Trouble on Tory Island...

Nomis21

http://www.thejournal.ie/tory-island-ferry-row-2-3841581-Feb2018/

Seems crazy to give the contract to someone with such an old boat.

The ferry is the lifeline for everyone who lives on Tory. Seas can be treacherous at the best of times around Tory and the operator who had the contract for the last five years did a good job and was well respected by the people of the island.

Also seems to me that the Government were only concerned with the price and not so much about the welfare and safety of the islanders

Spanish Eyes

They want the residents all back on the mainland.

It costs a lot to deliver the ballot boxes to these places. Boats, boxes, Gardai. Not to mind when someone gets sick, or the place runs out of Guinness.

silverharp

it would make a good prison , just catapult bags of spuds over every so often.

keith_sixteen

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

They want the residents all back on the mainland.

It costs a lot to deliver the ballot boxes to these places. Boats, boxes, Gardai. Not to mind when someone gets sick, or the place runs out of Guinness.

Everyone should live in Dublin. That's where all the stuff is.

seamus

Nomis21 wrote: »

http://www.thejournal.ie/tory-island-ferry-row-2-3841581-Feb2018/

Seems crazy to give the contract to someone with such an old boat.

The ferry is the lifeline for everyone who lives on Tory. Seas can be treacherous at the best of times around Tory and the operator who had the contract for the last five years did a good job and was well respected by the people of the island.

Also seems to me that the Government were only concerned with the price and not so much about the welfare and safety of the islanders

Does it make a difference? Have there been seismic shifts in the way the we build boats since 1976?

A quick search suggests that particular boat has recently undergone a pretty big refurb.

Boats are generally designed for longevity, it's not unusual to see them in operation for 50 years or more.

So the age of the boat alone shouldn't be an issue. If she's seaworthy and is equipped with modern safety and navigation equipment, what's the problem?

FCIM

The Tories don't deserve any better!

GLaDOS

I thought this thread was going to be about Brexit

Alun

I'm confused as to this "threat" to leave the island unless the existing ferry is reinstated. Let them leave, what's the problem?

Spanish Eyes

I do realise that the islanders have their own way of life and living, and are probably happy with their surroundings.

But looking it up there it is surely isolated alright. And it doesn't have the same draw as the Aran Islands either where outsiders visit every day.

I would hate it. I wonder how many twenty somethings live there and enjoy the isolation. Maybe some do.

Anyway, unless there is a Garda Station on the island the pubs probably never close. That might keep them sane.

Ajsoprano

I sometimes think that subsidized areas can just receive whatever tax they pay and be told to run a boat service road service guard service and all other services and subsidies out of it. They may even cheer for a certain gaa club they all boo to get their creeky boat back.

whisky_galore

Is there evidence that the ferry is unsafe?

If it meets or exceeds all that is looked for in the lines of surveys/inspections etc, I don't see what the problem is.

CrankyHaus

seamus wrote: »

Does it make a difference? Have there been seismic shifts in the way the we build boats since 1976?

A quick search suggests that particular boat has recently undergone a pretty big refurb.

Boats are generally designed for longevity, it's not unusual to see them in operation for 50 years or more.

So the age of the boat alone shouldn't be an issue. If she's seaworthy and is equipped with modern safety and navigation equipment, what's the problem?

Well they currently have one 20 years newer that they seem happy with so they may ask why something so critical to safety and life on the island is being made worse.

However there may be more to this. For example the current boat owner may simply be enlisting family and friends to support his position after he lost the tender.

loyatemu

For reference...

Queen of Aran:



Tormór (the current ferry):

McMurphy

I blame this little bollox.

seamus

CrankyHaus wrote: »

Well they currently have one 20 years newer that they seem happy with so they may ask why something so critical to safety and life on the island is being made worse.

Is it being made worse though?

Humans have been building boats for thousands of year, so we've gotten pretty good at it. The underlying methods and technology for creating a boat haven't changed in 20 years, so there's nothing to say that a newer boat is actually better. It comes down to which one was last overhauled. Once the hull is solid, everything inside the hull is just decoration.

However there may be more to this. For example the current boat owner may simply be enlisting family and friends to support his position after he lost the tender.

