Long surname issue with NDLS

lightpause

Hi Guys/Girls,

I've a bit of a problem. Having lived in Ireland for 14 years and due to the crazy prices of car insurance (and the descrimination that non nationals receive in these quotes), I have recently applied for an Irish Driving License.

The problem is that I have 4 surnames and they are long and don't fit the assigned spaces. I've offered to drop one of the middle names or even move the first middle name into the given names area but to no avail... to cut a long story short, they are forcing me to either get a PSC card done with the name I want or or to take it without actual surname (last name) which will be the ones almost everyone in the world will use and will not match my other documentation (passport, id,etc).

So, they can fit the last letter of my last name and that's all. I'm wondering if this will cause problems with authorities in other jurisdictions as well as with Gardaí and possibly insurance companies.

Aparently they can use one letter for my last name but can't do the same for any of my middle names which seems rather odd and very unhelpful.

I don't know if there are any EU or even Irish guidelines on long name abbreviations but I can't imagine that I'm the first one who's last name doesn't fit.

I would appreciate any help. Thank you.

Rodrigo

Glass fused light

lightpause wrote: »

I have recently applied for an Irish Driving License.

The problem is that I have 4 surnames and they are long and don't fit the assigned spaces. I've offered to drop one of the middle names or even move the first middle name into the given names area but to no avail... to cut a long story short, they are forcing me to either get a PSC card done with the name I want or or to take it without actual surname (last name) which will be the ones almost everyone in the world will use and will not match my other documentation (passport, id,etc).

Do you already have a PSC?
Have you called Social Welfare about what you have to do to get PSC with a different name? It would normaly take proof of 2 years usage of your new name and you dont have that.

The lenght of your name is a data processing problem. I would suggest that you call the Data Protection, and explain your difficulty and see if they can approach them on your behalf.

https://www.dataprotection.ie/docs/EN/Contact-us/m/11.htm

lightpause

Glass fused light wrote: »

Do you already have a PSC?
Have you called Social Welfare about what you have to do to get PSC with a different name? It would normaly take proof of 2 years usage of your new name and you dont have that.

The lenght of your name is a data processing problem. I would suggest that you call the Data Protection, and explain your difficulty and see if they can approach them on your behalf.

https://www.dataprotection.ie/docs/EN/Contact-us/m/11.htm

Yes I do, part of the problem is that in my PSC card they did the same thing but doesn't even fit the last letter of the last name so they just eliminated it completely. I've never worried about this because I thought this would never amount to anything, it is just an Irish card with no other use than the public services. Well I've used my last name since I was born so there will be no problem in providing 40 years of records if they want. My issue is their intransigence. I either do that or they will nor process my application and no refund, I'll have to apply again.

I've never seen such behavior. It was them that told me to apply like this and the poor clerk girl in their office even rang Cork to make sure that it was ok to pass one of the surnames to the given names. The name is exactly the same it is only a question of where it appears in the document or they could even abbreviate or eliminate one of the middle names just not the most important one.

Glass fused light

lightpause wrote: »

Yes I do, part of the problem is that in my PSC card they did the same thing but doesn't even fit the last letter of the last name so they just eliminated it completely. I've never worried about this because I thought this would never amount to anything, it is just an Irish card with no other use than the public services. Well I've used my last name since I was born so there will be no problem in providing 40 years of records if they want. My issue is their intransigence. I either do that or they will nor process my application and no refund, I'll have to apply again.

I've never seen such behavior. It was them that told me to apply like this and the poor clerk girl in their office even rang Cork to make sure that it was ok to pass one of the surnames to the given names. The name is exactly the same it is only a question of where it appears in the document or they could even abbreviate or eliminate one of the middle names just not the most important one.

You have a basic data processing issue so phone the DPC on both.

The PSC is an offical document without which you can be locked out of the services you are entitled to for "free". IMO its a national ID card roll out by stealth, but without the upsides of the national bit. You are already being excluded obtaining a driving licence due to a processing issue.

The spacing for the driving licence is just a computer says no. Would it have enough spaces for th name on your PSC?

Marcusm

lightpause wrote: »

Yes I do, part of the problem is that in my PSC card they did the same thing but doesn't even fit the last letter of the last name so they just eliminated it completely. I've never worried about this because I thought this would never amount to anything, it is just an Irish card with no other use than the public services. Well I've used my last name since I was born so there will be no problem in providing 40 years of records if they want. My issue is their intransigence. I either do that or they will nor process my application and no refund, I'll have to apply again.

