Where is the big IT money (Internationally) ?

Fr Tod Umptious

I'm an IT professional, 25 years experience.
I staryed off testing and have in the last 10 years moved into operations/support/sys admin type roles.
The plan is to get Cisco certification in the next few years and become specialised in networks.

Right now I work in rural Ireland in a steady IT job that does not pay that well, but are fully supporting me when in comes to training and upskilling etc.

I have a mortgage and a family to support so I can't just up sticks and move to the city at this time.

The plan is to get specialised in networks and in the future once the kids are a bit older go off get some high paying contracts to help with the kids college expenses and try get the mortgage down.

Now the question is, where are the really good paying IT jobs in this world ?

Europe ?
Dubai etc ?
Asia ?

Are there any developing markets that one should be looking at ?

Or are the contract jobs in places like Dublin just as good as what is elsewhere ?

retalivity

Dublin and london are prob higher than anywhere else in europe imo. Dubai had the whole tax free element to it so would probably be higher net salary than both. The crazy money is still in america though, i work with a few contractors in seattle, they are on serious wedges over and above dublin rates.

Edit: im in analytics, not networking

the whole year inn

retalivity wrote: »

Dublin and london are prob higher than anywhere else in europe imo. Dubai had the whole tax free element to it so would probably be higher net salary than both. The crazy money is still in america though, i work with a few contractors in seattle, they are on serious wedges over and above dublin rates.

Edit: im in analytics, not networking

You lucky enough to have a visa for that?

retalivity

the whole year inn wrote: »

You lucky enough to have a visa for that?

Nope, im in dublin. Some of these guys are indian though, were initially sponsored, then went off on their own. Not sure how that all works myself...

Think the tax rules around contracting in the us are more relaxed as well, meaning a greater takehome pay. The uk also has stuff like ISA's etc that allows you to lower your tax obligations

OMM 0000

I'm in HK. Lots of high paying IT jobs here and Singapore. They just don't have the talent here.

I can put you in touch with an Irish guy who does networking type stuff in various Asian countries.

Fr Tod Umptious

retalivity wrote: »

Dublin and london are prob higher than anywhere else in europe imo. Dubai had the whole tax free element to it so would probably be higher net salary than both. The crazy money is still in america though, i work with a few contractors in seattle, they are on serious wedges over and above dublin rates.

Edit: im in analytics, not networking

Already did the US thing early in my career, certainly great money there but I was happier raising a family in Ireland so I came back.

A H1B requires you to be employed by someone rather than a independent contractor in the purest sense, but even then the money is very good.

Fr Tod Umptious

OMM 0000 wrote: »

I'm in HK. Lots of high paying IT jobs here and Singapore. They just don't have the talent here.

I can put you in touch with an Irish guy who does networking type stuff in various Asian countries.

I'm a few years away being able to do this but I'll keep thise places in mind for sure.

Stheno

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

I'm a few years away being able to do this but I'll keep thise places in mind for sure.

what sort of salary are you targeting?

OU812

Automation seems to be quite lucrative. Currently know a couple of guys doing automation QA & testing and they’re taking home between €600 & €800 a day

theteal

While you're getting your cisco certs you may want to knuckle down on your programming too. It's all automation now. Very few network engineer jobs now are advertised without something like python also mentioned.

OMM 0000

OU812 wrote: »

Automation seems to be quite lucrative. Currently know a couple of guys doing automation QA & testing and they’re taking home between €600 & €800 a day

Software testing automation is an excellent route to go down.

Hardly anyone can do it, you're paid really well, and most importantly, you're left alone to do your thing...

retalivity

OMM 0000 wrote: »

I'm in HK. Lots of high paying IT jobs here and Singapore. They just don't have the talent here.

I can put you in touch with an Irish guy who does networking type stuff in various Asian countries.

I would be interested to find out more about this as well....

richy

Hey! I saw this thread and it inspired me to post my own threat in this forum. Didnt wanna hijack this thread with my questions. Would appreciate it if ye could check it out. Its titled "reskill to IT". Thanks

Fr Tod Umptious

Stheno wrote: »

what sort of salary are you targeting?

I honestly don't know

It's not something that's going to happen in the near future, it's a few years away before I get the chance to do this
(by the time I get certification, real world experience, kids get a bit older etc) so I have not thought about the salary.

