Rosslare Downgrade.

kneemos

Irish Ferries are cancelling their winter service to France from Rosslare in favour of Dublin apparently.
Haven't been in it for decades,sounds like it's been totally neglected.

http://wexfordtoday.com/2018/07/04/strong-public-support-for-rosslare-europort/

Video at end of article.

Marhay70

We have two FG "ministers" in this constituency, neither of whom is sure of retaining their seat at the next election, justifiably IMO. Maybe questions should be asked of them. Howlin too,seems to have rediscovered Socialism since Labour was given a caning in 2016, and could probably do with a cause to embrace.
It's time these guys earned their privileged existence rather than being given a free ride just because of who their family are.

kneemos

http://wexfordtoday.com/2018/07/05/politicians-blamed-for-crazy-situation-at-rosslare/

vicwatson

Marhay70 wrote: »

We have two FG "ministers" in this constituency, neither of whom is sure of retaining their seat at the next election, justifiably IMO. Maybe questions should be asked of them. Howlin too,seems to have rediscovered Socialism since Labour was given a caning in 2016, and could probably do with a cause to embrace.
It's time these guys earned their privileged existence rather than being given a free ride just because of who their family are.

Wexford has been served very very poorly by its “representatives” imo, none of them give a crap about the county

St Senan

vicwatson wrote: »

Wexford has been served very very poorly by its “representatives” imo, none of them give a crap about the county

I completely agree with you there. In my long time of voting no matter what party they represented i cant say that any TD in Wexford has done much, Especially in the Enniscorthy district. love them or hate them but Wexford could have done with the likes of the Healey Rae brothers.

Marhay70

Navarre wrote: »

I completely agree with you there. In my long time of voting no matter what party they represented i cant say that any TD in Wexford has done much, Especially in the Enniscorthy district. love them or hate them but Wexford could have done with the likes of the Healey Rae brothers.

And it will continue in the same vein until such times as people wake up to the fact these people serve vested interests and not the public interest. Local democracy has been whittled away until it is virtually irrelevant, Council chambers are reduced to talking shops with all decision making done by faceless, unelected Civil and Public Servants (a misnomer if ever there was one), who are accountable to no one. The evidence is there for all to see in the state of our roads, parks, and public services in general.
Rosslare Europort is just the latest in a litany of poor decision making by people who will suffer no consequences of their actions, those consequences will be suffered by you and I.
What people have failed to grasp is that the remedy could be in their own hands. We have had the same government, in all but name, for 100 years and, to paraphrase Einstein, " we can't keep making the same mistakes and expect a different outcome"

sameoldname

As someone who isn't from Wexford county and really doesn't want another Healy-Rea type inflicted upon the country, can I ask what you actually want done about this?


Do you want the government to subsidise Irish Ferries and others to operate out of the port? Better transport links? They're extending the M11 further south pretty consistently and New Ross is being bypassed as we speak.

I'm genuinely interested.

Del.Monte

sameoldname wrote: »

As someone who isn't from Wexford county and really doesn't want another Healy-Rea type inflicted upon the country, can I ask what you actually want done about this?


Do you want the government to subsidise Irish Ferries and others to operate out of the port? Better transport links? They're extending the M11 further south pretty consistently and New Ross is being bypassed as we speak.

I'm genuinely interested.

Preventing CIE from closing down the railway south of Gorey would be a start.

kneemos

sameoldname wrote: »

As someone who isn't from Wexford county and really doesn't want another Healy-Rea type inflicted upon the country, can I ask what you actually want done about this?


Do you want the government to subsidise Irish Ferries and others to operate out of the port? Better transport links? They're extending the M11 further south pretty consistently and New Ross is being bypassed as we speak.

I'm genuinely interested.

Rosslare is a bad location for freight and lack of foot passengers has resulted in the decline of the terminal and the station.

Irish Rail apparently runs the port,not sure what expertise or interest they have in investing a little money and imagination into doing anything with it.
Daddy Healy Rae got some goodies when he had the balance of power,the offspring are still dining out on the back of it.

Del.Monte

kneemos wrote: »

Rosslare is a bad location for freight and lack of foot passengers has resulted in the decline of the terminal and the station.

Irish Rail apparently runs the port,not sure what expertise or interest they have in investing a little money and imagination into doing anything with it.
Daddy Healy Rae got some goodies when he had the balance of power,the offspring are still dining out on the back of it.

