Charging Infrastucture - am I missing something?

KrustyBurger

Evening folks.

Got my new Ioniq a couple of weeks ago, love it and despite some comments on here love it in white as well!

Decided to take it for a spin to Donegal to see family yesterday. As you know it was Fri 13th. Managed to scratch the car (lightly) before setting off so not a great start. Things went downhill after that.

Drove to Monaghan and realised that all the green points on the ecars app were for the slower public chargers. Easy newbie mistake. Drove to Dungannon - 30 mins out of my route - to the only fast charger available. It showed as operational on the app. Plugged it in and then it went out of order. The staff at ecars rebooted it a few times without any joy. Drove back to Monaghan and managed to arrive there with 20kms remaining at 8pm. Charging would take 4 hours so with 2 kids in tow I booked into a hotel.

Drove back to Dublin this morning as I'd be faced with the same issue on the way back.

Am I missing something? I rang ecars and the man I spoke to expressed surprise at the lack of CCS fast chargers north of Dublin-Galway line. There's one in Dungannon and another in Laghy (Donegal so no use enroute).

If this is really the case then I can't drive to Donegal without a 4 hour stopover or risk the fast charge in Dungannon which may or may not be operational.

stesaurus

You clearly did zero research before buying. But zero research before attempting a journey like that????

KrustyBurger

stesaurus wrote: »

You clearly did zero research before buying. But zero research before attempting a journey like that????

I have no need or desire to defend the research I did before buying the car. Nor about undertaking the journey.

Maybe you could address the question i.e.the geographic polarisation of the fast chargers?

Clearly there are issues with the network, we've debated this for a long time here. Hopefully things will start moving again this year as the ESB are in negotiations with Topaz to upgrade existing chargers, whether this means all will be the new triple headed units and/or install more than one charger per site remains to be seen.

Ionity are due to have 1 site of 4 x fast chargers up and running by the end of the summer and plan to complete another 3 sites by the same time next year, all on or close to the motorways.

Topaz also plan to install their own charging network but there's no ETA on this.

Don't dismiss AC points, if you can get to town , plug in and in 3-4 hrs you could be fully charged, even 2 hrs will give you a good boost needing less time at fast chargers. While doing your business, having meal etc AC is really great.

Dglflyer

Being from the "forgotten" county of Donegal , it bites. Monaghan , Letterkenny and Sligo desperately need CCS chargers. On a recent
trip from Dublin to Donegal had to "camp out" in Cavan for two hours slow charging ( I drive an Ioniq) for my sins. Living in Ennis , we just got a CCS charger there, so the ESB does listen. It will take time, or you could trade up to a Kona (when it comes )

Dglflyer

In the same vein am planning a trip from Ennis to Dublin tomorrow , ,are the Midway and Ballinacolla CCS charges operational. I got burned at the Midway CCS charger on the last trip , map wasnt updated

thelikelylad

The north west is a bit of black hole when it comes to CCS points and I wouldn't count on that changing anytime soon unfortunately. One glimmer of hope is that ecars have actually replaced 2 CHAdeMO FCPs with triple standard units recently - Newcastle West and Ennis. They should really do the same with the Monaghan FCP but again I wouldn't count on it happening anytime soon. You could send an email to ecars about your experience with the lack of CCS points. I wouldn't bother saying it to the guys on the phone - these guys are in a 3rd party call centre working on behalf of ecars.

On the topic of the journey itself. I find it better to stop for a charge earlier than necessary to be safe. Can I ask where in Donegal you were headed for?

For Dublin to say Letterkenny I would aim for Castlebellingham North for my first stop. Or if I wanted to play it super safe, Lidl in Drogheda first with Castlebellingham North then as a backup. If Drogheda and Castlebellingham were both down then Dungannon would be a 3rd option. You'd be very unlucky to hit 3 broken FCPs but again you'd never know. Even if you were able to charge ok in Castlebellingham North it might still be an option to head for Dungannon anyway for a quick top-up.

I wouldn't disregard the option of stopping at a SCP on a long journey either. 30mins would give 10%/20km which may get you out of trouble later on in the journey.

KrustyBurger

thelikelylad wrote: »

The north west is a bit of black hole when it comes to CCS points and I wouldn't count on that changing anytime soon unfortunately. One glimmer of hope is that ecars have actually replaced 2 CHAdeMO FCPs with triple standard units recently - Newcastle West and Ennis. They should really do the same with the Monaghan FCP but again I wouldn't count on it happening anytime soon. You could send an email to ecars about your experience with the lack of CCS points. I wouldn't bother saying it to the guys on the phone - these guys are in a 3rd party call centre working on behalf of ecars.

