Can anybody give me some advice

shakeitoff

So I was out last night and while pre-drinking the girls who I am friends with(not very close but friends through friends and I know them years) were talking about who we were gonna meet in town. When they did this they start pairing up hypothetical matches 'Oh Ian you'd love Rachel'*naff names* but lmao, I didn't even feature in the conversation. I always feel like I'm just a background character, I'm friendly so you couldn't not like me but I don't really feature at all. I felt bad initially but working on myself to not be as sensitive so decided to just be present and enjoy the moment.

However, to add insult to injury, I helped one of their mutual friends home who we were drinking with, she was pretty drunk and we got cut off from group so I decided to stick with her. Turned out I had given my card to one of my mates so she kindly said she'd pay for taxi. I added her on FB and sent a message saying cheers and that I really want to get you back my half of the fare. She didn't reply or accept friend request lol. She seemed so nice though, if not attracted to me(shock!)

By advice I kind of just mean some words of encouragement for a pick me up. Sort of bummed. My confidence is pretty shot atm.

Wibbs

I'd not be too concerned over the FB thing anyway. It's not been long and some don't update their FB as much as others.

justincasey

Do you have a low opinion of your self as you talk about as your just there in the back round and your not surprised they dont fancy you. Maybe put your time in to some personal development ie sports studys or whatever your passionate about or intrested in. This is were your true personality may shine and meet like minded people. All that other stuff will fall in to place. Imo you have to like yourself before anyone else does..

Cyclepath

OP, you're not invisible, and if you don't feature in conversations with a certain group, then you may be in the wrong group. Don't waste your time with people that treat you like you're part of the furniture.

I've felt been in may situations where I felt like I was skirting around the edge of group and never quite felt like I was part of it all. In that case I just moved on until I found people that I could relate to.

Also, try not to seek validation from social media! It really is a dangerous way to measure your worth. The girl you helped home may be embarrassed or simply not interested, but the danger is in over-analysing it!

As justincasey advises above, try to find people that share your interests and passions!

OP, first off with group dynamics, if you allow others to take control, they will. You will be pushed more into the background as long as you allow it to happen. This is especially true when there are women as part of the group. Step forward and let them know your interest in such things, and that you wish to be considered. Likely, they never even thought to include you for <insert whatever reason>. Initially, they'll try to joke and dismiss your interest/intent (people don't like giving up control/influence)... but stick with it.

Secondly, regarding FB. FB or any social media is very hit & miss. If you liked the girl, contact her directly. It shows you as someone real. I have zero SM presence these days (apart from Whatsapp with my family), and I interact with people completely Old-school. It's far better. Less convenient, but that lack of convenience, has a lot of positives.

Last, take the initiative and don't simply respond/react to life. I'm not talking about any of this Alpha male BS. Simply step forward and take control over your life where it intersects with other people. Don't allow them to choose your state of being.

drunkmonkey

Don't give your cards to mates and don't lend them more than €50
Keep away from Facebook, delete it if you have the balls.
Don't poke, prod, tweet, text women, call them.
Don't be so sensitive.
Wear sunscreen.

shakeitoff

Good replies.

I'm fine with drink I think, like I was and stayed in a good mood and didn't really get too down. I'm such a weirdo tbh even when I was with girl I was hypothetically thinking how it was funny that the whole scenario was playing out like an Forever Alone meme. For the record, I had no real plans to get with this girl or anything, but it's only natural to think if she thinks you're attractive or whatever. She did ask me 'Had I 'been with' any of the group so I suppose she didn't see me as totally sexually invisible.

I was bullied relentlessly in primary school and for some reason it was girls especially who really honed in on me, lmao I still remember playing chasing in school and when I ran away from one girl and when she saw me she was like 'we're not going after you' BRUTAL. This experience in primary school combined with a lack of interest I've always just assumed girls don't like my energy or some ****.

BTW I should say that if I was to post a picture here I'm probably at worst 'above average' and perhaps even pretty attractive. It's this dichotomy between what I think I am and the reactions I'm met with IRL that I don't understand.

justincasey

Bully can have that prolonged effect on people and you can feed in to that negativite view of yourself . Have you ever considered talk therapy / counselling could be hughly beneficial.. good luck

shakeitoff

shakeitoff wrote: »

It's this dichotomy between what I think I am and the reactions I'm met with IRL that I don't understand.

Practice makes perfect. Seriously. You need to commit yourself to an outcome for things to change and for understanding to form.

Secondly, research. There are heaps of books, articles, lectures on social intercommunication for all manner of connections. Most are rubbish, but they all contain nuggets of truth which are useful for your own personality and preferred lifestyle. Just be aware that any real changes you make in your life will likely cost you "friends"... although TBF they're probably not as good of friends as your originally thought they were.

