The 8th amendment referendum - part 4

Cabaal

Python Desk wrote: »

There is an argument to be made for those who believe abortion is immoral to make it illegal to travel for abortion. Both yes side and no side are putting their heads in the sand.

Ok, so you think abortions are wrong.
Do you think we should enforce our existing laws and charge and jail thousands of women for breaking said laws?

You've ignored this question already, are you going to ignore it again.

Do you not have respect for our existing laws?

Overheal

pleas advice wrote: »

And rape didn't happen in marriage before 1990?

Again you’re talking about sovereign persons. A woman is a sovereign person. A fetus is not, it has no self-ownership.

Cabaal

gmisk wrote: »

The John waters one was an absolute Disaster! His cursing and walking out was bizarre.

I really wanted the no side to put John forward for the debate lastnight after Cora chickened out.

for the comedy factor it would have been great to hear him say f**k off on live tv
:pac::pac::pac:

Cupcake_Crisis

Itssoeasy wrote: »

Well going of this thread it seems that posters were surprised at how he did.

Consensus I’m getting on Twitter too, a lot of people pleasantly surprised. He had a big task considering how well Lisa Chambers spoke the night before.

Zubeneschamali

cournioni wrote: »

So killing an unborn is the solution to this?

Yes, without restriction up to 12 weeks. For medical reasons after that up to viability.

This is not news - it is in the recommendations from the Citizens Assembly and Oireachteas Committee which are the basis for this Referendum, and have been widely publicized.

If you are only finding this out days before the vote, you should maybe read up:

https://www.refcom.ie/

nullzero

Overheal wrote: »

You really are acting like a cretin.

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Overheal

nullzero wrote: »

You really are acting like a cretin.

“Play the ball not the man.”

gmisk

Cupcake_Crisis wrote: »

Consensus I’m getting on Twitter too, a lot of people pleasantly surprised. He had a big task considering how well Lisa Chambers spoke the night before.

Was Lisa Chambers the person on tonight show on Tuesday ? I didn't know her before that show but she was very good alright.

nullzero

Overheal wrote: »

Again you’re talking about sovereign persons. A woman is a sovereign person. A fetus is not, it has no self-ownership.

Perhaps you could qualify what makes a person Sovereign?

nullzero

Overheal wrote: »

“Play the ball not the man.”

You're not playing the ball yourself, you understand the concept of hypocrisy I take it?

Cupcake_Crisis

gmisk wrote: »

Was that Lisa Chambers the person on tonight show? I didn't know her before that show but she was very good alright.

The very one. She was incredibly articulate on the tonight show, I’d confidently say she swayed a few undecided voters.

Zubeneschamali

Python Desk wrote: »

Ans what will the ues campaign do to protect the unborn?

Nothing - we will take away their equal right to life, and allow women access to abortion services without restriction up to 12 weeks.

Because we oppose the equal right to life of the unborn at a fundamental level.

gmisk

....... wrote: »

Peak crazy? :D:D

http://www.thejournal.ie/no-sign-dublin-mountains-4028941-May2018/

Unfortunately it's only weds so more of this rubbish likely to be rolled out before friday zzz

average_runner

One question I like to ask the No group. Your campaign is all about protecting the baby in the womb and I agree with that while the baby is alive or can survive while born and not in agony, but you don't mention anything about protecting the mother when the baby is not alive in the womb or protecting the mother and her children she is already a mother to. Can you explain why?

The reason why I am voting Yes is to protect the mother when she needs the protection. I originally wasn't going to vote. I believe the people who just want abortion for non medical reasons will just go to the UK anyhow.

I am a male also if that actually matters.

Overheal

nullzero wrote: »

Perhaps you could qualify what makes a person Sovereign?

In a nutshell: free will

Here’s an essay if you’d like to philosophize it further: https://www.huna.org/html/perssov.html

Zubeneschamali

cournioni wrote: »

Adoption? Foster care? There are plenty of loving people who do not have the ability to procreate who would give up everything to have the ability to have a child.

How many adoptions of Irish children in Ireland last year?

How much capacity to adopt the 3500 unborn aborted just in England?

Overheal

nullzero wrote: »

You're not playing the ball yourself, you understand the concept of hypocrisy I take it?

What hypocrisy? Still waiting on that proof you are so burdened with.

Cupcake_Crisis

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

How many adoptions of Irish children in Ireland last year?

How much capacity to adopt the 3500 unborn aborted just in England?

There was 5 adoptions in Ireland last year.

nullzero

Overheal wrote: »

In a nutshell: free will

Here’s an essay if you’d like to philosophize it further: https://www.huna.org/html/perssov.html

Nice opinion piece, good to know your personal beliefs, why do you peddle them as fact?

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Overheal

Cupcake_Crisis wrote: »

There was 5 adoptions in Ireland last year.

Sad figures all sides agree as there are a disproportionate number of applicants looking to adopt. Adoption in Ireland should become a chief political issue in the near future to be redressed, though I don’t think it’s a panacea for replacing abortions.

Overheal

nullzero wrote: »

Nice opinion piece, good to know your personal beliefs, why do you peddle them as fact?

You asked me to qualify what makes a person sovereign. It’s a philosophical question in most respects so I gave you my viewpoint. I don’t see the problem here. Get off my dick.

nullzero

Overheal wrote: »

You asked me to qualify what makes a person sovereign. It’s a philosophical question in most respects so I gave you my viewpoint. I don’t see the problem here. Get off my dick.

Wonderful retort, my apologies to your member.

NuMarvel

....... wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

I think we passed peak crazy when Cora Sherlock posted a video to say she didn't pull out of the debate last night even though she was nowhere to be seen!

http://www.thejournal.ie/cora-sherlock-prime-time-4029067-May2018/

Water John

There is talk of, open adoption. This is where there are no chinese walls between the sets of parents. Has a place. Many would be more comfortable with that option, I think.

Overheal

nullzero wrote: »

Wonderful retort, my apologies to your member.

Better than your accusing me of being mentally retarded, I think you will agree.

seamus

nullzero wrote: »

Perhaps you could qualify what makes a person Sovereign?

Legally, in Ireland, there are two conditions you must meet to be a sovereign person:

1. You have to have gestated for at least 24 weeks, or weigh more than 500 grammes.

2. You have to be born


If you don't meet either of these two conditions, you don't qualify.

nullzero

Overheal wrote: »

Better than your accusing me of being mentally retarded, I think you will agree.

Acting like something and being something aren't the same. Again you failed to grasp the qualifying statement.

Overheal

seamus wrote: »

Legally, in Ireland, there are two conditions you must meet to be a sovereign person:

1. You have to have gestated for at least 24 weeks, or weigh more than 500 grammes.

2. You have to be born


If you don't meet either of these two conditions, you don't qualify.

Wouldn’t have known there was a legal definition but it makes sense it would be a requisite for establishing statutory law. Thanks for sharing.