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World Cup Bolters

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    #32
    Squidgy Black
    Registered Users Posts: 21,605 ✭✭✭✭Squidgy Black


    Dubinusa wrote: »
    O Halloran may be in with a shout if Connacht perform well. Matt Healy too! I think Ruddock will be thereabouts also.

    They're all capped players though.

    Thread is talking about non-capped.


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    #33
    hype101
    Registered Users Posts: 199 ✭✭hype101


    Jean Kleyn?


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    #34
    shaungil
    Registered Users Posts: 1,014 ✭✭✭shaungil


    Ciaran Frawley. Should get some good gametime as Byrne and Sexton are resed and with Lancsater and Dr Contemponi developing his game he can cover 10 12 and 15.


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    #35
    sioda
    Registered Users Posts: 4,453 ✭✭✭sioda


    hype101 wrote: »
    Jean Kleyn?

    I have this awful fear of Rassie offering him and Cloete the chance to play for ZA


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    #36
    Dubinusa
    Registered Users Posts: 8,129 ✭✭✭Dubinusa


    Thornbury?? Obviously a very long shot.


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    #37
    The Lost Sheep
    Registered Users Posts: 14,967 ✭✭✭✭The Lost Sheep


    Dubinusa wrote: »
    Thornbury?? Obviously a very long shot.
    No chance. Will he play enough with Connacht this season to try force a shot at squad as im not sure.


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    #38
    bilston
    Registered Users Posts: 17,742 ✭✭✭✭bilston


    sioda wrote: »
    hype101 wrote: »
    Jean Kleyn?

    I have this awful fear of Rassie offering him and Cloete the chance to play for ZA

    Well they are South African so fair play of it happens.


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    #39
    stephen_n
    Registered Users Posts: 12,920 ✭✭✭✭stephen_n


    Squidgy Black wrote: »
    They're all capped players though.

    Thread is talking about non-capped.

    Don’t think it’s about non capped, we already have a fairly strong idea what the squad will be. Bolters could easily have caps but are currently not in the obvious choices. I’d say Cooney is an example of a bolter at this point, even though he was on the tour this summer.


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    #40
    jm08
    Registered Users Posts: 11,296 ✭✭✭✭jm08


    sioda wrote: »
    I have this awful fear of Rassie offering him and Cloete the chance to play for ZA

    With the political situation in SA, there won't be many Saffers going back to SA without first having being resident long enough in Europe (or anywhere else) to acquire citizenship if they get the opportunity.


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    #41
    Faugheen
    Site Banned Posts: 12,341 ✭✭✭✭Faugheen


    Ruddock was arguably one of the first names on the team sheet at the autumn internationals last year. If he stays healthy he absolutely has to go. It is a big if, though.


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    #42
    sydthebeat
    Subscribers Posts: 40,983 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat


    Faugheen wrote: »
    Ruddock was arguably one of the first names on the team sheet at the autumn internationals last year. If he stays healthy he absolutely has to go. It is a big if, though.

    A guy that's captained Ireland is hardly going to be a world cup bolter


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    #43
    Clegg
    Registered Users Posts: 16,669 ✭✭✭✭Clegg


    sioda wrote: »
    hype101 wrote: »
    Jean Kleyn?

    I have this awful fear of Rassie offering him and Cloete the chance to play for ZA
    That wouldn't be a problem at all.

    We already have plenty of better players than Kleyn or Cloete.


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    #44
    Dubinusa
    Registered Users Posts: 8,129 ✭✭✭Dubinusa


    S,A is a mess. You can't fault guys for leaving, although I hate to see them capped for other nations.
    It's weird to think that they are not progressing and they may be going backwards.
    Another bolter, Delahunt?


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    #45
    Faugheen
    Site Banned Posts: 12,341 ✭✭✭✭Faugheen


    sydthebeat wrote: »
    Faugheen wrote: »
    Ruddock was arguably one of the first names on the team sheet at the autumn internationals last year. If he stays healthy he absolutely has to go. It is a big if, though.

    A guy that's captained Ireland is hardly going to be a world cup bolter

    I wasn't the person who brought his name into the conversation...


