New Worldwide Handicap System

HighLine

Just seen this announced today. Fairly surprised to see it coming into force by 2020. Practice rounds should never be counted for handicap purposes in my opinion.

https://www.golfnet.ie/news/golfnet/2903/world-handicap-system-features-announced

JOINT STATEMENT ON WORLD HANDICAP SYSTEM BY IRISH LADIES GOLF UNION & GOLFING UNION OF IRELAND

Sinead Heraty (CEO, ILGU): “A standard system of handicapping worldwide is a welcome development for the sport. The new system will make it easier to obtain and retain a handicap and will be easier to understand for all golfers.”

“The introduction of flexible formats to count for handicap purposes will also ensure that the game continues to become more inclusive and recognises more modern formats of the game which in turn will encourage more players into club membership.”

Pat Finn (CEO, GUI): "We welcome the announcement today in relation to the World Handicap System and we look forward to engaging and consulting with our affiliated golf clubs prior to adoption."


Features of the World Handicap System

The new system will feature the following:

Flexibility in formats of play, allowing both competitive and recreational rounds to count for handicap purposes and ensuring a golfer’s handicap is more reflective of potential ability

A recommendation that the number of scores needed to obtain a new handicap be 54 holes from any combination of 18-hole and 9-hole rounds, but with some discretion available for handicapping authorities or National Associations to set a different minimum within their own jurisdiction

A consistent handicap that is portable from course to course and country to country through worldwide use of the USGA Course and Slope Rating System, already successfully used in more than 80 countries

An average-based calculation of a handicap, taken from the best eight out of the last 20 scores and factoring in memory of previous demonstrated ability for better responsiveness and control

A calculation that considers the impact that abnormal course and weather conditions might have on a player’s performance each day
Daily handicap revisions, taking account of the course and weather conditions calculation

A limit of Net Double Bogey on the maximum hole score (for handicapping purposes only)

A maximum handicap limit of 54.0, regardless of gender, to encourage more golfers to measure and track their performance to increase their enjoyment of the game

Worldwide stakeholder engagement

Quantitative research was conducted in 15 countries around the world, through which 76 percent of the 52,000 respondents voiced their support for a World Handicap System, 22 percent were willing to consider its benefits, and only 2 percent were opposed. This was followed by a series of focus groups, in which more than 300 golf administrators and golfers from different regions around the world offered extensive feedback on the features of the proposed new system.

This feedback has helped shape the WHS, which has been developed by The R&A and the USGA with support from each handicapping authority as well as the Japan Golf Association and Golf Canada.

A modern and more accessible sport

Martin Slumbers, Chief Executive of The R&A, said, “We are working with our partners and National Associations to make golf more modern, more accessible and more enjoyable as a sport and the new World Handicap System represents a huge opportunity in this regard.

“We want to make it more attractive to golfers to obtain a handicap and strip away some of the complexity and variation which can be off-putting for newcomers. Having a handicap, which is easier to understand and is truly portable around the world, can make golf much more enjoyable and is one of the unique selling points of our sport.”

Mike Davis, CEO of the USGA, commented, “For some time, we’ve heard golfers say ‘I’m not good enough to have a handicap,” or ‘I don’t play enough to have a handicap.’ We want to make the right decisions now to encourage a more welcoming and social game. We’re excited to be taking another important step – along with modernising Golf’s Rules – to provide a pathway into the sport, making golf easier to understand and more approachable and enjoyable for everyone to play.”

Objectives of golf’s World Handicap System

The tenets of the new system focus on three main objectives: to encourage as many golfers as possible to obtain and maintain a handicap; to enable golfers of differing abilities, genders and nationalities to transport their handicap to any course globally and compete on a fair and equitable basis; and to indicate with sufficient accuracy the score a golfer is reasonably capable of achieving on any course around the world, playing under normal conditions.

Given worldwide alignment towards a single system, all parties will now embark on a two-year transition period targeting implementation in 2020. When adopted, the World Handicap System will be governed by The R&A and the USGA and administered locally by the six existing authorities and National Associations around the world, with safeguards included to ensure consistency as well as adaptability to differing golf cultures.

The six handicapping authorities represent approximately 15 million golfers in 80 countries who currently maintain a golf handicap.