Chicken and egg though as CIE have run the service into the ground for decades with badly timed trains, no marketing, and ultimately removing the station to its current location. CIE has no interest in doing anything with anything except self perpetuating the giant social employment scheme that it has become.

invara

sameoldname wrote: »

As someone who isn't from Wexford county and really doesn't want another Healy-Rea type inflicted upon the country, can I ask what you actually want done about this?


Do you want the government to subsidise Irish Ferries and others to operate out of the port? Better transport links? They're extending the M11 further south pretty consistently and New Ross is being bypassed as we speak.

I'm genuinely interested.

I would encourage you to read the South East Economic Monitor which details the core set of economic issues that drive things like this 'downgrade'. I should note that I am involved in producing it. Also worth looking at this:
https://www.cso.ie/multiquicktables/quickTables.aspx?id=tba07 which shows the long-term decline of the region's ports.

To be clear the government is subsidising Irish Ferries through the EIB loans that are funding new ships that serve Dublin. The road investment in the region is not comparable to the amount being spent in other regions and on a per capita basis. The regions Ports have a lower strategic designation that Cork, Limerick and Dublin which have been earmarked for greater investment.

vicwatson

Navarre wrote: »

I completely agree with you there. In my long time of voting no matter what party they represented i cant say that any TD in Wexford has done much, Especially in the Enniscorthy district. love them or hate them but Wexford could have done with the likes of the Healey Rae brothers.

And what will the electorate do? Vote them back in

St Senan

vicwatson wrote: »

And what will the electorate do? Vote them back in

I agree Vic sure its out with the old and in with the older and that just goes to show the unfortunate state that the state is in.

Marhay70

Navarre wrote: »

I agree Vic sure its out with the old and in with the older and that just goes to show the unfortunate state that the state is in.

The local media being in the pockets of the main parties doesn't help. It's amazing the amount of positive propaganda the likes of Kehoe, D'Arcy. Howlin and Browne get and it's rare to hear hard questions asked of them. The fourth estate has not served the public well either

kneemos

Somebody is making noises at least.

http://wexfordtoday.com/2018/07/13/browne-seeks-eu-funding-for-railways-and-port/

Marhay70

I see the bandwagon jumpers, Howlin and Browne have both come out with ideas and plans for upgrading services in Rosslare, obviously public opinion has filtered through the class barrier. Howlin has come a bit earlier to the show this time, doubtless to claim all the credit on the back of a public movement, just like he did with the Hospital. I look forward to hearing the excuses he'll come out with for the five years when he was in a senior cabinet position and IR was cutting back services on the Rosslare line.

vicwatson

Marhay70 wrote: »

I see the bandwagon jumpers, Howlin and Browne have both come out with ideas and plans for upgrading services in Rosslare, obviously public opinion has filtered through the class barrier. Howlin has come a bit earlier to the show this time, doubtless to claim all the credit on the back of a public movement, just like he did with the Hospital. I look forward to hearing the excuses he'll come out with for the five years when he was in a senior cabinet position and IR was cutting back services on the Rosslare line.

Election on the way so

vicwatson

Navarre wrote: »

I agree Vic sure its out with the old and in with the older and that just goes to show the unfortunate state that the state is in.

Have Sinn Fein ever run a candidate for TD position in Wex?

McLoughlin

vicwatson wrote: »

Have Sinn Fein ever run a candidate for TD position in Wex?

They had 3 Anti Treaty Sinn Fein and 1 Pro Treaty Sinn Fein in 1922 but I take it you mean the modern Sinn Fein. Oliver Murray (Gorey District I think) was the first in 1992 (came last) In 2002 and 2007 was John Dwyer (New Ross) with no luck he went independent in 2011. Anthony Kelly (Wexford Town) ran for Sinn Fien in 2011 came close if it wasn't for Wallace taking the "left vote" he could have got a seat.

2016 Johnny Mythen (Enniscorthy) came 6th again with around 53 less votes than Paul Kehoe. 53 votes think about that if more than 53 extra people decided to vote for Mythen we wouldn't have Paul Kehoe as a TD.

