Aer Lingus - Anyone had their complaint processed

SlowBlowin

Hi

I had reason to complain about service on a flight from Cork to Southampton. I fly Aer Lingus 20+ times a year and the experience is normally grand.

The staff member was having a meltdown on the flight and taking it out on me. I tried to complain when on board but I was just shouted at, so I waited a few days and wrote a reasoned complaint on the web site form.

After 3 weeks I called customer service, they said it was on the system but can take a long time to process. Its now weeks later and still nothing, has anyone had a complaint against a crew member handled in a reasonable timescale or do these things just get sidelined ?

SB

ted1

It took about 6 months for them to process a compensation claim. Their guest relations department sucks. I lodged a few official complaints with them and the IAA. just keep ringing them

notharrypotter

ted1 wrote: »

It took about 6 months for them to process a compensation claim. Their guest relations department sucks. I lodged a few official complaints with them and the IAA. just keep ringing them

Why report to IAA?

ted1

notharrypotter wrote: »

ted1 wrote: »

It took about 6 months for them to process a compensation claim. Their guest relations department sucks. I lodged a few official complaints with them and the IAA. just keep ringing them

Why report to IAA?

Meant the aviation regulator.

Fattes

There official procedure is for 60 days to reply to a complaint or query! Yep 60 days, start copying the aviation regulator on correspondence and it might speed things up!

Especially if it is a staff member not following procedures or acting in an irrational manner

martinsvi

Forgive me for being simple, but I want to know all the details of what happened! A cabin crew having a meltdown and shouting at a passenger seems front page news worthy, were you the only one being shouted at? Did other crew members notice and try to smooth things out? What about other passengers, clearly if there was an actual meltdown and shouting.. you know, there's always that one lad taking a video.. nothing?

Locker10a

Stobart are the employer of the crew on this route, have you contacted their HR department to allow them to investigate this meltdown. This person may not be fit to work at the moment.

SlowBlowin

martinsvi wrote: »

Forgive me for being simple, but I want to know all the details of what happened! A cabin crew having a meltdown and shouting at a passenger seems front page news worthy, were you the only one being shouted at? Did other crew members notice and try to smooth things out? What about other passengers, clearly if there was an actual meltdown and shouting.. you know, there's always that one lad taking a video.. nothing?

Try and take a video on Aer Lingus and you will soon be told to stop, they don't allow pictures of video on board.

My complaint was about a staff members attitude and anger.

Booked a ticket, printed out a boarding pass from the website, checked in, and boarded. Presented the boarding pass to the staff member, who said "window seat last row on the right", when I got to the seat there was someone sitting there. I asked him to move and he said the same staff member had just moved him from the front of the plane to my seat (which was last row at the back).

When I told the staff member she got in a huff and moved the chap in my seat and I was seated (he was moved next to me). She said "Happy now", with an obviously false smile and head cocked to one side !

She then got more and more frustrated with other seating issues on the plane, then came back to me and said can I see your boarding pass (for the second time). She looked at it and said "thats the problem, your seat is 18F and there is no 18F", I said "I just booked on the web site", she said "well you've done something wrong". It was at this point I realized she was an angry woman..

This was despite her directing me to my seat (I was directed to 17F), after I checked in and had my pass go through 2 checks.

5 Minutes later she reappeared, and said the captain has said the plane needs balancing I need you to move to the front of the plane (remember the chap on my left had been moved from his seat and the front, next to me at the back). I said "wouldn't it make more sense to move the chap you had already moved from the front", she said "No I want to move you, do you mind", I said "would it make any difference if I did mind", she said smiling "No", so I moved.

I was pretty upset and getting the blame so when I saw her mid flight I tried to talk to her about her customer approach, but she just said "you dont have a seat on this plane, there is no 18F, there is no 18F", she was still angry so I gave up.

As I was leaving the plane, walking down the steps she shouted down at me "I just found out they swapped the plane, thats why you dont have a seat, so your pass was wrong", and then turned away.

All I ever did was book a ticket on the web site.

As I passed the next crew waiting to get on I told them they couldn't do a worse job that the current crew.

