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Ireland 2040 plan "will kill rural Ireland"

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  • Registered Users Posts: 5,116 ✭✭✭ pg633


    I get that building in or near existing villages or towns would probably be good for the household, the village and society in general but blanket bans isn't going to suddenly create opportunities to build in or next to those villages.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,116 ✭✭✭ pg633


    Consonata wrote: »
    There are 379 primary schools with 2 teachers or less in the country. 379 schools which need seperate boards of management, funding for building repair, heating, electricity etc. It is one of the biggest wastes in our education budget and it is directly connected to people living in sparse communities and demanding that a school should be behind every cut stone wall in the west of ireland
    How many of these have opened in the past 40 years? I imagine most date (like my primary school) from the days when there was a large population living and working within walking distance.


  • Registered Users Posts: 878 ✭✭✭ greenfield21


    .


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,637 ✭✭✭ PhoenixParker


    What is the difference between a one off house a km from a small village and a house in a small village ?
    There will not be a Garda station, a post office, a bank, a hospital, a supermarket, no secondary school, no real bus service most likely.

    Either way the people living in that small village are going to have to use cars to get anywhere like shopping, schools, work, etc.

    For a start there'll be a primary school and kids who can safely walk there which is a massive health and wellbeing benefit for kids and allows independence. Socially it makes after school activities and contact much easier to arrange for that age group. From a government point of view that saves on school buses too.

    There might not be a secondary school but there can be one or two bus stops and a direct journey to the local school instead of a meandering long route through the countryside.

    A centre of population also means there's the possibility of an actual bus service to large local towns which can serve workers, the elderly, those who don't drive or those who can't afford a second car.

    There won't be a hospital but there might be a GP or pharmacy, both very handy to have nearby especially if you find it difficult to drive/can't drive. If a GP needs to make a home visit, vanishingly rare I know, it takes 20 minutes instead of an hour. If the HSE is providing home care travel costs and time are massively reduced. The same budget can provide more hours per person. Not so little things like that can be the difference between an elderly person living independently or having to move to a nursing home.

    The local pub will have people who can get there and back safely which means it's far more likely to stay open generating employment but also giving a space for community connections to form and a social outlet.

    The little things like being able to walk to a local shop and stop to say hello to a few people on the way are huge if you're in any way lonely or isolated.

    Villages are very different to isolated one off houses.


  • Moderators, Education Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 34,552 Mod ✭✭✭✭ AlmightyCushion


    jmayo wrote: »
    I know a school based in a village and a lot of the villagers actually drive their kids to it.

    And the small villages will not have the numbers for a secondary school so transport.
    Most of the shopping will be done in the nearest Lidl, Aldi, Tesco or Dunnes in the nearest large town so still driving.

    Walk to work ????
    So is every village going to get a factory. :eek:
    Better tell that poster from earlier.

    Seriously I don't know where some of you guys live or are from, but about the only thing people will walk to is the local pub.
    And yes maybe the national school.



    Granted wired broadband would be easier to supply.
    And yes there would be less need for electricity lines, but then again lines will have to be maintained to give power to farms, etc.
    Or will they be told they shouldn't have power ?

    Also has anyone ever thought that by moving everyone into a village you are then pushing the cost of water and sewage provision onto the local council (the state, the taxpayers) and not the individual as is with one off housing ?

    No for true cost benefits that some people want the only solution is everyone moves to a city, preferably the mecca of Ireland Dublin's inner city.

    When talking about shops, work and schools I used the word local before them. Sure if they work in another town or city they'll drive. That is fairly obvious. If they work in the local town, then they can walk to work.

    No one is saying farmers shouldn't have power. Arguments like this are just stupid.