So Sinn Fein are getting better with general election votes

Del.Monte

McLoughlin wrote: »

They had 3 Anti Treaty Sinn Fein and 1 Pro Treaty Sinn Fein in 1922 but I take it you mean the modern Sinn Fein. Oliver Murray (Gorey District I think) was the first in 1992 (came last) In 2002 and 2007 was John Dwyer (New Ross) with no luck he went independent in 2011. Anthony Kelly (Wexford Town) ran for Sinn Fien in 2011 came close if it wasn't for Wallace taking the "left vote" he could have got a seat.

2016 Johnny Mythen (Enniscorthy) came 6th again with around 53 less votes than Paul Kehoe. 53 votes think about that if more than 53 extra people decided to vote for Mythen we wouldn't have Paul Kehoe as a TD.

So Sinn Fein are getting better with general election votes

It would nearly tempt me but I can't bring myself to vote SF or FF/FG/Labour/Green/Renua....so it will be the man with beard in the pink shirt again and nobody else.

Marhay70

Del.Monte wrote: »

It would nearly tempt me but I can't bring myself to vote SF or FF/FG/Labour/Green/Renua....so it will be the man with beard in the pink shirt again and nobody else.

The man with the pink shirt has probably been more representative of Sean and Mary citizen than the other four put together. It's difficult enough having little time to get a word in Dail procedures but having to put up with personal jibes and taunts from your self styled betters must be hard to take.
Wallace is one of the few politicians I have any time for, sure he's not snow white but his sins pale into insignificance when compared to those committed against the Irish people by the likes of Kenny, Noonan, Cowen and Ahern, and don't get me started on the traitorous Labour party.

vicwatson

Surely the cosy Labour in Wexford town has to be smashed, will the people stop voting HOWLIN and Lawlor? They are pathetic

kneemos

Haven't heard a mention of Wallace for ages.

McLoughlin

vicwatson wrote: »

Surely the cosy Labour in Wexford town has to be smashed, will the people stop voting HOWLIN and Lawlor? They are pathetic

Bobby Ireton up in Gorey is surely the worst of the Labour but Labour in Wexford is dead and gone the old guard that was on the various councils is long gone. Howlin and Lawlor get voted in on their name not party and the way they spin everything to their advantage. The cosy Labour was sort of smashed when Joe Ryan didn't get elected last time round in the local elections despite believing he would walk it and when David Hynes walked away from the party taking Labour votes with him.

kneemos wrote: »

Haven't heard a mention of Wallace for ages.

Wallace has been in Syria for awhile seeing what Ireland can do to help before that he was going on about building a super fast second railway from Dublin to Wexford to which would help/save Rosslare Port.

It seems everyone except Fine Gael in late June/July has had some statement or another about Rosslare Port and its just a coincidence that the new local Wexford South electoral district was announced at the same time and parties may have to spend more time down around Rosslare canvasing.

Marhay70

McLoughlin wrote: »

Bobby Ireton up in Gorey is surely the worst of the Labour but Labour in Wexford is dead and gone the old guard that was on the various councils is long gone. Howlin and Lawlor get voted in on their name not party and the way they spin everything to their advantage. The cosy Labour was sort of smashed when Joe Ryan didn't get elected last time round in the local elections despite believing he would walk it and when David Hynes walked away from the party taking Labour votes with him.




Wallace has been in Syria for awhile seeing what Ireland can do to help before that he was going on about building a super fast second railway from Dublin to Wexford to which would help/save Rosslare Port.

It seems everyone except Fine Gael in late June/July has had some statement or another about Rosslare Port and its just a coincidence that the new local Wexford South electoral district was announced at the same time and parties may have to spend more time down around Rosslare canvasing.

Robbie Ireton is a good community worker and supporter of local causes, I think he will be elected again. Certainly he's a better choice than the likes of Sheehan or Hegarty or Codd-Nolan, useless wastes of space the lot of them.

outlooks

Things seem to be changing for Rosslare. http://www.thejournal.ie/rosslare-port-brexit-4125799-Jul2018/

Del.Monte

outlooks wrote: »

Things seem to be changing for Rosslare. http://www.thejournal.ie/rosslare-port-brexit-4125799-Jul2018/

Talk is cheap and that's all that ever happens regarding Rosslare. CIE seem to have teflon coat when it comes to dealing Government and will not do a damn thing to improve matters.

