Vinyl records have come back - will cassette tapes ever make a return?

TheBoyConor

Hello.
I was in a music shop there earlier today and as we all know the physical media market for music has contracted dramatically in recent times due to people sourcing their music via internet, iTunes, Spotify, etc, but a smaller number of physical media shops persist to service those people who prefer, for whatever reason, to have a physical form of their music be out CD, record or whatever.

I noticed in the shop, and others over the past few years, that the CD stock is nearly matched by the stock of vinyl records which is great to see.
So from probably the vinyl record was king for decades, then probably in the 70s cassette tapes became popular followed by cd which became popular in the late 80s and largely sufficed displaced vinyl and cassette altogether.
Cd never fully disappeared, it hung in there always despite internet music.

I assume it's due to the nostalgia and reputed sound quality factors that vinyl has become popular again but as for the other great medium of times past, the cassette tape, will we ever see these again on music shop shelves? It's there any nostalgia or quality factors attached to tape that could see them make even a limited appearance on shelves ever again? Or is the tape now fully extinct?

verycool

TheBoyConor wrote: »

It's there any nostalgia or quality factors attached to tape that could see them make even a limited appearance on shelves ever again? Or is the tape now fully extinct?

Probably not likely in a bricks and mortar, but some bands on bandcamp will issue their album on a cassette.

squawker

Tape was sh1te, it was just for portable music

24bit Vinyl Flac is where its at, if you don't have a record player

Xenji

Cassettes? Some recent releases have been on 8 Track .

Suckit

Vinyl never really disappeared either. It was always available, but usually in selected stores etc.
DJ's and collectors kept it going mainly. I think it is more popular as opposed to a revival, but doubt cassettes will become as popular.

Kolido

I will be getting a new stereo system soon. Going to pick up a record player, receiver, cd player and probably a tape deck. You can get a 2nd hand deck fairly cheap. Tapes can actually sound pretty good if the cassette is in good nick with a high quality deck.

Suckit

Kolido wrote: »

I will be getting a new stereo system soon. Going to pick up a record player, receiver, cd player and probably a tape deck. You can get a 2nd hand deck fairly cheap. Tapes can actually sound pretty good if the cassette is in good nick with a high quality deck.

I buy a few tapes from Discogs. Mainly magazine cover stuff.
I used to have all of the ones I have bought so far and lost them all to uncontrollable circumstances.
Been buying them back and transferring them over to flac. Slow process.

But very enjoyable

K.Flyer

If you were into collecting "boots" it was usually always cassette. I know I gave most of mine away, think I may still have few old Bowie ones in a box somewhere. As for a revival of cassettes, I don't think that there will be as big as interest as there now is with vinyl.

Conservatory

They will if the marketing men think they can convince us into believing they sound better than the current medium.

This is what they did for vinyl. Aparantly most vinyl recorded today is just taken straight from the digital copy and put on the vinyl.

K.Flyer

Conservatory wrote: »

They will if the marketing men think they can convince us into believing they sound better than the current medium.

This is what they did for vinyl. Aparantly most vinyl recorded today is just taken straight from the digital copy and put on the vinyl.

Some people, myself included, never stopped buying vinyl albums, albeit in limited numbers.
It nice to see the comeback, but with reservations, especially to do with pricing.
Regarding sound production, it really depends on what you are buying, but the concept of digital to vinyl is nothing very new.
I have just been playing Ry Cooder's 1979 Bop Till You Drop, which was the very first vinyl album to be digitally recorded before it was converted to wax.

Sheridan81

Tapes are generally unreliable so no.

noby

Tapes have made a limited comeback, but I think it will be very niche.

I've bought a few new albums/e.p.'s on tape over the last couple of years.
There's a bit of the punk/diy ethos about it, I think.
The last cassette album I bought was from a German ambient electronic artist - he records straight to tape, so it's all lo-fi, analog, and homemade.

I know of bands who sell tapes at their gigs, with download codes included. People get to go home with something physical, rather than just a qr code/slip of paper. I'm sure a lot of them never even listen to the tape, but a small minority will.

I think the next trend - and it's happening already - will be a backlash to over-priced records, and a return to CDs.

Wheety

Aldi have these on Thursday

https://www.aldi.ie/reka-black-boombox/p/084221209103600

beauf

Other than this...

http://www.walkman-archive.com/wa/project/guardians-of-the-galaxy-cassette-replica/

Lots of tape stuff here too http://www.techmoan.com

I switched from early cds back to cassettes because the quality of the mixing on CDs was abysmal and so were some of the portable cd players. They stopped making them for sound quality. I eventually switched to mini disc then hiMD then to MP3 and now I just use streaming.