True, true. Could easily just be a "we don't like change!" complaint from locals who've gotten friendly with the last captain.

end of the road

fair play to them, hopefully they get a resolution that meets their needs.

stimpson

I’ve been on both these boats in the past couple of years. They’re both equally shite.

Permabear

This post has been deleted.

corner of hells

Permabear wrote: »

This post had been deleted.

Was the Titanic a ferry to Tory island too ?

diomed

They need a boat built for the worst weather, not something that can "make the crossing".
I'm not a fan of the government splashing the cash, but here I'll make an exception.

hurler32

Nomis21 wrote: »

http://www.thejournal.ie/tory-island-ferry-row-2-3841581-Feb2018/

Seems crazy to give the contract to someone with such an old boat.

The ferry is the lifeline for everyone who lives on Tory. Seas can be treacherous at the best of times around Tory and the operator who had the contract for the last five years did a good job and was well respected by the people of the island.

Also seems to me that the Government were only concerned with the price and not so much about the welfare and safety of the islanders

Fine Gael are only concerned about the greater Dublin Area , if they could get rid of the islands boat altogether the money could go towards some rugby pitch in a South Dublin school ...

wexandproud

corner of hells wrote: »

Was the Titanic a ferry to Tory island too ?

it was ya , that's why they they didn't expect the iceberg

id say there's more to this that meets the eye.
however every nut and bolt on that ferry will be inspect and any flaws in the vessel will have to be put right and her stability will be checked . After that she will be passed fit for purpose or not . If its passed fit for purpose it will be interesting to see what the natives have to say then

byhookorbycrook

Fit for purpose like the school bus in Clare this week?
http://www.clare.fm/news/gardai-seize-clare-school-bus-badly-worn-tires-rust/

Ubbquittious

The British island of Lundy is served by a much older ferry, the MS Oldenburg. Built way back in 1958

Grand yoke. I never liked the idea of condemning a machine just because it's old

wexandproud

diomed wrote: »

They need a boat built for the worst weather, not something that can "make the crossing".
I'm not a fan of the government splashing the cash, but here I'll make an exception.

a boat built to stick the worst weather up there , most people would not want to be aboard it in that weather

sjb25

loyatemu wrote: »

For reference...

Queen of Aran:



Tormór (the current ferry):

Admittedly iv no clue about boats/ferry’s/ships but the new one looks a bit of a sh1tbox compared to the current one

Ajsoprano

hurler32 wrote: »

Fine Gael are only concerned about the greater Dublin Area , if they could get rid of the islands boat altogether the money could go towards some rugby pitch in a South Dublin school ...

I’d be more inclined to make up a story that the politicians brother owns the ferry and leases it to the island for 60 million a day than make up a story that says they are spending the money tax payers in south dublin pay on a south dublin project.
How about we introduce an island tax for Islanders by household to pay for boats and such.

downwesht

Big money spent on Cape Clear down here on a new pier /pontoons and deservedly so.Tory should get a decent ferry service too.We need to maintain our offshore communities who have rich traditions and heritage.

Funkfield

hurler32 wrote: »

Fine Gael are only concerned about the greater Dublin Area , if they could get rid of the islands boat altogether the money could go towards some rugby pitch in a South Dublin school ...

Is that cos of their leadership?

jamesbere

sjb25 wrote: »

Admittedly iv no clue about boats/ferry’s/ships but the new one looks a bit of a sh1tbox compared to the current one

The new one looks like an upgraded fishing trawler.
I think the islanders are perfectly right. Its taking a step backwards in commissioning an older boat to do the journey. I think a new one should be built.

Spanish Eyes

downwesht wrote: »

Big money spent on Cape Clear down here on a new pier /pontoons and deservedly so.Tory should get a decent ferry service too.We need to maintain our offshore communities who have rich traditions and heritage.

Insular point. Very few people go to Tory in reality.

Aran Islands and CapeClear. fine. but that place up there along with Rathlin Island is really off the beaten track.

It is for a certain cohort of visitors for sure, and many people just do not have the time in their itinerary to include these offshore islands.

