Ulster Bank League 2018-2019 Talk/Gossip/Rumours

Squidgy Black

Playing in the Aviva is a spectacle not only for the players, but also for the fans seeing their home club in the national stadium, as well as the minis and other underage teams who get to have a runout at half time. I think taking that away from them and playing it in the likes of the RDS or Donnybrook would take a lot away from the event.

troyzer

The All Ireland in GAA is played in Croke Park and the LOI cup is in Lansdowne.

You always play your national club championship in your national stadium. The Welsh and the English do this as well, I'm sure there are other countries.

The Lost Sheep

Squidgy Black wrote: »

Playing in the Aviva is a spectacle not only for the players, but also for the fans seeing their home club in the national stadium, as well as the minis and other underage teams who get to have a runout at half time. I think taking that away from them and playing it in the likes of the RDS or Donnybrook would take a lot away from the event.

Spot on. Donnybrook should be used for provincial finals not senior all ireland finals

troyzer wrote: »

The All Ireland in GAA is played in Croke Park and the LOI cup is in Lansdowne.

You always play your national club championship in your national stadium. The Welsh and the English do this as well, I'm sure there are other countries.

Welsh do more and play many club finals in Millenium and i wish we did the same and played far more in Lansdowne road.

troyzer

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

Squidgy Black wrote: »

Playing in the Aviva is a spectacle not only for the players, but also for the fans seeing their home club in the national stadium, as well as the minis and other underage teams who get to have a runout at half time. I think taking that away from them and playing it in the likes of the RDS or Donnybrook would take a lot away from the event.

Spot on. Donnybrook should be used for provincial finals not senior all ireland finals

troyzer wrote: »

The All Ireland in GAA is played in Croke Park and the LOI cup is in Lansdowne.

You always play your national club championship in your national stadium. The Welsh and the English do this as well, I'm sure there are other countries.

Welsh do more and play many club finals in Millenium and i wish we did the same and played far more in Lansdowne road.

The Welsh club game to be fair is much better supported. And that's at the expense of their professional game.

RuPi

I totally agree with playing the final in Lansdowne Road, will Energia coming on as principal sponsor mean we could see a Finals day held in Energia Park or see play off finals between leagues moved to there? I hope not as clubs lose out on the home advantage but also bar takings but could be interesting to see if changes may happen. I know Ravenhill holds a good number of cup finals for teams the equivalent of J4 even and it is a big thing for clubs and players at all levels in Ulster. It would be a shame to deprive our best club players of the chance of playing at Lansdowne Road.

The Lost Sheep

troyzer wrote: »

The Welsh club game to be fair is much better supported. And that's at the expense of their professional game.

Im talking about the community game and the top welsh premiership sides are kind of different...

RuPi wrote: »

I totally agree with playing the final in Lansdowne Road, will Energia coming on as principal sponsor mean we could see a Finals day held in Energia Park or see play off finals between leagues moved to there? I hope not as clubs lose out on the home advantage but also bar takings but could be interesting to see if changes may happen. I know Ravenhill holds a good number of cup finals for teams the equivalent of J4 even and it is a big thing for clubs and players at all levels in Ulster. It would be a shame to deprive our best club players of the chance of playing at Lansdowne Road.

Hopefully we wont see finals moved to Donnybrook and certainly not playoff finals whih should be kept in the venue of the higher ranked club from season rankings.
Ulster are excellent at playing finals in Ravenhill as are Connacht in Sportsground. Thomond Park since the redevelopment hasnt had games played on main pitch bar schools cup final/munster senior cup final but finals have started to be played on the back pitch again which is something

ArmchairQB

Playing a few games on AIL Finals day would be great. Division promotion relagation earlier in the day perhaps

The Lost Sheep

ArmchairQB wrote: »

Playing a few games on AIL Finals day would be great. Division promotion relagation earlier in the day perhaps

Using back pitch as well. Not enough club games played in the Aviva main pitch

D14Rugby

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

Using back pitch as well. Not enough club games played in the Aviva main pitch

Can't really have more as the events are pretty much split 50/50 football/rugby then extra events on top of that so for every rugby match you add you're adding another football match. And every event has to go towards the stadium board and if the FAI can't match it they'll probably try block it or get in on the revenue. The stadium is also pretty expensive to open and run.

The Lost Sheep

D14Rugby wrote: »

Can't really have more as the events are pretty much split 50/50 football/rugby then extra events on top of that so for every rugby match you add you're adding another football match. And every event has to go towards the stadium board and if the FAI can't match it they'll probably try block it or get in on the revenue. The stadium is also pretty expensive to open and run.