The new digital formats are just vastly more convenient and the sound quality can be just as good if not better if you know what you are doing. Also are living spaces are shrinking and we travel a lot more and move around a lot more. So we don't have the space for the old formats.

Suckit

beauf wrote: »

now I just use streaming.

The new digital formats are just vastly more convenient and the sound quality can be just as good if not better if you know what you are doing. Also are living spaces are shrinking and we travel a lot more and move around a lot more. So we don't have the space for the old formats.

Sorted.


The difference with cassette and non streaming i find, is that there is a hell of a lot more stuff available on cassette.
As somebody mentioned, bootlegs, rare recordings, etc.

Streaming doesn't have a lot of stuff that I listen to, and probably never will. A lot of stuff has also been recorded on to cassette from the 70's to 90's and much of it still not converted to any other format yet, or very hard to get.
I doubt cassette will ever have much of a revival though.
Except for maybe old spectrum 48k's or commodore 64's

beauf

I noticed that the sound quality was better in some of my audio cassette was better than some of the CDs I had. Assume because of mastering and analog etc. Noisy as heck for sure.

But over time the cassettes degrade, I transferred the best of mine to MP3, then ditched the rest. I still have a decent quality deck, but it would need the belts done to be usable now.

I found most of my obscure music on streaming. I was never a big fan of bootlegs or gigs. The quality of those was often abysmal. Sometimes your get a version of live song or gig thats just blows the studio stuff away. That's true. You tube is my new source for that and finding new bands.

beauf

Wheety wrote: »

Aldi have these on Thursday

https://www.aldi.ie/reka-black-boombox/p/084221209103600

Techmoan has reviewed some of these before.

Amalgam

Suckit wrote: »

Except for maybe old spectrum 48k's or commodore 64's

Full circle.. I am old enough to have loaded games from vinyl, into a ZX Spectrum, one concerning a text adventure to do with the band, The Thompson Twins..

I miss my Aiwa 202..

Kolido

Technomoans channel is great, I follow it. Another couple of good channels for cassette videos are

vwestlife and databits

I dont think cassettes will take off again like vinyl, not for general music listeners anyway, it is more for hobbyists and enthusiasts, probably more so than vinyl. I plan to pick up a quality deck soon and give my old tapes a go.

Amalgam

beauf wrote: »

Techmoan has reviewed some of these before.

The 8-bit Guy also, if it is the one that can record to .mp3. The review is bad..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GNgm8Cn-HpY

The problem is, no one is making decent tape heads anymore, it is all generic Chinese non brands. The industry backing just isn't there, same for new, reliable, branded, Chrome and Metal tapes.. rare as hen's teeth.

Suckit

beauf wrote: »

I found most of my obscure music on streaming. I was never a big fan of bootlegs or gigs. The quality of those was often abysmal. Sometimes your get a version of live song or gig thats just blows the studio stuff away. That's true. You tube is my new source for that and finding new bands.

Live bootlegs depending on where recorded (and equipment used) can be very good, as can the studio bootlegs.
There are also some sessions (usually spontaneous or outdoor), pirate radio and rare recordings etc.
Admittedly quality isn't always great but it may be the only version or only recording of some stuff in existence.
Not all of it is up on youtube yet fortunately/unfortunately. I prefer it untouched, but sometimes the uploader has messed around with it .
Most of it available on forums anyway.
Plenty of places to find new stuff now, but finding the old stuff is often harder.

Amalgam wrote: »

I miss my Aiwa 202..

I didn't even know it was possible to load from vinyl :eek::)

I remember those AIWA though. I was hoping there was one in the attic when we cleared it out, but if there was, it was snagged by someone else. I got two Sony walkmans.

TheIrishGrover

How will hipsters fit the tapes into their skinny jeans?

noby

TheIrishGrover wrote: »

How will hipsters fit the tapes into their skinny jeans?

Sure those new I-phones are bigger than an 8-track.

dasdog

Amalgam wrote: »

Full circle.. I am old enough to have loaded games from vinyl, into a ZX Spectrum, one concerning a text adventure to do with the band, The Thompson Twins..