On the topic of the journey itself. I find it better to stop for a charge earlier than necessary to be safe. Can I ask where in Donegal you were headed for?

For Dublin to say Letterkenny I would aim for Castlebellingham North for my first stop. Or if I wanted to play it super safe, Lidl in Drogheda first with Castlebellingham North then as a backup. If Drogheda and Castlebellingham were both down then Dungannon would be a 3rd option. You'd be very unlucky to hit 3 broken FCPs but again you'd never know. Even if you were able to charge ok in Castlebellingham North it might still be an option to head for Dungannon anyway for a quick top-up.

I wouldn't disregard the option of stopping at a SCP on a long journey either. 30mins would give 10%/20km which may get you out of trouble later on in the journey.

I'd be going to Letterkenny.
Before the ev I'd go via Monaghan, Omagh, Letterkenny. That'll have to change now obviously!

If there was a FC at Monaghan it'd fit the bill perfectly. I'll definitely be emailing the ESB about this.

My other option is to simply hire a car for the week-end but that's sort of beside the point. As ev owners we should be able to travel to the top half of the country as easily as the bottom half.

It's odd that that there's such a polarisation in the fast chargers. You'd think that there'd be a planned roll-out for the country.

Dglflyer

FYI , the new fast charger in Ennis is not on line yet

Orebro

Utter disgrace that the salesperson in the dealership didn’t go through the charging of your car properly with you before/during the purchase.

KrustyBurger

Naw that's on me! The app is easy to use in fairness. My issue is with the obvious and, at least to me, mystifying geographic polarisation of fast chargers. Evs have been around for a few years nows it's not too much to ask that the infrastructure would be at least fit for purpose.

Well , until it was known who was going to take control of the infrastructure after the trial phase the ESB were not going to invest their own money.

All the chargers installed are either paid for by the E.U or paid by the tax payer through the CER who oversaw the trial project.

It took 6 years for this decision to be finally made and the ESb are free to do with the network what they want, so hopefully now they will get the finger out.

By the way the Ionity chargers will be 150 Kw and I hope the ESB upgrade to 100+ Kw but I do not know of any triple headed chargers capable of 100 Kw +.

The Ionity chargers will be CCS only so the ESB might have to install CCS only chargers that are 100+ kw and ChaDeMo owners should know that the future is CCS.

I would really hate to think that the ESB install crappy 45 Kw chargers after all this time knowing that 100+ kw cars are not that far from being released.

The first of those could be the 60 Kwh Leaf by mid to late 2019, the Kona can take just 70 Kw which is odd with a 64 Kwh battery.

It would be a crying shame to see 100+ capable cars stuck to 45 Kw chargers that would be a disaster so while ChaDeMo owners might suffer the writing is on the wall I think for this standard in Europe and the U.S.

KrustyBurger

Thanks for that, I hadn't realised the history of the network setup.

I've faith in the ESB. They run a very successful operation both here and abroad so hopefully they'll sort out the situation pronto.

I hope they do but we also need the manufacturers to get the finger out and make more electric models, so far this year EV sales and plug ins accounted for a really pathetic 0.6% of total new car sales and this may not be incentive enough for the ESB to invest, on the other hand we need to get the network right today, they need to invest for the future.

Min 4 x 150 Kw chargers per site is what's required in the busier spots. That will allow some future proofing.

IF the ESB are taking the p1ss we'll see new charger sites of just 45 Kw chargers and not 100+ Kw. That means any EV in the future that is 100 Kw capable has to charge at 45 Kw and that means they have to stay much longer than they need to meaning someone in a queue has to wait even longer etc.

Also free charging is coming to an end, how soon we don't know, can the ESB really charge people for such a sh1t network ? on the other hand if they did start to charge it would greatly cut down on the amount of people using the chargers for free electricity while they shop etc leaving the person who needs it waiting outside for up to 1 hr, that can't continue.

Shopping centre charging sites should be abolished or at least install 20 Kw chargers in such places where it's not a complete waste of infrastructure or cause of great inconvenience to those who need the chargers, in other words put the high power chargers on the motorways and main national routes.

nailer54321

Just out of curiosity what is the time frame for ordering an ionic, how long a wait from start to finish.