SB

notharrypotter

Oops69 wrote: »

you can forget about getting a reply from the IAA , E-mails sent there just don't get answered , its appalling .

Maybe it's because they are been sent to the wrong regulatory authority.

Locker10a

SlowBlowin wrote: »

martinsvi wrote: »

Forgive me for being simple, but I want to know all the details of what happened! A cabin crew having a meltdown and shouting at a passenger seems front page news worthy, were you the only one being shouted at? Did other crew members notice and try to smooth things out? What about other passengers, clearly if there was an actual meltdown and shouting.. you know, there's always that one lad taking a video.. nothing?

Try and take a video on Aer Lingus and you will soon be told to stop, they don't allow pictures of video on board.

My complaint was about a staff members attitude and anger.

Booked a ticket, printed out a boarding pass from the website, checked in, and boarded. Presented the boarding pass to the staff member, who said "window seat last row on the right", when I got to the seat there was someone sitting there. I asked him to move and he said the same staff member had just moved him from the front of the plane to my seat (which was last row at the back).

When I told the staff member she got in a huff and moved the chap in my seat and I was seated (he was moved next to me). She said "Happy now", with an obviously false smile and head cocked to one side !

She then got more and more frustrated with other seating issues on the plane, then came back to me and said can I see your boarding pass (for the second time). She looked at it and said "thats the problem, your seat is 18F and there is no 18F", I said "I just booked on the web site", she said "well you've done something wrong". It was at this point I realized she was an angry woman..

This was despite her directing me to my seat (I was directed to 17F), after I checked in and had my pass go through 2 checks.

5 Minutes later she reappeared, and said the captain has said the plane needs balancing I need you to move to the front of the plane (remember the chap on my left had been moved from his seat and the front, next to me at the back). I said "wouldn't it make more sense to move the chap you had already moved from the front", she said "No I want to move you, do you mind", I said "would it make any difference if I did mind", she said smiling "No", so I moved.

I was pretty upset and getting the blame so when I saw her mid flight I tried to talk to her about her customer approach, but she just said "you dont have a seat on this plane, there is no 18F, there is no 18F", she was still angry so I gave up.

As I was leaving the plane, walking down the steps she shouted down at me "I just found out they swapped the plane, thats why you dont have a seat, so your pass was wrong", and then turned away.

All I ever did was book a ticket on the web site.

As I passed the next crew waiting to get on I told them they couldn't do a worse job that the current crew.

SB

Sounds less like a meltdown and more like you caught someone having a very bad day and in a very bad mood. Which unfortunately happens, but anyone dealing with the public should realise expressing you’re frustrations on others never makes a situation better, only worse, and is generally never worth it.
Honesty though there’s not much any airline will do here other than send a scripted reply apologising to you. The crew member may indeed get “feedback” when the complaint is passed along but I’m not sure what your hoping to get from this.

SlowBlowin

I dont think not complaining about something just because there is a good chance nothing will happen is a good enough reason not to complain.

I have elderly relatives that visit on that route, I would not like them to get the same experience.

It could be shes done it several times before, and they would like a further complaint, I dont know.

I do know I would feel better knowing I had done all I could to let them know how angry she can get, and how unsuitable she is in a public facing position.

Given her level of frustration, anger, and lack of logical thinking I wonder how she would fair under the pressure of an emergency.. ?

SB

Locker10a

SlowBlowin wrote: »

I dont think not complaining about something just because there is a good chance nothing will happen is a good enough reason not to complain.

I have elderly relatives that visit on that route, I would not like them to get the same experience.

It could be shes done it several times before, and they would like a further complaint, I dont know.

I do know I would feel better knowing I had done all I could to let them know how angry she can get, and how unsuitable she is in a public facing position.

Given her level of frustration, anger, and lack of logical thinking I wonder how she would fair under the pressure of an emergency.. ?

SB

By all means forward your complaint, I just wouldn’t expect much back other than an apology.
Also have you considered emailing Stobart, as they would be the actual employer in this case, Any complaint to Aer Lingus will only be directed to Stobart anyway.

SlowBlowin

Locker10a wrote: »

By all means forward your complaint, I just wouldn’t expect much back other than an apology.
Also have you considered emailing Stobart, as they would be the actual employer in this case, Any complaint to Aer Lingus will only be directed to Stobart anyway.

