weird and wonderful derailleurs

comanche_cor

An interesting article in the guardian. Makes an for an interesting read and an interesting talk!

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/bike-blog/2018/jun/07/10-weird-and-wonderful-derailleurs-and-how-they-changed-cycling

It's interesting to see the evolution of the derailleurs but its been incremental. When you thing about it there's been some big changes over the years in gear shifting:
- indexed gears
- grip shifts (what a bad idea)
- the move of the gear levers from frame

And on the face of it, it looks like we are in the middle of another evolution with 1x setups and electronics.

Anyone here have any interesting setups over the years?

Hurrache

comanche_cor wrote: »

- grip shifts (what a bad idea)

Never had a bike with grip shift, but over the weekend there was an oul jocker with grip shift laying around where we were staying so I took it for a spin around the field and decided to do some cool wheelies to amaze the kids.

First up is that the tracking or balancing in the wheels must have been off as I kept going to the one side (joke btw). Compensated for that and then when I was pulling up on the handle bars the grip shift decided to come to life, popping the gears all over the place, slipping the drive and me whacking my shins.

cjt156

Hurrache wrote: »

...do some cool wheelies to amaze the kids.

Speaking of bad ideas...:D

ILIKEFOOD

ah grip shift, now there's a blast from the past! It's still about seemingly... never had an issue with it but then again I was 11..thought it was the dog's b......

benneca1

Gripshift worked well for the front derailleur back in the days when mountain bikes came with triple rings>

Wishbone Ash

ILIKEFOOD wrote: »

ah grip shift, now there's a blast from the past! It's still about seemingly.......

Dublin Bikes are grip shift aren't they?

ILIKEFOOD

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

Dublin Bikes are grip shift aren't they?

yes, come to think of it. pain in the bum moving from the gears to the brakes, now i remember

elric

SRAM resurrected grip shifters for MTB back in 2012:

https://bikerumor.com/2012/03/29/new-sram-grip-shift-tech-details-photos-weights-first-impressions/

https://www.bikeradar.com/mtb/news/article/video-sram-grip-shift-full-details-revealed-33574/

Still riding a grip shift for my work horse. Looking to get a new one in the coming months this one served me well over the last 12 years or so

How do the trigger shifters on new mtb/hybrid bikes work? I've never ridden a bike with those.

Hurrache

Deleted User wrote: »

How do the trigger shifters on new mtb/hybrid bikes work? I've never ridden a bike with those.

We're probably as old as each other, but I've had them on a MTB from the early 90s and thought they were great. There's a variety, but basically two triggers, one for one way, the other for the other. Decent ones work very well with little pressure required, and you can hold to jump a couple of gears.

Wishbone Ash

Deleted User wrote: »

...How do the trigger shifters on new mtb/hybrid bikes work? I've never ridden a bike with those.

Much better than grip shifts in my experience.

ednwireland

My mtb had thumb shifters. Grip shifts. Sram grip shifts. An now sram trigger shifters liked them all

magicbastarder

what did your mtb have?

Thread summoned lovely memories of when I was a lad being ferried around on the 'crossbar' (we didn't call it a top tube back then) of my dads bike (peugeot if I recall) and our chat being interrupted by up or down commands and me reaching down to change gears. **** haven't thought of that in an age.

How did that gearing/shifting match up with what we have today. Ok you have to reach for them but aside were they any better in any way?

Hurrache

I think the non indexed gears were better for the battering you gave your bike as a kid. It meant you manually found the sweet spot so didn't have to put up with the clickety of maladjusted gears. They were usually only non indexed at the front though

eeeee

My commuter is a non indexed ten speed. It's great, you never miss a far provided the cabling is alright and can always stop a rattle.
However there are only 5 cogs on the block at the back, so it's easy enough change one gear on so few cogs. Also it gets a bit jammy towards the end, 90% of the time only use 2 gears.

Sti 's are easier to use, and handier (literally ). Clear change, goes largely where you want them to go etc. On a long spin it's easy easier and more convenient to have sti's. However when they're off they're a pain. You can't shift them around to fix the indexing on the go!

I prefer sti's, but the ease of maintenance of downtube non indexed shifters is in a league of its own. They're bulletproof.

Borderfox

I had a Lemond Gan replica with Mavic Zap in 1993/4 (not sure what year) till someone crashed into me in Bohermeen and totalled it. Great design rear derailleur that got its power from the top jockey wheel and only needed a small battery for signals in the handlebars

Fian

ILIKEFOOD wrote: »

ah grip shift, now there's a blast from the past! It's still about seemingly... never had an issue with it but then again I was 11..thought it was the dog's b......