Thats a cop out and FAI can manage it with FAI junior, intermediate and senior cup finals. Its ridiculous we dont do same with all levels of rugby games

D14Rugby

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

Thats a cop out and FAI can manage it with FAI junior, intermediate and senior cup finals. Its ridiculous we dont do same with all levels of rugby games

They're all already played there. It's not a cop out, I'd assume its in the contract somewhere. Doesn't get by the fact anyway that it's bloody expensive to open the ground anyway.

The Lost Sheep

D14Rugby wrote: »

They're all already played there. It's not a cop out, I'd assume its in the contract somewhere. Doesn't get by the fact anyway that it's bloody expensive to open the ground anyway.

You are assuming. Big assumptions to make. Everything shouldnt simply be down to cost of a venue being opened on a day.

D14Rugby

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

You are assuming. Big assumptions to make. Everything shouldnt simply be down to cost of a venue being opened on a day.

It's not so much an assumption, it's more an educated guess based on the previous events and that the stadium is operated on a 50/50 basis for everything else.
And incase you hadn't noticed this is boards.ie not the stadiums operating company boardroom all we can really do it guesswork for these sort of things.
And yes it is a factor, the IRFU aren't rolling around in money they can't afford to host games in Lansdowne Road and make a lose just because, there's a reason the Leinster schools final isn't held there anymore.

The Lost Sheep

D14Rugby wrote: »

It's not so much an assumption, it's more an educated guess based on the previous events and that the stadium is operated on a 50/50 basis for everything else.
And incase you hadn't noticed this is boards.ie not the stadiums operating company boardroom all we can really do it guesswork for these sort of things.
And yes it is a factor, the IRFU aren't rolling around in money they can't afford to host games in Lansdowne Road and make a lose just because, there's a reason the Leinster schools final isn't held there anymore.

Then you would never have any finals in some of the provincial stadiums.
Everything cant be down to the financials. The cost benefit analysis of getting all ireland underage finals outweigh in the long term the financial costs.
Same with underage finals in Donnybrook/Sportsground etc.

troyzer

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

D14Rugby wrote: »

It's not so much an assumption, it's more an educated guess based on the previous events and that the stadium is operated on a 50/50 basis for everything else.
And incase you hadn't noticed this is boards.ie not the stadiums operating company boardroom all we can really do it guesswork for these sort of things.
And yes it is a factor, the IRFU aren't rolling around in money they can't afford to host games in Lansdowne Road and make a lose just because, there's a reason the Leinster schools final isn't held there anymore.

Then you would never have any finals in some of the provincial stadiums.
Everything cant be down to the financials. The cost benefit analysis of getting all ireland underage finals outweigh in the long term the financial costs.
Same with underage finals in Donnybrook/Sportsground etc.

Just to play devil's advocate here, what is the primary goal of moving more games to Lansdowne?

Are people really going to pay to watch a match that they're not willing to go to for free?

Why is it necessarily a concern that people don't attend club games?

As someone who doesn't go to many club games, I'm interested to hear your answers here. You're clearly the most passionately pro club person here. So what value do you see in getting more people watching club rugby? Or is it just for the sake of it?

I think answering those questions would go a long way to deciding the AIL's future.

The Lost Sheep

troyzer wrote: »

Just to play devil's advocate here, what is the primary goal of moving more games to Lansdowne?

Are people really going to pay to watch a match that they're not willing to go to for free?

Why is it necessarily a concern that people don't attend club games?

As someone who doesn't go to many club games, I'm interested to hear your answers here. You're clearly the most passionately pro club person here. So what value do you see in getting more people watching club rugby? Or is it just for the sake of it?

I think answering those questions would go a long way to deciding the AIL's future.

Its about recognition of the competitions, for the players the clubs involved. The premier all ireland competitions should be played in the countries premier rugby venue.
And the all ireland youths finals are not free to go to. There is a cost.
The value in people attending club games more is about the community aspect, the long term goal. For younger people if they have kids it will be through clubs that their initial forays into rugby will be if they play the sport etc and having ties helps keep that going. This is much more than simply the AIL

troyzer

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

troyzer wrote: »

Just to play devil's advocate here, what is the primary goal of moving more games to Lansdowne?

Are people really going to pay to watch a match that they're not willing to go to for free?

Why is it necessarily a concern that people don't attend club games?

