Which would you recommend? Leaf or I3?

Rougebladez

Nearly ready to pull the trigger on getting an EV. Ideally I'd love the new 181 Leaf but finances tells me I only have 22K.

With that in mind, its either a 2nd hand Leaf or I3. I3 looks great but the Leaf seems more tested.

Ive heard the I3 tyres cost 200+ each. Yes EACH!!

Anyone know of any other BMW surprises?

Any other surprises with the Leaf?

mordeith

Rougebladez wrote: »

Nearly ready to pull the trigger on getting an EV. Ideally I'd love the new 181 Leaf but finances tells me I only have 22K.

With that in mind, its either a 2nd hand Leaf or I3. I3 looks great but the Leaf seems more tested.

Ive heard the I3 tyres cost 200+ each. Yes EACH!!

Anyone know of any other BMW surprises?

Any other surprises with the Leaf?

Are you looking at the i3 BEV or the Rex. We've had a Leaf and now have the Rex. The i3 is certainly a more upmarket finish then the Leaf we had but I don't think it's worth the extra cost if you are not getting the Rex.

Rougebladez

mordeith wrote: »

Are you looking at the i3 BEV or the Rex. We've had a Leaf and now have the Rex. The i3 is certainly a more upmarket finish then the Leaf we had but I don't think it's worth the extra cost if you are not getting the Rex.

I've been looking at the BEV as the rex brings the cost up by 5k. And if I add another 3k I'd have the cost of the 181leaf.

goz83

Tell us about your situation and needs. Commute, type of driving, family members, second ICE car etc. Otherwise we have no basis to recommend either car and you will only get biased opinions.

Rougebladez

Im driving a clio as a second car(changing it). 50 km round trip commute to work 5 day week. 2 kids.

And I'm not too keen on battery rental/lease.

NIMAN

Rougebladez wrote: »

Im driving a clio as a second car(changing it). 50 km round trip commute to work 5 day week. 2 kids.

Leaf would be grand so.

waynegalway

Rougebladez wrote: »

Im driving a clio as a second car(changing it). 50 km round trip commute to work 5 day week. 2 kids.

If you’re changing he Clio because it’s too small for the family, then perhaps a 2nd hand LEAF is a better prospect than an i3. When I was shopping around, physical size was important to me (2 kids), and the Zoe was just too small. I didn’t look at an i3 (not within my budget), but I’d imagine it would have been too small for me in any case.

Rougebladez

The I3 wouldnt be too small. Very rarely any more than 3 in the car at any time. Max 4 and NEVER 5.

waynegalway

Rougebladez wrote: »

The I3 wouldnt be too small. Very rarely any more than 3 in the car at any time. Max 4 and NEVER 5.

Fair enough. I was kinda thinking about boot space too, should have clarified!

slave1

Leaf 30 perfect for you, surprisingly large on the inside and a very comfy car for your commute

Soarer

Don't bother spending €22k on a run around.

Spend €9k on this, and save yourself €13k.

mordeith

Soarer wrote: »

Don't bother spending €22k on a run around.

Spend €9k on this, and save yourself €13k.

Sound advice if you have a backup ICE for longer trips.

Rougebladez

That has racked up 100,000 MILES in 4 yrs.

Jeez, bit scary.

Wheety

mordeith wrote: »

Sound advice if you have a backup ICE for longer trips.

Interesting. I'm considering switching too. I keep changing my mind between something like a Hyundai i30 or go electric and get a Leaf.

I'm in Down next week. Might have a look around.

Sorry meant to quote someone else. I could probably borrow a car for long journeys or rent one. Or just stop somewhere to charge :-)

Zenith74

Rougebladez wrote: »

That has racked up 100,000 MILES in 4 yrs.

Jeez, bit scary.

