Relentless taunting and bullying that leads to suicide.

c68zapdsm5i1ru

One of many similar stories, but what is wrong with young people who see nothing wrong with bullying someone so badly that they commit suicide, and who even continue to taunt their victim after they have survived a suicide attempt?

I genuinely can't even begin to understand the mindset of young people like this.

http://www.msn.com/en-ie/news/newsireland/mum%e2%80%99s-plea-for-bullying-law-%e2%80%98it%e2%80%99s-too-late-for-nicole-but-may-help-another-family%e2%80%99/ar-AAvqXdG?li=BBr5KbJ

Mossy Monk

They should be publicly flogged. Cowards is all they are.

garbo speaks

Some people just like to see others suffer.:(

razorblunt

Wow, that seems to be a bit of different story though, from the usual "teenage" bullying", given the issues appeared to start when she was 18.
Sad story too. As an aside though I find that grieving a bit OTT, but each to their own.

I remember the first young person suicide I encountered was a lad from my rugby team. Lovely guy, bit timid, like many of us, carried a bit too much weight so was podgy. No issues in the club but he didn't come back one season after being there for the previous 3. Saw his death notice in the newspaper about 2 months later. Poor fella had hung himself in the garage, he lived close by too so I'd often think about him when I was walking my dig past his house. Still do.
Turned out he was bullied quite badly in school.

Some people are just ****s. They were bullying and taunting when I was a teen, and there's going to be people doing it long after I'm dead.

I wish there was some way to teach teens how to protect themselves from these muppets. For most of us, we learn how to do so in our twenties after the worst of it is finished.

jimgoose

Children are basically wild animals. Empathy for one's fellow-creatures and manners come with maturity and an understanding that if you act like an asshole you will be treated as such. In the old days, if a youngster was acting like that towards another person their father would say something like "What am I after rearing?!?! If I catch you behaving like that again I'll kick the head clean off you, you little shit!!". Nowadays, due to technology they have free-reign and this sort of thing is virtually impossible to detect and put a stop to in good time.

Graces7

facebook needs to be closed down, And kids meanwhile need to stop using it.

SEPT 23 1989

would have no issue doing a stretch if that was my daughter and i found the ring leaders addresses

c68zapdsm5i1ru

I never witnessed this level of bullying when I was a teenager. A bit of slagging, or some sneering about people behind their back, yes. But not ongoing and relentless taunting, and pleasure in seeing the victim become more and more distressed to the point of suicide.

This seems to be relatively recent and it's worrying that some young people seem to be so detached from reality that they can't understand that the source of their 'pleasure' is another human being with real feelings and emotions. I would be sick to my stomach if any of my nephews or nieces took part in that kind of behaviour.

Stonedpilot

Graces7 wrote: »

facebook needs to be closed down, And kids meanwhile need to stop using it.

Gurantee you have an active updated facebook account.

Birneybau

Stonedpilot wrote: »

Gurantee you have an active updated facebook account.

I believe she's an elderly lady so...maybe

Tyson Harsh Cylinder

Tyson Harsh Cylinder wrote: »

I never witnessed this level of bullying when I was a teenager. A bit of slagging, or some sneering about people behind their back, yes. But not ongoing and relentless taunting, and pleasure in seeing the victim become more and more distressed to the point of suicide.

This seems to be relatively recent and it's worrying that some young people seem to be so detached from reality that they can't understand that the source of their 'pleasure' is another human being with real feelings and emotions. I would be sick to my stomach if any of my nephews or nieces took part in that kind of behaviour.

Hardly relatively recent. I'm in my early 40s and I was relentlessly bullied in both primary and secondary school. Physical and emotional abuse. I had the misfortune of having my parents as teachers in both schools. I also have a shaking disorder (the more obvious reason to be bullied about).

There have always been kids/teens who either punish for their own pleasure or to gain social standing with others. Before I was 18, I was put in hospital 4 times by others. Not a simple beating, but broken bones. I won't go into the emotional abuse except to say that young people can be very inventive in how they want to abuse someone else.

