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Irish Rail September Timetable Changes

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,822 ✭✭✭The J Stands for Jay


    L1011 wrote: »
    Rebasing to reality has to be done sometimes.

    One thing that may have a slight benefit in keeping to time on a more frequent schedule is that drivers shouldn't feel any need to wait for late passengers running down the platform

    I'm getting no increase in frequency out of this, just a bigger rush from the crèche to the train station


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,872 ✭✭✭thomasj


    Most Sligo trains , inbound and outbound, will stop at drumcondra in the new timetable

    Exception being the 08.00 and 17.10 services out of Connolly


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,351 ✭✭✭Cloudio9


    Cloudio9 wrote: »
    Is there an updated timetable anywhere?

    Bump


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,922 ✭✭✭GM228


    Do you mean the 8200 returning to service and there is enough coaches to operate minimum 6 car trains.

    Not the 8200s, some of the other longer term stored 8100s and 8500s, for example 8103/8303 has recently moved from Inchicore to Fairview in readiness for a return to service having been missing from the network since August 2010.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,922 ✭✭✭GM228


    Can you clarify what exact issue the union raised?

    The usual, smaller trains, safety issues etc.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,922 ✭✭✭GM228


    That’s going to drive people mad! I had heard somewhere they were talking about some sort of fly over/under there.. NO idea how they would achieve that, however.

    There was to be a flyover, but that plan is officially dropped due to a huge amount of local objection, and due to the EU Habitats Directive there are protections on the seafront (it is designated a Special Area of Conservation) meaning no other alternatives are available - the gates are staying.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,922 ✭✭✭GM228


    Cloudio9 wrote: »
    Is there an updated timetable anywhere?

    Not yet, just via the journey planner for IC trains.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,409 ✭✭✭✭gimli2112


    L1011 wrote: »
    Rebasing to reality has to be done sometimes.

    One thing that may have a slight benefit in keeping to time on a more frequent schedule is that drivers shouldn't feel any need to wait for late passengers running down the platform

    There's nothing worse than seeing a fellow commuter ambling up to the doors attempting to get on. Yes, we're all waiting here for you sir/madam.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,221 ✭✭✭goingnowhere


    GM228 wrote: »
    The usual, smaller trains, safety issues etc.

    They wanted more money for longer trains...

    Unions need to shut up or put up and stop messing with trying to control the railway.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,922 ✭✭✭GM228


    They wanted more money for longer trains...

    Unions need to shut up or put up and stop messing with trying to control the railway.

    They were not looking for smaller trains, rather they were concerned about about the safety of smaller trains and issues with overcrowding.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,239 ✭✭✭Decuc500


    GM228 wrote: »
    Sizes will vary (4, 6 and 8 carriages), the unions have raised this issue at the WRC and the company have indicated there will be slightly less 8 car trains, but more 6 car over 4 car trains - the NTA have allocated money to return some of the longer term out of service units to service.

    Is the aim of this new timetable to improve rush hour conditions or just to pander to politicians and public image?

    As a rush hour commuter I don’t care that there’s a Dart every 10 minutes during the day.

    I do care if Darts leaving Howth and Malahide at a (too long) gap of 20 minutes in rush hour are going to be only 4 carriages long.
    I would hope these 4 carriage sets won’t be let anywhere near rush hour but with Irish Rail anything is possible.


  • Registered Users Posts: 412 ✭✭Ireland trains


    Decuc500 wrote: »
    I do care if Darts leaving Howth and Malahide at a (too long) gap of 20 minutes in rush hour are going to be only 4 carriages long.
    I would hope these 4 carriage sets won’t be let anywhere near rush hour but with Irish Rail anything is possible.
    IÉ have enough coaches to operate mainly 8 car trains with a few 6 car.
    Rosslare services should do what enterprise and commuters do at mallahide which is overtake on the up lane and cross back to the down line.
    Northern line commuters first stop should be at mallahide with some calling at howth junction.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,339 ✭✭✭highdef


    GM228 wrote: »
    They were not looking for smaller trains, rather they were concerned about about the safety of smaller trains and issues with overcrowding.

    So initially the drivers wanted more money for driving for longer trains (I still can't get my head around that logic) and now that it was suggested to make trains more frequent but shorter, they want more money....Am I reading that incorrectly?