KrustyBurger

If it's white they may well have it in stock otherwise it could be a few months afaik.

nailer54321

Thanks for that, thinking of going electric but have a few worries, not sure if it is too early to go fill electric, i travel on average 140km per day.

Have you considered 22 or 33 Kw i3 Rex ?

22 Kwh should do 100-120 Kms 33 Kwh 150-180 kms depending on conditions and speed but the Rex. I have a similar commute but have work charging so have not really put it to the test, I know I did it 2 or 3 times and had about 20% left driving slower so it's more than possible in the 33 Kwh.

The 22 Kwh you'd have to use some petrol for about 40-45 Kms give or take depending on speed, conditions and it gets 40 odd mpg on petrol.

The beauty of the Rex is that while the infrastructure is not so good now you can eliminate completely any charging if you want on a long trip or if chargers are in use or broken.

nailer54321

@mad_lad thamks for that, i have a lot of thinking to do, was reading about the kona ev which should have a range of 380km if thats correct. I want something that will do the millage and also i would be looking at how much the battery will depleat over a few years,

No bother,

Yes the Kona should have decent range but I am being critical of it and I don't think too much so, it looks cheap and nasty inside and it's about 35K give or take, I'd be expecting a lot better. I'm sure there are a lot who will be happy with it and that's good the more electrics on the road the better and Hyundai deserve a lot of credit for getting it out there.

In other words, I do not need the range of the Kona often but I'd be glad of it all the same if I had to go full EV, so personally I'd rather a high spec i3 Rex that's super fun to drive and a lot higher quality2nd hand for the same money or not much more than the Kona,it's not to everyone's taste and it's not practical for those who need a lot of space and if I need to use some petrol now and then I can live with it for now.

Availability of the Kona is another matter.

Regarding battery longevity , the i3 33 Kwh is holding up well and the 33 Kwh is too early to know but their battery specs in theory should provide 500,000 kms to 80% battery capacity which would be absolutely mega if it pans out, on paper it looks good but the reality could be different.

With the Rex the worst that will happen is that you may use a bit more petrol with a BEV you loose range.

But absolutely the Kona should have pretty decent range the question you have to ask is, or rather I would ask is would I be happy with the Kona, Range V quality, in the i3 I got both and for a few grand more I got a pretty amazing car, 9 months old and 9,500 Kms.

If I had to make the choice between the Ioniq and Kona I would probably choose the Kona for more power and range but it will cost more, the i3 is a fun high quality car but can go anywhere without the need to worry about charging or chargers or even queues.

Anyway I'm only throwing the idea out there only you can decide what's best for you.

liamog

There's a thread with lots of info on the Kona Electric, so far looks like a 400km range car with 80kW charging speeds. It will be CCS so will have the same NW of Ireland problem, though hopefully eCars will continue to replace the CHADeMO only chargers.

The aesthetic of the Kona is very similar to the Ioniq, if you're OK with the Ioniq interior then you should be ok with it.
A new I3 is going to cost €5,000 more than a Kona, and €10,000 more if you want the REX version.

With all the CCS cars coming out, the number of CCS chargers is only going to increase.

I wasn't talking about a new i3.......

A kona won't have 400 Kms range at 120 Kph roughly 300, still not bad though.

And no the Kona is not like the ioniq inside which I thought was a lot nicer.

Where's all the CCS cars coming out ? Niro, Kona, neither are on the road yet.

The infrastructure greatly needs to improve but we're not at that point yet, not by a long shot.

thierry14

nailer54321 wrote: »

@mad_lad thamks for that, i have a lot of thinking to do, was reading about the kona ev which should have a range of 380km if thats correct. I want something that will do the millage and also i would be looking at how much the battery will depleat over a few years,

Battery won't depleat in our climate on modern Evs from Tesla/Hyundai/VW/Kia etc ( only the crap Renault-Nissan group to worry about )

We are a haven for Evs with our temperate climate, even a crappy battery new Leaf should be fine

Something like a Kona 64kWhwill do 2000 cycles to 80% capacity

Thats 800k km

Car will be long shot before battery is done

Well for starters the 24 Kwh Leaf battery is holding up pretty well over 160,000 kms at around 90% capacity and there's no real data on the 30 Kwh in Ireland either.

There's no data on the Kona battery or is there ? where did you see the data on the battery cells whether they are rated at 2000 cycles ?