This isn't new behavior. They've just got some new delivery systems for their abuse.

c68zapdsm5i1ru

It's terrible to think that even though the Gardaí knew what was going on, there is absolutely no law whatsoever to prevent this type of behaviour and the awful consequences that follow.

I really hope this poor mother achieves her aim of getting some kind of law introduced to counter this increasing phenomenon of some young people behaving like absolute animals, emotionally savaging someone to death just for kicks.

Stonedpilot

These things happen people go ahhhh isnt that terrible/ what a tradegy/ I hope those responsible get whats coming to them/ so sad etc etc etc

All thats nice but utterly meaningless rhetoric.

We all know people struggling ask them do they want to talk, talk to the folk in shops them name tags help build rapport who bothers addressing the person by their name even?. Sit with a homeless person on the street and chat.
Its not the talking its giving the other person TIME. People pick up on you spending time on them gives them self worth.



The only way we can connect with folk is in real life person to person.

This online malarkey is just people sprouting off virtue signalling pladitudes.

Graces7

Stonedpilot wrote: »

Gurantee you have an active updated facebook account.

Really? Then you would be totally wrong. I had one long ago and binned it fast. A friend is someone I can talk to , share with in complete trust, sit down to coffee with. Not some faceless attacker .
At least here we can use the ignore button.

These kids use facebook like a deadly weapon; too cowardly to face those they are attacking . Dump facebook and give kids a chance,

Maybe you remember a short while ago a teenager who vanished on St Patrick;s night and was found dead? Another social media casualty.

The more attractive and gifted the person, the more they get attacked.

Stop giving them a chance.

Graces7

Birneybau wrote: »

I believe she's an elderly lady so...maybe

Thank you! Even were I not I would bin facebook . See my reply later.

Graces7

Stonedpilot wrote: »

These things happen people go ahhhh isnt that terrible/ what a tradegy/ I hope those responsible get whats coming to them/ so sad etc etc etc

All thats nice but utterly meaningless rhetoric.

We all know people struggling ask them do they want to talk, talk to the folk in shops them name tags help build rapport who bothers addressing the person by their name even?. Sit with a homeless person on the street and chat.
Its not the talking its giving the other person TIME. People pick up on you spending time on them gives them self worth.

The only way we can connect with folk is in real life person to person.

This online malarkey is just people sprouting off virtue signalling pladitudes.

Hoping you do all this; I certainly do when I am out.

Wondering why you are here then :rolleyes:

c68zapdsm5i1ru

Stonedpilot

The fact that people want to discuss the issue, doesn't mean that they don't also engage with people, build relationships, get involved in their community etc.

I don't really understand your post.

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

Birneybau wrote: »

I believe she's an elderly lady so...maybe

Oh don't play the age card!
I'm 74 and have a Facebook account - little used but handy for sharing family photos and keeping in touch with family on their travels. I know several in the 75 to 85 age bracket with very active Facebook accounts. Though none of them engage in taunting or bullying behaviour.

Those inclined to such cruel behaviour will find other ways if not using Facebook.
Suicides as a result of online bullying are reported on and, to a degree quantifiable. Years ago people committed suicide and the societal issues and pressures that led to them were not known, because most taunting etc. was verbal and secreted.

punisher5112

Tyson Harsh Cylinder wrote: »

I never witnessed this level of bullying when I was a teenager. A bit of slagging, or some sneering about people behind their back, yes. But not ongoing and relentless taunting, and pleasure in seeing the victim become more and more distressed to the point of suicide.

This seems to be relatively recent and it's worrying that some young people seem to be so detached from reality that they can't understand that the source of their 'pleasure' is another human being with real feelings and emotions. I would be sick to my stomach if any of my nephews or nieces took part in that kind of behaviour.

It ain't recent it's just with so much on social media etc it's so much more out there.

Bullying is shocking and my whole time from playschool to secondary was hell.

Permabear

This post has been deleted.