    I work in television broadcasting and we add new channels to the line-up every now and then. I could just imagine the laugh management would have if I suggested an X% increase in pay every time that more TV channels are added. I don't think the unions would entertain that either. In my case, every extra channel added does result in a some extra workload however I can't understand how more carriages on a DART can increase the workload of a driver, apart from the likes of checks of the train at the start of the shift, if indeed the driver is the person who undertakes this task and not a maintenance worker.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,922 ✭✭✭GM228


    highdef wrote: »
    So initially the drivers wanted more money for driving for longer trains (I still can't get my head around that logic) and now that it was suggested to make trains more frequent but shorter, they want more money....Am I reading that incorrectly?

    You are reading that incorrectly, they are not looking for extra money, they just raised the issue (again) of shorter trains.

    See for example:-

    https://www.google.ie/amp/s/amp.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/ireland/10-minute-dart-service-plans-described-as-ambitious-844386.html
    "We don't have the extra coaches for a 10 minute DART service. It could be a case that the current eight-piece coaches could be reduced significantly to two four-pieces for example.

    "You might have a situation where people might have a 10 minute service but they might not be able to access the service at a time they want to."

    This issue has been brought up again by the unions at the WRC and the company have said it is not the case for most trains.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,221 ✭✭✭goingnowhere


    Its amazing that we had a better than 10 minute service 11 years ago with the current fleet.

    There are enough coaches to run a meaningful service, it would be a mix of 6-8 coaches every 10 minutes, there would be more coaches in daily service than today, so net capacity will be up and thats what counts.

    There are plans to bring the Alstom units back and there are a handful of coaches out of service for some time, 8103 was supposed to be back by now


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 438 ✭✭andrewfaulk


    There are plans to bring the Alstom units back and there are a handful of coaches out of service for some time, 8103 was supposed to be back by now[/quote]

    What’s your source on the 8200s coming back? Can’t see it happening


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,922 ✭✭✭GM228


    There are plans to bring the Alstom units back

    There are no plans to bring them back at present, a few options were looked at regarding them (which was before the DEMU project was approved) which sparked several rumours such as converting them to push-pull stock.

    All that was confirmed at the time was that an estimated €2.75M investment was required to refurbish them.

    Since the DEMU project was approved any interest in them seems to have vanished and I'd say is unlikely to return, but, I suppose never say never.


  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 11,693 Mod ✭✭✭✭devnull


    I've heard that the 8200s are not coming back at all no matter what.

    What will happen though is a number of 8100/8500 sets that are not required at peak times at the moment and also some troublesome units that need substantial work done and need overhauls will be done and be deployed at peak times.

    Of course this might lead to the odd short form as there is less slack in the fleet, but better to have as much capacity as possible out there and short form a set the occasional time it's needed, than to have 16 carriages laying around every day.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,221 ✭✭✭goingnowhere


    8103 is the only long term out of service unit, it was to be fixed and should be back by now, the other 37 sets should all be considered active

    There is a test set with the new cab signalling which is permanently coupled up so if any of the coaches have a problem all 8 are stopped


  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 11,693 Mod ✭✭✭✭devnull


    8103 is the only long term out of service unit, it was to be fixed and should be back by now, the other 37 sets should all be considered active

    Yes - the others are considered in service but even today I've seen 14 cars outside Clontarf Depot at peak time and that's excluding any that are not visible.

    So there's scope to put more of them in service to enhance capacity.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,351 ✭✭✭Cloudio9


    So is anything changing to allow higher throughput in Connolly-Pearse ?


  • Registered Users Posts: 15,304 ✭✭✭✭stephenjmcd


    Timetable for the 10 minute service this Sunday for the popes visit is now online. Imagine that this will be the trial run really


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,872 ✭✭✭thomasj


    I've never seen a Maynooth/m3 parkway timetable that good for a weekday , never mind a Sunday!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,339 ✭✭✭highdef


    Timetable for the 10 minute service this Sunday for the popes visit is now online. Imagine that this will be the trial run really
    Do you have a link for it? I couldn't find it in the homepage or timetables section of the Irish Rail website (on laptop).


  • Registered Users Posts: 15,304 ✭✭✭✭stephenjmcd


    highdef wrote: »
    Do you have a link for it? I couldn't find it in the homepage or timetables section of the Irish Rail website (on laptop).

    Just used the journey planner. First date from bray on a normal Sunday is 9am. 6.11am this Sunday


  • Registered Users Posts: 412 ✭✭Ireland trains


    highdef wrote: »
    Timetable for the 10 minute service this Sunday for the popes visit is now online. Imagine that this will be the trial run really
    Do you have a link for it? I couldn't find it in the homepage or timetables section of the Irish Rail website (on laptop).
    Look at bray to connolly on 26th of August on journey planner.
    You will find the journey planner on the irish rail website


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,339 ✭✭✭highdef


    Thanks all. The original message said that the "timetable was now online" so obviously I went to timetable section assuming that there would be a sub-section for the Papal visit, or at the very least an obvious redirection from the homepage.