Lastly, be positive. Positive vibes attract people, and in turn, attract better outcomes. Learn to re-frame situations in an honest manner.

shakeitoff

I don't want to go off on a tangent but I'm going to do just that. If I was to analyse my personality I would say I am the definition of the lampooned 21st century male. I'm very passive, inoffensive, harmless. respectful. Probably why I was such a target back in primary school. I left primary and went to an all boys school and didn't really socialise with girls throughout my time there. As I hit 20, I fell in with a group of guys in my area that I sort of knew and blossomed of sorts. In the subsequent years, I've had a pretty social 20's a far cry from when, back in 2007, I actually wrote up on Boards about having no friends so I count myself lucky in that regard, but the penny never dropped with girls. I act the same with girls and lads but my personality just works better with guys. I've never really developed an amazing rapport with a girl. By convos are always just so matter of fact, you can I am someone who listens but at same time if there was an independent observer looking on it would probably sound as if I was an interviewer or interviewee. Cringeworthy tbh. I have very poor verbal IQ actually, my sentence structure is so stop start and I forget words easily. I can see people getting bored when I speak.

But the thing is, in my interactions let's say with that girl the other night, I just like being a friendly guy, I don't want to be some smooth talking cringeworthy player overcompensating in the bar. I want to be someone who gives off a happy, youthful and innocent vibe. I suppose that is what I have to reconcile and come to terms with. The person I am happy being won't necessarily be the one women will be in a rush to get with.

shakeitoff

shakeitoff wrote: »

I don't want to go off on a tangent but I'm going to do just that. If I was to analyse my personality I would say I am the definition of the lampooned 21st century male. I'm very passive, inoffensive, harmless. respectful. Probably why I was such a target back in primary school. I left primary and went to an all boys school and didn't really socialise with girls throughout my time there. As I hit 20, I fell in with a group of guys in my area that I sort of knew and blossomed of sorts. In the subsequent years, I've had a pretty social 20's a far cry from when, back in 2007, I actually wrote up on Boards about having no friends so I count myself lucky in that regard, but the penny never dropped with girls. I act the same with girls and lads but my personality just works better with guys. I've never really developed an amazing rapport with a girl.

But the thing is, in my interactions let's say with that girl the other night, I just like being a friendly guy, I don't want to be some smooth talking cringeworthy player overcompensating in the bar. I want to be someone who gives off a happy, youthful and innocent vibe. I suppose that is what I have to reconcile and come to terms with. The person I am happy being won't necessarily be the one women will be in a rush to get with.

Greatest advice I can give. Don't analyse your personality. It changes. It adapts. It evolves. It experiences through the lens that is life, and grows into something more. Analyzing your personality is like putting on handcuffs. It boxes you into phrases and terminology created for mass production, about things that are individualistic in nature. It's one of the biggest conflicts within Psychology. This need to generalise something that is particularly unique in all of us.

And yes, I have been analysed professionally. I've been told by three different psychologists that I am a borderline sociopath with psychopathic tendencies. Awesome! And what does that mean? Absolutely nothing. It means that they want you to have no personal direct influence over your personality. It's to put you into a category of someone elses creation and perception.

Personally, the biggest threat to humanity within the last thirty years is this belief that Psychology is so important to us all and is applicable. It's not. It's still an extremely fuzzy "science" with incredibly questionable research methods.

Think positive. Do positive things. Surround yourself with positive people. Cut away those who try to drag you down. The past is dead. It's finished. You can't change the past, but you can change what you remember of it. Don't allow the past to define you.

Move on, and enjoy your life. It's really not that difficult.

H3llR4iser

My guess is that you tried to contact her through FB as it's the only point of contact you have - as it often is nowadays, unless you're already on familiar of friendly terms with someone.

I assume you're pretty young OP - I don't claim to have solutions, less than anything "silver bullets", only experience - would you please humor me by reading this?

Point number 1 - group dynamics: they suck, period, especially at younger ages. Everybody with a bit of experience will tell you that, in mixed groups, there tend to be a few (often just one) "top guys" attracting the attentions of all the women in the group while everyone else might as well not be there. While it's the same the other way around (the "hot girl" with a swarm of dudes following her around), it's way more extreme and it can be downright upsetting - especially when you're subjected to ravings about how "great" this or that guy are.

Don't let it get to you, as it's something you will experience over and over in your social life; The trick is to join a group where your attitude, character and personality are valued - you'll notice you won't be sidelined nearly as much.

Point number 2 - Don't assume "interest" from attention: it's not spoken about very often but the truth is that women are as clueless about us as we are about them. They work on generalizations, assumptions and stereotypes as much as we do - therefore misinterpreting our intentions quite often and giving out mixed, cryptic although involuntary signals. In "popular culture", this often is seen as somewhat malicious or manipulative with the label of "friendzone" or similar - while there are some women who'd use smitten "friends" to their advantage, most of the times the whole situation arises from her not understanding his feelings and him misinterpreting her attentions. So this girl being nice to you on the way home is just that - her being nice; Don't sweat it, don't read too much into it. She doesn't reply? No problem, happens, which leads to...