Normally though a larger battery is not cycled nearly as much and this greatly helps extend life so I'm sure the Kona will have a long battery life.

And Renault do NOT use a Nissan battery they get their batteries form LG Chem.

nailer54321

#mad_lad thanks for that input, I have a lot to think about, i need to test drive a few different cars, but i do want to go full electric so millage is a big priority. Something like the kona range would work fine for me. Its s big step moving to electric so range is top of my list at the moment. Thanks again for your input.

liamog

Mad_Lad you've sat in the ICE Kona which has a drastically different interior. The reviewers who sat in the Kona Electric in Geneva all commented that the interior was very Ioniq like.

Moreilly

nailer54321 wrote: »

Thanks for that, thinking of going electric but have a few worries, not sure if it is too early to go fill electric, i travel on average 140km per day.

140km is no probs for the ioniq, whatever the weather, ive had one for quite a while now and would never go back

BUT......, its the day you dont do your average, it's the day when you get home from work and have another trip to do somewhere straight away with no time to charge at home that you might get caught out range wise, so it depends on your location and the location of public chargers and their type of the chargers around you, plus if it fits in with your general lifestyle
i reckon you wont regret the change though, but you will find yourself thinking ahead a little more than you would have with a ice car...

nailer54321

@Moreilly, Thanks for that, I have access to charge points in work but don't want to rely on them, I want to fine a battery range that will do my daily millage and have a bit for unplanned driving.

liamog

liamog wrote: »

Mad_Lad you've sat in the ICE Kona which has a drastically different interior. The reviewers who sat in the Kona Electric in Geneva all commented that the interior was very Ioniq like.

I'll reserve final judgement for the production model but from the pics and videos I saw it was horrid. Ok for the petrol 20K version in more basic trim I'd say grand but for 35 K........ anyway I'll wait and see.

liamog

You know what they say about personal taste, I'm not a huge fan of minimalist interiors, it's one of the reasons I've gone off the idea of buying a Model 3.

All cars have their own issues and there is always something better "just around the corner" in "18 to 24 months". If you need 140 km a day with a buffer any of the cars on market at the moment can do that with ease. In a lots of cases the makers are announcing future models just to delay other makers gaining market share.

When the 60 kWh cars are in the market many of you will say that 300 km on motorway is not enough, wait for the 90 kWh models which "are just around the corner" and that can do 450 km at 120 km/h. It's easy to overestimate your needs and then end up lugging extra battery around every day when cheaper small battery would have been the right option.

When there are two battery options the larger option will be a really high cost upgrade as for foreseeable future there still won't be enough batteries available in the market. Also don't expect many of these cars on sale as the makers won't be able to make many anyway due to above and secondly because traditional makers will manufacture just enough to just slip under the regulatory fleet wide emission targets. That way they can continue to pile legacy cars high and dry on people's driveways for as long as possible.

ED E

KrustyBurger wrote: »

KrustyBurger wrote: »

My issue is with the obvious and, at least to me, mystifying geographic polarisation of fast chargers.

Not sure you need a doctorate in something to see whats going on with that map.....



EV users barely warrant charges in the built up areas of the country, its not at all surprising that the NW is essentially dead.

KrustyBurger

I suppose it's the chicken and egg scenario. If the infrastructure is there then the evs will come.

ED E

Affluent motorists will buy EVs and fit charging pedestals in their gardens. This will create a market for charging around the periphery (Dubs create demand 150km in each direction). When demand reaches threshold locations fit FCPs there. That encourages locals in that area to buy EVs which then pushes a demand wave further out.

Another few years of ok EV sales and motorway services will cop to the fact how much food they can sell EV drivers while they charge.

Shefwedfan

Dglflyer wrote: »

Being from the "forgotten" county of Donegal , it bites. Monaghan , Letterkenny and Sligo desperately need CCS chargers. On a recent
trip from Dublin to Donegal had to "camp out" in Cavan for two hours slow charging ( I drive an Ioniq) for my sins. Living in Ennis , we just got a CCS charger there, so the ESB does listen. It will take time, or you could trade up to a Kona (when it comes )

A chance to sample the delights of Cavan town!!! how could you complain?

ELM327

Deleted User wrote: »

Well , until it was known who was going to take control of the infrastructure after the trial phase the ESB were not going to invest their own money.

All the chargers installed are either paid for by the E.U or paid by the tax payer through the CER who oversaw the trial project.

