2,000 affordable homes planned Dublin

Pelvis

Another affordable housing scheme.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/more-than-2-000-affordable-homes-planned-for-10-dublin-sites-1.3619644

Single applicants must earn less than €50,000, while the limit for a couple will be €75,000.

Once again, those caught between the "rich" and the "poor" are screwed.

Pelvis

Pelvis wrote: »

Another affordable housing scheme.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/more-than-2-000-affordable-homes-planned-for-10-dublin-sites-1.3619644


Once again, those caught between the "rich" and the "poor" are screwed.

A single person earning over 50k and a couple earning over 75k can afford to house themselves.

SEPT 23 1989

nice little bargain if you get one in O’Devaney gardens for that price

Pelvis

mariaalice wrote: »

A single person earning over 50k and a couple earning over 75k can afford to house themselves.

A single person earning 50k in Dublin cannot afford a house worth living in.

Wheeliebin30

mariaalice wrote: »

A single person earning over 50k and a couple earning over 75k can afford to house themselves.

After they pay 25k tax?

Gavin "shels"

Pelvis wrote: »

A single person earning 50k in Dublin cannot afford a house worth living in.

€175,000 mortgage plus deposit & savings.... should be enough for a two bed apartment in Dublin, no?

power pants

Gavin "shels" wrote: »

€175,000 mortgage plus deposit & savings.... should be enough for a two bed apartment in Dublin, no?

No, can’t find anywhere going for 200 in Dublin and I have searching for months as have a rebuilding Ireland mortgage approval

Prices end up going well over the 200k


Also how do you apply for the affordable housing in the link?

I rang Dublin council and they have no idea. ?!

Caliden

Gavin shels wrote: »

€175,000 mortgage plus deposit & savings.... should be enough for a two bed apartment in Dublin, no?

In Dublin? No.

Maybe in the commuter towns.

Gavin "shels"

power pants wrote: »

No, can’t find anywhere going for 200 in Dublin and I have searching for months as have a rebuilding Ireland mortgage approval

Prices end up going well over the 200k


Also how do you apply for the affordable housing in the link?

I rang Dublin council and they have no idea. ?!

Well you've half the battle, mortgage approval. The right property is there and will be available at the right price at some stage.

In the article above:

"The lack of detail on a national affordable purchase scheme would not be a hindrance to the council, Mr Kenny said.

“There is no urgency in relation to determining issues of eligibility or selection, as we can carry on with putting these sites to the market and I’d be pretty sure by the time the houses would be ready, the scheme would be in place.”"

power pants

Gavin "shels" wrote: »

Well you've half the battle, mortgage approval. The right property is there and will be available at the right price at some stage.

In the article above:

Thanks

Not sure if that’s sensible logic or not regarding the policy for the affordable housing

I think whenever I see articles , I want to follow up so that I don’t miss out. Ie ring few months down the line and told should have applied last year etc

Pixel Eater

The council will literally do anything not to build public housing themselves. Part of the reason they have so little stock at the moment was becasue they sold of so much of their housing over the last few decades (and didn't replace them). They should simply just up the income threshold for public housing (to at least 50k), charge more rent and use the money gained to keep building more hosuing.

April 73

Pixel Eater wrote: »

The council will literally do anything not to build public housing themselves. Part of the reason they have so little stock at the moment was becasue they sold of so much of their housing over the last few decades (and didn't replace them). They should simply just up the income threshold for public housing (to at least 50k), charge more rent and use the money gained to keep building more hosuing.

By doing that aren’t we admitting that a lot of guards, teachers, nurses etc etc need social housing because our housing market is so dysfunctional.

Someone on €50k who can get a mortgage for 3.5 times income plus deposit could afford a property at 200k. In many parts of the country this would buy something decent - much harder in Dublin. But the truth is it’s hard for single people to buy property in s capital city anywhere. It’s really not achievable unless two people pool resources.

Carlos Orange

Pixel Eater wrote: »

The council will literally do anything not to build public housing themselves. Part of the reason they have so little stock at the moment was becasue they sold of so much of their housing over the last few decades (and didn't replace them). They should simply just up the income threshold for public housing (to at least 50k), charge more rent and use the money gained to keep building more hosuing.

They literally just put out a billion euro tender for building houses. Granted they aren't building them themselves but they shouldn't be either.

ted1

power pants wrote: »

No, can’t find anywhere going for 200 in Dublin and I have searching for months as have a rebuilding Ireland mortgage approval

Prices end up going well over the 200k


Also how do you apply for the affordable housing in the link?

I rang Dublin council and they have no idea. ?!