Point Number 3 - Don't waste your energy hoping to get noticed: We've all been there at some point; Going the extra step, doing something we really didn't want to, going somewhere we didn't fancy and so on, just so that maybe she'd finally take notice of us. It won't work; She will be thankful, say nice things to you but it won't make her "fall" for you. It's a complete and total waste of time, energy and resources. If she's not interested in you romantically fine, it happens more often than not; nice meeting you, cut the ties and move on, in the long term it's the better choice. You won't be wasting energy, she won't be pointed out as the one "leading you on" and both will avoid a feelings minefield.

One last thing strikes me from your posts - why do you define yourself "weird"? The only reason coming to my mind is that some of these supposed "friends" describe you that way. If that's the case, even more reasons to walk away and find new acquaintances that are more in-tune with your personality.

RocketRaccoon

Is there any chance that maybe they could think you are gay and that's why they didn't "pair you off"?

LOL

Lorelli!

RocketRaccoon wrote: »

Is there any chance that maybe they could think you are gay and that's why they didn't "pair you off"?

I highly doubt it. The op said that he knows the girls for years.

shakeitoff

That's an interesting perspective on psychology and I can definitely see how pigeon holing yourself into these general overarching boxes would be to your detriment, almost like forcing you to act in that way and conforming to the behaviour of that personality type.

You're right about being positive, I become quite self-indulgent after I 'take to the field' and have my worst fears and preconceptions come to pass. Perhaps the girl just wasn't comfortable asking some randomer that she knows through mutual friends to get her money back. She probably didn't mind that much or at least wasn't bothered enough to go to the effort of exchanging bank details and stuff with a rando and rather than getting into it, just left the message on read and left it at that. It's a kind of awkward message to reply back to I guess to someone you don't know. Writing to her seemed like the right thing to do in the moment though. Sometimes I can be a bit too familiar too quickly. *She did actually accept my friend request in the end*

I'm actually not young relatively speaking but the group dynamics are pretty much as they were. TBH, there isn't actually that much fawning over the good looking guys, maybe when they were younger but I didn't become friends with them until after 21. If anything, it's the guys with the gregarious loud personality that they're drawn to but tbf, they all know these guys way longer than me.

You're right about the assuming attention. Because I think I am better looking than I am, I just assume that by being a nice non-arrogant friendly guy that girls will automatically crush on me. I lived for so long without any conversations with girls that I built up this idea that as long as I got into a position to chat to a girl and for her to see my smile, nice eyes, good nature etc. she would instantly like me. It's actually a huge flaw I have. It's innocent, I just want to be liked and desired but I definitely have an presumption of implied attraction. So that girl not writing back was as much a blow to my ego as anything. Sometimes I ask how sincere am I!

There is a chance they think I'm gay tbh hahah.

Well... I would say... never ever assume you know what someone is thinking or feeling at any given moment. You really have no idea, so don't make **** up to justify passions (positive or negative) in your own mind. It's not worth it. 9 times out of 10 you will be wrong, and that 1 time you are right, you'll be inaccurate.

Any time you want to know what someone is thinking. Ask. Oddly enough, it's something that few people actually do, as if there's some unspoken rule against it, and yet, it's that degree of honesty that helps me enormously with dating.

As for age... most of my friends are younger than me. It's always been that way for me. I have few friends my own age since I had so little in common with them. My mother says my life learning is ten years behind everyone else. and shes kinda right. So, while I was in my 30's most of my friends were in their 20s and still more experienced than I was at dating. Go figure. (if you want to know more, just do a few searches on this forum section where I go into a good bit of detail).

All I can say is... don't sweat it. haha. It's really not as difficult as we make it out to be. We create so many obstacles to our own success and happiness. Life gets much easier once you throw out the bull**** and just start living.

Lorelli!

Ok so you're a bit down about that girl. You were nice, you helped her home and you contacted her to repay for the fare.

She could have responded but she didn't. It's no big deal. You didn't do anything wrong.

You might be looking into other things too deeply cause your ego is a little bit bruised after she didn't reply but it will pass.

shakeitoff

TBF, I'm so used to penning my frustrations that this is just routine therapy for myself. I actually came back pretty well from it all things considered. In the past, like 3 or 4 years ago, I would have descended into a 3 day rut.

I sound a bit like you Klaz, I'm fine now, I'm well-rounded enough and can engage in a lot of diverse environments with different types of people but I needed to drop back a bit and befriend people who were more in line with my life experience so a lot of my friends are 2/3 years younger.

You're right I just have to get over it and dust myself down. Don't get too caught up in these things. If you live a good life and are true to yourself that's all ya can do.

I actually mean to make this thread a bit more general about guys who don't conform to typical male traits but I see there's been a lot of JBPesque discussion here and it wasn't really needed.

TBF you don't even know if the girl checked her facebook and rejected you. Talk to your friends, get her details, and ask her out for coffee. See what happens. Don't create the story before it actually happens.

Doffer

I think Klaz gave solid advice. Do not go down the self analysis route - only ends up supporting any negative assumptions you may have. Also in one of your earlier posts you said "I just like being a friendly guy, I don't want to be some smooth talking cringeworthy player" . I think there is a wider approach you could take , which is why not continue to be the friendly guy, but also one who actually says what they would like and not let it up for interpretation.