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Brexit discussion thread V - No Pic/GIF dumps please

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Comments

  • Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 18,691 Mod ✭✭✭✭DOCARCH


    Thargor wrote: »
    The way she turns every question about her various disasters into 'Well yeah but what about Labour? is embarrassing.

    FYP.

    Part of the problem is lack of effective opposition in HoC.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,229 ✭✭✭LeinsterDub


    Thargor wrote: »
    The way she turns every question about her various disasters into 'Well yeah but what about Labour?' is embarrassing.

    Seems she's learned a thing or two from the DUP. Whataboutye!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,415 ✭✭✭sjb25


    Thargor wrote: »
    The way she turns every question about her various disasters into 'Well yeah but what about Labour?' is embarrassing.

    Order order the prime minister WILL BE HEARD


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,204 ✭✭✭blackcard


    The famine getting a mention in the HOC


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,415 ✭✭✭sjb25


    The prime minister just said she will not leave us without food in Ireland thank god for that!! :)


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,758 ✭✭✭Laois_Man


    They think they still have the power to starve us

    They think it's still 1848!!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,964 ✭✭✭✭Leroy42


    I'll say one thing, that story about the 13 yo that committed suicide due to online and social media abuse puts everything in perspective.

    While the HoC fannys around not having a clue what they are doing or what they want in terms of Brexit, there is a real world out there which is being left fall apart since nobody is paying attention.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,099 ✭✭✭✭J Mysterio


    Leroy42 wrote: »
    I'll say one thing, that story about the 13 yo that committed suicide due to online and social media abuse puts everything in perspective.

    While the HoC fannys around not having a clue what they are doing or what they want in terms of Brexit, there is a real world out there which is being left fall apart since nobody is paying attention.

    Im not sure it does put everything in perspective. There are lots of areas in the UK which are struggling badly now, they will be royally fucķed in a No Deal Brexit. You would see a lot more suicides as jobs are lost and businesses go under. As services are removed and social welfare goes down while prices go up. It could get a lot worse.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,229 ✭✭✭LeinsterDub


    DAVID Davis and Dominic Raab have teamed up to launch their alternative Brexit deal today in an open pitch for the keys to Number 10.

    The two ex-Brexit Secretaries appeared on stage with DUP leader Arlene Foster this morning in a surprise bid to drum up support for their ideas.....

    It will scrap the hated Northern Ireland backstop which is why so many MPs are opposed to the PM's agreement.

    This back-up plan, to stop there being a hard border in Ireland if there was no trade deal, would put the UK in a customs territory with the EU.

    https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/brexit/7959113/brexit-deal-latest-david-davis-dominic-raab-alternative/


    Davis, Raab and Foster have invented some new unicorns!


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,964 ✭✭✭✭Leroy42



    Even a cursory glance shows that it absurd, and what the hell is Foster doing there, it completely goes against her main principle
    But Mr Davis and Mr Raab would try and replace the backstop with a ten-year, extendable agreement.

    They say this would involve free trade in goods, no tariffs, and a Max Fac-style solution for the border.

    The UK wouldn't be in the same customs union territory, it said.

    So, they would leave the EU without a backstop but stay in the CU for a further 10 years! Which could be extended! And NI would be treated differently until some new systems could be developed!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,806 ✭✭✭An Ciarraioch


    Rather dramatic shift in NI trade - exports to GB have fallen for the first time on record (by almost £3 billion), while sales to the Republic have risen by £540m:

    https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/business/northern-ireland/northern-ireland-exports-to-britain-plunge-by-20-and-sales-to-republic-rise-by-16-37619643.html


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,029 ✭✭✭hill16bhoy


    Hearrrrrrrrrr hearrrrrrrrrr

    I know pmqs is mostly theatre, but this is pure pantomime.
    British politics at the moment is like a giant production of Keeping Up Appearances with Theresa May as Mrs. Bucket.

    Then there are a load of other assorted other comedy characters thrown in.

    Boris Johnson is Basil Fawlty.
    Nigel Farage is Alan Partridge.
    David Davis is David Brent.
    Jacob Rees-Mogg is Jeeves.
    Michael Gove is Del Boy.
    Dominic Raab is Rodney.

    Fintan O'Toole must be running out of pop-cultural references for his articles at this stage so he can feel free to steal this one.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,387 ✭✭✭EKRIUQ


    I'm after watching a lot of Sky News coverage and apparently all Teresa has to do is go back to Europe and get a better deal.

