Hire car - minor accident - excess

mickey15ie

Evening All,

I had a minor accident in a hire car from Europcar today, unfortunately the car insurance disc was out of date so i had to ring europcar as the guards spotted it.

When we pulled the cars away from each other we realised there was little damage to either car.

My car had a couple of scuffs which i got out with T-Cut, the only thing that is any sign of the incident is the bottom of the bumper is slightly cracked.

I didnt take the excess insurance with them are they likely to try and screw me for the whole lot.

You cant see any of the scuffs.

Car is 181 reg and only had 700km on it before i took it out.

The other car is not looking to make a claim, as we made an agreement.

Charles Babbage

They probably will try and screw you for the max.
What make is it? You might price a bumper change from a main dealer to give yourself something to argue about.

mickey15ie

Its a mazda 3 saloon.

the crack is less than 5cm in length at the very bottom of the bumper.

i hire cars from the company all the time and never have an issue, so this is the first time something has happened.

Anyone ever had an similar experiences?

ohnonotgmail

they will charge you to replace the bumper. I wouldnt expect anything else on basically a brand new car.

mickey15ie

Is that not a bit extreme as they will not replace the bumper and will just send it straight back out on the road with another customer?

Lantus

You won't get change of a grand from a new bumper. I tipped a 7 year old Micra once and it cost me 800 to replace the bumper and respray.

They may not notice if it's hard to spot or some good repair work is done on it.

okidoki987

Is that not a bit extreme as they will not replace the bumper and will just send it straight back out on the road with another customer?

Isn't that what most car hire companies do?

Samuel T. Cogley

If you rent regularly it's well worth having third party excess insurance. It costs about €50 a year.

ohnonotgmail

mickey15ie wrote: »

Is that not a bit extreme as they will not replace the bumper and will just send it straight back out on the road with another customer?

bumpers on new cars cant be repaired so replacement is the only option. Whether they ACTUALLY replace the bumper or not is down to them but you are on the hook for the cost.

mickey15ie

on the excess insurance i normally take out but for some reason it didnt renew last year.

In terms of charging for a brand new bumper if i am being charged for a new bumper surely i am entitled to ask for the old one back to prove they dont replace.

Anyone any idea what a new bumper would cost? In my eyes it would be extreme to replace. It definitely wouldnt be the full value of the excess

mickey15ie

Lantus wrote: »

You won't get change of a grand from a new bumper. I tipped a 7 year old Micra once and it cost me 800 to replace the bumper and respray.

They may not notice if it's hard to spot or some good repair work is done on it.

But now that they have a tip off that something has happened they will be eagle eyed for it now i would assume. If they look for anywhere near a grand for it i will go through solicitors on it if i have to.

ohnonotgmail

mickey15ie wrote: »

But now that they have a tip off that something has happened they will be eagle eyed for it now i would assume. If they look for anywhere near a grand for it i will go through solicitors on it if i have to.

that would be throwing good money after bad. The bumper costs what it costs.

Samuel T. Cogley

You can probably go the small claims route if needed. They should only be charging you for their actual costs. However bear in mind this is the bumper and any time the car is off the road.

elperello

How much is the excess?

mickey15ie

elperello wrote: »

How much is the excess?

Excess is €1500.

Lantus

It's tough but if it was your brand new car would a crack in the bumper be acceptable or would you want it repaired?

There are very few bits of a car that cost less than 1k to fix in any light interaction with another car. The panel, spraying and labour add up easily.

See what they say......not to many options as it's not your car to repair.

mickey15ie

Lantus wrote: »

It's tough but if it was your brand new car would a crack in the bumper be acceptable or would you want it repaired?

There are very few bits of a car that cost less than 1k to fix in any light interaction with another car. The panel, spraying and labour add up easily.

See what they say......not to many options as it's not your car to repair.

Hopefully they will value that i have been a customer with them since Early 2016, and this is just a minor blip.

mickey15ie

mickey15ie wrote: »

Hopefully they will value that i have been a customer with them since Early 2016, and this is just a minor blip.

doubt you will get any leeway tbh, sorry to say. you can always try. are you on the hook for damage to the other car also?

edit read that you made a deal with other car

elperello

They could go for the €1500.
Read your contract very carefully before you go in to negotiate.
I'd say you will end up having to take it on the chin but no harm in trying.

A cracked bumper seriously devalues a 181 car and it will have to be fixed before it is sold on anyway.

mickey15ie

does anyone recon a good body garage could probably do a good quick job on it.

dingding

mickey15ie wrote: »

Is that not a bit extreme as they will not replace the bumper and will just send it straight back out on the road with another customer?

If they don't you will be stuck with the cost of the car hire that is lost for repairs. I would imagine at the end when the return the car to Mazda, they will be hit for the costs of all the repairs.

It makes no sense to fix cosmetic repairs as they happen, rather wait till the end.

Generally the cars are hired for 6 months as there is a scheme to delay the payment of VRT. At that stage the cars would be brought up to showroom condition and sold on.