    Some small towns will have supermarkets, they won't have everything you need like a big supermarket will but they would carry a lot of it. Even if you live in a small village with only a small shop, people living in the village can walk to the local shop when they run out of milk or bread or whatever instead of driving to the same shop (they're not going to drive to the lidl in the next big town to get some milk). Seriously, I don't see what is so hard to comprehend here. If people have services close to them, they are more likely to walk to them or cycle instead of hopping in the car. If people lived in villages and towns instead of a few KM down the road from them in a one off house, then they would be more likely to walk to those services instead of driving.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 8,402 ✭✭✭ John_Rambo


    jmayo wrote: »
    No for true cost benefits that some people want the only solution is everyone moves to a city, preferably the mecca of Ireland Dublin's inner city.

    Except nobody said this. Just you.


  • Registered Users Posts: 10,129 ✭✭✭✭ markodaly


    Honestly what are you talking about? Vain?

    No it's very not vain it's having the house I want, you might be happy spending a few 100k on a small house or poky apartment and making do with that so you can live in other things people's laps but for me that just doesn't cut it. Having the house I want with the space, layout and facilities I want is far more important than being able to walk to a cafe.

    veruca-salt.jpg


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,084 ✭✭✭ DaCor


    Here's one for ye, why do farmers have to live on the farm?

    Everyone else has a commute to work, I don't see them being any different. It's done this way all over the world. They live in the village and drive to their land.

    No (logical) reason Irish farmers couldn't do the same


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,402 ✭✭✭ John_Rambo


    DaCor wrote: »
    Here's one for ye, why do farmers have to live on the farm?

    Everyone else has a commute to work, I don't see them being any different. It's done this way all over the world. They live in the village and drive to their land.

    No (logical) reason Irish farmers couldn't do the same

    I've worked on farms, when it comes to livestock there's a 100% need for someone on site. Particularly lambing, dairy and beef. Mind you the percentage of these among current rural one off house dwellers is tiny. The one off housing scourge is a further reason for farmers to be on site with dogs straying, theft and other problems because of increased rural population.


  • Registered Users Posts: 10,129 ✭✭✭✭ markodaly


    DaCor wrote: »
    Here's one for ye, why do farmers have to live on the farm?

    Everyone else has a commute to work, I don't see them being any different. It's done this way all over the world. They live in the village and drive to their land.

    No (logical) reason Irish farmers couldn't do the same

    I understand completely why farmers need to live out on the land, being close to livesstock is one. However, not everyone out in the sticks is a farmer.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 5,116 ✭✭✭ pg633


    markodaly wrote: »
    I understand completely why farmers need to live out on the land, being close to livesstock is one. However, not everyone out in the sticks is a farmer.
    A neighbour of mine when they first moved to their urban generated rural one off house many years ago supposedly complained that they didn't realise there would be so many farmers around.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 24,778 ✭✭✭✭ Juniper Black Pinprick


    markodaly wrote: »
    veruca-salt.jpg

    You could make the same statement about anyone on the thread. Plenty of "I want to be close to cafes, "I want to be able to walk to work", I want to be close to aminities", "I want to live in big city" etc etc.


  • Registered Users Posts: 10,129 ✭✭✭✭ markodaly


    You could make the same statement about anyone on the thread. Plenty of "I want to be close to cafes, "I want to be able to walk to work", I want to be close to aminities", "I want to live in big city" etc etc.

    You want your cake and to eat it as well.

    You want your MTV cribs McMansion with road frontage but want others to subsidise the cost of that, namely connections for the ESB and BB.


  • Registered Users Posts: 19,462 ✭✭✭✭ Tell me how


    DaCor wrote:
    Here's one for ye, why do farmers have to live on the farm?

    Added security. Unless you want them bring their tools home everyday. That wouldn't be difficult, I mean, that's what other people have to do.

    Also, lambing/calving season would mean driving all night which we wouldn't want would we.


  • Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 13,128 Mod ✭✭✭✭ marno21


    Going back to the topic at hand, has anyone seen a time for when this will be published?


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 9,005 ✭✭✭ pilly


    DaCor wrote:
    Here's one for ye, why do farmers have to live on the farm?

    DaCor wrote:
    Everyone else has a commute to work, I don't see them being any different. It's done this way all over the world. They live in the village and drive to their land.

    DaCor wrote:
    No (logical) reason Irish farmers couldn't do the same


    Disagree with this one completely. Farming is not a 9-5 job.

