How many weeks 'til I become a "morning person"?

CM24

So, I work the regular 9-5. For various reasons I've decided to start getting up 2 hours earlier, and hopefully going to sleep 2 hours earlier at night.

Today is my 5th day of forcing myself up at 6am. My body still hasn't adapted to it. I'll feel groggy during the day, sometimes dosing off whilst working at my desk, then at 10pm when I try to sleep, I just can't drift off.

I'm doing everything "right". I:

- Completely cut out caffeine, except for a weak cup in the morning.

- Try not to look at any bright screens just before bedtime.

- Sleep in a very dark room.

- Have a sunrise alarm clock that gradually brightens the room before 6am.

- Get my workout done first thing in the morning, so I can relax in the evening.

I'm determined to stick to this schedule until I adapt, and start naturally falling asleep at 10, getting a good 8 hours deep sleep, then rising like a lark in the morning.

Has anyone else succesfully transformed from night-owl to morning-lark? How long did it take?

monkeysnapper

I think maybe you should introduce it a bit slower , 2 hours is huge .

I'm no expert tho .

I'm still using cycle turbo in evenings in week , I hope to start going out in evenings in next few weeks in prep for cycle end of May.

I think 2 hours is to much , got to be an easier way.

silverharp

anything along those lines the advice was to back it up 15 minutes per day

Probably not what you want hear op but I'm not convinced it's really possible to do, and about a year back read some newish properly conducted scientific studies confirming same; if I find them again I'll post links. Gist was that the more 'night owl' you are, the harder it is to change because true night owls tend to have a circadian rhythm that runs long - e.g. 25 instead of 24 hours so its very very hard to calibrate backwards longterm - your trend will always be to longer days.

I'm mid-40s now and have tried all of your suggestions over the years before just giving up - only thing I could ever do was really grumpy sad morning cardio. Apart from your list I also tried afternoon /early evening naps, but they just made the second waking torture and physically exhausting myself - again, disaster because my mind still kicked into gear at night, and I wound up feeling wired for the sleepless night hours. And I really really tried and really really wanted to change because the world is geared for early birds! The more and longer I tried the worse I felt.

My physical performance is so much better at night it's crazy. Same with mood, mental capacity, endurance and patience. I never understood people who got tired or wanted to leave bars/go home early or who could wake up ready to go. I can't eat for hours after getting up early, and always have to watch that I'm not blatantly rude or grumpy if I have to talk or present at early work meetings. So now I just accept it and work around it - if I force too many early mornings I just crash from lack of sleep and end up doing or saying stupid things out of exhaustion. My father, and his family were all the exact same, so I'm convinced it's genetic and that's that!

CM24

Thanks for the replies guys. I know I should probably have gradually set my alarm a little bit earlier week-by-week, but I thought if I just suffered through the first day without caffeine or a nap, then I'd just naturally fall asleep early that night. Didn't happen!

@Caligirl, you're right, that's not really what I wanted to hear! I've been looking into it myself, and some people say you're genetically programmed to be either a morning person or a night person but then others say that only a small percentage of us are "true" night-owls, the rest of us have just convinced ourselves we are by staying up late browsing the internet/Netflix.

My sleeping habits were haywire during college, when I didn't have a fixed schedule, then they've been semi-decent whilst I've been working a 9-5. So I don't really know whether I'm a true night-owl or not.

I'm determined to give this a good go, for a month at least. A big motivator for me is that I'm very into kickboxing, and my training sessions are either at 6:30am or from 8pm - 9:30pm. I used to always go to the later one, but we always finish with sparring/HIIT, so I'd finish the session with my heart and mind absolutely racing, and then can't sleep til at least 1am.

The sessions are only Tuesday and Thursday mornings though, so I'm hoping to get my lifting sessions or a bit of work-prep done on the other days.

Forgot to mention, the supplements that I take that are supposed to help with sleep are zinc & magnesium, Ashwagandha, and some night-time tea. Can't say they help much though. The magnesium gives me a really deep sleep and some crazy vivid dreams, but it doesn't actually help me get to sleep faster. It also makes me groggier in the morning, I find.