I loved my raleigh grifter, with grip shift gearing. One minor drawback was that the skin on the outside of my right thumb, just on the joint, was constantly split for several years, from gripping teh griftshift. It seemed to stretch my child sized thumb enough that the skin would split on the outside of the thumb joint. Then it would scab, and then as i cycled along it would split again.

good times......(not being sarcastic.)

hesker

Author of the article has his own website for a good few years now. Much more in depth info there

http://www.disraeligears.co.uk/

xxyyzz

in mountainbiking terms it is probably the one piece of kit that everybody knows needs to be gotten rid of but the big 2 are not willing to invest in it. Basically you have this thing hanging down a few inches off the ground waiting to be ripped off the bike. There are gearbox mtb's out there but they probably need a cash injection from Sramano to move them on to being viable technology, they are still a little clunky and don't change well under load. I have a feeling that they will be the next innovation on e-mtb's and this may trickle down regular pedal bikes.

Hurrache

Do many get ripped off? I've seen many get bent but when caught on something and you're going forward they swing back, often then protected by the guard. I seem to see more hangers snapped on road bikes than on MTBs, but that maybe just because there's more out there.

Hurrache

hesker wrote: »

Author of the article has his own website for a good few years now. Much more in depth info there

http://www.disraeligears.co.uk/

The ones with the smooth jockey wheels, are they just smoothed over time or how do they work like that?

magicbastarder

i've often wondered why bike manufacturers don't occasionally re-make old stock - there's clearly a market out there for restoring old bikes where sometimes parts can be hard to come by. i guess it's not economically viable to make a 1984 shimano 600 RD at a price people will pay.

xxyyzz

Hurrache wrote: »

Do many get ripped off? I've seen many get bent but when caught on something and you're going forward they swing back, often then protected by the guard. I seem to see more hangers snapped on road bikes than on MTBs, but that maybe just because there's more out there.

I've seen hangers break or bend enough to end a ride prematurely. It's probably a main point of failure on the bike outside of the tyres. The thing with gearboxes is that you can use a stronger chain that doesn't have to traverse a massive 10 - 50t cassette so snapped chains will be a thing of the past also. Fortunately front derailleurs are a thing of the past.

Eamonnator

Honda had a Downhill Mountainbike, for a couple of years, with internal gears:

http://downhill24.bike/inside-info-honda-rn01-silver-bullet/

xxyyzz

Eamonnator wrote: »

Honda had a Downhill Mountainbike, for a couple of years, with internal gears:

http://downhill24.bike/inside-info-honda-rn01-silver-bullet/

Yeah, pinion currently manufacture gearboxes for mtb's. Zerode make all their bikes with them https://www.zerodebikes.com

eeeee

Eamonnator wrote: »

Honda had a Downhill Mountainbike, for a couple of years, with internal gears:

http://downhill24.bike/inside-info-honda-rn01-silver-bullet/

Man that thing is beautiful bike. Didn't Greg Minnar actually race it?

Eamonnator

nee wrote: »

Man that thing is beautiful bike. Didn't Greg Minnar actually race it?

He sure did.
And won several World Cups on it.

Eamonnator

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fuoFQNptubo&t=1s

Minaar on Honda

eeeee

Carbon fiber stanchions?

8valve

Hurrache wrote: »

Do many get ripped off? I've seen many get bent but when caught on something and you're going forward they swing back, often then protected by the guard. I seem to see more hangers snapped on road bikes than on MTBs, but that maybe just because there's more out there.

I'm a fulltime bike mechanic and I'll let you in on an observation...
People hit off rear derailleurs or drop their bikes on the drive side. This can happen loading it onto a car mounted bike rack or just hitting it with the lawnmower getting it out of the shed!

On modern bikes, the sacrificial rear mech hangers bend easily (they're designed to do this rather than damage your frame!); the hanger gets bent and when people go for the largest sprocket on the back, 99% of the time, the jockey wheel cage catches a spoke while the wheel is turning, starting a chain reaction (pardon the pun!), pulling and bending the mech out of shape, breaking the rear mech hanger, and occasionally twisting links in the chain.


Here's a free tip from me...save yourself a fortune if your bike falls on the drive side...check your hanger hasn't been bent inwards. if it has, you can gently bend it back straight/perpendicular to the ground with a large flathead screwdriver, using the smallest sprocket on your cassette as leverage.


I had a lovely bike in today, a Pinarello Dogma, Zipp wheels, Sram fancy-schmancy electronic gears...the owner gave it to a family member to go for a quick spin...they managed to catch the rear mech in the spoke while travelling at speed, snapping the mech hanger, twisting the derailleur beyond repair and...for the icing on the cake, the spoke held firm and ripped a piece out of the hub, rendering the wheel as a wall ornament.
A four-figure repair to put the bike back the way it was before the incident!