I would not risk taking out a hired car without either their insurance, or indeed a third party policy that covers the excess.

So easy to damage a car even if some idiot parks beside you and bangs against it. etc....

dingding

dingding wrote: »

If they don't you will be stuck with the cost of the car hire that is lost for repairs. I would imagine at the end when the return the car to Mazda, they will be hit for the costs of all the repairs.

It makes no sense to fix cosmetic repairs as they happen, rather wait till the end.

Generally the cars are hired for 6 months as there is a scheme to delay the payment of VRT. At that stage the cars would be brought up to showroom condition and sold on.

I would not risk taking out a hired car without either their insurance, or indeed a third party policy that covers the excess.

So easy to damage a car even if some idiot parks beside you and bangs against it. etc....

yes worth it - third party generally should work out at only a few euro a day or if you use it a good bit find some annual policy.

Toyotafanboi

mickey15ie wrote: »

on the excess insurance i normally take out but for some reason it didnt renew last year.

In terms of charging for a brand new bumper if i am being charged for a new bumper surely i am entitled to ask for the old one back to prove they dont replace.

Anyone any idea what a new bumper would cost? In my eyes it would be extreme to replace. It definitely wouldnt be the full value of the excess

Not trying to be harsh but I wouldn't like to see you set yourself up for a fall, "in your eyes" doesn't count for anything and you don't have an entitlement to ask for the old bumper back. Going to a solicitor is also madness, it'd be more expensive than the excess. They are wise to a thorough damage check now anyway as the Gardai requested for proof of insurance.

Most rental companies use one of these wear and tear/ damage evaluators, its worth a read.



Unfortunately it says any rips, regardless of size to a plastic bumper are classed as damage.

You're really at the mercy of the rental company but to be fair if the excess is €1500, that's probably not a million miles away from the cost to supply and fit a new bumper with some minor extras. Whether they actually repair it or not is unfortunately not your concern.

It's a bitter pill though.

Nonoperational

mickey15ie wrote: »

Lantus wrote: »

You won't get change of a grand from a new bumper. I tipped a 7 year old Micra once and it cost me 800 to replace the bumper and respray.

They may not notice if it's hard to spot or some good repair work is done on it.

But now that they have a tip off that something has happened they will be eagle eyed for it now i would assume. If they look for anywhere near a grand for it i will go through solicitors on it if i have to.

And argue what? They are entitled to put the car back to the way it was. With an undamaged bumper, not one filled and repainted.

redcup342

mickey15ie wrote: »

on the excess insurance i normally take out but for some reason it didnt renew last year.

In terms of charging for a brand new bumper if i am being charged for a new bumper surely i am entitled to ask for the old one back to prove they dont replace.

Anyone any idea what a new bumper would cost? In my eyes it would be extreme to replace. It definitely wouldnt be the full value of the excess

Nope, they are entitled to the financial cost of returning the car to it's previous state. They don't actually have to carry out the repair.

In any case the rental firms tend to only fix up damage before they sell on the car.

Also while the bumper might be fine, you don't know what damage there is behind the bumper.

mickey15ie

will just have to see how i get on tomorrow.

hopefully it is peeing rain and they have no interest in looking at it.

rocky

Wondering if the other car was at fault, (in general, not this specific instance), would the rental company still take the excess, or would they deal with the other party's insurance?

thebiglad

rocky wrote: »

Wondering if the other car was at fault, (in general, not this specific instance), would the rental company still take the excess, or would they deal with the other party's insurance?

They will take the excess and you can recover it from the other insurer yourself.

The hire company only has your word that the other party was responsible so they cannot let you walk away without paying. What if the other driver turned out not to have a valid insurance, regardless of fault there would be no recovery.

CalamariFritti

It’s not a great situation to be in. But I’d prepare myself to be on the hook for all or near enough to the €1500.

Not sure what you could do about it either. It’s unlikely they will bother to do anything but standard procedure for you. It’s just too much hassle for them. And why would they.

Toyotafanboi

Toyotafanboi wrote: »

Not trying to be harsh but I wouldn't like to see you set yourself up for a fall, "in your eyes" doesn't count for anything and you don't have an entitlement to ask for the old bumper back. Going to a solicitor is also madness, it'd be more expensive than the excess. They are wise to a thorough damage check now anyway as the Gardai requested for proof of insurance.

Most rental companies use one of these wear and tear/ damage evaluators, its worth a read.

[IMG][/IMG]

Unfortunately it says any rips, regardless of size to a plastic bumper are classed as damage.

You're really at the mercy of the rental company but to be fair if the excess is €1500, that's probably not a million miles away from the cost to supply and fit a new bumper with some minor extras. Whether they actually repair it or not is unfortunately not your concern.

It's a bitter pill though.

Interesting. Is that 6 cms measured?

Toyotafanboi

6 inches I would say. Enterprise usually print it on the back of their envelopes.