I've never seen such behavior. It was them that told me to apply like this and the poor clerk girl in their office even rang Cork to make sure that it was ok to pass one of the surnames to the given names. The name is exactly the same it is only a question of where it appears in the document or they could even abbreviate or eliminate one of the middle names just not the most important one.

Might (admittedly limited) experience with NDLS is that it is simply a time sink dealing with them. Choose how you want to move forward and tell them. Expecting a sentient individual to deal with is unlikely to be successful. Aggressive automatons need apply.

lightpause

Marcusm wrote: »

Might (admittedly limited) experience with NDLS is that it is simply a time sink dealing with them. Choose how you want to move forward and tell them. Expecting a sentient individual to deal with is unlikely to be successful. Aggressive automatons need apply.

That pretty much resumes my experience the last couple of times I spoke to them on the phone both times over an hour and both times I've had to request to speak with a supervisor about the issues as I kept getting put on hold. Even the supervisors put you on hold and aren't very helpful it seems. It just annoys me that they say they can't initial the middle names but then are fine with initialling the most important name. Makes zero sense.

lightpause

Glass fused light wrote: »

You have a basic data processing issue so phone the DPC on both.

The PSC is an offical document without which you can be locked out of the services you are entitled to for "free". IMO its a national ID card roll out by stealth, but without the upsides of the national bit. You are already being excluded obtaining a driving licence due to a processing issue.

The spacing for the driving licence is just a computer says no. Would it have enough spaces for th name on your PSC?

Thanks for the sugggestion I will try to reach out tomorrow.

No it doens't seem to fit on the PSC card either and I remember hearing on Newstalk recently all the controversy about the PSC card and the roll out of it as a national ID card but some minister came to say that it wouldn't be a requirement. That they could not force you to get one.

I do have one but is missing my surname completely, I never paid attention to it since I never expected that it would be used as an ID card and certainly not outside the country whereas my drivers license will be, even outside the continent on multiple occasions where it will be cross referenced to my passport and then my last name won't match. I'm already envisioning all sorts of problems.

Another issue is that if I want to tell them to not go ahead they won't refund me even though they told me it was ok to apply like this and it would be no problem.

It is the worst bit of public service I've encountered in this country in the 14 years I've lived here.

hullaballoo

From a legal perspective, the decision to refuse to issue a licence in your name is probably something that can be looked at by the courts but this is an expensive process.

I am unsure how practical a suggestion this is but speaking to a solicitor may be an option. You may be required to put in an internal appeal before taking things further but if the appeal is lodged on your behalf by a lawyer, it may have a better outcome than trying to conduct it yourself.

Glass fused light

hullaballoo wrote: »

From a legal perspective, the decision to refuse to issue a licence in your name is probably something that can be looked at by the courts but this is an expensive process.

I am unsure how practical a suggestion this is but speaking to a solicitor may be an option. You may be required to put in an internal appeal before taking things further but if the appeal is lodged on your behalf by a lawyer, it may have a better outcome than trying to conduct it yourself.

The cheaper short term option may be waiting until the new data protection rules come into play and make a formal complaint internally, and then to the DPC.

lightpause

Thanks everyone for the replies. I really appreciate it. So today I took another half day to get into the social offices to check what would take to change the name on the PSC card.

The reply: What name do you want to show on the card? Write it down and I'll do it for you here. The card will take 5 days to arrive though.

I've since had to take 2 half days off work and 2 monhts delays to take care of an issue that their office told me initially was ok. I had to drive to their office twice and will have to do it a third time yet to give the PSC card when apparently in the state to issue an official card in another service that will serve as proof for this all it takes is for me to say how I want my name to show. Why can't they just initial one of the names and are ok with initialling the most important name (the last one).

Anyone with more than one brain cell would realise this. Innitialing a name when it doesn't fit is something that is almost universally in the world.

Fred Swanson

This post has been deleted.

lightpause

I've always praised the public service in Ireland and in fairness in most of my dealings with anything public, when I compare it to Portugal (where I was born), Ireland has always come out ahead, until this time. I can safely say that I've never experienced such dose of unhelpfullness, intransigence and pure and simple lack of intelligence and common sense as with these people. Having said that I must praise the girls in the Wicklow office, they were really nice and helpful but the people in the head office were the worst I've ever had to deal with, they brought rudeness, narrow mindness and unhelpfullness to a whole new level.

I have logged a complaint with the NDLS about their dealing with this situation. I will probably log another complaint with them and ask for a full refund of the monies paid in lieu of the time, stress and money I spent sorting one situation that they told me in the office was ok.

My advice to anyone dealing with these guys/girls... beware, make sure you have all the i's dotted and the t's crossed or they will find a way to make a mess out of everything.