Collaboration

The announcement is the latest step in a multi-year collaboration between The R&A and the USGA, handicap authorities and national and regional golf associations around the world to introduce one set of Rules for handicapping, aimed to support modernising, growing and supporting accessibility of the sport.

As an extension of their support of the Rules of Golf worldwide, Rolex has made a commitment to support The R&A’s and the USGA’s efforts to implement a World Handicap System. The Swiss watchmaker’s contribution to excellence in golf is based on a rich heritage stretching back more than 50 years, forged through pivotal partnerships at every level of the game, from the sport’s leading professional and amateur competitions and organisations, to players at the pinnacle of their sport worldwide.

To provide feedback on the new World Handicap System or for more information, visit randa.org.

willabur

handicaps up to 54 will lead to some very long rounds out there. While it might encourage people to get into the sport I think it'll annoy people out of the sport in a short amount of time.

HighLine

willabur wrote: »

handicaps up to 54 will lead to some very long rounds out there. While it might encourage people to get into the sport I think it'll annoy people out of the sport in a short amount of time.

The 54 handicap limit is already in place as of January this year. Agree with your points on it though.

martinkop

It is set up for banditry of the highest order. Crazy stuff.

Play 20 9 hole "practice" rounds, then have your targeted handicap for the big comps.
I'm assuming the max 1 stroke back is gone with this, if based on previous scores

CalamariFritti

Unless there is more to it I have to say this sounds like a bad joke. While it may ‘include’ some folks into golf I could see it pissing a lot more people off.

Average of best 8 out of the last 20 (including casual rounds). That’s like what the USGA does.
Just to remind everyone how well that works....

The guy who won the pebble beach pro-am last week went from 6.6 to 12 in the space of two months last year.

They can’t be fkn serious. It’s basically make up your own handicap.

I dearly hope there is more to it. Because on face value it has the potential to ruin golf here.

dan_ep82

The nett double bogey part, does this mean an 8 on index one par4 still gets a point for 1HC golfer?

I don't see bandit problems but more less skilled lower handicaps.

martinkop

Looking on R&A website, looks like national associations can decide whether or not to include casual rounds. I'd assume the GUI will stay as is in that case, this part of the WHS is for the US only.

HighLine

martinkop wrote: »

Looking on R&A website, looks like national associations can decide whether or not to include casual rounds. I'd assume the GUI will stay as is in that case, this part of the WHS is for the US only.

That statement I quoted above issued by the GUI specifically mentions "recreational rounds" to count towards handicap purposes.

martinkop

HighLine wrote: »

That statement I quoted above issued by the GUI specifically mentions "recreational rounds" to count towards handicap purposes.

Right you are, thanks. That's not good, hopefully enough clubs will push back against it.

Webbs

It could also have a real impact on the amount of work and responsibility of handicap committees if the following has to be looked at by committees, its hard enough for clubs to fill these positions already.

'An average-based calculation of a handicap, taken from the best eight out of the last 20 scores and factoring in memory of previous demonstrated ability for better responsiveness and control

A calculation that considers the impact that abnormal course and weather conditions might have on a player’s performance each day
Daily handicap revisions, taking account of the course and weather conditions calculation'

If competition and casual rounds are taken into account and your an honest golfer who wants to get cut then having to do these calculations before your next competition will be a nightmare

HighLine

martinkop wrote: »

Right you are, thanks. That's not good, hopefully enough clubs will push back against it.

Agree. It's a farcical system.

ROS123

It mentions casual rounds a lot, does one still have to be a member of a club to get an official handicap. Can society members get an official handicap?

doublecross

This will kill revenue for golf clubs. If casual golf is counting then a lot of people just won't bother playing competitions.

slingerz

This has been totally confused.

Is my current handicap now going to change as a result of slope of my home course compared to other courses? How will that work for interclub competitions?

dan_ep82

No more info until Jan 2019 going by the FAQ.

Handicaps may change under the new system.

They really should have had all the info available with the announcement.

backspin.

martinkop wrote: »

Looking on R&A website, looks like national associations can decide whether or not to include casual rounds. I'd assume the GUI will stay as is in that case, this part of the WHS is for the US only.

I would be very very surprised if the GUI allowed casual rounds to count towards handicaps. They are fighting a losing battle already against handicap builders. Including casual rounds would be a complete farce.