I sent my complaint in months ago, hence this thread ?

I am not after material gain from this, only to let the management know who they are employing.. I would like to think that somewhere within Stobart/Aer Lingus there might be individuals that would like to know how they are failing as a company, or are you saying 100% of the management don't give a toss ?

SB

martinsvi

but surely there is 18F, I mean could you not just point at the overhead panel where it would clearly indicate which row it is and what letters are assigned to the seats? I mean, don't get me wrong, but I'm not surprised it is taking them so long to come back to you, they are still probably scratching their heads trying to make any sense of this story.. try aerlingus facebook wall really, if your story is true, she does seem like a ticking time bomb

SlowBlowin

Some ATR72s have 18F, others only go up to 17F.

The web site thought there was an 18F on that route, but after the plane swap there is no 18F, but not my fault.

Happened to me once more after.

SB

faoiarvok

SlowBlowin wrote: »

Try and take a video on Aer Lingus and you will soon be told to stop, they don't allow pictures of video on board.

That's mad, especially given that Aer Lingus have used video posted on YouTube by a passenger in their TV ads.

Locker10a

faoiarvok wrote: »

SlowBlowin wrote: »

Try and take a video on Aer Lingus and you will soon be told to stop, they don't allow pictures of video on board.

That's mad, especially given that Aer Lingus have used video posted on YouTube by a passenger in their TV ads.

Its standard policy in commercial Aviation that videoing inside the cabin is not permitted, nor is taking photographs that capture crew members at work. You’ll find the same policy on any airline, and it has a background in security as well as liability issues iirc

Brennus335

faoiarvok wrote: »

That's mad, especially given that Aer Lingus have used video posted on YouTube by a passenger in their TV ads.

Mind if I come into your office and start videoing and photographing you at work?

Mebuntu

Locker10a wrote: »

Its standard policy in commercial Aviation that videoing inside the cabin is not permitted, nor is taking photographs that capture crew members at work. You’ll find the same policy on any airline, and it has a background in security as well as liability issues iirc

Just to clarify, I take it that you mean videoing the inside of the cabin is not permitted. I've done a great many videos over time of the outside from inside the cabin both on the ground and in the air and never had a problem with CC who clearly saw me and youtube is also full of them. In fact, on a few occasions CC have passed comments like "I hope you're getting some good shots". As an aside, youtube and the newspapers regularly display images of events that took place inside the cabin.

BTW, I have never seen any warnings or heard any announcements about photography onboard like you would see or hear, for example, in a theatre.

faoiarvok

Locker10a wrote: »

Its standard policy in commercial Aviation that videoing inside the cabin is not permitted, nor is taking photographs that capture crew members at work. You’ll find the same policy on any airline, and it has a background in security as well as liability issues iirc

If that’s the case they’re not doing a great job communicating that policy as I’ve never heard it mentioned, and certainly aren’t doing very well enforcing it, given the number of amateur “trip report”/“flight review” videos online, including plenty of Aer Lingus ones.

faoiarvok

Brennus335 wrote: »

Mind if I come into your office and start videoing and photographing you at work?

Not really, but that’s beside the point.

Locker10a

Mebuntu wrote: »

Locker10a wrote: »

Its standard policy in commercial Aviation that videoing inside the cabin is not permitted, nor is taking photographs that capture crew members at work. You’ll find the same policy on any airline, and it has a background in security as well as liability issues iirc

Just to clarify, I take it that you mean videoing the inside of the cabin is not permitted. I've done a great many videos over time of the outside from inside the cabin both on the ground and in the air and never had a problem with CC who clearly saw me and youtube is also full of them. In fact, on a few occasions CC have passed comments like "I hope you're getting some good shots". As an aside, youtube and the newspapers regularly display images of events that took place inside the cabin.

BTW, I have never seen any warnings or heard any announcements about photography onboard like you would see or hear, for example, in a theatre.

Correct, this issue is with photos or videos of the crew inside the cabin.
There has also been previous issues with passengers being unhappy about being recorded or photographed by randomers.