As I said I'm years in the IT business but I never specialised in anything, I think that if I can specalise (in networks) then my chances of getting a better paid job down the lineare greater.

Tom Dunne

richy wrote: »

Hey! I saw this thread and it inspired me to post my own threat in this forum

:eek:

corcaigh1

OMM 0000 wrote: »

I'm in HK. Lots of high paying IT jobs here and Singapore. They just don't have the talent here.

I can put you in touch with an Irish guy who does networking type stuff in various Asian countries.

No talented chinese?

micosoft

theteal wrote: »

While you're getting your cisco certs you may want to knuckle down on your programming too. It's all automation now. Very few network engineer jobs now are advertised without something like python also mentioned.

Everything is moving to Software including Networking...
TBH unless you are working in Telco or DC there will be no money in Networking. Like every other admin job it is being quickly automated and moved to (Cloud) software. Majority of Businesses can use Cisco Meraki which does not need any certifications or understanding of IOS.

Personally if I were not working for a Telco or a big cloud player I'd be getting out of Networking. In a world of DevOp's and software networking there just isn't much need for Cisco Certified folk and pay will be static.

Best route for you is CyberSecurity and get your Security Certification along with a good Data Protection qualification as a combo. That will get you global consulting opportunities and significantly increase earning rights. Probably best to contract as well.

OMM 0000

corcaigh1 wrote: »

No talented chinese?

Not really.

The problem is their education system is entirely memorisation, so they are extremely weak at independent thinking / critical thought.

I've been a manager (IT stuff) in China for a long time, and it is extraordinarily painful watching Chinese programmers just copy and paste code.

You'll notice a lot of software teams in China hire foreigners...

That's not to say there aren't great people in China, but they're rare. Generally the good people leave.

An interesting question you can ask yourself:

China has the largest population in the world, and the second largest economy. You can probably think of some big Chinese companies - Huawei
(Cisco clone), Taobao (eBay + Amazon clone), Xiaomi (Apple clone), Lenovo (IBM's laptop division)... but can you think of one innovative company/product?

EDIT: I'm talking about mainland China. Hong Kong is a lot better, but there's still a lack of talent due to everyone wanting to get into banking.

dodgystats

OMM 0000 wrote: »

I'm in HK. Lots of high paying IT jobs here and Singapore. They just don't have the talent here.

I can put you in touch with an Irish guy who does networking type stuff in various Asian countries.

Could you PM me the details of this guy?
Thanks

gctest50

OMM 0000 wrote: »

...............

An interesting question you can ask yourself:

China has the largest population in the world, and the second largest economy. You can probably think of some big Chinese companies - Huawei
(Cisco clone), Taobao (eBay + Amazon clone), Xiaomi (Apple clone), Lenovo (IBM's laptop division)... but can you think of one innovative company/product?

OMM 0000 wrote: »

.
but can you think of one innovative company/product?

OMM 0000 wrote: »

. Huawei (Cisco clone)

Cisco was stolen, design and code :

Despite founding Cisco in 1984, Bosack, along with Kirk Lougheed, continued to work at Stanford on Cisco's first product. It consisted of exact replicas of Stanford's "Blue Box" router and a stolen copy of the University's multiple-protocol router software.

OMM 0000 wrote: »

Xiaomi (Apple clone)

Apple ? bsd with emphasis on spinning beachballs etc for those who like that sort of thing

Fr Tod Umptious

micosoft wrote: »

Everything is moving to Software including Networking...
TBH unless you are working in Telco or DC there will be no money in Networking. Like every other admin job it is being quickly automated and moved to (Cloud) software. Majority of Businesses can use Cisco Meraki which does not need any certifications or understanding of IOS.

Personally if I were not working for a Telco or a big cloud player I'd be getting out of Networking. In a world of DevOp's and software networking there just isn't much need for Cisco Certified folk and pay will be static.

Best route for you is CyberSecurity and get your Security Certification along with a good Data Protection qualification as a combo. That will get you global consulting opportunities and significantly increase earning rights. Probably best to contract as well.

Certainly and area I'm interested in continuing into.

corcaigh1

OMM 0000 wrote: »

Not really.