Try Ballyfermont, finglas, inchicore. Some showing up in daft

ted1

ted1 wrote: »

Try Ballyfermont, finglas, inchicore. Some showing up in daft

https://www.myhome.ie/residential/dublin-11/new-homes/property-for-sale-in-finglas

That is a new A rated 3 beds for €259,500 in Dublin.

Pixel Eater

April 73 wrote: »

By doing that aren’t we admitting that a lot of guards, teachers, nurses etc etc need social housing because our housing market is so dysfunctional.

Someone on €50k who can get a mortgage for 3.5 times income plus deposit could afford a property at 200k. In many parts of the country this would buy something decent - much harder in Dublin. But the truth is it’s hard for single people to buy property in s capital city anywhere. It’s really not achievable unless two people pool resources.

Well our housing market is dysfunctional because they relied on the free market to house the vast majority of our citizens. The reason for public housing is to house those who can't/struggle to house themselves in the private market, that includes guards, nurses etc.

psinno wrote: »

They literally just put out a billion euro tender for building houses. Granted they aren't building them themselves but they shouldn't be either.

Which is to be, tentatively, welcomed. But it comes several years into a major housing crisis, they shoulve been building for years. And why should'nr they be building it themselves?

Carlos Orange

Pixel Eater wrote: »

Which is to be, tentatively, welcomed. But it comes several years into a major housing crisis, they shoulve been building for years. And why should'nr they be building it themselves?

Aside from any other arguments it doesn't make sense to tool up an organisation to do €1 billion in house building unless you are planning to do that in a sustainable repeatable rate. No point building up to do €500M or €750M a year in house building and then shutting it down a year latter.

Pixel Eater

psinno wrote: »

Aside from any other arguments it doesn't make sense to tool up an organisation to do €1 billion in house building unless you are planning to do that in a sustainable repeatable rate. No point building up to do €500M or €750M a year in house building and then shutting it down a year latter.

Well that's my point; they should be doing it in a sustainable repeatable manner for the foreseeable future. The council did build plenty of housing previously then stopped and lost a great deal of the skills and expertise since.


In any case I don't mind too much of some construction is out sourced to private contractors, just as long as the council retain ownership afterwards, that is that it's simply not just handed to a developer to build and dictate terms.

Carlos Orange

Pixel Eater wrote: »

Well that's my point; they should be doing it in a sustainable repeatable manner for the foreseeable future. The council did build plenty of housing previously then stopped and lost a great deal of the skills and expertise since.

How many houses a year did Dublin City Council build in the past, say in the 80s for example? Would you be happy if they did that level of building now? The number I see quoted in articles about this tender is 110,000 houses over a 10 year period. Were they building that much in the past?

power pants

ted1 wrote: »

Try Ballyfermont, finglas, inchicore. Some showing up in daft

I have as I live in one of those areas

The price will show on ad for 175 or 180 etc

But they have them purposely low so you can add at least 30k on to that by the time the bidding ends

This isn’t an exaggeration but fact unfortunately

The very odd one that goes below 200 is usually cash only

pwurple

Is it me, or is housing single people in individual units a new thing? Have we lost the ability to live with eachother? My parents' generation, the siblings or cousins who didn't get married would have either lived together and shared, or joined a community living arrangement, like a religious community. Even in my own generation, I don't think I've ever lived alone, and I wouldn't know too many people who do either. 

It strikes me as hard on the environment, wasteful of resources, solitary / not good for mental health, and possibly poor community outcome to house every single person individually.

Alkers

April 73 wrote:

Someone on €50k who can get a mortgage for 3.5 times income plus deposit could afford a property at 200k. In many parts of the country this would buy something decent - much harder in Dublin. But the truth is it’s hard for single people to buy property in s capital city anywhere. It’s really not achievable unless two people pool resources.

We don't need everyone earning 50k to own a decent house, a 2-bed apartment suits them unless they have a familly

Sleeper12

mariaalice wrote:

A single person earning over 50k and a couple earning over 75k can afford to house themselves.

What would a single person be doing buying a house? Wouldn't an apartment be be more suitable & affordable?

omb0wyn5ehpij9

Sleeper12 wrote: »

What would a single person be doing buying a house? Wouldn't an apartment be be more suitable & affordable?

Apartments in this country aren't designed for long term living. They are too small, there is next to no storage, lack of parking, lack of outdoor space, etc. This all pushes people towards houses, and I can't blame them. I've lived in apartments for the last 9 years and the parking situation alone has ensured I will never buy an apartment

Franz Von Peppercorn

Simona1986 wrote: »

We don't need everyone earning 50k to own a decent house, a 2-bed apartment suits them unless they have a familly

Yeh, they won’t get that either in most parts of Dublin.

ted1

mariaalice wrote: »

https://www.myhome.ie/residential/dublin-11/new-homes/property-for-sale-in-finglas

That is a new A rated 3 beds for €259,500 in Dublin.