Pretty crazy mileage alright! FWIW I have fairly similar commute etc and bought a Leaf24 a few months ago, could not be happier with it, actually went and bought a second one a month later we were that impressed. If you’re into gadgets in cars the Tekna is worth the extra money, couldn’t go to far wrong with the likes of this for €11k with just over 30k km on the clock - https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201804265920877?advertising-location=at_cars&keywords=Tekna&year-from=2012&maximum-mileage=25000&price-to=11000&postcode=w45ya&model=LEAF&page=1&make=NISSAN&year-to=2016&onesearchad=Used&onesearchad=Nearly%20New&onesearchad=New

Save that extra €10k to upgrade to a Leaf40 or Kona in a few years time maybe... Also at €11k you’re taking a much lower risk on your first electric!

Rougebladez

The 181 Leaf40 is the ideal for me .

The I3 looks and seems way better but the BMW tag does come at a cost and the tyre price....Yeeesh.
I'd be seriously worried about other costs.

Zenith and the rest of ye have given me the nudge to enquire about a cheaper Leaf and upgrade at a later date.

waynegalway

Rougebladez wrote: »

a cheaper Leaf and upgrade at a later date.

That was exactly my thinking last autumn!

I bought a 151 LEAF24, thinking that I'd go to the 40 in a couple of years. I can't really see myself losing money on the LEAF, as 2nd hand prices have held very steady over the past year or so, plus I'm saving about €2k a year on running costs.

I wrote a post about buying my LEAF, which you might find useful in answering some questions that you'll almost certainly have. You can read it here:

https://waynegibbons.wordpress.com/electric-vehicle-qa/

Wayne

Zenith74

Rougebladez wrote: »

The I3 looks and seems way better but the BMW tag does come at a cost and the tyre price....Yeeesh.
I'd be seriously worried about other costs.

FWIW I changed from a fairly high-end BMW to my Leaf24, thinking I’d miss the comfort/features/sturdiness of the BMW and ultimately want it back at some point, but tbh if you go for the Leaf Tekna I think you’ll find it very similar to a BMW. Keyless entry, leather, sturdy on the road, nippy etc. I’ve been very pleasantly surprised.

Wheety

What's the next level down from the Tekna and what are you missing?

Soarer

Tekna (UK) is SVE here.
Acenta (UK) is SV here.
Visia (UK) is XE here.

Think it's leather and Bose are the main differences between the SVE and the SV. Maybe the 360 camera too?

Soarer

Soarer wrote: »

Tekna (UK) is SVE here.
Acenta (UK) is SV here.
Visia (UK) is XE here.

Think it's leather and Bose are the main differences between the SVE and the SV. Maybe the 360 camera too?

LED headlamps on SVE are a good upgrade too. Mad_lad will soon tell you that Bose is crap but I mainly miss the LEDs and Bose on the current L40. It gave just enough extra oomph and the standard system is a bit clockradioish in comparison without.

waynegalway

Wheety wrote: »

What's the next level down from the Tekna and what are you missing?

Tekna has leather seats and steering wheel, cold pack, LEDs, 360 parking camera and BOSE sound system as standard.

All nice to have, but given the choice between a 3.3kW Tekna and a 6.6kW Acenta (which would be about the same price, all else being equal), I’d take the Acenta, for sure.

Wheety

Just looking at one up North. Put it through Revenue website. Is there no VRT on electric cars?

Soarer

Wheety wrote: »

Just looking at one up North. Put it through Revenue website. Is there no VRT on electric cars?

Nope.

As long as the OMSP is less than around €35k.

ELM327

Rougebladez wrote: »

That has racked up 100,000 MILES in 4 yrs.

Jeez, bit scary.

I did 55k km in 12 months in a leaf 24, I know of others including posters on here that do the same or more. If your commute suits it its the cheapest and most relaxing commute out there! The leaf gen 1.5 is a much better car than that which preceded it, for battery deg.

Wheety wrote: »

Just looking at one up North. Put it through Revenue website. Is there no VRT on electric cars?