The problem is their education system is entirely memorisation, so they are extremely weak at independent thinking / critical thought.

I've been a manager (IT stuff) in China for a long time, and it is extraordinarily painful watching Chinese programmers just copy and paste code.

You'll notice a lot of software teams in China hire foreigners...

That's not to say there aren't great people in China, but they're rare. Generally the good people leave.

An interesting question you can ask yourself:

China has the largest population in the world, and the second largest economy. You can probably think of some big Chinese companies - Huawei
(Cisco clone), Taobao (eBay + Amazon clone), Xiaomi (Apple clone), Lenovo (IBM's laptop division)... but can you think of one innovative company/product?

EDIT: I'm talking about mainland China. Hong Kong is a lot better, but there's still a lack of talent due to everyone wanting to get into banking.

Wow! Always thought of the chinese as gifted programmers. Very interesting. Great point on chinese tech companies actually, never thought of that...


Though one could look at Jack Ma's education history and how successful he has become growing Alibaba!

OMM 0000

corcaigh1 wrote: »

Wow! Always thought of the chinese as gifted programmers. Very interesting. Great point on chinese tech companies actually, never thought of that...

Though one could look at Jack Ma's education history and how successful he has become growing Alibaba!

The Chinese business environment is a bit strange.

Basically you need a thing called "guanxi" (gwon-see) which means "relationships".

Jack Ma has had a lot of government help. His relationship with the government has meant he could be the only player in the market for a long time. Don't get me wrong, he has done a great job, but he had a huge amount of government "help".

I'll give a specific example based on my own experience:

A friend of mine worked for a company which arranged visas for Chinese people. Think "shady oversees investment visas". The kind of thing Ireland recently launched. She would spend a lot of time give "hongbao" (hong-bow like wow) which means bribes to officials. In return no other visa offices opened in the area.

seannash

OMM 0000 wrote: »

An interesting question you can ask yourself:

China has the largest population in the world, and the second largest economy. You can probably think of some big Chinese companies - Huawei
(Cisco clone), Taobao (eBay + Amazon clone), Xiaomi (Apple clone), Lenovo (IBM's laptop division)... but can you think of one innovative company/product?

I'd say that your wrong about non innovative companies.
Huawei are way ahead of apple in terms of innovations. They're cameras on their phones are miles ahead of apple as well as there new GPU boosting software. Also Xiamoi came out with the first full screen phone long before apple and Oppo have come out with an new phone with a revolutionary design.
If anything its apple that's lagging behind


https://www.gsmarena.com/oppo_find_x_hands_on-review-1782.php
https://wccftech.com/huawei-gpu-turbo-explained/

OMM 0000

seannash wrote: »

I'd say that your wrong about non innovative companies.
Huawei are way ahead of apple in terms of innovations. They're cameras on their phones are miles ahead of apple as well as there new GPU boosting software. Also Xiamoi came out with the first full screen phone long before apple and Oppo have come out with an new phone with a revolutionary design.
If anything its apple that's lagging behind

https://www.gsmarena.com/oppo_find_x_hands_on-review-1782.php
https://wccftech.com/huawei-gpu-turbo-explained/

I don't agree Xiaomi and Oppo are innovative. I can accept they are nimble though.

If you truly believe China have innovative companies, you should be able to name a bunch of truly innovative products. (I don't believe putting a large screen on a phone counts as truly innovative).

For example, the US invented the Internet, digital photography, etc.

beauf

seannash wrote: »

I'd say that your wrong about non innovative companies.
Huawei are way ahead of apple in terms of innovations. They're cameras on their phones are miles ahead of apple as well as there new GPU boosting software. Also Xiamoi came out with the first full screen phone long before apple and Oppo have come out with an new phone with a revolutionary design.
If anything its apple that's lagging behind


https://www.gsmarena.com/oppo_find_x_hands_on-review-1782.php
https://wccftech.com/huawei-gpu-turbo-explained/

Poor examples.

I don't think a gimmick of the pop up camera is innovative. The industry moved away from physical mechanisms (and buttons) for good reason.

And using the GPU for hardware acceleration is not innovative. Not even in mobile.

seannash

beauf wrote: »

Poor examples.