Ashbourne hoop

Tyson Harsh Cylinder wrote: »

It's terrible to think that even though the Gardaí knew what was going on, there is absolutely no law whatsoever to prevent this type of behaviour and the awful consequences that follow.

I really hope this poor mother achieves her aim of getting some kind of law introduced to counter this increasing phenomenon of some young people behaving like absolute animals, emotionally savaging someone to death just for kicks.

It comes under the Non Fatal Offences Against the Person Act 1997, and my understanding is that charges have been brought in similar circumstances. Should be used more often in my opinion.

Ashbourne hoop

Graces7 wrote: »

facebook needs to be closed down, And kids meanwhile need to stop using it.

Kids (12-16) are now giving Facebook a wide berth. Instagram and Snapchat are now the social media of choice for that age group. Snapchat is a particularly difficult one as posts disappear after a certain time (as far as I know, I'm not a user of it, so open to correction on that). Parents need to be vary aware of what their kids do on social media, its difficult though when everyone has a smart phone and everywhere has free wi-fi. Giving kids of 8 or 9 a smart phone is madness, do they even need a phone ffs.

c68zapdsm5i1ru

Permabear wrote: »

This post had been deleted.

I agree. But you also have to worry about the kind of kids/teenagers who seem to see nothing wrong in targeting someone in a really vicious way and not even relenting when their target tries to take their own life; instead almost seeing it as some kind of 'win' and boasting and jeering about it on social media. There has to be something seriously wrong with kids who instigate that kind of thing, and their followers who keep going along with it, even when it has obviously taken a very, very serious turn.

Permabear

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irishrebe

I'd honestly think twice before having kids now. What a world to grow up in. Many of us were bullied at school but we didn't have all this social media and whatsapp so that there was no escape. You could leave it behind you on Friday afternoon, at least. Imagine lying in bed and your phone beeping with people sending nasty messages. Everyone able to take photos with their smartphones and use them to mock people behind their back. I would absolutely hate to be a teenager now.

Graces7

irishrebe wrote: »

I'd honestly think twice before having kids now. What a world to grow up in. Many of us were bullied at school but we didn't have all this social media and whatsapp so that there was no escape. You could leave it behind you on Friday afternoon, at least. Imagine lying in bed and your phone beeping with people sending nasty ro

So do not take your phone to bed with you! Social media is not compulsory. Switch it off. You are doing this to yourself

Permabear

This post has been deleted.

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

Permabear wrote: »

This post had been deleted.

And that's what responsible parents do. Children are taught to use, and deal with, these thing properly by their parents and they grow to use them with care. There seems to be a school of thought that social media is compulsory, all powerful and non-selective. My children and grandchildren use social media but they know who to liaise with, who to ignore and how to turn away from the seedier side of it. What person continues to read comments or posts from vindictive nasty people? You don't hang around with people who bully or belittle you, so why do so on social media?

Franz Von Peppercorn

What’s stopping the publication of the Facebook posts? Privacy laws?

jimgoose

Brylee Green Shamrock wrote: »

...What person continues to read comments or posts from vindictive nasty people? You don't hang around with people who bully or belittle you, so why do so on social media?

That's how a healthy, well-adjusted adult looks at it, S. Most kids are so impressionable, immature and emotionally vulnerable that they can't seem to look away.

Tyson Harsh Cylinder

Tyson Harsh Cylinder wrote: »

I agree. But you also have to worry about the kind of kids/teenagers who seem to see nothing wrong in targeting someone in a really vicious way and not even relenting when their target tries to take their own life; instead almost seeing it as some kind of 'win' and boasting and jeering about it on social media. There has to be something seriously wrong with kids who instigate that kind of thing, and their followers who keep going along with it, even when it has obviously taken a very, very serious turn.

You know, I've met many of those who bullied me as adults, and they actually grew up into decent people. Oh, sure, some people are assholes for life, but childhood/teenage periods are too complicated to be so simplistic about what happens. The bullies i have known in my life, for the most part, had loads of **** going on that pushed them to pass on their pain on to other people. Quite often **** that their parents or teachers pushed on to them.

