes, but then any time I've been down it there's only been a few cars that proceed to turn down Serpentine Road - most continue straight towards Ballsbridge

Also bear in mind that there's roadworks around Booterstown-Trimblestone which probably aids in clumping all of the cars together.

p_haugh

Seen this today, finally there'll be pretty much continuous pedestrianisation from Talbot Street junction to Capel Street from the end of this month!

https://twitter.com/JanetPHorner/status/1631639500655919107?t=6fPtApq7osmsZhfNUoVpng&s=19

In terms of pedestrian areas, the north inner city centre should look like this in the near future (yellow lines being pedestrian areas):

The strech between Capel Street and Talbot Street alone will be just over 700 meters long.

serfboard

I was over in London in the last few weeks. I came out of Euston train station and was walking around the area. This was at about 5PM.

When I came out of the train station I expected to hear the usual roar of a city. What really struck me was how quiet it was. Almost eerily quiet. You could even hear the birds clearly.

And this was despite the fact that the area is not pedestrianised.

I put it down to several factors:

1. It was a Monday and a lot of people work from home on Mondays now.
2. The congestion charge in London removing a lot of cars from the roads.
3. The electrification of the remaining fleet of cars and vans. In fact whenever I did hear an old diesel engine, it really stood out.

As well as cutting down on actual pollution, the amount by which the changes have reduced noise pollution was striking.

Seth Brundle

Dot density map of car ownership in London. 1 dot apparently equals 10 households...

https://twitter.com/PhinHarper/status/1631399400667750402?t=rh4KK6X57kSWRvj0m_e4Lw&s=19

Sam Russell

That is a lot of no-cars in a household.

Is it poverty or congestion charges?

DaCor

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120310467#Comment_120310467

Its more likely down to good alternatives i.e. PT (Buses & tube) and the expansion of cycling infrastructure. There are now more people cycling in London than driving

Thelonious Monk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120310467#Comment_120310467

you don't really need one so it's just an unnecessary expense. where i am in hackney it's really quiet too, hardly any cars around until you go down to kingsland road towards the city and even that isn't too bad. you'd only really need a car if you're leaving the city everything else is accessible by pub tran or walking/bike. i honestly can't think of anyone in my social circle that owns a car here, except one but he lives a bit further out in croydon direction.

cgcsb

It's funny because last time I was in London I found public transport to be quite poor, feck all capacity relative to the amount of people trying to use it. Poor frequency on a lot of lines, again relative to usage, interchanges were often cumbersome. And Needless to say the most expensive public transport I've been on anywhere in the world. Yet they've still followed a policy of car reduction. Here any attempt to restrict cars is usually met with 'improve public transport first'.

DaCor

Just on the recent posts, here's the article with the details on numbers of cars/bike

https://twitter.com/carltonreid/status/1630877795785080832?t=uxo2Xh71NCqDcuwxhSMkXw&s=19