Locker10a

faoiarvok wrote: »

Locker10a wrote: »

Its standard policy in commercial Aviation that videoing inside the cabin is not permitted, nor is taking photographs that capture crew members at work. You’ll find the same policy on any airline, and it has a background in security as well as liability issues iirc

If that’s the case they’re not doing a great job communicating that policy as I’ve never heard it mentioned, and certainly aren’t doing very well enforcing it, given the number of amateur “trip report”/“flight review” videos online, including plenty of Aer Lingus ones.

Yes it’s the case, we have always been told, if we see someone photographing or videoing you or other crew members ask them to delete it and inform them it’s not permitted.

faoiarvok

Locker10a wrote: »

Correct, this issue is with photos or videos of the crew inside the cabin.
There has also been previous issues with passengers being unhappy about being recorded or photographed by randomers.

Totally understand people’s discomfort with it, but if it’s policy they should make that clear. Can’t find any reference in the Conditions of Carriage on the website either.

We’ve probably gone a bit off topic now anyway.

Fred Swanson

This post has been deleted.

Locker10a

Fred Swanson wrote: »

There is a lad on youtube that always videos inside aircraft for trip reports, several EI videos in there.

Yes, and I have encountered many passengers doing trip reports and there was no issue whatsoever. Provided it’s done in a respectful manner, and crew aren’t being obviously recorded or photographed. Of course I’ve seen many of these trip reports on YouTube myself and seen tonnes of clips with the crews faces shown, so of course it happens, but if a crew member notices it happening then don’t be surprised if they ask for it to stop or be deleted as that’s exactly the instruction given to us during training.
I’d say I’m in the background of hundreds of snapchats and other airport and plane selfies that people take when traveling, as many hundred are in the background of mine, it’s just the world we live in now, but when someone is deliberately filming you, or your colleagues carrying out their job it’s slightly different.

SlowBlowin

I used to film on board, until I was asked to stop by crew. I have even been asked to stop filming through the window.

There was someone removed from a plane in the US for talking pictures, even though he denied ever doing it.

IMO there is no justification to the no filming, and its a silly rule that will change. Airlines re-tweet customer videos when it suits them, google Aer Lingus cabin crew and you will find thousands of images of their faces, name badges etc. You can film most people doing their jobs in front of the public, including police (planes are privately owned public spaces). In fact its already changing with airlines like Qantas publicizing their use cameras as much as you like policy.

Anyway thats why I had no video/pictures of my experience.

I guess the advice from the insiders is don't bother complaining the system will not allow customer driven change, archaic thinking.

SB

Fred Swanson

This post has been deleted.

BeardySi

Fred Swanson wrote: »

How can the cabin crew enforce deletion of images? I doubt they can physically take the device.

They can't, all they can do is ask.

Locker10a

SlowBlowin wrote: »

I used to film on board, until I was asked to stop by crew. I have even been asked to stop filming through the window.

There was someone removed from a plane in the US for talking pictures, even though he denied ever doing it.

IMO there is no justification to the no filming, and its a silly rule that will change. Airlines re-tweet customer videos when it suits them, google Aer Lingus cabin crew and you will find thousands of images of their faces, name badges etc. You can film most people doing their jobs in front of the public, including police (planes are privately owned public spaces). In fact its already changing with airlines like Qantas publicizing their use cameras as much as you like policy.

Anyway thats why I had no video/pictures of my experience.

I guess the advice from the insiders is don't bother complaining the system will not allow customer driven change, archaic thinking.

SB

You’ve already been told what will happen! You’ll get an apology email, and the feedback will be passed on to the crew-member either via email or a chat with someone in base management.
What’s archaic about that?
What would you like to see happen? The individual fired without explanation ? This isn’t Trumps America...yet

Locker10a

SlowBlowin wrote: »

I used to film on board, until I was asked to stop by crew. I have even been asked to stop filming through the window.

There was someone removed from a plane in the US for talking pictures, even though he denied ever doing it.

IMO there is no justification to the no filming, and its a silly rule that will change. Airlines re-tweet customer videos when it suits them, google Aer Lingus cabin crew and you will find thousands of images of their faces, name badges etc. You can film most people doing their jobs in front of the public, including police (planes are privately owned public spaces). In fact its already changing with airlines like Qantas publicizing their use cameras as much as you like policy.