But good luck to them. It is not for me and never will be.

downwesht

Are the Islanders not entitled to a decent boat whether tourists go there or not?

511

hurler32 wrote: »

Fine Gael are only concerned about the greater Dublin Area , if they could get rid of the islands boat altogether the money could go towards some rugby pitch in a South Dublin school ...

That's a load of bollocks. FG are trying to rollout fibre optic broadband to every one-off house in the backarse of nowhere, while they keep stalling on Dublin North Metro. They also built a dual carriage way to bypass Tuam which has a population of almost 9,000. The government are also building a bridge to bypass New Ross, with its population of 5,000. Considering this entire country is subsidised by Dublin and Cork, rural areas receive a hughly disproportionate amount of investment in their favour compared to what they put in.

Odelay

Permabear wrote: »

This post had been deleted.

Had exactly the same thought myself.

Odelay

Ubbquittious wrote: »

The British island of Lundy is served by a much older ferry, the MS Oldenburg. Built way back in 1958

Grand yoke. I never liked the idea of condemning a machine just because it's old

You and your common sense.

end of the road

511 wrote: »

That's a load of bollocks. FG are trying to rollout fibre optic broadband to every one-off house in the backarse of nowhere, while they keep stalling on Dublin North Metro. They also built a dual carriage way to bypass Tuam which has a population of almost 9,000. The government are also building a bridge to bypass New Ross, with its population of 5,000. Considering this entire country is subsidised by Dublin and Cork, rural areas receive a hughly disproportionate amount of investment in their favour compared to what they put in.

it's not disproportionate, but in line with the ideals of bringing the country up to a high standard (for what it's worth, the new-ross bridge and tuam by-pass are a waste of money)

Spanish Eyes

I think it all boils down to boat no 1, and its operator, and boat no. 2 and its operator.

It is all based on who you know and what you know.

The current operator missed out on the contract, so the Islanders are going mad with the new one.

Brave new operator there!

Anyway if they all moved to the mainland, good luck to them. I am sure they will have researched all the benefits from the taxpayer they will get for going on shore.

Load a bollix imv. But anyway.

wexandproud

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

I think it all boils down to boat no 1, and its operator, and boat no. 2 and its operator.

It is all based on who you know and what you know.

The current operator missed out on the contract, so the Islanders are going mad with the new one.

Brave new operator there!

Anyway if they all moved to the mainland, good luck to them. I am sure they will have researched all the benefits from the taxpayer they will get for going on shore.

Load a bollix imv. But anyway.

id say that's fairly close to the truth and the boat is just being used as an excuse . Thats why it will be interesting to see what happens if the new boat is licensed or if the old one fails a survey

whisky_galore

The leaving the island 'threat' is only bluff.

I don't know why that island wasn't evacuated decades ago like the Blaskets.

Permabear

This post has been deleted.

Ajsoprano

whisky_galore wrote: »

The leaving the island 'threat' is only bluff.

I don't know why that island wasn't evacuated decades ago like the Blaskets.

I’d say it’d save the taxpayer a fortune if they did. 5-10 board failte staff or seasonal staff could run the tourist part and make the island profitable.

wexie

whisky_galore wrote: »

The leaving the island 'threat' is only bluff.

Why would that even be a threat? I don't think I get it?
What's supposed to happen? Are the powers that be supposed to start quaking in their boots that a strategic piece of coastal defenses will no longer be manned?

Sounds to me like if they did all choose to leave it would only save the government a great deal of money and hassle? Subsidized boat, flights and no doubt a great deal of other things?

Am I missing something?

Ubbquittious

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

Insular point. Very few people go to Tory in reality.

Aran Islands and CapeClear. fine. but that place up there along with Rathlin Island is really off the beaten track.

It is for a certain cohort of visitors for sure, and many people just do not have the time in their itinerary to include these offshore islands.

But good luck to them. It is not for me and never will be.

I've been twice. Have been meaning to go again. Any time I went the ferry was far from empty

Spanish Eyes

whisky_galore wrote: »

The leaving the island 'threat' is only bluff.

I don't know why that island wasn't evacuated decades ago like the Blaskets.

Why would anyone live on an island 14km from civilisation? They must never get sick or need anything.