My problem isn't so much with Children or teens being mean. That goes with the territory of growing up as people discover the difference between their parents values, societys values and the values we develop for ourselves. Often through experimentation.

The focus should be on educating children/teens in how to protect themselves, and to learn the inner 'balance' that life often requires. This attempt to make everything safe is short-sighted and doomed to failure. It's creating a system of victims. Better to teach children to be independent, realistically aware of the dangers in the world, and for them to have the ability to react to those dangers.

Pretending that life as a teen isn't hard is not preparing them for the challenges they'll face both pre-adult and once they become adults, since the bullying/peer pressure often increases into university.

And it's going to get worse as the technology progresses. VR will change the SM landscape once it gets properly up and running... and that has the potential to be accessible virtually everywhere.

RoboRat

I went through hell as a kid with bullying, I got beaten so badly once I was off school for 6 weeks. I am so glad social media wasn't around when I was a kid.

The only positive is that if you can come through it, you end up being far stronger mentally than the bully's. I still see some of the culprits every now and then and they have piled on the weight and live crap lives. Ironically, I wouldn't have a pop in revenge as there is no point, they can see it themselves, there is no need to say anything.

If that was happening to either of my kids, I would have no hesitation to call around to the kids parents and explain quite clearly that if it continued, there would be consequences - their kids are their responsibility, as are mine. I am also ensuring that my kids also learn self defence as I have been training for nearly a decade and it does wonders for your self esteem, confidence and as a result, how you hold yourself. People think twice about saying something if they think you can make them eat their words.

Malayalam

Permabear wrote: »

This post had been deleted.

That is a good aspiration. In real life it may (will) be much harder to enforce, especially once they get past 14 or so. Maybe younger, for some. They will go behind your back as they get older if you are too strict, that's just a fact. The battles with modern children have to be carefully picked. It is better to talk regularly and bluntly with them about electronic bullying. Serious on-the-level stuff about the nature of different interactive mediums and their effect on the psyche. Keep up to date with your children, not by policing their devices until they are 18, but by communication, eye to eye. They will all be teased, it's inevitable - horrid photos, crazy admirers, silly pranks, neurotic stalkers, kids trying out their humour bone and ending up being just mean - and that teasing can occasionally feel incredibly magnified because of the medium. It can escalate to bullying - what begins as teasing sometimes becomes worse as the herd smells blood. Or a bully finds their mark. You have to teach them not to ever be available to be a bullies mark. The only defense is that they become very tough minded. They should feel utter contempt for bullies- a kind of ironic hardness of attitude, they should understand the mechanics of it all. How some people have that much hurt in them that they need to hurt others. How some people are psychopathic by inclination, and don't care for others pain. How to bully another is a lowly, pathetic, contemptible act, absolutely not a sign of strength. It's a pity to have to develop these aspects in our beloved children, but it is necessary, otherwise they are defenseless. Social media will be part of their lives regardless of what we want or think.
They should also have outside activities that make them feel super-good about themselves. Empowered. Valued. Self-sufficient. We found martial arts fitted that bill - boys and girls. But whatever works for the individual child.

c68zapdsm5i1ru

Deleted User wrote: »

You know, I've met many of those who bullied me as adults, and they actually grew up into decent people. Oh, sure, some people are assholes for life, but childhood/teenage periods are too complicated to be so simplistic about what happens. The bullies i have known in my life, for the most part, had loads of **** going on that pushed them to pass on their pain on to other people. Quite often **** that their parents or teachers pushed on to them.

My problem isn't so much with Children or teens being mean. That goes with the territory of growing up as people discover the difference between their parents values, societys values and the values we develop for ourselves. Often through experimentation.

The focus should be on educating children/teens in how to protect themselves, and to learn the inner 'balance' that life often requires. This attempt to make everything safe is short-sighted and doomed to failure. It's creating a system of victims. Better to teach children to be independent, realistically aware of the dangers in the world, and for them to have the ability to react to those dangers.