There’s other houses. Nothing wrong with second hand homes ... kids today.

ted1

Sleeper12 wrote: »

What would a single person be doing buying a house? Wouldn't an apartment be be more suitable & affordable?

No because eventually they’ll have a family. And they Will have to fork out money for a solicitor , survey , estate agent , valuation , stamp duty , moving van. All over again
They’ll also need to redecorate the home again to their needs and wants.

So effectively they are spending double.

omb0wyn5ehpij9

Franz Von Peppercorn wrote: »

Yeh, they won’t get that either in most parts of Dublin.

And that's the biggest problem. A 15-20 year old 2 bed apartment in a half decent area is 300k +

Sleeper12

BDJW wrote: »

Apartments in this country aren't designed for long term living. They are too small, there is next to no storage, lack of parking, lack of outdoor space, etc. This all pushes people towards houses, and I can't blame them. I've lived in apartments for the last 9 years and the parking situation alone has ensured I will never buy an apartment

That's wonderful that single people dream of owning a house but you can't expect affordable housing scheme to give the same breaks as couples. The way things usually work is you buy your apartment first & move into a bigger property as you need it. The scheme isn't designed to provide you with what you might need sometime in the future. It's designed to meet peoples needs in the present

Sleeper12

ted1 wrote: »

No because eventually they’ll have a family. And they Will have to fork out money for a solicitor , survey , estate agent , valuation , stamp duty , moving van. All over again
They’ll also need to redecorate the home again to their needs and wants.

So effectively they are spending double.

Hello!!

This is how it has always been done. Ever hear of a starter home?

power pants

pwurple wrote: »

Is it me, or is housing single people in individual units a new thing? Have we lost the ability to live with eachother? My parents' generation, the siblings or cousins who didn't get married would have either lived together and shared, or joined a community living arrangement, like a religious community. Even in my own generation, I don't think I've ever lived alone, and I wouldn't know too many people who do either. 

It strikes me as hard on the environment, wasteful of resources, solitary / not good for mental health, and possibly poor community outcome to house every single person individually.

I have no family here at all and have worked everyday of the 18 years I have been here
From circumstances outwith my control I’m a single parent

I’ve saved and saved and struggled to get a deposit but I have

Even though I have mortgage approval but can’t quite get a place I’m not sure living in a commune or religious sect is my next solution....... just yet

Franz Von Peppercorn

Sleeper12 wrote: »

Hello!!

This is how it has always been done. Ever hear of a starter home?

People now buy at average 36 34. That also explains why people want to live on their own and not share.

They buy once.

Also how many people in the past bought apartments?

If that were common we’d remember being born and growing up in an appartment before moving to a house. I don’t.

Edit:

34 not 36

https://www.irishtimes.com/business/economy/average-age-of-first-time-buyers-in-ireland-rises-to-34-1.2675430?mode=amp

Mrs OBumble

Sleeper12 wrote: »

That's wonderful that single people dream of owning a house but you can't expect affordable housing scheme to give the same breaks as couples. The way things usually work is you buy your apartment first & move into a bigger property as you need it. The scheme isn't designed to provide you with what you might need sometime in the future. It's designed to meet peoples needs in the present

So you can have kids, dogs, aging parents ... and not need stoage space, outdoor access or parking. But as soon as ypu get a live-in bed-buddy you do?

Pixel Eater

psinno wrote: »

How many houses a year did Dublin City Council build in the past, say in the 80s for example? Would you be happy if they did that level of building now? The number I see quoted in articles about this tender is 110,000 houses over a 10 year period. Were they building that much in the past?

Well in 1985 they build appox. 6,500. And it's not so much if I'd be happy with that amount, rather if that amount was enough for the demand at any particular time. I'd hazard a guess if they'd built around that number the last few years the housing crisis would be a lot less severe.

100,000 plus units over the next few years is a lot (if they do manage to come anywhere near that number) but the main issue I have is that the current social hosuing system is dysfunctional, with low rents, massive arrears and anti social behaviour. The systems needs to be reformed IMO.

Carlos Orange

Sleeper12 wrote: »

Hello!!

This is how it has always been done. Ever hear of a starter home?