lazer.blue

Not a particular fan of Howlin, but in his last stint in government he appears to have been at least partially instrumental in alot of capital spending particularly in the town. Obviously the strong labour tradition in the town is on the and sadly the Labour party we have today bears little resemblance to that of Corish years. When Howlin calls it a day I'd say Lawlors 'personbal 'popularity' may not be enough to get him over the line.
As regards Rosslare harbour, regardles off whether it's bandwagon jumping or not they must all do their utmost to push for the development of Rosslare. I would feel more confident of something coming of it with Howlin in governemnt than any of the others at this stage

kneemos

The complicated ownership structure of Rosslare Harbour is apparently a hindrance to its privatisation. Stena Line and Irish Rail have a stake in it.
Have to wonder how easily or otherwise these difficulties could be overcome if the will was there.


https://wexfordtoday.com/2018/10/05/legal-issues-inhibits-rosslare-europort-progress/

hurler32

https://m.independent.ie/life/travel/ireland/absolute-disaster-for-the-southeast-as-irish-ferries-unlikely-to-operate-france-service-next-year-from-rosslare-37639011.html

It seems the Fine Gael government want to move everything to Dublin . Hard to know how Wexford elects two Fine Gael TDS!!
Fine Gael the Dublin party ☹️

Del.Monte

Hard to know why Wexford people vote for any of the main political parties.

andrewfaulk

hurler32 wrote: »

https://m.independent.ie/life/travel/ireland/absolute-disaster-for-the-southeast-as-irish-ferries-unlikely-to-operate-france-service-next-year-from-rosslare-37639011.html

It seems the Fine Gael government want to move everything to Dublin . Hard to know how Wexford elects two Fine Gael TDS!!
Fine Gael the Dublin party ☹️

Irish ferries is a private operator, fail to see how this one can be blamed on the government

hurler32

andrewfaulk wrote: »

Irish ferries is a private operator, fail to see how this one can be blamed on the government

If the local TDS were any good they would have lobbied to keep in Rosslare and there are 2 Fine Gael tds but Fine Gael HQ want everything based in Dublin .
Maybe the other TDS have zero power or influence

andrewfaulk

hurler32 wrote: »

If the local TDS were any good they would have lobbied to keep in Rosslare and there are 2 Fine Gael tds but Fine Gael HQ want everything based in Dublin .
Maybe the other TDS have zero power or influence

But how can a TD lobby a private company to do something that no longer makes commercial sense for them to do.. They would quite rightly tell them where to go

First Up

hurler32 wrote:

If the local TDS were any good they would have lobbied to keep in Rosslare and there are 2 Fine Gael tds but Fine Gael HQ want everything based in Dublin . Maybe the other TDS have zero power or influence

Do you wan't the government to nationalise Irish Ferries?

vicwatson

First Up wrote: »

Do you wan't the government to nationalise Irish Ferries?

Been there (B&I line)

invara

andrewfaulk wrote: »

But how can a TD lobby a private company to do something that no longer makes commercial sense for them to do.. They would quite rightly tell them where to go

Worth repeating our conversation in the Waterford boards page.....


This is a not a commercial decision, this has been a political stroke to invest in Dublin based on EIB loans which are Government approved.

http://www.eib.org/en/projects/loan/list/index?from=&region=&sector=2010&to=&country=IE&fbclid=IwAR1PX6pZqTXDVGzbbkCfPVkWJdY5RjpCFdT0HUd0OfV4QfUSj4IkfqXgWFE

It shows 3 large investments- 2 directly to Irish Ferries (€90m and €75), and €100 to Dublin Port. Rosslare is owned partly by CIE who take around €2.5m of the surplus into their central coffers, and does nothing to reinvest and even nurture rail access to Rosslare.

bigroad

They are very shortsighted Rosslare is going to boom.

Carawaystick

sameoldname wrote: »

Do you want the government to subsidise Irish Ferries and others to operate out of the port? Better transport links? They're extending the M11 further south pretty consistently and New Ross is being bypassed as we speak.

I'm genuinely interested.

Why should people stay on a sloooow ship at 25kmh, when the M11 lets them go at 120kmh, to get wherever they want to get to faster?

hurler32

First Up wrote: »

Do you wan't the government to nationalise Irish Ferries?

Let’s just move everything to Dublin .

First Up

hurler32 wrote:

Let’s just move everything to Dublin .

Companies go where it makes the most sense for them and their customers. Dublin is more accessible for freight and IF are responding to customer demand.

If Dublin Port gets too congested, Rosslare may get more attractive - government (and EU) doing their part by building a motorway.