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    #46
    sydthebeat
    Subscribers Posts: 40,983 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat


    Faugheen wrote: »
    I wasn't the person who brought his name into the conversation...

    Fair point,
    You just happened to be the last post before me :)


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    #47
    Jump_In_Jack
    Registered Users Posts: 3,609 ✭✭✭Jump_In_Jack


    stephen_n wrote: »
    Don’t think it’s about non capped, we already have a fairly strong idea what the squad will be. Bolters could easily have caps but are currently not in the obvious choices. I’d say Cooney is an example of a bolter at this point, even though he was on the tour this summer.

    You might just take a read of the opening post, it explicitly says uncapped players only.


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    #48
    stephen_n
    Registered Users Posts: 12,920 ✭✭✭✭stephen_n


    Jump_In_Jack wrote: »
    You might just take a read of the opening post, it explicitly says uncapped players only.

    Mea culpa, missed that. In which case no one then, there’s no way an uncapped player is going to make it into the squad at this stage.


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    #49
    Shefwedfan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    Im surprised he hasn't been mentioned and always has to be included in every thread

    Zebo :-)


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    #50
    Scythica
    Registered Users Posts: 961 ✭✭✭Scythica


    Shefwedfan wrote: »
    Im surprised he hasn't been mentioned and always has to be included in every thread

    Zebo :-)
    Dave K will take his place so no need to mention it! ;)


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    #51
    padser
    Registered Users Posts: 2,375 ✭✭✭padser


    stephen_n wrote: »
    Mea culpa, missed that. In which case no one then, there’s no way an uncapped player is going to make it into the squad at this stage.

    James Ryan was uncapped this time last year.

    Conor Murray was uncapped at this stage of the world cup cycle two cycles ago.

    Drico was uncapped 13 months before his hat trick in Paris.

    I'd say there is a slightly less than 50 - 50 chance that someone emerges next season who makes the extended squad - certainly not "no way"


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    #52
    Former Former
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,728 ✭✭✭Former Former


    stephen_n wrote: »
    Mea culpa, missed that. In which case no one then, there’s no way an uncapped player is going to make it into the squad at this stage.

    We don't have a third choice out half who has been capped. One of Byrne, Bleyendaal, McPhillips or Burns will have to be in the conversation at least.

    After that, I don't think anyone else will force their way in.


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    #53
    Shefwedfan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    Former Former wrote: »
    We don't have a third choice out half who has been capped. One of Byrne, Bleyendaal, McPhillips or Burns will have to be in the conversation at least.

    After that, I don't think anyone else will force their way in.


    Byrne will be the bolter


    He is very similar to Sexton and it makes sense to move him to back up. He also gets to play week in week out with the Irish centre partnership.



    Unless Ireland figure out how to play with Carberry they will need to bring Byrne in. PLaying a Sexton gameplan with Carberry at 10 will not work.


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    #54
    stephen_n
    Registered Users Posts: 12,920 ✭✭✭✭stephen_n


    padser wrote: »
    James Ryan was uncapped this time last year.

    Conor Murray was uncapped at this stage of the world cup cycle two cycles ago.

    Drico was uncapped 13 months before his hat trick in Paris.

    I'd say there is a slightly less than 50 - 50 chance that someone emerges next season who makes the extended squad - certainly not "no way"

    James Ryan is a once in a generation player though. I think if Porter and Larmour were only breaking through this season they wouldn’t get the opportunities they did. We have built depth now in every position except 10. I don’t see many chances for players outside the expected squad in the next 12-14 months. The AI’s will be the last chance for experimentation and I can’t think of any as yet uncapped player who will come in then?
    Former Former wrote: »
    We don't have a third choice out half who has been capped. One of Byrne, Bleyendaal, McPhillips or Burns will have to be in the conversation at least.

    After that, I don't think anyone else will force their way in.

    I think at this stage it would have to be someone who has been in camps though, there is usually a long lead up with Joe before a first cap. Yes 10 is definitely an open one, though maybe we will go with 2 1/2 tens this time and bring Cooney.