HighLine

backspin. wrote: »

I would be very very surprised if the GUI allowed casual rounds to count towards handicaps. They are fighting a losing battle already against handicap builders. Including casual rounds would be a complete farce.

See below

JOINT STATEMENT ON WORLD HANDICAP SYSTEM BY IRISH LADIES GOLF UNION & GOLFING UNION OF IRELAND

.......

Flexibility in formats of play, allowing both competitive and recreational rounds to count for handicap purposes and ensuring a golfer’s handicap is more reflective of potential ability

backspin.

doublecross wrote: »

This will kill revenue for golf clubs. If casual golf is counting then a lot of people just won't bother playing competitions.

The only reason i play the game is for competitions. Sweeps, Classics, Matchplay, Medals etc. If they allow the handicap system to be ruined by casual golf handicap building i could see myself giving the game up.

We take the game seriously in this country i'd hate to see us go down the route of 'mulligan' type american golf.

paulos53

Unlimited casual games counting towards handicap adjustments is already in since January 1st

Supplementary scores are not new but I think the old limit was 10 rounds a year.

jamok

With the introduction of casual rounds being counted, Does this mean that the present Non Qualifying winter golf would be eligible for handicap reduction/increase. Nuts and Bolts obviously haven't been worked out yet. Not sure why they have gone public with it.

fred funk }{

jamok wrote: »

With the introduction of casual rounds being counted, Does this mean that the present Non Qualifying winter golf would be eligible for handicap reduction/increase. Nuts and Bolts obviously haven't been worked out yet. Not sure why they have gone public with it.

I'd imagine not as winter rules are in place.

HighLine

paulos53 wrote: »

Unlimited casual games counting towards handicap adjustments is already in since January 1st

Supplementary scores are not new but I think the old limit was 10 rounds a year.

That's not true.

paulos53

HighLine wrote: »

That's not true.

Which part?

LuckyGent88

Agree with a lot of the posts already in here. The scores from practice rounds is a load of bollix really, will lead to more handicap building, serious confusion for handicap committees and more work for already overworked handicap secretaries.

HighLine

paulos53 wrote: »

Which part?

This..

paulos53 wrote: »

Unlimited casual games counting towards handicap adjustments is already in since January 1st

Spider Rico

Would the casual round need to be signed by a GUI member?

Lots to iron out.

One key draw to the game for me at the moment, is trying to compete to a standard that gets me cut, or avoid an increase. Whereas, this change seems to de-value the meaning of the handicap, with a casual 9 holes counting, it suits both handicap builders and those holding onto a trophy handicap.

prawnsambo

Don't casual rounds make up your initial handicap allotment?

HighLine

prawnsambo wrote: »

Don't casual rounds make up your initial handicap allotment?

This isn't about initial handicaps, it's about continuous handicap assessment and adjustments basked on casual rounds (as well as competitive) of golf like the American system.

Russman

This is going to lead to a complete change of how we think of handicaps in this country, which I think will be the biggest obstacle. I know I’ve always thought of my handicap as a “thing” that was almost tangible in a sense, and, while not fixed, it could only change by fairly small but well defined increments. At first glance this new system seems to be the US system under a different guise and from my very limited knowledge of it, would mean your handicap is a sort of rolling average kind of number (best 8 out of last 20). I suppose the maths of it would mean it would take a lot for a significant change.
Even the idea that you could be off 10 one day on one course and off 8 or 12 another day on a different course might make sense in theory, (ie not all courses are equal), it’s so different to the way we’ve all been conditioned.

I guess the devil will be in the detail, but as others have mentioned hopefully we don’t end up with US style mulligan & non competition golf over here. I think our culture of weekend competitions is so vastly different from the US one, that one system can’t really work for all, can it ?

Shame they haven’t all the mechanics of it ready yet. Some of the online debate I’ve seen varies from “it’ll be the end of Stableford” to “everything might as well be Stableford now” !!

The race for Pierce Purcell eligibility might require spreadsheets in future :-) !!

prawnsambo

HighLine wrote: »

This isn't about initial handicaps, it's about continuous handicap assessment and adjustments basked on casual rounds (as well as competitive) of golf like the American system.