Pretending that life as a teen isn't hard is not preparing them for the challenges they'll face both pre-adult and once they become adults, since the bullying/peer pressure often increases into university.

And it's going to get worse as the technology progresses. VR will change the SM landscape once it gets properly up and running... and that has the potential to be accessible virtually everywhere.

I see what you're saying and I agree that many teens who bully go on to be decent adults. But there's levels of bullying, and situations where a teenager knows that they have driven another teenager to attempt suicide and continue to taunt and jeer at that teenager have gone beyond anything that can be dismissed as 'teenagers being teenagers', 'they're just going through a difficult time themselves' etc. There is something fundamentally disturbed, inhuman and deeply nasty about that kind of behaviour.

jimgoose

Malayalam wrote: »

...We found martial arts fitted that bill - boys and girls. But whatever works for the individual child.

A fourteen-year-old with a second-degree black belt in Taekwon-Do and who is capable of shoving the average teenager's head up his or her arse within seconds, presents a very different proposition psychologically to a cyber-bully. :pac::pac::pac:

one armed dwarf

I feel this has been a thing since forever. Back in 03 or so when all my classmates and friends were setting up Bebo accounts they asked me all the time to sign up and I didn't want to because I noticed other kids getting bullied on it by the same people who would bully me. After school was like a kind of psychological refuge from that **** so bringing it online sounded like a special kind of hell.

Graces7

OSI wrote: »

Yes, literally no one has ever been bullied or committed suicide as a result of a bullying induced mental state before the arrival of Facebook. Not one.

That is a quantum leap that has no connection with anything raised in this thread.

Maybe check stats on this though; or are you saying that no one commits suicide because of social media? Have a work with google about this , please.

Social media widens the field for bullies. It opens a worldwide arena. No longer "just " school or work bullying .

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_media_and_suicide

Are not our young people worth saving and protecting?

jiltloop

I understand that there are no laws to deal with online abuse and verbal bullying I think that needs to be reviewed sooner rather than later.

However there is a law against physical abuse, if someone was putting out cigarettes on my daughter I'd be making sure the gardai were dealing with it in a very serious manner.

Malayalam

jimgoose wrote: »

A fourteen-year-old with a second-degree black belt in Taekwon-Do and who is capable of shoving the average teenager's head up his or her arse within seconds, presents a very different proposition psychologically to a cyber-bully. :pac::pac::pac:

Yes. It is interesting to see that as social media use has increased there has been a similar surge in MMA and various schools of self defense. Perhaps not unconnected.

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

Graces7 wrote: »

That is a quantum leap that has no connection with anything raised in this thread.

Maybe check stats on this though; or are you saying that no one commits suicide because of social media? Have a work with google about this , please.

Social media widens the field for bullies. It opens a worldwide arena. No longer "just " school or work bullying .

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_media_and_suicide

Are not our young people worth saving and protecting?

That is not what was being said. Wiki? Great. Ask it were there suicides brought on by bullying and ostracisation before Facebook, because that was the point being made.

professore

jimgoose wrote: »

Children are basically wild animals. Empathy for one's fellow-creatures and manners come with maturity and an understanding that if you act like an asshole you will be treated as such. In the old days, if a youngster was acting like that towards another person their father would say something like "What am I after rearing?!?! If I catch you behaving like that again I'll kick the head clean off you, you little shit!!". Nowadays, due to technology they have free-reign and this sort of thing is virtually impossible to detect and put a stop to in good time.

SOME children are.

professore

Permabear wrote: »

This post had been deleted.

I agree with you to some extent but unless you follow them around 24/7 you won't stop them accessing stuff like this anyway.

Better to teach them how to handle it IMO.

r93kaey5p2izun

I think bullying has always happened but that social media and the online element is different and cannot be compared to what people dealt with previously. All of what happened in the past is still there plus the online bullying.