Anyway thats why I had no video/pictures of my experience.

I guess the advice from the insiders is don't bother complaining the system will not allow customer driven change, archaic thinking.

SB

You’ve already been told what will happen! You’ll get an apology email, and the feedback will be passed on to the crew-member either via email or a chat with someone in base management.
What’s archaic about that?
What would you like to see happen? The individual fired without explanation ? This isn’t Trumps America...yet

Locker10a

BeardySi wrote: »

Fred Swanson wrote: »

How can the cabin crew enforce deletion of images? I doubt they can physically take the device.

They can't, all they can do is ask.

Ive had a situation where a self proclaimed “online journalist “ was filming crew members assisting an reduced mobility passenger into their seat during boarding . They were spotted by other passengers who felt this was an invasion of that individuals privacy. Crew asked them to delete said footage, and they refused.
Short shrift from the captain soon changed their mind when the option was delete it in front of the captain or off you go.

SlowBlowin

Calm down and read my posts and yours.

I said I wanted management to know know, thats logical and sensible don't you think ?

You said I would get a scripted reply, and the crew might get feedback. Not listening to real world paying customer feedback is archaic.

I hope you get it now.

SB

Locker10a

SlowBlowin wrote: »

Calm down and read my posts and yours.

I said I wanted management to know know, thats logical and sensible don't you think ?

You said I would get a scripted reply, and the crew might get feedback. Not listening to real world paying customer feedback is archaic.

I hope you get it now.

SB

They will get your real world customer feedback, my point about a scripted reply is you’ll get an apology, you won’t get a he said, she said explanation as to what happened in terms of the actual confrontation.
Did you also contact Stobart as suggested ?

SlowBlowin

The logical thing would be for management to contact me, listen to my complaint, and deal as they see best to impelment the companies mission.. No scripted replies. I would be happy knowing the right thing for the company was being done.

Yes I took time to follow your suggestion, Stobart website contact redirects to Aer Lingus who handle all communications relating to ALR flights, so a waste of time.

SB

Locker10a

SlowBlowin wrote: »

The logical thing would be for management to contact me, listen to my complaint, and deal as they see best to impelment the companies mission.. No scripted replies. I would be happy knowing the right thing for the company was being done.

Yes I took time to follow your suggestion, Stobart website contact redirects to Aer Lingus who handle all communications relating to ALR flights, so a waste of time.

SB

In an ideal world yes, but airlines tend to keep staff costs as low as possible and so I’d say they have nowhere near the man power to actually follow up issues as thoroughly as they probably should. The complaints departments is not a priority for any airline, but keeping a costs low and therefore fares is what’s king, airlines aren’t know for their customer service departments!

SlowBlowin

Well they really are two faced then as what you say goes totally against their company mission statement which I quote:

"We support and trust each other in an open and respectful manner. We actively seek feedback on our performance and behaviour and engage in constructive dialogue."

SB

Locker10a

SlowBlowin wrote: »

Well they really are two faced then as what you say goes totally against their company mission statement which I quote:

"We support and trust each other in an open and respectful manner. We actively seek feedback on our performance and behaviour and engage in constructive dialogue."

SB

Sure every airline and big company has these bulls#it statements, worth very little in my experience

john boye

Surely deleting pics/vids these days is futile when everything is backed up on cloud/Google/Dropbox etc?

lintdrummer

john boye wrote: »

Surely deleting pics/vids these days is futile when everything is backed up on cloud/Google/Dropbox etc?

Those backups are often set to happen on wifi only, not every airline has wifi and even if they do it's not normally available until well into the climb.

I've seen a member of the cabin crew tackle someone for videoing them doing their safety presentation. She just said "You have to stop that and delete it" and watched the person delete it before carrying on. I've also seen crew stop a demo to have a stern word with two grown women who were laughing and mimicking the actions. She told them it was an intimidating enough thing to stand up and do without being laughed at.

Fred Swanson

This post has been deleted.