If only melatonin was readily available in Ireland, it's the only thing I've taken that helped me to doze off.

Anwyay, I'll bump this thread in a fortnight with an update!

Ooh - forgot to mention: I find Melatonin great (esp when taken with gaba and 5-htp which I think are both available here), but am terrified to over use (melatonin is technically a hormone). I try to limit it to when I'm jet lagged or exhausted and take only lower doses of 1 - 3 mg. Oh or if I've been sparring late (these days I only do occasional light/touch sparring) or high intensity cardio. I stock up when in the US.
marksdailyapple.com has some good background on melatonin.

G'luck with the experiments!

DM_7

I have changed my get up time over the years due to work and commute. Anywhere from 5am to 8.30am.

Just focus on getting up at the time you want to. Your going to bed time will fall in line soon enough. Also eat at regular times, if you are up earlier your food intake will need to be in line.

The big list of changes suggests you have a lot of planning and thought going into it. Maybe all that thought is making it more difficult to sleep, you are not relaxed enough?

CM24

DM_7 wrote: »

I have changed my get up time over the years due to work and commute. Anywhere from 5am to 8.30am.

Just focus on getting up at the time you want to. Your going to bed time will fall in line soon enough. Also eat at regular times, if you are up earlier your food intake will need to be in line.

The big list of changes suggests you have a lot of planning and thought going into it. Maybe all that thought is making it more difficult to sleep, you are not relaxed enough?

To be honest, most of the things I listed were things I tried to do anyway, even when getting up at 8am. So the only thing that’s really changed is my alarm time. I was never a big caffeine drinker in the first place.

I will try what you said about the eating times. My appetite has been crazy this week, as it always is when I’m sleep deprived. I must try stopping eating/drinking for a few hours prior to bed, as I always wake up needing to pee at least once during the night.

I do find it hard to stop overthinking about how many hours sleep I’m going to get also. I can see the time on my alarm clock and just seeing it ticking down and realising I have to be up in 5-6 hours stresses me out, and tries to force myself to sleep, but that doesn’t work!

What are your verdicts on naps during the day? Friend or foe? I just had one on the couch now, and I feel totally refreshed, after feeling tired for hours previously. Just not sure if it will mean I’ll struggle to sleep again tonight.

bonzo_k

Hi, I get up at 4.45 and exercise from 5.00 until 7.00, then I head to work. It has taken me nearly 20 years to establish this pattern.

When I started this routine I would get up at 6.30. Gradually over the years its got earlier. During the week I am in bed by 21.00. At the weekend I usually have a lie in until 8.00. From time to time the routine might break due to sickness or holidays, but once I am back in work its easy enough to reestablish the routine. I don't drink tea or coffee or eat any food after 19.00 but also I don't go to bed hungry, so I have a big dinner at 17.30.

I sometimes nap during the day on a sofa in work but it usually means that I haven't slept enough the previous night.

I suppose my advice is take it very slowly and make sure you are getting enough sleep. Being tired when you wake makes it really hard to get out of bed.

Sangre

CM24 wrote: »

So, I work the regular 9-5. For various reasons I've decided to start getting up 2 hours earlier, and hopefully going to sleep 2 hours earlier at night.

Today is my 5th day of forcing myself up at 6am. My body still hasn't adapted to it. I'll feel groggy during the day, sometimes dosing off whilst working at my desk, then at 10pm when I try to sleep, I just can't drift off.

I'm doing everything "right". I:

- Completely cut out caffeine, except for a weak cup in the morning.

- Try not to look at any bright screens just before bedtime.

- Sleep in a very dark room.

- Have a sunrise alarm clock that gradually brightens the room before 6am.

- Get my workout done first thing in the morning, so I can relax in the evening.

I'm determined to stick to this schedule until I adapt, and start naturally falling asleep at 10, getting a good 8 hours deep sleep, then rising like a lark in the morning.

Has anyone else succesfully transformed from night-owl to morning-lark? How long did it take?

What are you doing when you get up?

I can't see this working unless you using the early rise to head straight to work or else go to the gym.