    A lot of politicians in the government really believe that. The past 21 months has just gone over their head.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,026 ✭✭✭farmchoice


    EKRIUQ wrote: »
    I'm after watching a lot of Sky News coverage and apparently all Teresa has to do is go back to Europe and get a better deal.

    A lot of politicians in the government really believe that. The past 21 months has just gone over their head.
    it really is quite extraordinary, it seems to some kind of innate British superiority complex.


  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 11,775 Mod ✭✭✭✭devnull



    All these politicians in the UK and none of them have a basic command of English.

    It seems they do not understand what the word 'deal' means:
    an agreement entered into by two or more parties for their mutual benefit, especially in a business or political context.

    The Brexiteers seem to be of the opinion
    We Want Something.
    We Say Something.
    We Get Something.

    The arrogance is outstanding, it's like they just cannot accept that when you are negotiating something, you can't just hold the guns to someones head and tell them 'hey, take your medicine we force feed down your throat' which is the approach that they are going through now.

    It's only a deal if two parties agree to it, otherwise it's a proposal, the lack of any kind of basic negotiating skills is completely embarrassing for the average British person who did not vote to be poorer or to lose their job or to see their cost of living go up whilst the rich put a bonfire on workers rights.

    Being serious though, it's obvious what their game is, set up some unreasonable demands that the leavers want but are not achievable, the EU obviously is going to reject it and there you will have a No Deal outcome which is exactly what they want.

    The British people are being played for a fool and Raab and Davis are only too happy to go along with it by manufacturing a scenario in a cloak and dagger way, using the leavers fury and misinformation in order to further an agenda, the whole thing is sick and in years to come when the UK is suffering badly, history will show them as committing treason against their country.


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  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 11,775 Mod ✭✭✭✭devnull


    EKRIUQ wrote: »
    I'm after watching a lot of Sky News coverage and apparently all Teresa has to do is go back to Europe and get a better deal.

    A lot of politicians in the government really believe that. The past 21 months has just gone over their head.

    They are completely deluded to be fair, none of them has the slightest clue about Ireland or Northern Ireland for that matter and they seem to think that they want something, they say something and they get it. They want to bully the other side into what they want as their arrogance doesn't allow them to think any other way.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,662 ✭✭✭✭lawred2


    sjb25 wrote: »
    The prime minister just said she will not leave us without food in Ireland thank god for that!! :)

    Would you put a blockade of our supply chains past some Tories?

    I wouldn't


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,662 ✭✭✭✭lawred2


    Rather dramatic shift in NI trade - exports to GB have fallen for the first time on record (by almost £3 billion), while sales to the Republic have risen by £540m:

    https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/business/northern-ireland/northern-ireland-exports-to-britain-plunge-by-20-and-sales-to-republic-rise-by-16-37619643.html

    This is obviously project fear orchestrated by Gerry Adams

    Seriously though - that's a staggering statistic. Would like to see what the DUP think of that!?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,667 ✭✭✭✭VinLieger


    Any word on if they still plan on bringing barges across the Irish sea to help keep the lights on in NI?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,117 ✭✭✭✭Junkyard Tom


    The DUP must feel really important swanning around the halls of power in Whitehall but they're too flegged to realise that the Tory far-right are using the backstop to engineer a 'shock therapy' crash-out.

    Then you have Labour who are also courting the DUP in order to topple the Tory government so that they can apply their leftist/socialist vision for Britain.



    'What a fool I was! I was only a puppet, and so was Ulster, and so was Ireland'

    Edward Carson.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,099 ✭✭✭✭J Mysterio


    Raab and Davis.. two useless idiots who couldnt negotiate their way out of a phone box, failed in the Brexit Secretary role, and have now joined forces with a new ridicuous plan! How marvelous. Then just add a pinch of Unionist madness in the form of Arlene (not even an MP) and you have the most ridiculous proposition.

    Its gone past silliness into downright madness.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,029 ✭✭✭hill16bhoy


    lawred2 wrote: »
    Would you put a blockade of our supply chains past some Tories?

    I wouldn't
    How long before somebody on the Tory backbenches calls for the British Army to re-invade Ireland?

    "It would solve the border problem once and for all."