Tenger

SlowBlowin wrote: »

...........I would like to think that somewhere within Stobart/Aer Lingus there might be individuals that would like to know how they are failing as a company, or are you saying 100% of the management don't give a toss?........

Sorry to hear of your experience on that EIR flight. Defo sounds like someone who shouldn’t have been in work that day.
Unfortunately from following the Aerclub thread I think your last sentence hits the nail on the head. Recent anecdotal info indicates the template response mentioned by Locker10a will be the best you can expect.




Just to cover the “no photo or videography” regulation; EI used to have a line in their inflight mag to cover this. Not sure if it’s still there, my recollection goes back over 10 years. When I was with them I had a TV journalist try to argue that he was permitted to video in the cabin as “personal camcorders” were permitted. I firmly pointed out that a 3 foot camera needing to be held on your shoulder was not a “personal camcorder”

Modern recording devices must be pretty nigh impossible to police in a crowded aircraft.



Aviation law also covers them as when you book you agree to comply with their Ts&Cs, the primary rule being along the lines of “you must comply with any instruction from the captain or his representative”

john boye

Fred Swanson wrote: »

Stuff is often done on the ground. My phone sends everything to google as soon as it is taken.

I would say most stuff happens when between the gate and take off.

Agree with this. Some of the examples in this thread happened during boarding etc when phones would still be in coverage.

Mebuntu

SlowBlowin wrote: »

I used to film on board, until I was asked to stop by crew. I have even been asked to stop filming through the window.
SB

Can you tell us what airline(s) stopped you from filming?

SlowBlowin

Aer Lingus

JCX BXC

I think OP is perfectly correct to lodge a complaint, even if it's not fully taken on board, EI may look at it if there's several.

The attitude of "they won't listen so no point trying" is a very negative attitude that won't ever achieve much imo.

SlowBlowin

Hi All

After a bit more digging I think I know why I am not getting any communications from Aer Lingus. There is no complaints department at the moment they are moving the jobs abroad, this is from the Independent:

Fearghal O'Connor

December 24 2017 2:30 AM


Staff at Aer Lingus's Dublin-based complaints department have been offered a choice between possible redeployment as cabin crew or voluntary severance.

Last month this newspaper reported how the airline's chief operating officer, Mike Rutter, had made the shock announcement that the department is to be relocated to the United States in February as part of the establishment there of a new Global Guest Relations Service Centre.

Mebuntu

SlowBlowin wrote: »

Staff at Aer Lingus's Dublin-based complaints department have been offered a choice between possible redeployment as cabin crew or voluntary severance.

Last month this newspaper reported how the airline's chief operating officer, Mike Rutter, had made the shock announcement that the department is to be relocated to the United States in February as part of the establishment there of a new Global Guest Relations Service Centre.

I'm amazed that this got past the unions with no hullabaloo -Aer Lingus getting rid of Irish staff and their jobs going to Mr. Trump's jurisdiction

SlowBlowin

So in summery:

I booked a flight on Aer Lingus website.

Got terrible customer service.

Turned out the staff are employed by Stobart.

Complained to Aer Lingus as they handle Stobart complaints.

No reply - chased - Still no reply..

Turns out the Irish Aer Lingus complaints department is in the process of being relocated to America and the service outsourced.. Staff moral at a low with possible strike action.

This is all being done to "improve efficiency" according to Aer Lingus. What bollox.

SB

Tenger

Mebuntu wrote: »

I'm amazed that this got past the unions with no hullabaloo -Aer Lingus getting rid of Irish staff and their jobs going to Mr. Trump's jurisdiction

I personally love the corporate BS of “it’s not outsourcing as the new staff will be direct EI employees” Oh that makes it OK.

Personally as a customers I would have an issue calling an Irish/EU airline to be met with a US customer care rep. The 2 jurisdictions have markedly different aviation cultures.

JCX BXC

Outsourcing customer care has always been a truly terrible idea. Companies who have call centers abroad are generally renowned for terrible customer service. You see companies like Three moving their customer care back to Ireland, and hence increasing their market share. Now obviously customer care lines are more important for a phone company than an airline, but if you want a good way to piss off your customer base this is one of them!

They're moving to the US, will this even save much money?