It took 6 years for this decision to be finally made and the ESb are free to do with the network what they want, so hopefully now they will get the finger out.

By the way the Ionity chargers will be 150 Kw and I hope the ESB upgrade to 100+ Kw but I do not know of any triple headed chargers capable of 100 Kw +.

The Ionity chargers will be CCS only so the ESB might have to install CCS only chargers that are 100+ kw and ChaDeMo owners should know that the future is CCS.

I would really hate to think that the ESB install crappy 45 Kw chargers after all this time knowing that 100+ kw cars are not that far from being released.

The first of those could be the 60 Kwh Leaf by mid to late 2019, the Kona can take just 70 Kw which is odd with a 64 Kwh battery.

It would be a crying shame to see 100+ capable cars stuck to 45 Kw chargers that would be a disaster so while ChaDeMo owners might suffer the writing is on the wall I think for this standard in Europe and the U.S.

Chademo isn't going anywhere.
CCS is the EU mandated standard but there's nothing to outlaw chademo.
It is the most populous charging standard here and the UK.

Chademo 1 is capable of 62.5kW max and chademo II is already up to 150kW in the wild. There are a number of 100kW chademo stations in Norway. The new Kia Soul charges at a similar speed to an Ioniq on a 100kW station.

I read a rumour online that Nissan were joining Ionity meaning that the new charger sites would have chademo and CCS. But instead it seems they have their own group.
https://insideevs.com/renault-nissan-joins-ultra-fast-charge-group-in-europe/

Ewan Hoosarmi

There are 2 CHAdeMO chargers on the Rosslare road, very close together, in Wexford. I e-mailed ecars and asked them if one could be converted to a CCS head.

Reading between the lines of the answer, it said. We're only going to maintain what's there.

The evidence suggests that they aren't even committed to that!

On another question. Rapid chargers seem to installed in Lidl, Ikea and some other retailers in the UK, but not here. Why? Are the Irish a lower class of customer, or do they know that we are too quiet.

If the charging network was better, there would be more uptake of EVs. Is there some lobby, maybe the SIMI, that don't want that to happen?

I asked about Nissan's plans a couple of months ago regarding the Ionity and this was their answer:

Thank you for contacting Nissan Ireland.

We are aware that Ionity announced towards the end of last year that plans were now laid out to launch a new CCS charging network in Europe, to include Ireland, and this roll out will continue through to at least the end of 2019.

Plans are already in place for the remainder of our dealer network to have Fast Chargers installed on their premises, where possible. As always Nissan Global and Nissan Europe continue to watch how the charging infrastructure develops and changes across Europe and will address the topic of of CHAdeMO vs CCS when they feel it necessary.

Kind Regards,
Nissan Ireland Zero Emissions Team.

KCross

Samih, that was a very non-committal response you got

My paraphrase....
We will install, where possible.
We will continue to watch
We will address the topic when we feel it necessary.


Basically, as we are, until the market pushes them.

I hope that "where possible" means that they will install one if there is enough electrical supply and space available for the installation. The "plans are already in place" and "remainder of our dealer network" sound promising anyway. It was in the news sometime last year that Nissan as a company have purchased lots of CHAdeMO and CCS 150 kW capable chargers that will be installed at dealers.

But yes, I agree, the answer was waffly at the best. As the new LEAF is selling fast there are no reasons why any dealer would voluntarily opt out from a free rapid charger.

KCross

samih wrote: »

I hope that "where possible" means that they will install one if there is enough electrical supply and space available for the installation.

But yes, I agree, the answer was waffly at the best. As the new LEAF is selling fast there are no reasons why any dealer would voluntarily opt out.

Yea, there is. It costs the dealer money.

Apparently there was a Nissan dealer in Kerry that removed the rapid because they were unwilling to pay for the electricity.

I also wonder, do they have to buy the rapid itself (albeit at large discount from Nissan?) and who pays for the installation and ground works to get that kind of power installed which will likely cost many thousands.

Selling a few Leafs might not be enough for some dealers to bite. Now, if Nissan are footing the bill then sure, who would opt out in that case, but I dont think that is the case based on the Kerry example.

ELM327

I was told from a friend in the trade that the chargers were paid for by the garage.
But that was a couple of years ago at this stage, when Nissan had special "EV garages".