No, VRT is zero on any EV once the price (the "OMSP" set by revenue) is less than 35k approx

Zenith74

Again depends on what you want in a car, but the more premium feel of the leather seats and heated leather steering wheel, better speakers/sound, much nicer looking wheels, tinted rear windows etc means for me the Tekna is an absolute no brainer. There only seems to be €1k in the difference to buy them, and of course when you sell it in a few years the Tekna will still be with more, so really small beans, especially as you’ve just saved €10k by not going for a €22k car :-). As it’s your first EV, get one you’re most likely to enjoy is my view...

On the chargers I assume this varies on where you will tend to charge? We have a 3kw and a 6kw, but as we mainly charge overnight or at DC fast chargers I’ve yet to see any benefit to the 6kw. Interestingly the garage I bought the 6kw from didn’t know it had it!

waynegalway

Zenith74 wrote: »

Again depends on what you want in a car, but the more premium feel of the leather seats and heated leather steering wheel, better speakers/sound, much nicer looking wheels, tinted rear windows etc means for me the Tekna is an absolute no brainer. There only seems to be €1k in the difference to buy them, and of course when you sell it in a few years the Tekna will still be with more, so really small beans, especially as you’ve just saved €10k by not going for a €22k car :-). As it’s your first EV, get one you’re most likely to enjoy is my view...

On the chargers I assume this varies on where you will tend to charge? We have a 3kw and a 6kw, but as we mainly charge overnight or at DC fast chargers I’ve yet to see any benefit to the 6kw. Interestingly the garage I bought the 6kw from didn’t know it had it!

I do a mixture of charging at home (32a unit) and while out and about in Galway. I just like getting more kilometers per hour on charge with the 6kW LEAF. If all your charging is overnight, there’s no big advantage, but I like to be able to top up even for an hour here and there. It gives me a bit more peace of mind in case I unexpectedly have to take the car somewhere.

Rougebladez

waynegalway wrote: »

I do a mixture of charging at home (32a unit) and while out and about in Galway. I just like getting more kilometers per hour on charge with the 6kW LEAF. If all your charging is overnight, there’s no big advantage, but I like to be able to top up even for an hour here and there. It gives me a bit more peace of mind in case I unexpectedly have to take the car somewhere.

I've just taken a test drive in a 161 30kw. I'll probably go with one of them but I may go North. Way cheaper(4k) for a Tekna .
That's if the vrt is 0.

How much would I expect to pay for a granny plug?

goz83

Rougebladez wrote: »

I've just taken a test drive in a 161 30kw. I'll probably go with one of them but I may go North. Way cheaper(4k) for a Tekna .
That's if the vrt is 0.

How much would I expect to pay for a granny plug?

Usually comes with one. Second hand will be around €250

Rougebladez

On the one I saw yesterday it only had a lead for the charge stations and not the Granny home plug.

goz83

Rougebladez wrote: »

On the one I saw yesterday it only had a lead for the charge stations and not the Granny home plug.

Then it was an Irish car.....and/or the owner sold the granny charger for a profit of around €250-300. The granny charger is a life line.

waynegalway

Rougebladez wrote: »

I've just taken a test drive in a 161 30kw. I'll probably go with one of them but I may go North. Way cheaper(4k) for a Tekna .
That's if the vrt is 0.

How much would I expect to pay for a granny plug?

Given the distance of the commute that you mentioned I’d say a 30kWh version might be wasted on you. I regularly do 80-90km a day in my 24, and I’ve not been stuck yet. Just saying, as a 30kWh one is likely to be considerably more expensive.

NIMAN

VRT is technically not zero, but you get €5k off any VRT for EVs, so it always works out as being zero unless you are bringing in a top of the range Tesla or similar.

With a Leaf or I3 you'll be grand.

Rougebladez

It is more expensive but Id prefer to have the range and not need it.

Also if im getting it in NI Id like to have less stops on the way home.

goz83

Rougebladez wrote: »

It is more expensive but Id prefer to have the range and not need it.

Also if im getting it in NI Id like to have less stops on the way home.

Where are you based?

tedpan

Rougebladez wrote:

Ive heard the I3 tyres cost 200+ each. Yes EACH!!