    Would be good to have an actual timetable to view for the day rather than have to go through the journey planner but I guess there's be a fair bit of work involved so understandable.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,740 ✭✭✭TheChrisD


    highdef wrote: »
    Thanks all. The original message said that the "timetable was now online" so obviously I went to timetable section assuming that there would be a sub-section for the Papal visit, or at the very least an obvious redirection from the homepage.

    Yea, this. Especially since that planner doesn't work when Javascript is disabled, when cookies are disabled, or when the actual JSON backend is 404'ing like it is for me right now.
    HTTP404: NOT FOUND - The server has not found anything matching the requested URI (Uniform Resource Identifier).
    (XHR)GET - http://journeyplanner.irishrail.ie/webapp/config/webapp.config.json?1.3.7&rnd=1534988616429
    


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,922 ✭✭✭GM228


    thomasj wrote: »
    I see that Maynooth line services post 9th September have been taken down off the website. Will we see them changes too?

    Just an update on this, indications are the NTA want some off peak (possibly weekend only) Maynooth and Northern commuter trains operate to/from Connolly as opposed to Pearse to minimise potential conflicts with/delays to the DART.

    Last two or three services only would operate to/from Pearse, again I'll repeat despite being only a few weeks away nothing is finalised and talks are still ongoing with the NTA and separately in the WRC which are not going too well.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,774 ✭✭✭✭Jamie2k9


    GM228 wrote: »
    Just an update on this, indications are the NTA want some off peak (possibly weekend only) Maynooth and Northern commuter trains operate to/from Connolly as opposed to Pearse to minimise potential conflicts with/delays to the DART.

    Last two or three services only would operate to/from Pearse, again I'll repeat despite being only a few weeks away nothing is finalised and talks are still ongoing with the NTA and separately in the WRC which are not going too well.

    So NTA know it will not work but want to be seeing as doing something. Terminating off peak to at Connolly (even a few) is just making it even worse when its not necessary.

    Big FU to those who travel at peak times!


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,153 ✭✭✭✭loyatemu


    so when does the new Dart timetable go up - it's now 2 weeks away.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,907 ✭✭✭Stephen15


    I saw a DART today with two people in the cab one appeared to be the driver and the other had his head out the window making sure it was all clear to close the doors. Mentoring a new driver perhaps.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,922 ✭✭✭GM228


    loyatemu wrote: »
    so when does the new Dart timetable go up - it's now 2 weeks away.

    Unlikely to be up for a while as the September 10th start is in jeopardy.


  • Registered Users Posts: 412 ✭✭Ireland trains


    They said it will be up later this week.
    Mind you they've been saying this for the last month


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,922 ✭✭✭GM228


    GM228 wrote: »
    Just an update on this, indications are the NTA want some off peak (possibly weekend only) Maynooth and Northern commuter trains operate to/from Connolly as opposed to Pearse to minimise potential conflicts with/delays to the DART.

    Last two or three services only would operate to/from Pearse, again I'll repeat despite being only a few weeks away nothing is finalised and talks are still ongoing with the NTA and separately in the WRC which are not going too well.

    Further to this and assuming the timetable change goes ahead (make or break talks ongoing):-
    • ALL Maynooth and Drogheda/Dundalk services will operate to/from Connolly at weekends.
    • Moderate Sunday Rosslare timetable change.
    • Only minor timing changes to other services (there will be one less Commuter train through to Bray in the mornings).

    Major timetable change expected in December (extra service each way to/from Sligo, all day GCD service, off peak Maynooth services to/from GCD, half hourly weekend Maynooth services and Heston side timing improvements).


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,872 ✭✭✭thomasj


    Aside from this , are we expecting Maynooth line to go 30 minutes and later Sunday evening , even if from Connolly in this upcoming timetable change?


  • Registered Users Posts: 412 ✭✭Ireland trains


    What are the Sunday rosslare service changes


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,922 ✭✭✭GM228


    thomasj wrote: »
    Aside from this , are we expecting Maynooth line to go 30 minutes and later Sunday evening , even if from Connolly in this upcoming timetable change?

    Not this time round.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,922 ✭✭✭GM228


    What are the Sunday rosslare service changes

    I don't know the specifics, but earlier departure to Rosslare in the morning and later departure ex Rosslare in the evening.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,872 ✭✭✭thomasj


    GM228 wrote:
    Not this time round.