Lots of moving parts to this with Brexit affecting the Landbridge and IF have had their financial problems too.

Let's remember its tough out there.

First Up

Carawaystick wrote:

Why should people stay on a sloooow ship at 25kmh, when the M11 lets them go at 120kmh, to get wherever they want to get to faster?

The estimated difference to the journey time (including loading, unloading and sailing time) is half an hour.

Turbohymac

Its.just irish ferries way of applying for government funding to keep rosslare /France route open.. unfortunately this process of application doesn't apply to the taxpayers of Ireland ..another smaller version of our infamous bank bailout.. and as a taxpayer we have no control..

andrewfaulk

invara wrote: »

Worth repeating our conversation in the Waterford boards page.....


This is a not a commercial decision, this has been a political stroke to invest in Dublin based on EIB loans which are Government approved.

http://www.eib.org/en/projects/loan/list/index?from=&region=&sector=2010&to=&country=IE&fbclid=IwAR1PX6pZqTXDVGzbbkCfPVkWJdY5RjpCFdT0HUd0OfV4QfUSj4IkfqXgWFE

It shows 3 large investments- 2 directly to Irish Ferries (€90m and €75), and €100 to Dublin Port. Rosslare is owned partly by CIE who take around €2.5m of the surplus into their central coffers, and does nothing to reinvest and even nurture rail access to Rosslare.

Convenient how you pick up on the loans that suit your anti-Dublin agent.. When on the very same list are loans for the development of Port of Cork and the M11 which would improve road access to Rosslare..

Also the EIB is an EU body, not an Irish government one..

And finally, the ships are going to use Dublin.. but are no means limited to Dublin, they could equally be used to service Rosslare or even Cork.. that’s the nature of most transport equipment, it’s not route specific..

The reality is, the IF service probably won’t pay to run because IF are competing against Stena ex Rosslare, and Brittany ex Cork.. Better for them to concentrate on Dublin and benefit from the economies of scale the new vessel brings..there probably isn’t enough viable traffic for them to operate two routes.. Basically Rosslare has lost out due to better services being available from bigger population centres nearby

Del2005

hurler32 wrote: »

Let’s just move everything to Dublin .

Companies and people want to move to big cities and in that context Dublin isn't a big city. Look at the USA or UK where some regions are booming with companies moving in or expanding( London and some parts of California) while other regions are struggling ( Northern Ireland and the rust(bible) belt in the USA). The same is happening in all countries.

Nothing governments do can change this because companies aren't choosing between Dublin and Rosslare for their base they are choosing between Dublin, London, Frankfurt etc.

First Up

andrewfaulk wrote:

And finally, the ships are going to use Dublin.. but are no means limited to Dublin, they could equally be used to service Rosslare or even Cork.. that’s the nature of most transport equipment, it’s not route specific..

You can't blame the ferry companies for keeping their options open. They make long term investments of hundreds of millions in a market that can change overnight on a political whim.

Their only flexibility is their routes and they are entitled to see what they can leverage from government, EU, EIB or anyone else in making decisions. That's what those incentives are there for.

I'd hoped for a big increase in direct sailings to by-pass the UK. We have some new services but it is a pity that some are displacement from Rosslare to Dublin.

When the post Brexit scene is clearer we are likely to see some more changes - the overall direction is up.

AAAAAAAAA

kneemos wrote: »

Irish Ferries are cancelling their winter service to France from Rosslare in favour of Dublin apparently.
Haven't been in it for decades,sounds like it's been totally neglected.

maybe if you and all the other people whinging about the loss of the service would have used it, it would have remained viable

jpb1974

AAAAAAAAA wrote: »

maybe if you and all the other people whinging about the loss of the service would have used it, it would have remained viable

Can you demonstrate where kneemos was deemed to be whinging on this thread please?

kneemos

AAAAAAAAA wrote: »

maybe if you and all the other people whinging about the loss of the service would have used it, it would have remained viable

Nobody is going to use it if they don't intend travelling via ferry.

my3cents

LOL Just researched this after my wife said she heard on the radio that IF were stopping ferries from Rosslare to the UK :rolleyes:

Anyway did anyone see the Irish Mail story https://www.irishmirror.ie/news/irish-news/irish-ferries-to-axe-rosslare-13751714 with a picture of the Isle Of Inishmore at Rosslare - the ferry that sales to the UK (another :rolleyes:).