Ah I suppose we taxpayers pay a premium for all these insular people correct?

Tory is nothing like Aran Islands. That is their problem they need to market it, but there is no way I would travel that far to an outcrop in the Atlantic. Sorry there.

The threat is hilarious, well come back to Donegal mainland why don't you. Ridiculous threat really.

Ubbquittious

Permabear wrote: »

This post had been deleted.

There was one on Tory for sale for 30,000 for quite a while. Might still be there. I must say I was tempted

Alun

wexie wrote: »

Why would that even be a threat? I don't think I get it?
What's supposed to happen? Are the powers that be supposed to start quaking in their boots that a strategic piece of coastal defenses will no longer be manned?

Sounds to me like if they did all choose to leave it would only save the government a great deal of money and hassle? Subsidized boat, flights and no doubt a great deal of other things?

Am I missing something?

I agree, for a threat to be a threat, there has to be something bad happening if what is being threatened actually happens. I'm at a loss to understand what that "bad thing" is in this case. Like you say, if everybody did leave it'd save the government a load of money, so a win rather than a lose.

Ubbquittious

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

Why would anyone live on an island 14km from civilisation? They must never get sick or need anything.

Ah I suppose we taxpayers pay a premium for all these insular people correct?

Tory is nothing like Aran Islands. That is their problem they need to market it, but there is no way I would travel that far to an outcrop in the Atlantic. Sorry there.

The threat is hilarious, well come back to Donegal mainland why don't you. Ridiculous threat really.

It's not for everyone but then neither is the mainland. It's a really fun place and I'd recommend it to anyone

I've said before I find the Aran islands a bit posh and a bit too commercialised. Still good for a weekend but it's clear to see that they're just milking the tourists and there's throngs of them arriving on every ferry in the summer. I think it's great that there's people living on places like Tory and that they havn't been evacuated like the Blaskets, Inishark, Inishtrahull. If anything they should be bringing people back to these islands, restoring the old ruins to their former glory and so on. I don't think there's anything noble in the humdrum of modern society and if someone wants to live on an island like that fair fcuks to them, most people are too busy sitting behind their xbox to take up island life.

retalivity

There used to be one guard between tory and aranmore, with 4 pubs on the former and 7 on the latter. With recent garda cutbacks in north donegal, there is no station between milford and glenties anymore, barely a patrol car unless theres a callout.

Both places are absolute madhouses and have plenty of visitors to them, nowhere near the likes in galways, kerry or cork, but plenty busy in the summer

whisky_galore

Alun wrote: »

I agree, for a threat to be a threat, there has to be something bad happening if what is being threatened actually happens. I'm at a loss to understand what that "bad thing" is in this case. Like you say, if everybody did leave it'd save the government a load of money, so a win rather than a lose.

Loss of 'culture and music', and people to show the tourists around perhaps.

Ajsoprano

We should build a giant prison on it. But rent the beds to oversees prisons. Imagine how much a foreign prison would pay to have a place to send the prisoners who are too much hassle for them. Places like gitmo. We could pass a law pretending that it’s an old Tory island custom to burn the feet of new visitors to check if they are witches and make it compulsory if they are to visit the non tourist side. The tourist side can carry on oblivious. The money raised might be enough to let them choose whose uncle gets the drive the boat.

Spanish Eyes

Ubbquittious wrote: »

It's not for everyone but then neither is the mainland. It's a really fun place and I'd recommend it to anyone

I've said before I find the Aran islands a bit posh and a bit too commercialised. Still good for a weekend but it's clear to see that they're just milking the tourists and there's throngs of them arriving on every ferry in the summer. I think it's great that there's people living on places like Tory and that they havn't been evacuated like the Blaskets, Inishark, Inishtrahull. If anything they should be bringing people back to these islands, restoring the old ruins to their former glory and so on. I don't think there's anything noble in the humdrum of modern society and if someone wants to live on an island like that fair fcuks to them, most people are too busy sitting behind their xbox to take up island life.

You live there all year round or just a visitor for the insular craic?

I personally would dislike the fact that everyone knows my business, I think living in a terraced house in somewhere like Cork or Dublin would be less nosey,

That is a No from me so.