I don't think a gimmick of the pop up camera is innovative. The industry moved away from physical mechanisms (and buttons) for good reason.

And using the GPU for hardware acceleration is not innovative. Not even in mobile.

How innovative can you be in an established form already though

How are laptop and computer manufacturers innovative. The form is the same
I take your point though
I guess dji is another one.

Small point: I dont think the pop up camera is a gimmick. Its more a response to the market wanting full screen phones with next to zero bezels

beauf

As soon as you pop up the camera you have a bezel.
Also you need it to unlock the phone, and its adds delay.
Mechanical stuff breaks. Which is why they've largely moved away from it.
Though its handy for something like a camera button, or music playback.

How about having more than one speaker on the phone perhaps on both sides so its not blocked when it put down, or in a pocket.
Nokia's 41MP camera. Xenon Flash. Motorola Moto Mods, 41MP, yotaphone with a 2nd black and white screen, 120Hz screens, Nokia Glance screen.

I think the pop up camera is a response to the stupid notch. But the solution is just put it in the bezel. Get over the size of the bezel.

seannash

beauf wrote: »

As soon as you pop up the camera you have a bezel.
Also you need it to unlock the phone, and its adds delay.
Mechanical stuff breaks. Which is why they've largely moved away from it.
Though its handy for something like a camera button, or music playback.

How about having more than one speaker on the phone perhaps on both sides so its not blocked when it put down, or in a pocket.
Nokia's 41MP camera. Xenon Flash. Motorola Moto Mods, 41MP, yotaphone with a 2nd black and white screen, 120Hz screens, Nokia Glance screen.

I think the pop up camera is a response to the stupid notch. But the solution is just put it in the bezel. Get over the size of the bezel.

I dont really get your point that when you have the camera pop up you have a bezel. The camera only pops up when you want to take a selfie, for the rest of the time its practically bezeless.
In terms of the camera and the examples you cite which i assume is in reference to Huawei's camera tech. Huawei have combined 3 cameras on their newest model to give it very detailed low light pictures as well as normal pictures. Also prior to that they had a dual leicia branded cameras to achieve a more detailed picture. These cameras have been stacked up against each other and reviewed and its gernerally acknowleged that Huawei has the better one.
The pixel count isn't the be all and end all.



I understand you dont care about bezels but consumers do and as such they have found a way to offer them what they want without sacrificing a selfie camera on the front of the screen. Speakers being blocked must not matter to all consumers either otherwise they would cater to them.



Anyway I take your point but I find it hard to believe chinese tech companies aren't innovative. Apologies for derailing the thread

beauf

seannash wrote: »

....
The pixel count isn't the be all and end all....

The point of the 41mp camera is the not the pixel count. It was about resampling, cropping, lossless zoom, it also had OIS, Xenon, BIS and massive sensor for a phone.

This article is a bit bias, but for an old obsolete phone its still impressive camera.

http://allaboutwindowsphone.com/features/item/22979_Cross-generational_shootout_10.php

seannash wrote: »

...I understand you dont care about bezels but consumers do and as such they have found a way to offer them what they want without sacrificing a selfie camera on the front of the screen. Speakers being blocked must not matter to all consumers either otherwise they would cater to them....

Well they do some phones offer speakers on both front and back, or the sides for this reason.

I think the pop up is a fad that will die out.

Apologies for going off topic. But I think a lot of true innovation is missed and gimmicks get blown way out of proportions by today's media, and fixation on trivial nonsense by the social media obsessed. Tech companies pander to it. Rather than innovate as its an easy win.

beauf

OMM 0000 wrote: »

Not really.

The problem is their education system is entirely memorisation, so they are extremely weak at independent thinking / critical thought. ....

That's an interesting insight.

The job market is hard to predict at the moment.

lawred2

OU812 wrote: »

Automation seems to be quite lucrative. Currently know a couple of guys doing automation QA & testing and they’re taking home between €600 & €800 a day

oh rly?

that's very interesting

wherabouts and who with? I'd be a principal automation engineer and I ain't coining that...

OU812

lawred2 wrote: »

oh rly?

that's very interesting

wherabouts and who with? I'd be a principal automation engineer and I ain't coining that...

All of them work in aviation. (Which generally carries a small premium)