Really? You think?

In light of that, you might want to read my post again. It's quite short.

prawnsambo

Russman wrote: »

Even the idea that you could be off 10 one day on one course and off 8 or 12 another day on a different course might make sense in theory, (ie not all courses are equal), it’s so different to the way we’ve all been conditioned.

This one is probably badly needed. I've been talking to golfers who's courses have shut down recently (in the last year or so) and pretty much all of them have been at least two or three shots off the pace at their new clubs. In a negative sense. Under the current system, unless they get an end of year adjustment (and that's not guaranteed), they could be a couple of years getting themselves and their handicaps to align.

I know in my own club, we've had members in and out from other clubs and one I spoke to said they left because they just couldn't get competitive. It's a tough track alright and would be depressing coming in with points in the mid to high twenties all the time.

And of course the opposite is also true.

paulos53

paulos53 wrote: »

Unlimited casual games counting towards handicap adjustments is already in since January 1st

Supplementary scores are not new but I think the old limit was 10 rounds a year.

To clarify, it is unlimited supplementary scores that is in since January 1st. This doesn't apply to Category 1 players

spacecoyote

prawnsambo wrote: »

This one is probably badly needed. I've been talking to golfers who's courses have shut down recently (in the last year or so) and pretty much all of them have been at least two or three shots off the pace at their new clubs. In a negative sense. Under the current system, unless they get an end of year adjustment (and that's not guaranteed), they could be a couple of years getting themselves and their handicaps to align.

I know in my own club, we've had members in and out from other clubs and one I spoke to said they left because they just couldn't get competitive. It's a tough track alright and would be depressing coming in with points in the mid to high twenties all the time.

And of course the opposite is also true.

When I was joining my current club a couple of years ago, we had to meet with a member of the committee, who also happened to be one of the founding members. He made it pretty clear at the start that it would take at least a year to properly start to find my way round the place & get competitive.

I thought it was a good, fair & reasonable statement to make. I don't get that guys should expect to walk into a new club & be automatically able to start winning competitions.

OK, I get that it might be frustrating if you can't ever break 30 points, so maybe its exceptional, but I still think that we have issues with some people thinking shooting 36 points should be their average score

Russman

spacecoyote wrote: »

I still think that we have issues with some people thinking shooting 36 points should be their average score

This exactly ^^^


It'll be interesting to see how many "local" conditions are imposed by the GUI on the new WHS. How will they reconcile the current regime of not being able to get more than a shot back in a year with taking the best 8 out of your last 20 scores ? It would seem very contrived if they were to go down the route of something like "best 8 out of last 20 but only as long as........bla, bla...."

Even thinking it through, how will the cut offs for interclub work I wonder ? For example, in something like the Metro, could there be a scenario where a 9 handicap on a really tough course could be excluded and an 8 handicap on a very easy course could be eligible ? What baseline level of course would they work off ?

As for including casual rounds - that's beyond a joke IMO, no matter what system its under.

newport2

Flexibility in formats of play, allowing both competitive and recreational rounds to count for handicap purposes and ensuring a golfer’s handicap is more reflective of potential ability

The only way I see this working is if casual rounds could only decrease your handicap and not increase it. If you're playing off 10, then it means you have the potential to play to 10, even after a bad run of play or a bad season. If you improve drastically, by all means let casual rounds cut your handicap if you want. But don't allow casual rounds to increase handicap.

prawnsambo

spacecoyote wrote: »

When I was joining my current club a couple of years ago, we had to meet with a member of the committee, who also happened to be one of the founding members. He made it pretty clear at the start that it would take at least a year to properly start to find my way round the place & get competitive.

I thought it was a good, fair & reasonable statement to make. I don't get that guys should expect to walk into a new club & be automatically able to start winning competitions.

OK, I get that it might be frustrating if you can't ever break 30 points, so maybe its exceptional, but I still think that we have issues with some people thinking shooting 36 points should be their average score

It's a factor of coming from a course that's easier to play to one that's quite tough. It's kind of accepted that you will only play to your handicap in a competitive round a handful of times a year. You might be in the buffer zone half the time and not breaking thirty for the rest. But I'm talking about guys off the pace completely. Never within a shout of hitting their handicap and as much as three shots off it on their very best days.