The SVE or Tekna model leaf has 17" tyres. To replace them with the recommended A energy efficient Dunlop/Goodyear/Michelin tyres are 160 a corner. I've replaced them 3 times in the 105,000kms. Just to be aware

Rougebladez

goz83 wrote: »

Where are you based?

Cork.

goz83

Rougebladez wrote: »

Cork.

Depending on where in Cork and where you buy from up North, you are looking at 1 or 2 charges in a 30kWh. It's only an extra charge with a 24kWh.

In any case, would you not consider going to the UK. You should be able to pick up something within a few miles of your chosen port. Wouldn't be much more trouble than driving from NI to Cork tbh and you could do better.

Zenith74

I’d second the 24kwh suggestion. 30kwh means going for 2016 or newer and they are relatively rare, so you may not have the choice of colours etc. You could be back up to your €22k again fairly quickly.

I’d also consider buying in the UK, I bought our two there, just far more choice so you can aim for a specific year in a specific spec with super low mileage in one of the nice colours etc. Flight over might cost you €100 including the Uber to the pick-up point, the motorways there are littered with fast chargers, ferry is pretty painless and there are two quick chargers at Holyhead Port. It’s actually a great way to get to know the car and learn where to stop to charge etc.

That’s my 2 cents anyway, will stop trying to brow-beat you into it now :-)

waynegalway

Rougebladez wrote: »

It is more expensive but Id prefer to have the range and not need it.

Also if im getting it in NI Id like to have less stops on the way home.

That’s fine, but just think it through fully. Probably the longest trip you will ever take is the one back from the dealer. If it takes an extra stop or two for the 24kwh for this once-off trip, is that really worth it when you consider how much more expensive the 30kWh version will be? It’s worth keeping an open mind on this and saving yourself thousands in the process. With an EV, every car has to suit the use case of the driver. Anything over and above what you really need is possibly not the best use of your budget. I went through the same thing you’re doing now, and I was convinced I needed a 30kWh car “just to be safe” with range. Having owned a 24kwh since last November, I can definitely say that a 30kWh would have been wasted on my commute and I would have needlessly spent about €5k more than I had to.

Soarer

NIMAN wrote: »

VRT is technically not zero, but you get €5k off any VRT for EVs, so it always works out as being zero unless you are bringing in a top of the range Tesla or similar.

With a Leaf or I3 you'll be grand.

Well if we're being technical, you get "up to" €5,000 off the VRT on an EV.

Also, you mightn't "be grand" if you get an i3.
If it's a REx, there'll be VRT due.
If it's a top spec BEV with an OMSP of €36k+, there'll be VRT owning.

ELM327

Zenith74 wrote: »

I’d second the 24kwh suggestion. 30kwh means going for 2016 or newer and they are relatively rare, so you may not have the choice of colours etc. You could be back up to your €22k again fairly quickly.

I’d also consider buying in the UK, I bought our two there, just far more choice so you can aim for a specific year in a specific spec with super low mileage in one of the nice colours etc. Flight over might cost you €100 including the Uber to the pick-up point, the motorways there are littered with fast chargers, ferry is pretty painless and there are two quick chargers at Holyhead Port. It’s actually a great way to get to know the car and learn where to stop to charge etc.

That’s my 2 cents anyway, will stop trying to brow-beat you into it now :-)

There was a user on here not so long ago selling a 30kWh listed around 17k
Dealers list at 18k for 30kWh. 22k you'd buy a L40/Ioniq from the UK

goz83

Also the 30kWh battery seems to be degrading quicker than the 24kWh.

The vast mahority of 2014/15 Leafs will have 90%+ battery health. some of the 30kWh (2016) are already below 90%. Not much is known about the issue, but just be aware of it.

Also whatever Leaf you buy, have the alignment checked. The rear axle in lots of them is bent and requires replacing, or a shim-kit.

Get a late 2015 or early 2016 24kWh with manufacturer warranty and that issue can be sorted at no cost, regardless of where you buy.