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,042 ✭✭✭Shelga


    J Mysterio wrote: »
    Raab and Davis.. two useless idiots who couldnt negotiate their way out of a phone box, failed in the Brexit Secretary role, and have now joined forces with a new ridicuous plan! How marvelous. Then just add a pinch of Unionist madness in the form of Arlene (not even an MP) and you have the most ridiculous proposition.

    Its gone past silliness into downright madness.

    What! I genuinely didn’t realise that Arlene Foster isn’t even an MP. What is her role then??


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 10,375 ✭✭✭✭kunst nugget


    Shelga wrote: »
    What! I genuinely didn’t realise that Arlene Foster isn’t even an MP. What is her role then??

    Vibes master.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,667 ✭✭✭✭VinLieger


    Shelga wrote: »
    What! I genuinely didn’t realise that Arlene Foster isn’t even an MP. What is her role then??


    Scowler in chief also up until recently, ash inspector.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,042 ✭✭✭Shelga


    Does the head of the DUP, or any party, not also have to be an elected MP?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,725 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    Shelga wrote: »
    What! I genuinely didn’t realise that Arlene Foster isn’t even an MP. What is her role then??

    She's leader of the DUP and so their members in West Minister follow her instructions.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,844 ✭✭✭intellectual dosser


    Shelga wrote: »
    What! I genuinely didn’t realise that Arlene Foster isn’t even an MP. What is her role then??

    Member of the Legislative Assembly (MLA) in the north and leader of the DUP. Other party members are Westminster MPs.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,910 ✭✭✭✭Strazdas


    Shelga wrote: »
    What! I genuinely didn’t realise that Arlene Foster isn’t even an MP. What is her role then??

    Party leader but Nigel Dodds is head of the Parliamentary party.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,725 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    Laura Keunnsberg suggesting that she is going to tell the party later that she is not going to context the next election but will step down after Brexit is delivered.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,943 ✭✭✭Russman


    hill16bhoy wrote: »
    How long before somebody on the Tory backbenches calls for the British Army to re-invade Ireland?

    "It would solve the border problem once and for all."

    D'ya know, having read briefly some of the Daily Mail (yeah, I know) comments referred to in an earlier post, its almost not that far fetched !!
    They really do still have the empire mentality and regard Europe as their "foes".


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,609 ✭✭✭Mooooo


    Tis alright joe Duffy is sorting it


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,939 ✭✭✭goat2


    My own thought is,
    They don't have a clue what they are doing, nothing planned, and all well paid to do a job they cannot do


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,523 ✭✭✭✭Alun


    Laura Keunnsberg suggesting that she is going to tell the party later that she is not going to context the next election but will step down after Brexit is delivered.
    So plunge the country into an economic depression and then run away into the sunset, just like Cameron. What a coward.


  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 11,775 Mod ✭✭✭✭devnull


    Alun wrote: »
    So plunge the country into an economic depression and then run away into the sunset, just like Cameron. What a coward.

    You don't forget Farage, he ran away from it before, came back for a little while and has vanished again.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,964 ✭✭✭✭Leroy42


    Laura Keunnsberg suggesting that she is going to tell the party later that she is not going to context the next election but will step down after Brexit is delivered.

    To which the reply will be

    "Well, du'h. That's been the plan since you fecked up the last GE!"


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,758 ✭✭✭Laois_Man


    devnull wrote: »
    You don't forget Farage, he ran away from it before, came back for a little while and has vanished again.

    He's starting a new party to run in the European elections in the event that the UK is still in the EU come next May


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,725 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    Alun wrote: »
    So plunge the country into an economic depression and then run away into the sunset, just like Cameron. What a coward.

    That's one opinion.
    Another would be she went against her convictions in supporting membership of the EU to negotiate a deal enabling them leaving which would be least damaging to the UK while still respecting the result of the EU referendum. She then acknowledged that she was willing to become the sacrificial lamb while a new leader looked to take the country forward knowing that the finger would be pointed at her for every difficulty.

    I would not be surprised if she claims later (maybe never publicly to be fair) that she never wanted to negotiate Brexit but could neither leave the country to the whim of Boris Johnson or ignore the will of the people.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,470 ✭✭✭McGiver


    lawred2 wrote: »
    Seriously though - that's a staggering statistic. Would like to see what the DUP think of that!?