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    #55
    Buer
    Registered Users Posts: 24,176 ✭✭✭✭Buer


    If someone sorts out their goal kicking to a high standard this side of the RWC, I reckon they'll get the nod. No sign of that happening any time soon with either Byrne or Carbery though based on what we've seen to date despite reports of them working overtime on it.


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    #56
    AbusesToilets
    Registered Users Posts: 9,957 ✭✭✭AbusesToilets


    Buer wrote: »
    If someone sorts out their goal kicking to a high standard this side of the RWC, I reckon they'll get the nod. No sign of that happening any time soon with either Byrne or Carbery though based on what we've seen to date despite reports of them working overtime on it.

    RingTone should be trusted to develop his kicking game, madness to just toss that aside. We've seen already this past season how valuable it is having Murray being able to kick to a high level. Similar to how handy McFadden was in that regard a few years back.


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    #57
    padser
    Registered Users Posts: 2,375 ✭✭✭padser


    stephen_n wrote: »
    James Ryan is a once in a generation player though. I think if Porter and Larmour were only breaking through this season they wouldn’t get the opportunities they did. We have built depth now in every position except 10. I don’t see many chances for players outside the expected squad in the next 12-14 months. The AI’s will be the last chance for experimentation and I can’t think of any as yet uncapped player who will come in then?

    Agreed that Ryan (and indeed the other two I mentioned) are once or twice generation players (say coming along once every 5 to 10 years) but also all of them went from uncapped to nailed on starter inside 13 months.

    All someone has to do is go from uncapped to 3rd choice in their position to get into the squad.....

    In general I agree, we will likely bring a third out half (as yet uncapped) assuming Joe isn't allowed to select Paddy Jackson.

    I also think there is space for someone to emerge for a backup back 3 player and possibly on midfield.

    Also, on back, there is every possibility of 3 injuries in the back row meaning an 8th choice backrow could travel...


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    #58
    Buer
    Registered Users Posts: 24,176 ✭✭✭✭Buer


    AbusesToilets wrote: »
    RingTone should be trusted to develop his kicking game, madness to just toss that aside. We've seen already this past season how valuable it is having Murray being able to kick to a high level. Similar to how handy McFadden was in that regard a few years back.

    Murray isn't really kicking to a particularly high level. I'd wager his success rate for Munster/Ireland is pretty low even allowing for the fact that many are from further out. I recall he missed one against Leicester before attempting three against Racing and only slotting the last (he had the distance on all of them). Then he also shovelled a penalty against Australia which dropped wide from the 10m line. It's a great weapon to have but only if the kicker has a good chance of nailing the kick.

    Whilst Ringrose was prolific in schools rugby, if he hasn't been kicking for several years, I would imagine he'll struggle to ever be a useful option at test level. It's something we should keep practicing in Ireland and utilise but I don't think guys like Ringrose or Luke McGrath are going to be options at this stage unless they're handed kicking duties regularly for their province to get back into the swing of it which isn't going to happen.

    I'd love to see other players/positions used for the kicking duties to let the outhalf focus on his core duties but I don't see it happening unless we have a player who is kicking regularly throughout his career. Even now, I would see it as highly unlikely for McFadden to take over kicking duties for Leinster unless they were badly stuck given his lack of kicking in recent seasons.


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    #59
    Dubinusa
    Registered Users Posts: 8,129 ✭✭✭Dubinusa


    Get Furlong up to speed on the kicking game!!! Well, he's top notch at everything else lol.
    Dave Kearney is down the pecking order for Leinster. I don't think there's any chance he makes it, barring mass injuries.


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    #60
    Shefwedfan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    Dubinusa wrote: »
    Get Furlong up to speed on the kicking game!!! Well, he's top notch at everything else lol.
    Dave Kearney is down the pecking order for Leinster. I don't think there's any chance he makes it, barring mass injuries.



    So was Healy last season :P



    D Kearney should get a few games at start of season and if he is in form he could keep his place the same Healy did.....the challange is to him now....


    Would be great to see him back playing regular....


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    #61
    Clegg
    Registered Users Posts: 16,669 ✭✭✭✭Clegg


    Think Kearney is well down the pecking order now. Can't see him making Leinster's best 23 never mind Ireland's.


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