Have you always been around? Pretty sure the concept of a starter home is a relatively recent one.

omb0wyn5ehpij9

Sleeper12 wrote: »

That's wonderful that single people dream of owning a house but you can't expect affordable housing scheme to give the same breaks as couples. The way things usually work is you buy your apartment first & move into a bigger property as you need it. The scheme isn't designed to provide you with what you might need sometime in the future. It's designed to meet peoples needs in the present

Sleeper12 wrote: »

Hello!!

This is how it has always been done. Ever hear of a starter home?

Wow, are we back to this line of thinking? Does anybody else not remember what has happened in the last 15-20 years?

Buy an apartment with all your money to get your foot on the "ladder" and then trade up to a bigger house when you have some equity as property prices only go one way :rolleyes:. I'm sure the people living a 90 minute drive from work in an apartment far too small for their family and in negative equity might have something to say about that...

ted1

Sleeper12 wrote: »

Hello!!

This is how it has always been done. Ever hear of a starter home?

And there’s thousands of people stuck in starter homes who can’t afford to move.

You better off going for a long term home

Sleeper12

Franz Von Peppercorn wrote: »

People now buy at average 36 34. That also explains why people want to live on their own and not share.

They buy once.

Also how many people in the past bought apartments?

If that were common we’d remember being born and growing up in an appartment before moving to a house. I don’t.

Edit:

34 not 36

https://www.irishtimes.com/business/economy/average-age-of-first-time-buyers-in-ireland-rises-to-34-1.2675430?mode=amp

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

So you can have kids, dogs, aging parents ... and not need stoage space, outdoor access or parking. But as soon as ypu get a live-in bed-buddy you do?

psinno wrote: »

Have you always been around? Pretty sure the concept of a starter home is a relatively recent one.

I bought a starter home in 1992 & I wasn't the first to buy one. They've been around a good 50 years or so


Affordable homes are to meet your requirements now, not sometime in the future. I wouldn't think it fair a single person getting the same leg up as a couple. A single person in a 3 bed house has more rooms to rent out & this would infact give them a bigger advantage over a couple.


Affordable homes have been around for decades in some form or another. A single person has never been treated the same as a couple nor should they. Single person = one person. Couple = two or more people. Obviously Two or more deserve a bigger leg up than one person.

Sleeper12

ted1 wrote:

You better off going for a long term home

Yes you can do that if you can afford it yourself. The state does not pay for homes too big for your present needs. Same with council house. They don't give a 4 bed to a couple with one child because they plan to have more children. There would be outcry if this were to happen

ted1

Sleeper12 wrote: »

I bought a starter home in 1992 & I wasn't the first to buy one. They've been around a good 50 years or so


Affordable homes are to meet your requirements now, not sometime in the future. I wouldn't think it fair a single person getting the same leg up as a couple. A single person in a 3 bed house has more rooms to rent out & this would infact give them a bigger advantage over a couple.


Affordable homes have been around for decades in some form or another. A single person has never been treated the same as a couple nor should they. Single person = one person. Couple = two or more people. Obviously Two or more deserve a bigger leg up than one person.

Do you think families in council homes should be turned out once a child flies the coup and a bedroom becomes empty

the_syco

Gavin shels wrote: »

€175,000 mortgage plus deposit & savings.... should be enough for a two bed apartment in Dublin, no?

Not unless it's in a sh|thole where the people getting the affordable home would never move to.

April 73 wrote: »

Someone on €50k who can get a mortgage for 3.5 times income plus deposit could afford a property at 200k.

50 * 3.5 = 175
And it's not 50. It's 50 minus tax. 50 after tax is €36,548.
36,548 * 3.5 = 127,918

Sleeper12 wrote: »

What would a single person be doing buying a house? Wouldn't an apartment be be more suitable & affordable?

A one bed apartment has nowhere to store anything.

Sleeper12 wrote: »

The way things usually work is you buy your apartment first & move into a bigger property as you need it.

Sounds like property ladder bullsh|t from the last boom. In reality, you buy an apartment, and you're stuck with it until it's paid off, as when you try to sell it it'll be worth less than it cost to buy it.

Sleeper12 wrote: »

Hello!!

This is how it has always been done. Ever hear of a starter home?

The 2000's wants their property ladder bullsh|t terms back.

Sleeper12 wrote: »

I bought a starter home in 1992

For what? €50k? Starter homes inside the M50 start off at €150k, right next to the Cottage Inn. Doubt any of the 2,000 people will want to live there, but it'll be a "starter home" for someone.

=-=

I wonder how many of the 2,000 houses will stay vacant because they're either built in the wrong area, or too far from mammy/school/local pub?