CM24

Monday and Friday I go to the gym and lift weights. Tuesday and Thursday I do kickboxing. All from 6:30am to 7:30am. This actually motivates me greatly to get out of bed, as I usually have to drag myself training after an exhausting day at work.

I’m doing a bit of study on the side also, so if so could get a 2 hour shift in on Wednesday/Sat and Sun mornings that would be great too.

Been doing some reading about siestas. Some people think that that’s our natural evolutionary sleeping pattern. One long sleep at night, then another short sleep around noon. That could actually suit me, as I’m able to get home for lunch, and I generally hit a slump around that time anyway. Might give it a try as I just don’t seem to be able to sleep before 11pm, regardless of how tired I am.

Macy0161

I went to a sleep techniques talk as this is the one aspect that my health is still really lacking. (Not that I've implemented much/ any of what I've heard yet, but I'm trying! :rolleyes: ).

They suggested 20-30 minutes earlier than normal for 3 weeks, but that was more to sorting sleep habits to the existing schedule rather than implement a new schedule.

I think the research suggests 66 days to ingrain a habit though, so 5 days might be optimistic!

CM24

I have to add a disclaimer, Saturday before last, I had stayed up til 6:30am after a night out, watching the UFC. That alone probably threw my sleep patterns out the window. Maybe should have waited til the following week to try and start this routine!

Sure I’ll stick at it now anyway. I’m sure the hardest part is over.

randomchild

It takes 4 weeks for a habit to set in, but even then youll still have to get yourself out of bed each morning. Its never easy for me, its a challenge every morning.

CelticRambler

CM24 wrote: »

Sure I’ll stick at it now anyway. I’m sure the hardest part is over.

Maybe.

Or maybe not!

I'm the same as Cali_girl (except for the "girl" part :pac:) - had my mother telling me all through adolescence to go to bed earlier, and in my young adulthood had the missus implying that I'd be more awake in the mornings if I didn't stay up past midnight.

Now over 50, I've accepted that my body clock is just wrong. I cannot go to sleep before midnight, or if I do (which would usually be around eight or nine, because I'm wrecked from getting up "early" - e.g. 8am - all week) it's only for a couple of hours, then I'm wide awake for the rest of the night.

I've chosen to live with it. Given the chance, I'll work night shifts in preference to the day, my principal leisure interests (fortunately) are "after dark" events, and I prefer hanging out with teenagers to the 9-5 brigade, so it's fine for me. :cool:

ThinkProgress

CM24 wrote: »

So, I work the regular 9-5. For various reasons I've decided to start getting up 2 hours earlier, and hopefully going to sleep 2 hours earlier at night.

Today is my 5th day of forcing myself up at 6am. My body still hasn't adapted to it. I'll feel groggy during the day, sometimes dosing off whilst working at my desk, then at 10pm when I try to sleep, I just can't drift off.

I'm doing everything "right". I:

- Completely cut out caffeine, except for a weak cup in the morning.

- Try not to look at any bright screens just before bedtime.

- Sleep in a very dark room.

- Have a sunrise alarm clock that gradually brightens the room before 6am.

- Get my workout done first thing in the morning, so I can relax in the evening.

I'm determined to stick to this schedule until I adapt, and start naturally falling asleep at 10, getting a good 8 hours deep sleep, then rising like a lark in the morning.

Has anyone else succesfully transformed from night-owl to morning-lark? How long did it take?

Early mornings are kind of just routine for me now. Always been a morning person, but the last few years I've been pushing the envelope a bit more.... great for getting stuff done before the day gets crazy!

Here are some things that might be useful early on to build the routine:

- Get a VERY loud alarm clock, and strategically place it well out of reach from your bed. This way you will be forced to exit your bed to turn the damn thing off, before you wake up everyone in 2 mile radius!

- Drink some water... colder the better. Cold water will usually wake your body up, and make you visit the bathroom. Which again gets you out of bed.

- Workouts in the morning are a great idea, but in the beginning don't be overambitious in this area. Just commit to doing something of a physical nature... even if it barely qualifies as a workout. This is because, if you know you are facing a tough workout every morning... your mind will convince you to hit the snooze button and you will break the routine.