Lord Nikon

Say nothing to them, see what happens. If it's raining, then might not notice anything. Worst case scenario, they spot it and your down 1500.

dingding

Lord Nikon wrote: »

Say nothing to them, see what happens. If it's raining, then might not notice anything. Worst case scenario, they spot it and your down 1500.

And be pleasant if caught, the operator may have discretion in how he costs up if it is borderline between two categories of damage. Looking for the old bumper, threatening the solicitor won't get you any favours.

ted1

mickey15ie wrote: »

Evening All,

I had a minor accident in a hire car from Europcar today, unfortunately the car insurance disc was out of date so i had to ring europcar as the guards spotted it.

When we pulled the cars away from each other we realised there was little damage to either car.

My car had a couple of scuffs which i got out with T-Cut, the only thing that is any sign of the incident is the bottom of the bumper is slightly cracked.

I didnt take the excess insurance with them are they likely to try and screw me for the whole lot.

You cant see any of the scuffs.

Car is 181 reg and only had 700km on it before i took it out.

The other car is not looking to make a claim, as we made an agreement.

Not screw you, just charge to going rate , about 2k.

monkeysnapper

When member of staff comes to look at car pretend to have an old war injury in leg and go down on floor in agony holding leg .

DaveyDave

That damage evaluator does seem to be pretty fair, you'd be get away with some small dings here and there. Interesting that the lower bumper doesn't count either which is good as you may have a car with a large front end and might scrape the path in a parking space.

One thing to consider is you can get away with small/light damage here and there, but repeat that for a different person every week. It's understandable why they'd need to chase down larger damage.

dingding

OP How did you get on today when you left back the car.

webpal

Just a general question whilst eagerly awaiting OPs response, if damage is not spotted when you hand the keys back, can they come back later and say by the way we noticed xyz damage afterwards, we'll be charging your credit card.

elperello

webpal wrote: »

Just a general question whilst eagerly awaiting OPs response, if damage is not spotted when you hand the keys back, can they come back later and say by the way we noticed xyz damage afterwards, we'll be charging your credit card.

Frequently reported as happening at overseas holiday destinations. It's always best to get a member of staff to inspect the car and sign off that they received it in good order.

elperello

OmegaGene wrote: »

Get the collision damage waver
Worth every penny even for piece of mind the deckers won’t come after you
I know someone that left a car in and it had a slow puncture
They tried to claim for an alloy saying it was buckled

Yes peace of mind is important especially when on holidays. After all the whole idea is to relax and enjoy your break.

An annual car hire excess policy is more economical than the rental company CDW but you must allow for your credit card being blocked for the sum of the excess.

dr.fuzzenstein

OP, any update or did your solicitor advise you not to write anything else on this thread?

yeah OP, what is the story? update needed!

dingding

elperello wrote: »

Yes peace of mind is important especially when on holidays. After all the whole idea is to relax and enjoy your break.

An annual car hire excess policy is more economical than the rental company CDW but you must allow for your credit card being blocked for the sum of the excess.

And also be sure how to make a claim. You may need some documentation when you return the car.

josip

Probably too late now, but if the bumper is only cracked rather than broken, you could 'muddy' it up a bit so that it's not so visible.
You'd need to splash on the muddy water so that it looked like it came from a puddle.
If they've already gotten a heads up, you might still get found out.

K.Flyer

elperello wrote: »

Frequently reported as happening at overseas holiday destinations. It's always best to get a member of staff to inspect the car and sign off that they received it in good order.

A relative took car hire from one of these special deal places. Having read the horror stories he was careful to take an adequate amount of pictures of the car before signing for it.
When he brought it back they non-nonchalantly took the keys and didn't check the car over.
He again had taken an adequate amount of pictures when he returned it.
A month later he got a letter claiming for damage to the door and that they were taking it from his credit card.
He contacted them, told them about all his photographs and threatened to sue them for fraud and theft if they touched his card.
They dropped the claim and apologised for a misunderstanding :rolleyes:

bennyc

what I normally do is give the car a very good check before driving off and I have got any marks not on the sheet marked off, so good chance the next renter may be the one to notice the damage.

fullstop

webpal wrote: »

Just a general question whilst eagerly awaiting OPs response, if damage is not spotted when you hand the keys back, can they come back later and say by the way we noticed xyz damage afterwards, we'll be charging your credit card.

Hertz did that to me before, didn't even tell me, just charged my card. I kicked up hell and eventually got the money back.

webpal

fullstop wrote: »

Hertz did that to me before, didn't even tell me, just charged my card. I kicked up hell and eventually got the money back.

Kinda my worst fear about car rental. Especially if I genuinely didn't cause any damage.

FranklinMint

Is there no way of blocking them after or using a temp card?

whomitconcerns

FranklinMint wrote: »

Is there no way of blocking them after or using a temp card?

If you could do that they would never rent to you. Sure you could wreck the car and say "I've had my fun, that's all that matters"

FranklinMint

whomitconcerns wrote: »

If you could do that they would never rent to you. Sure you could wreck the car and say "I've had my fun, that's all that matters"

It's mostly the other way round after in fairness

The hire companies taking the p1ss