I think 2FM or whatever incarnation it was at the time broadcast a spectrum game that you were supposed to record to tape and load. Reasonably innovative actually. Pretty sure the final production of Michael Jackson's Thriller was mixed down on a cassette. Great sounding format but as has been eluded to it loses quality over time and is generally a pain in the arse.

Anesthetize

The return in popularity of vinyl over the past 10 years was more of a counter-reaction to the increasing digitialisation of music. Streaming in particular. Early on, people wanted something more tangible, collectible, and in the right conditions - better sound quality. Now we have over-priced albums, and cheap record players in Lidl..

There has been an increase in artists releasing music on cassette in recent years but mainly on smaller niche labels. These are collectors items more than anything else and will never make a mainstream return.

I'm just old enough to remember what cassettes were like in the late 90's. One of the best birthday presents I ever got was a Philips personal CD player for my 12th birthday. I embraced CDs and never looked back. I never missed having to put up with the pain of tapes wearing and tearing.

Suckit

Anesthetize wrote: »

I'm just old enough to remember what cassettes were like in the late 90's. One of the best birthday presents I ever got was a Philips personal CD player for my 12th birthday. I embraced CDs and never looked back. I never missed having to put up with the pain of tapes wearing and tearing.

kunst nugget

I had decks twenty years ago and a load of vinyl as a result - mostly house, jungle and trance. I pulled down one of them a couple of months ago and started buying up my favourite albums from over the years through Discogs and reissues. I listen to a lot of music in the background through the day, streaming with Apple Music but I'm digging sticking on an album in the evenings. It gives a different listening experience for me and I'll tend to sit down and listen to the whole album.

Tapes were always crap though.

Amalgam

Some of the most expensive separates for sale in the Dublin Virgin Megastore were tape decks. Nakamichi tape decks. About £2000 and up, as far as I can remember, up the escalators and to your left, against the wall.

I distinctly remember the Dragon being sold.

CaptainPants

Tapes are making a comeback in some hipster circles, as a way of circumventing the devaluing of music caused by streaming etc - i.e. "There's only 100 copies of this album in existence' and they are on cassette , so thats the only way you can hear them, which I can see the value of.

Personally, I think well maintained metal tapes can be better quality than actually existing vinyl - I find pops, clicks, skips, surface noise and rumble more intrusive than a slight background hiss. I got into vinyl last year again after many years , with a pretty nice Pro-ject turntable and was dissappointed to find that the second hand vinyl in most shops is mostly covered in pops clicks and surface noise, and the new stuff costs as months as 3 months of Spotify. So its kind of a catch 22.

Id like to see a new analog format invented though - say something that works by reading a metal disc with a laser or something.

TheBoyConor

CaptainPants wrote: »

Id like to see a new analog format invented though - say something that works by reading a metal disc with a laser or something.

There are analog hard disks out there. They exist but they would be rare and only used for specific niche applications.

Kolido

Some enthusiasts used to or maybe still do use video tape for audio recordings, apparently some VCRs gave excellent or better sound reproduction.

K.Flyer

CaptainPants wrote: »

Id like to see a new analog format invented though - say something that works by reading a metal disc with a laser or something.

But that just amounts to a glorified cd.

Ultimate Analogue anyone?

High End Munich 2018 – The Ultimate In Analog Music Is Back

CaptainPants

No, I mean a disc that contains hills and valleys to represent an analog waveform which is read by a laser - so similar to a vinyl record, but there would be no rumble/clicks/surface noise. It not going to happen obviously, as most people wouldnt care enough for it to be worth it.

K.Flyer

CaptainPants wrote: »

No, I mean a disc that contains hills and valleys to represent an analog waveform which is read by a laser - so similar to a vinyl record, but there would be no rumble/clicks/surface noise. It not going to happen obviously, as most people wouldnt care enough for it to be worth it.

Do you mean something like this?

Suckit

LaserDisc was analog. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LaserDisc

horseofstone

Can't see cassettes making a comeback.times have moved on for the youth in particular

Atoms for Peace

Xenji wrote: »

Cassettes? Some recent releases have been on 8 Track .

Meh! Wax cylinders is where it's at.:rolleyes:

Anesthetize

Joanna Newsom is re-issuing her discography on cassette.

https://www.stereogum.com/2000431/joanna-newsoms-catalog-now-available-on-cassette/news/

Arghus

Anesthetize wrote: »

Joanna Newsom is re-issuing her discography on cassette.

https://www.stereogum.com/2000431/joanna-newsoms-catalog-now-available-on-cassette/news/

The question that springs to mind is why?