    So with the promise that the service was to get better it's actually getting worse?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,922 ✭✭✭GM228


    thomasj wrote: »
    So with the promise that the service was to get better it's actually getting worse?

    Changes this time round are associated with 10 minute DARTs. Improved services such as the Maynooths are not too far behind it if all goes according to plan. I suspect weekends to/from Connolly will not last post the December change.


  • Registered Users Posts: 412 ✭✭Ireland trains


    Rosslare train service have added nearly 10 min from greystones to Connolly from september and first 2 will also call at grand canal dock


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,573 ✭✭✭Infini


    I honestly don't know if the NTA really understands the issues regarding the infrastructure being constricted the way it is around connolly. Realistically we need serious upgrades to the entire system like DU, triple/quad tracking the north side and removal of the southside level crossings to have any hope of a realistic 10m or better DART service. They're probably only starting to see how constrained the current system is now.


  • Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 10,420 Mod ✭✭✭✭CatInABox


    Infini wrote: »
    I honestly don't know if the NTA really understands the issues regarding the infrastructure being constricted the way it is around connolly. Realistically we need serious upgrades to the entire system like DU, triple/quad tracking the north side and removal of the southside level crossings to have any hope of a realistic 10m or better DART service. They're probably only starting to see how constrained the current system is now.

    They do, but as with anything in Ireland, they face a number of obstacles, the biggest of which are political, economical, and legal.

    They've tried to bring in the Dart Underground, but economics and a lack of political backing put an end to that.

    They've tried to sort the south side crossings, but planning and legal issues put an end to that.

    The four tracking is something that needs to happen, and I've no doubt that they know about it, but other issues are higher priority for now. Bringing in a ten minute Dart is realistic, but will cause problems else where. Highlighting those problems will also be easier after the fact, including four tracking and the crossings.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,573 ✭✭✭Infini


    GM228 wrote: »
    Further to this and assuming the timetable change goes ahead (make or break talks ongoing):-
    • ALL Maynooth and Drogheda/Dundalk services will operate to/from Connolly at weekends.
    • Moderate Sunday Rosslare timetable change.
    • Only minor timing changes to other services (there will be one less Commuter train through to Bray in the mornings).

    Major timetable change expected in December (extra service each way to/from Sligo, all day GCD service, off peak Maynooth services to/from GCD, half hourly weekend Maynooth services and Heston side timing improvements).

    Out of interest but why they moving the commuters to Connolly on the weekends when the earlier proposal for 10m was for during the week? Doesn't make a lot of sense there or are they looking at 10m on the weekends now too?


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,822 ✭✭✭The J Stands for Jay


    Rosslare train service have added nearly 10 min from greystones to Connolly from september and first 2 will also call at grand canal dock

    This '10 minute DART' is going to have a negative effect on my work/life balance.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,594 ✭✭✭Working class heroes


    Rosslare train service have added nearly 10 min from greystones to Connolly from september and first 2 will also call at grand canal dock

    Sure they might as well call at every stop if it’s going to take that long.

    This 10 minute Dart lark will be like squeezing a six inch sh1te down a four inch pipe.

    Racism is now hiding behind the cloak of Community activism.



  • Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 14,482 Mod ✭✭✭✭marno21


    CatInABox wrote: »
    They do, but as with anything in Ireland, they face a number of obstacles, the biggest of which are political, economical, and legal.

    They've tried to bring in the Dart Underground, but economics and a lack of political backing put an end to that.

    They've tried to sort the south side crossings, but planning and legal issues put an end to that.

    The four tracking is something that needs to happen, and I've no doubt that they know about it, but other issues are higher priority for now. Bringing in a ten minute Dart is realistic, but will cause problems else where. Highlighting those problems will also be easier after the fact, including four tracking and the crossings.

    Seeing as they've been told to make do with the existing infrastructure, these expansions will clearly demonstrate how the current infrastructure is not fit for purpose.

    An answer to chaos is usually the reason stuff gets built in Ireland


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 69,766 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    Rosslare train service have added nearly 10 min from greystones to Connolly from september and first 2 will also call at grand canal dock

    And yet when it was pointed out that the 10 minute frequency would remove most of the speed advantage the Rosslare trains had from Bray it was shouted down...


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,922 ✭✭✭GM228


    Infini wrote: »
    Out of interest but why they moving the commuters to Connolly on the weekends when the earlier proposal for 10m was for during the week? Doesn't make a lot of sense there or are they looking at 10m on the weekends now too?

    I'm not sure, but all I know is it is related to "DART improvements", there will apparently be enhanced weekend DART timetables, but not to the tune of every 10 minutes.


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