That's what these guys are telling me when they leave. I took the trouble to ask them because it's always a disappointment when it happens.

A system that evens out the hills and troughs has to be better imo.

dan_ep82

prawnsambo wrote: »

It's a factor of coming from a course that's easier to play to one that's quite tough. It's kind of accepted that you will only play to your handicap in a competitive round a handful of times a year. You might be in the buffer zone half the time and not breaking thirty for the rest. But I'm talking about guys off the pace completely. Never within a shout of hitting their handicap and as much as three shots off it on their very best days.

That's what these guys are telling me when they leave. I took the trouble to ask them because it's always a disappointment when it happens.

A system that evens out the hills and troughs has to be better imo.

I experienced this in Tara, my new course I've yet to shoot below 34 and that was a bad day all round.

I like the idea of slope rating, it makes sense that Ardee will play a few shots easier than a card wrecker like corballis can be.

If you had to sign in/declare before the round you were using it as a hc round it would make sense but still open to abuse.

the long lad

newport2 wrote: »

The only way I see this working is if casual rounds could only decrease your handicap and not increase it. If you're playing off 10, then it means you have the potential to play to 10, even after a bad run of play or a bad season. If you improve drastically, by all means let casual rounds cut your handicap if you want. But don't allow casual rounds to increase handicap.

Not a bad idea, but what about people who like to artificially lower their handicap? IMO it's a bigger problem now than the bandits, since only 10 .1s back per year are allowed. I've seen heaps of instances of low guys not handing in cards.

I was a fan of the australian system when I was there, but since coming home I much prefer what we've got. The changes will be huge for all of the team competitions and championships. Most people's handicap will lower as a result of taking their best 8 from 20 rounds. We'll have an abundance of scratch golfers.

Russman

the long lad wrote: »

Not a bad idea, but what about people who like to artificially lower their handicap? IMO it's a bigger problem now than the bandits, since only 10 .1s back per year are allowed. I've seen heaps of instances of low guys not handing in cards.

I was a fan of the australian system when I was there, but since coming home I much prefer what we've got. The changes will be huge for all of the team competitions and championships. Most people's handicap will lower as a result of taking their best 8 from 20 rounds. We'll have an abundance of scratch golfers.

These two points exactly. There seems to be a view that a vanity handicap (ie too low) is somehow not as bad as a bandit. But what about the good player off 2 who can't get into a championship because a heap of scratch guys who never return cards are entered ?

Yeah, I think the rule of thumb when comparing the US and CONGU systems was that the CONGU handicap was about 2 or 3 shots higher than a USGA handicap. There are numerous threads on Golfwrx comparing/contrasting both and that seems to be the general consensus, broadly speaking. ie a CONGU 9 handicap would likely be a 6/7 in the US.

Ronney

An American Solution to an American Problem.....

Seve OB

There are 6 worldwide bodies governing handicaps. I think apart from CONGU, the rest of them are all quite similar to each other. I think people are confusing the GUI here with CONGU, as my reading is that it will be CONGU administering the local rules.

I like the CONGU rules for obvious reasons, but I'm happy to give the benefit of the doubt to the new system. Particularily when I read things like "factoring in memory of demonstrated ability for better responsiveness and control”. I'm sure it will come out in the wash what that is actually supposed to mean, but my guess is it means that there will be certain restrictions in place and we are unlikely to be able to jump handicaps by submitting a few poor scores.

The fact is Americans play mostly casual golf and I'm not really sure what the rest of the world do, but I think it is mostly the same.

We play mostly competitons.

Nothing I've read suggests that either situation has to or indeed is likely to change, all it means is that if you play a casual round, it should count and I've no quams with that. Obviously it stands to bring its flaws, such gimmes.

regarding managing the handicaps, i dont see why it cant be done through computers, play your round, pump your score into the computer and stick your card in the box, just like you do for any comp. algorithms can be run in the background to do all the necessary checks agains historical scores etc.

people will always be out there who try and cheat the system and no matter what you do, they will still be there. most of us are honorable and we really cant legislate for the cheats.

i play off 11, my best handicap ever. ive been a member in greystones for almost 30 years. twice i have shot +10 as my best score around the course. only twice in 30 years! however i am now also a member in castleknock and last year i shot a +5, +6 & a +9 (along with a lot of other terrible scores :rolleyes:) I've had similar scores over the years on other courses (not a lot of them, but a few). But i cant play to 11 in greystones or anywhere near it, ever. Point being, not all courses are equal and while your handicap might be 11 on one track, it could be quite easily a 14 on another or possibly an 8 on another.