Anesthetize

Arghus wrote: »

The question that springs to mind is why?

Because she can, I guess.

I still don't like her music.

Suckit

I came across this today, You can use google or yandex to translate

The 12 most expensive cassette decks
https://www.hi-fi.ru/magazine/audio/12-cassette-deck/
Translated version - https://bit.ly/2KSW83q
and
The 10 most bizarre boomoxes (a few with cassette decks)
https://www.hi-fi.ru/magazine/audio/10-strannykh-bumboksov
Translated version - https://bit.ly/2u28E6Y

Some of them do look amazing..
I read around and it seems that there is already the beginning of a decent revival

Aesthetically, I like them a lot. I couldn't afford any of those on the expensive list though.

The JVC 3090

The Panasonic RX-CT810 (that link is an expensive example) seems to be one that many are able to buy and are modding it. But I don't get it, as they are removing one of the decks, and adding this Bluetooth Module.
I mean I get that they are doing it for aesthetics, and as I type this I just copped that only one deck is needed..:o Still though, It seems a bit of a shame unless it's reversable.

Modded - https://i.imgur.com/GXp3Xj5.jpg

The Nal

Arghus wrote: »

The question that springs to mind is why?

None more hipster.

"You like vinyl? Well get a load of me!"

dr.fuzzenstein

Kolido wrote: »

Some enthusiasts used to or maybe still do use video tape for audio recordings, apparently some VCRs gave excellent or better sound reproduction.

That!
Vinyl is OK, cassettes are sh*te and reel to reel is fantastic.
But a good nicam VCR that records the sound via rotating heads (NOT linear!) stuffs the lot for sound quality. Well, all but some exotic reel to reels that will cost well into a few thousands.
I need to dig out specs, but frequency response, noise floor, dynamic range and wow and flutter would be equal to some of the most expensive reel to reel machines and cassettes have been left for dust many light years back.
Getting a second hand VCR could be the cheapest way to get a tape recorder with unbeatable quality.

dr.fuzzenstein

As for cassette tapes. With the right source, amp, super-high quality deck, metal tapes, HX Pro, cassettes can sound quit OK.
Of course that would be a setup that is exotic, costs thousands and the tapes won't play in anything that can't handle metal and HX Pro.
Which is nowhere.
For that money and impracticability you might as well get a reel to reel that has proper quality.
Or a VCR for a fraction of the cost and quality that beats both.

Also, new cassette decks are mostly sh*t. There is no nice way of saying it. The equivalent of a crosley cruiser. They have no Dolby and the tapes are all FE. They're a novelty at best.
The only way is vintage.

Now, I propose a different way altogether.
Personally I had reel to reel, cassette and VCR for audio recording.
In the end I turned everything digital.
You need a decent HiFi setup, a good soundcard and something like Adobe Audition. Or in my case Cool Edit. Audition is Cool Edit anyway with a few gigs of Adobe bloatware added on.
You can record in quite high quality, higher than CD and save as wav or flac.
And encode as mp3 for the car.
I have a huge library of vinyl ripped to wav and mp3. It beats the sh*t out of any analog magnetic tape recording system or any physical medium.
I've been recording this way since the early 2000's. And it's great.

LoughNeagh2017

I vaguely remember audio cassettes, I remember sitting by a big radio around 2000 as an 8 year old waiting for Anastasia songs to come on so I could record them, that was because I had older siblings who had tapes lying around the house,I wonder would a 1992 birth who didn't have older siblings remember them.

NewbridgeIR

In 1988 for every six new albums sold, four were on cassette. One each for LP and CD.

beauf

http://www.thejournal.ie/golden-discs-profit-2017-4134867-Jul2018/

I can't see cassettes coming back. Mini disc was a better cassette like format.

Suckit

beauf wrote: »

http://www.thejournal.ie/golden-discs-profit-2017-4134867-Jul2018/

I can't see cassettes coming back. Mini disc was a better cassette like format.

I was with you.
But I can see it happening.. I don't know if it is hipsters, collectors, or a lot of a generation deciding they like it. I can see why it might be collectors, in relation to timing though.

But it does seem to be growing. I haven't read that article yet.

bullpost

Tower Dublin now selling Cassette decks

emo72

Are blank cassettes still being made? C90s ?

bullpost

emo72 wrote: »

Are blank cassettes still being made? C90s ?

See image above -yes.