Apiarist

ted1 wrote: »

Do you think families in council homes should be turned out once a child flies the coup and a bedroom becomes empty

I would think that they should be offered an opportunity to move to a smaller house. I am sure some couples would accept this as the new location can be more suitable for them, or a smaller house / apartment could be a single-story so that they do not need to risk the stairs to go to a bathroom etc.

However, in practice, that would mean that the council forks out the cost of the refurbishment for two houses. Will that be cost effective?

Alkers

the_syco wrote:

50 * 3.5 = 175 And it's not 50. It's 50 minus tax. 50 after tax is

Wrong, 3.5*gross income

Alkers

Some of the thinking in this thread is mad!
To me it is perfectly acceptable that a single person on an average wage cannot buy a family home in our capital city. These people are prime candidates to be renting. Any assistance offered to help to buy, affordable housing etc should be offered to couples or families (including single parents) trying to buy properties suitable for their nerds. And I think it makes perfect sense that social housing should not be for like but should vary as the persons circumstances do e.g. children growing up etc

Carlos Orange

Sleeper12 wrote: »

I bought a starter home in 1992 & I wasn't the first to buy one. They've been around a good 50 years or so

Maybe 30 or 40 years but not 50 since my mum has said they didn't exist as a concept when she bought her house [circa 45 years ago]. We probably need a few more data points than 1992 and the mid 70s.

Franz Von Peppercorn

Sleeper12 wrote: »

I bought a starter home in 1992 & I wasn't the first to buy one. They've been around a good 50 years or so


Affordable homes are to meet your requirements now, not sometime in the future. I wouldn't think it fair a single person getting the same leg up as a couple. A single person in a 3 bed house has more rooms to rent out & this would infact give them a bigger advantage over a couple.


Affordable homes have been around for decades in some form or another. A single person has never been treated the same as a couple nor should they. Single person = one person. Couple = two or more people. Obviously Two or more deserve a bigger leg up than one person.

You missed my main point. The average age people buy at now is too old to buy a starter home. It doesn’t work. A decade later a mortgage would be hard to get. You also moved goal posts from apartments to houses.

Franz Von Peppercorn

Simona1986 wrote: »

Some of the thinking in this thread is mad!
To me it is perfectly acceptable that a single person on an average wage cannot buy a family home in our capital city. These people are prime candidates to be renting. Any assistance offered to help to buy, affordable housing etc should be offered to couples or families (including single parents) trying to buy properties suitable for their nerds. And I think it makes perfect sense that social housing should not be for like but should vary as the persons circumstances do e.g. children growing up etc

Nobody is saying that single people over 50k should get social housing but that housing in general should be cheaper.

50k is above average as it happens.

hots

the_syco wrote: »

Not unless it's in a sh|thole where the people getting the affordable home would never move to.


50 * 3.5 = 175
And it's not 50. It's 50 minus tax. 50 after tax is €36,548.
36,548 * 3.5 = 127,918

Not how it works.

A one bed apartment has nowhere to store anything.

Should there be no one beds anywhere so? They suit some people

Sounds like property ladder bullsh|t from the last boom. In reality, you buy an apartment, and you're stuck with it until it's paid off, as when you try to sell it it'll be worth less than it cost to buy it.

Not true

The 2000's wants their property ladder bullsh|t terms back.

The idea of buying multiple houses in a lifetime isn't that crazy, buy what you can afford now and upgrade if you need to?

Sleeper12

ted1 wrote:

Do you think families in council homes should be turned out once a child flies the coup and a bedroom becomes empty

A single person will never get a council house. They will only ever get a one bedroom apartment.

Sleeper12

Franz Von Peppercorn wrote:

You missed my main point. The average age people buy at now is too old to buy a starter home. It doesn’t work. A decade later a mortgage would be hard to get. You also moved goal posts from apartments to houses.

No you are missing the point.

The council, the government, the social welfare, charities etc do not give you things based on your future needs. Never have & never will. You will only ever get help based on your present needs. Anyone expecting otherwise will be sorely disappointed

the_syco

hots wrote: »

Should there be no one beds anywhere so? They suit some people

One bed apartments near Dublin city centre are usually very expensive when bought new, and are sold at a loss, as the market for one beds is very small. You have one bedroom that often only barely fits a double bed and a wardrobe, a kitchen-dining room, and very little storage. Most one beds that I looked at seemed to be an afterthought thrown together.

Further out, nearer to the M50, some look half decent for €150k.

hots wrote: »

The idea of buying multiple houses in a lifetime isn't that crazy, buy what you can afford now and upgrade if you need to?

Anyone I know that were able to "upgrade" their house to a new one were those that bought during 1995 and before. Most people just put an extension on their current house.