So bring in a slope index for golf courses is a really brilliant idea, and something that makes sense. The weather thing is something I think we already have here with CSS but the yanks dont have that when they are playing casual golf. it will be interesting to see how that is rolled out for casulal golf.

Solutions will be established to finda a happy medium for a interclub comps.

I would like to see handicap categories unified though. Intermediate might be 10-18 at one club and 12-17 in the next and that is just silly. sure clubs can have their own divisions when it comes to in house club comps based on their membership criteria.

lastly, distances. while they are at all these changes, i wish they would decide that all courses need to represent the same distances, some courses its yards, some meteres, some to the front, some to the middle. some have blue flags for pin at back and some have yellow, some have red flags to the middle and some have red flags at the front. how easy would it be to make a change to have all this kinds of stuff unified at every course around the county or even world for that matter.

Seve OB

Haven't read this yet but it looks like it could be an interesting read so i'm sticking the like here for easy access later on

https://www.nationalclubgolfer.com/news/world-handicap-system-issues/

Rikand

Congratulations to the 2022 all ireland Pierce Purcell winners XXXXX club for completing a most extraordinary double after having been the all Ireland Senior cup winners the year previous with the exact same group of players....

doublecross

Came across this article about the winner of the pebble beach pro-am. His handicap jumped from 6 to 12 in two months. Fun times ahead, I'll be able to play junior and minor scratch cups in the same year

https://www.golfdigest.com/story/larry-fitzgerald-won-the-pebble-beach-pro-am-by-so-much-that-people-are-questioning-his-handicap

Seve OB

doublecross wrote: »

Came across this article about the winner of the pebble beach pro-am. His handicap jumped from 6 to 12 in two months. Fun times ahead, I'll be able to play junior and minor scratch cups in the same year

https://www.golfdigest.com/story/larry-fitzgerald-won-the-pebble-beach-pro-am-by-so-much-that-people-are-questioning-his-handicap

I'm not so sure.

The is a new worldwide handicapping system. Sure it is based on the USGA System, but also takes elements from the other hanciappping authorities such as CONGU and there are 4 others I believe.

In fact I think CONGU is pretty much odd one out when it comes to handicapps as most of them do base it on last 20 rounds.

So it wont just be a case of us ditching the CONGU System and using the American one, but rather a mix of the best each system has to offer.

That is my reading of it anyway. Unfortunately it seems that actual details of how the system is set to work are rather sketchy and I have seen no actual info on how to calculate handicaps with the new proposed worldwide system.

I live in hope.... :P

Seve OB

Did anyone apply to join a course raters team?

applications close today

mighty magpie

Seve OB wrote: »

Did anyone apply to join a course raters team?

applications close today

where/how can I apply for this?

Seve OB

mighty magpie wrote: »

where/how can I apply for this?

I got an email from my club outlining the requirements and an application form.

Closing date was 7th March.

It was just for Leinster branch but I would assume other branches may also be recruiting

Seve OB

Bumping this thread as there is now a bit more information coming out about this.

New website is supposedly launched, but showing nothing more than a white screen now for me https://www.whs.com/

It appears that CONGU (GB&I) will not be ready to implement this on 1 January 2019 along with the rest of the world, but it could be late in the year. I have read November, an odd time if you ask me. It begs the question, will we now have qualifying comps all year round?

mighty magpie

Do we have any details on how the 8 best rounds (out of 20) are used to determine handicap.

Obviously slope is factored in to these 8 so maybe 1 round at +10 on a high slope index is actually a +12 and vice versa.

Is there an average of these taken and then a multiplier applied to bring it lower again?

Seve OB

My understanding is that it will be "based" on the USGA Handicapping system. "Based" IMO means that it will be tweaked somewhat and a of yet I haven't seen definitive guidelines as to how it will be operated.

However, reading the USGA system, it looks very complex so I would hope they simplify it.

Some good info on this page and the links it highlights