- Do whatever relaxes your mind in the evening. I don't personally buy into the whole "no bright lights" in the evening thing. I read and use my PC right up until 20-30 mins before going to sleep, and I have no problems sleeping - but that's me... others might be different.

- Prepare some meals and snacks. Whatever makes life easier and saves time when you're tired, is a great help.

- Motivational music. Sounds a bit cheesy, but this actually does work for a quick bit of motivation in the morning. Just allow yourself 5-10 mins after your alarm clock goes off... then pretend your rocky balboa and leap out of bed...(minus the raw eggs!)

- Try to avoid eating much or anything first thing in the morning. If you've eaten a good meal before going to bed, you will be surprised by how much you actually have in your reserve tank before needing anything substantial. And you will also get the added bonus, of feeling like you really just earned your breakfast afterwards.

- Just commit to it, like you have no other choice. Make yourself accountable and eventually the routine will become automatic!

Bob Harris

CM24 wrote: »

Been doing some reading about siestas. Some people think that that’s our natural evolutionary sleeping pattern. One long sleep at night, then another short sleep around noon. That could actually suit me, as I’m able to get home for lunch, and I generally hit a slump around that time anyway. Might give it a try as I just don’t seem to be able to sleep before 11pm, regardless of how tired I am.

A friend of mine with sleep problems went to a sleep expert recently. He was told that our body naturally slows in the early afternoon between about 2-4pm. Apparently nothing to do having lunch but a universal trend in people's daily cycle that we all experience. If people do have a siesta it should be no more than 20/25 minutes.

CM24

Bob Harris wrote: »

A friend of mine with sleep problems went to a sleep expert recently. He was told that our body naturally slows in the early afternoon between about 2-4pm. Apparently nothing to do having lunch but a universal trend in people's daily cycle that we all experience. If people do have a siesta it should be no more than 20/25 minutes.

Yeah I learned that lesson yesterday. Had a 90 minute siesta, then found myself unable to sleep again that night, even though I was in bed by 21:30.

Today, I crashed around the same time, but set a timer for 20 mins. I didn’t actually fall asleep, but just laying down and relaxing did seem to rejuvenate me. Hopefully tonight will finally be the night I can fall asleep early.

I’m listening to the Audible version of the book “Why We Sleep” by Matthew Walker, a Harvard-educated Sleep Professor, and he mentioned that midday energy crash too. The whole book is fascinating, and will really make you prioritise your sleep!

Sangre

In my experience, provided that you usually enjoy going to training , you will be able to get into this routine after 2-3 weeks. One thing that I’ve found that helps is to try and make the use of your free evenings now. If you don’t have time to go to the gym in the evening then you’ll have even more motivation to go into the morning.

The most important thing is to ensure you have a structured week that avoids you staying up late unexpectedly during the week and throwing off your schedule. I could never stick to early mornings for more than a couple of months at a time due to work. Hard to get up at 6.30am when you’re wording past midnight….

As mentioned above, find a routine that allows you to roll straight out of bed and out the door as quick as possible.

Not so much about being a morning person - but if you have time OP this is a great podcast about sleep and latest research on it. It's really interesting, esp impact on sleep deprivation on cardio and sports performance amongst other things.

It's crazy how little we understand our own bodies still...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pwaWilO_Pig

EDIT: Just copped - this Joe Rogan podcast is with same Matt Walker whose book you referenced/have been reading! Funny. Nothing new for you so I'm guessing but prob nice to seem him live and in flow!

CM24

That’s funny, I actually already listened to that whole podcast. Interesting stuff!

I’m into the habit of getting up early and getting to bed early now, although there’s been a few hiccups. The midweek Champions League matches on TV usually keep me up late, as my friends tend to hang around for a bit after them. Then at the weekends I’m often staying up til at least midnight, which throws me off my routine.

My advice to anyone else who wants to start getting up early would be, take it slowly! Don’t do what I did and make a drastic sudden change. I think maybe do 20mins earlier per week, that should make the transition period less miserable.