    Anyway, farmers are not the problem.


  • Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 13,128 Mod ✭✭✭✭ marno21


    From the Morning Papers

    * Luas extensions to Bray, Finglas, Lucan and Poolbeg
    * DART Expansion to Maynooth and Drogheda (??)
    * 1bn for rural towns
    * Metro including Luas Green Line
    * Cork-Limerick motorway


  • Registered Users Posts: 17,773 ✭✭✭✭ BonnieSituation


    marno21 wrote: »
    From the Morning Papers

    * Luas extensions to Bray, Finglas, Lucan and Poolbeg
    * DART Expansion to Maynooth and Drogheda (??)
    * 1bn for rural towns
    * Metro including Luas Green Line
    * Cork-Limerick motorway

    We're upgrading the green line to metro standard... And then putting more trams further out beyond the M50. What about metro outside the M50. You couldn't make it up.

    The Lucan alignment will be interesting. And not good interesting. If it dog legs at Ballyfermot to head down the Kylemore Road to join the red line either at the Naas Road or down the canal to join the red line at black horse you can keep it.

    It needs to get directly into town and hit Heuston via Con Colbert and John's Road.


  • Registered Users Posts: 19,462 ✭✭✭✭ Tell me how


    marno21 wrote:
    * Luas extensions to Bray, Finglas, Lucan and Poolbeg * DART Expansion to Maynooth and Drogheda (??) * 1bn for rural towns * Metro including Luas Green Line * Cork-Limerick motorway

    Does it suggest how the €1B will be spent in towns and who gets what?


  • Registered Users Posts: 10,129 ✭✭✭✭ markodaly


    * Luas extensions to Bray, Finglas, Lucan and Poolbeg - Finglas would be the only one I support there, Luas is grand when moving small distances but to Bray? **** off!

    * DART Expansion to Maynooth and Drogheda (??) - Good, but what about Dart Underground

    * 1bn for rural towns - Not sure, its this the one for everyone in the audience? What about the cities?

    * Metro including Luas Green Line - Good, if this means upgrading this line to Metro

    * Cork-Limerick motorway - Good


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  • Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 13,128 Mod ✭✭✭✭ marno21


    Irish Examiner also indicates the N86 Tralee-Dingle (24km remaining) will be included, cost will be approx €60m


  • Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 13,128 Mod ✭✭✭✭ marno21


    Does it suggest how the €1B will be spent in towns and who gets what?

    We'll likely find out in full tomorrow.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,353 ✭✭✭ Shn99


    Will the NPF conference be streamed on social media tomorrow does anyone know?


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,978 ✭✭✭ Peter Flynt


    This shower of muppets in FG have been in power for the best part of a decade.

    Public services are a mess due to underinvestment, there's no housing policy (because most of them are landlords) and the transport system is beyong a joke.

    They can't sort out day to day basic issues and they're planning for 2040?

    Gimme a break.

    Just PR nonsense.


  • Registered Users Posts: 13,512 ✭✭✭✭ Zebra3


    Seems to be nothing to indicate DU will be planned.


  • Registered Users Posts: 10,190 ✭✭✭✭ salmocab


    NIMAN wrote: »
    Looking forward to this plan being released to see how the NW fares!

    It appears you could draw a line across the country from Dublin, and everything above that is forgotten.

    So it appears you could draw a line across the country and it would mean nothing


  • Registered Users Posts: 10,190 ✭✭✭✭ salmocab


    Without details obviously but apart from DU everything else seems reasonable.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 9,005 ✭✭✭ pilly


    salmocab wrote:
    Without details obviously but apart from DU everything else seems reasonable.


    Can I ask what DU is?


  • Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 59,579 Mod ✭✭✭✭ L1011


    The Luas to Bray would hopefully remove some N11 traffic to rail for Cherrywood etc. It's not for people going all the way in. This is what having a transport *network* allows


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  • Registered Users Posts: 13,512 ✭✭✭✭ Zebra3


    DART Underground.


This discussion has been closed.
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