As someone who doesn't go to many club games, I'm interested to hear your answers here. You're clearly the most passionately pro club person here. So what value do you see in getting more people watching club rugby? Or is it just for the sake of it?

I think answering those questions would go a long way to deciding the AIL's future.

Its about recognition of the competitions, for the players the clubs involved. The premier all ireland competitions should be played in the countries premier rugby venue.
And the all ireland youths finals are not free to go to. There is a cost.
The value in people attending club games more is about the community aspect, the long term goal. For younger people if they have kids it will be through clubs that their initial forays into rugby will be if they play the sport etc and having ties helps keep that going. This is much more than simply the AIL

Alright well I don't have kids and we have no intention of having any.

We also don't have a rugby team in our area. There's one close by but it's the next parish over as they say.

I understand what you mean about building communities etc. But to be honest, is it normal for people to attend their local club amateur games in any sport? There's a soccer club 50m from my house, nobody goes to the games. Unless of course you have a family member playing. There's also a cricket team just up the road, they play regularly enough and you'd see them walking to the shop. I've never seen more than a handful of people watching.

The entire concept of going to an amateur game just for the sake of it is weird to me. And that's obviously quite common.

What you seem to be talking about more is engagement with the club in general but I would argue that attending games is a poor proxy for that. I have no club to join in my area. I wouldn't feel that community spirit with a club that I have to jump on the M50 to get to.

I'm starting to ramble a bit here. I'm just struggling to understand why it's important to get people to watch amateur sport. I've gone to a few Trinity games but that's more nostalgia for when I studied there. They were also handy enough times just before a few internationals in Lansdowne. I wouldn't have gone otherwise.

Stainalert

D14Rugby wrote: »

Can't really have more as the events are pretty much split 50/50 football/rugby then extra events on top of that so for every rugby match you add you're adding another football match. And every event has to go towards the stadium board and if the FAI can't match it they'll probably try block it or get in on the revenue. The stadium is also pretty expensive to open and run.

Don't think that's how it works

Stainalert

Squidgy Black wrote: »

Angus Lloyd started for Clontarf and Conor O'Brien and Vakh Abdaladze came on off the bench.

Thought it was a great game of rugby in general. Clontarf really didn't make the most of their opportunities in the first half whilst Con did the exact opposite and then started the 2nd half really well. Thought the ref had a very good game and allowed the game flow. Great to see Pro's like Duncan Williams getting stuck in to help out their club and nice way for him to sign off. Paul Barr has done a really excellent job in getting Con playing a more expansive game and it has really paid dividends. Tough result for Clontarf but given the strength of their U'20s this season I think we will be seeing a lot more of them in the future.

Stainalert

Also well done to UCC on staying up. Expect them to be stronger again next season with more experience.

Tough finish for Old Wesley but they have played some great rugby this season.

FellasFellas

To be fair, the closeness of 1B showed this season that the teams there aren't ready to come up yet. UCC showed that they were definitely better than ninth this season in 1A, hopefully Hinch dont yoyo back down to 1B again.

The Lost Sheep

troyzer wrote: »

Alright well I don't have kids and we have no intention of having any.

We also don't have a rugby team in our area. There's one close by but it's the next parish over as they say.

How far away is it

I understand what you mean about building communities etc. But to be honest, is it normal for people to attend their local club amateur games in any sport? There's a soccer club 50m from my house, nobody goes to the games. Unless of course you have a family member playing. There's also a cricket team just up the road, they play regularly enough and you'd see them walking to the shop. I've never seen more than a handful of people watching.

The entire concept of going to an amateur game just for the sake of it is weird to me. And that's obviously quite common.

Yes its extremely normal. GAA are the perfect example of whole upport.

What you seem to be talking about more is engagement with the club in general but I would argue that attending games is a poor proxy for that. I have no club to join in my area. I wouldn't feel that community spirit with a club that I have to jump on the M50 to get to.

Attending games is only part of engagement in a club. I worked on a job scheme in my local GAA club for a year. Huge proportion of the footfall was not directly linked to hurling(gaelic doesnt exist by and large in the club). Between cards, pilates classes, the gym, irish dancing the ground was busy most evenings.

I'm starting to ramble a bit here. I'm just struggling to understand why it's important to get people to watch amateur sport. I've gone to a few Trinity games but that's more nostalgia for when I studied there. They were also handy enough times just before a few internationals in Lansdowne. I wouldn't have gone otherwise.

power of community. link to who you are a member of etc.

Stainalert

Is there a new thread yet?

The Lost Sheep

Stainalert wrote: »

Is there a new thread yet?

there is now...