True they need to pay for the power, would typically be a couple of Euro per car anyway. Can't speculate on that one particular dealer but based on dealings with other dealers I have called to over the years I haven't been made feel unwelcome anyway. As a matter of fact in Wexford and Carlow we have been invited for a coffee and chat while charging which has further increased their expenditure but we didn't get a feeling that they particularly hated us there.

Each sold LEAF brings probably a couple of grand of money for the dealer so if they sold even a handful of cars a year the costs don't sound too bad *if* Nissan pays for the charger itself.

Edit: I haven't taken the proverbial with the charge volume in any of the dealers during my travels. Maybe the local drivers helped themselves a bit too much of the free power in Kerry?

ELM327

ELM327 wrote: »

Chademo isn't going anywhere.
CCS is the EU mandated standard but there's nothing to outlaw chademo.
It is the most populous charging standard here and the UK.

Chademo 1 is capable of 62.5kW max and chademo II is already up to 150kW in the wild. There are a number of 100kW chademo stations in Norway. The new Kia Soul charges at a similar speed to an Ioniq on a 100kW station.

I read a rumour online that Nissan were joining Ionity meaning that the new charger sites would have chademo and CCS. But instead it seems they have their own group.
https://insideevs.com/renault-nissan-joins-ultra-fast-charge-group-in-europe/

I was told that the Ionity chargers will be ccs only 150 Kw this does not include ChaDeMo , perhaps they would have separate chargers 2 x ChaDeMo and 2 X CCS but that would be a waste and meaning if 4 CCS cars pulls up only 2 could charge, that's ridiculous.

Perhaps they will install 150 Kw ChadeMo + CCS but that's unlikely in the short term.

It makes no sense to have 2 charging standards considering the majority are adopting CCS.

ELM327

Deleted User wrote: »

I was told that the Ionity chargers will be ccs only 150 Kw this does not include ChaDeMo , perhaps they would have separate chargers 2 x ChaDeMo and 2 X CCS but that would be a waste and meaning if 4 CCS cars pulls up only 2 could charge, that's ridiculous.

Perhaps they will install 150 Kw ChadeMo + CCS but that's unlikely in the short term.

It makes no sense to have 2 charging standards considering the majority are adopting CCS.

But the majority of EV on the road are not compatible with CCS and I don't see that changing for some time.

Leafs will continue to be Chademo I would imagine, given Nissan's affinity to and investment in their network in Europe.

unkel

Ionity is CCS only, effectively the new DC charging standard for most of the world

Nissan will also have to provide all their cars with CCS going forward, but this is not yet mandatory either in Europe or in the US, but at some point it inevitably will, so I'm sure they're making plans to dump CHAdeMO and jump on the CCS / Ionity bandwagon

ELM327

unkel wrote: »

Ionity is CCS only, effectively the new DC charging standard for most of the world

Nissan will also have to provide all their cars with CCS going forward, but this is not yet mandatory either in Europe or in the US, but at some point it inevitably will, so I'm sure they're making plans to dump CHAdeMO and jump on the CCS / Ionity bandwagon

I guess we can revisit this thread in 5-7-10 years time, at which point you may be right.
But Chademo is not being replaced (repealed, if you can pardon the tired references), not for some time, as Nissan has spent probably millions in this little country alone, and more in the UK, with the chademo network.

Chademo will continue as a standard, it will just be less prevalent in the EU than before as time goes by. Especially if any new cars that are capable of 350kW are only on CCS and chademo is stuck to 62.5-100kW.

unkel

Ah yeah, the public and Nissan dealer CHAdeMO chargers are not going to disappear any time soon (hopefully :eek:)

Same as there will still be petrol stations long after the sale of new petrol / diesel cars will be banned...

ELM327

It's kindof like I surmised it would be a while ago. Today's 2014-15 fast chargers (50kW DC) will become the new semi fast charging in the future, and fast charging will then be 150-350kW. Kindof like Tesla's model today where you have the 120kW DC superchargers but also can use ~50kW DC and 16-22kW AC.

Dardania

It probably won't be so expensive to change the connector, as they have the hard work done: location, civils, power supply to it, comms etc.?

ELM327

Dardania wrote: »

It probably won't be so expensive to change the connector, as they have the hard work done: location, civils, power supply to it, comms etc.?

But it's not just a matter of changing the plug at the end of the wire, the comms protocol is very different between Chademo (which uses canbus, the automotive standard generally) and CCS which uses a different comms protocol.