    How is it staggering?

    rUK - £11.3
    RoI - £3.9
    rEU - £2.0
    World - £4.3

    RoI exports are "only" 33% of that to the rUK. EU27 exports are still only 50% of that to the rUK. Long way to go to shift the focus from the rUK to the EU and elsewhere.

    rUK - 53% exports
    EU27 - 27%
    World - 20%

    Scotland is in a similar position, actually even more dependent on the rUK trade. It would have to seriously reorient their exports to think about independence. AFAIk the figure in Scotland's case is 60%+.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,647 ✭✭✭✭El Weirdo


    137 Tory MPs have publicly declared their support for TM. Whether they're telling the truth or not is another matter.

    How many votes does she need to defeat the motion of no confidence? 150+?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,758 ✭✭✭Laois_Man


    David Cameron did not do the cowardly thing - He did the respectable thing! It might not be saying much, but he was a more honorable PM than May is


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,758 ✭✭✭Laois_Man


    El Weirdo wrote: »
    137 Tory MPs have publicly declared their support for TM. Whether they're telling the truth or not is another matter.

    How many votes does she need to defeat the motion of no confidence? 150+?

    158


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,910 ✭✭✭✭Strazdas


    El Weirdo wrote: »
    137 Tory MPs have publicly declared their support for TM. Whether they're telling the truth or not is another matter.

    How many votes does she need to defeat the motion of no confidence? 150+

    She'll probably 'win' the vote. Of far more interest will be the level of opposition to her - that's the thing that will decide her long term future.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,739 ✭✭✭serfboard


    Laura Keunnsberg suggesting that she is going to tell the party later that she is not going to context the next election but will step down after Brexit is delivered.
    Unlike Maggie Thatcher, I don't believe that TM will go if she only gets 50%+1 in the vote.

    She will have to be dragged out of No. 10 kicking and screaming, and having her fingers prised off the door jams.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,844 ✭✭✭intellectual dosser


    El Weirdo wrote: »
    137 Tory MPs have publicly declared their support for TM. Whether they're telling the truth or not is another matter.

    How many votes does she need to defeat the motion of no confidence? 150+?

    She needs 158

    Latest count is 174 publicly supporting her


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,725 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    Laois_Man wrote: »
    David Cameron did not do the cowardly thing - He did the respectable thing! It might not be saying much, but he was a more honorable PM than May is

    Can't agree with that view.

    She has done many things wrong but not sure how her honour can be questioned when she picked up a stick dynamite masquerading as a baton.

    What do you think she should have done which you would consider as respectful.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,758 ✭✭✭Laois_Man


    serfboard wrote: »
    Unlike Maggie Thatcher, I don't believe that TM will go if she only gets 50%+1 in the vote.

    She will have to be dragged out of No. 10 kicking and screaming, and having her fingers prised off the door jams.

    She'll win with more than 40 to spare IMO


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,662 ✭✭✭✭lawred2


    McGiver wrote: »
    How is it staggering?

    rUK - £11.3
    RoI - £3.9
    rEU - £2.0
    World - £4.3

    RoI exports are "only" 33% of that to the rUK. EU27 exports are still only 50% of that to the rUK. Long way to go to shift the focus from the rUK to the EU and elsewhere.

    rUK - 53% exports
    EU27 - 27%
    World - 20%

    Scotland is in a similar position, actually even more dependent on the rUK trade. It would have to seriously reorient their exports to think about independence. AFAIk the figure in Scotland's case is 60%+.

    Proportional changes are relative.

    And those relative changes are staggering.

    Despite the backdrop of a run up to a possible hard Brexit, which the DUP would actively agitate for if any other deal was perceived to be weakening their union, the North is becoming increasingly dependent on the South of Ireland for exports.

    And in fact it is trade with the RoI that filled a gap left by the consumption decline in rUK..

    I don't think anyone here read that and thought in macro terms that the 'mainland' was not the largest 'export' market for NI.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,204 ✭✭✭blackcard


    Laois_Man wrote: »
    David Cameron did not do the cowardly thing - He did the respectable thing! It might not be saying much, but he was a more honorable PM than May is
    There are 315 Conservative MP's so 158 is the number that May needs to survive. She doesn't seem like the resigning type but hard to see her struggling on unless she gets 200 or more votes


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,670 ✭✭✭✭briany


    El Weirdo wrote: »
    137 Tory MPs have publicly declared their support for TM. Whether they're telling the truth or not is another matter.

    How many votes does she need to defeat the motion of no confidence? 150+?

    The irony if she wins by a close vote and all the Brexiteer MPs are still complaining about her.


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