I think the behaviour of many adults - many of whom consider themselves respectable members of society - online is deplorable. The same person who likes a Pieta House link and retweets Darkness into Light one minute is engaging in nasty personal attacks in online comments sections or groups the next. Making nasty personal comments publicly online is normalised. And it's people of all ages and social classes. And they get so defensive about it when called out on it in person - as if their online comments aren't real.

Spewing bile and making personal attacks seems to be accepted as the norm in online discourse. Lots of people seem to have a complete disconnect in how they behave in person versus online. I don't think it's in any way surprising that many young people engage in bullying online and through social media.

professore

Graces7 wrote: »

That is a quantum leap that has no connection with anything raised in this thread.

Maybe check stats on this though; or are you saying that no one commits suicide because of social media? Have a work with google about this , please.

Social media widens the field for bullies. It opens a worldwide arena. No longer "just " school or work bullying .

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_media_and_suicide

Are not our young people worth saving and protecting?

This is true but you are better to teach your kids to develop coping strategies than to try to turn back the clock to the 1980s. Most platforms allow you to block people.

c68zapdsm5i1ru

Tessa Millions Ankle wrote: »

I think bullying has always happened but that social media and the online element is different and cannot be compared to what people dealt with previously. All of what happened in the past is still there plus the online bullying.

I think the behaviour of many adults - many of whom consider themselves respectable members of society - online is deplorable. The same person who likes a Pieta House link and retweets Darkness into Light one minute is engaging in nasty personal attacks in online comments sections or groups the next. Making nasty personal comments publicly online is normalised. And it's people of all ages and social classes. And they get so defensive about it when called out on it in person - as if their online comments aren't real.

Spewing bile and making personal attacks seems to be accepted as the norm in online discourse. Lots of people seem to have a complete disconnect in how they behave in person versus online. I don't think it's in any way surprising that many young people engage in bullying online and through social media.

Yes, I totally agree with this. Even on ordinary chat forums you will see people engaging in totally unprovoked nastiness and sneering, putting other people down for fun, ganging up on a poster whose views they don't agree with and resorting to personal spiteful comments if they're losing an argument. It's depressing to see this kind of behaviour from adults, and then reading another post where they refer to their children and you realise they're actually parents (not that I'm saying that kind of behaviour is acceptable from any adult, but you wonder how they're raising their children when you see their own behaviour on line).

Graces7

professore wrote: »

This is true but you are better to teach your kids to develop coping strategies than to try to turn back the clock to the 1980s. Most platforms allow you to block people.

You see all this as progress? Interesting idea.

Graces7

Tyson Harsh Cylinder wrote: »

Yes, I totally agree with this. Even on ordinary chat forums you will see people engaging in totally unprovoked nastiness and sneering, putting other people down for fun, ganging up on a poster whose views they don't agree with and resorting to personal spiteful comments if they're losing an argument. It's depressing to see this kind of behaviour from adults, and then reading another post where they refer to their children and you realise they're actually parents (not that I'm saying that kind of behaviour is acceptable from any adult, but you wonder how they're raising their children when you see their own behaviour on line).

Yep. A jungle indeed.

professore

Graces7 wrote: »

You see all this as progress? Interesting idea.

Of a sort. Progress is not universally positive. There are some great things that come with the internet too. At least my kids don't have to worry about being felt up or worse by a priest, a real concern for teenagers of my vintage.

Whispered

I think every generation of parents face a "new" fear for their kids and for the most part the kids navigate admirably. My biggest fear for my boy is how to teach him to protect his mental health in an increasingly confusing world.

I've seen the aftermath of bullying, well before social media became so prevalent. You cannot control how others speak to you/about you so you have to control your reaction. How to teach that to a child though..... it is a complicated question.

freshpopcorn

Permabear wrote: »

This post had been deleted.

We had social media as a teenager. It's not as big now but just be careful of them using older dives/friends devices/having multiple accounts/ using different names. Just based on my experience parents who over monitored things kids ran into more trouble.