CNG in Ireland

Ubbquittious

A few months ago I saw a demo truck with some signage printed on the side saying it ran on CNG, then a few days ago I saw a VW Caddy also with some signs saying it ran on CNG. Both were near Little Island

Where are these lads filling up?

Are they even filling up?

Are they actually running them off of petrol and did they only them on CNG from a small cylinder delivered from Germany by DHL for a few minutes for a demonstration that involved a bunch of lads with suit pants and white shirts and ties bursting into applause the instant the salesman pressed the button to activate the CNG system?

tabby aspreme

Harris transport have a Daf truck hauling malt from Athy to Guinness's running on CNG, it refuels in Dublin port

tabby aspreme

This

GMSA

Bus Eireann tried it back in 2012. Don't think it took off.
http://www.thejournal.ie/bus-powered-by-natural-gas-bus-eireann-523356-Jul2012/

ezra_

My parents ran a car on gas some years back, there was a grant where you could get a petrol car modified to also run on gas.

There were a few petrol stations around the place that did it, think some still do, pretty sure I saw a pump recently. Prices were about 50% cheaper than petrol.

Filing it was always fun - you had an adapter that would screw into the valve on the car and that would take the head of the pump, but the adapter would keep getting stuck to the car. Great fun!

Markcheese

Bord gáis used to do it with some of their vehicles years ago...dunno how it worked out.

gctest50

Fill up at home for small things

Alf Veedersane

ezra_ wrote: »

My parents ran a car on gas some years back, there was a grant where you could get a petrol car modified to also run on gas.

There were a few petrol stations around the place that did it, think some still do, pretty sure I saw a pump recently. Prices were about 50% cheaper than petrol.

Filing it was always fun - you had an adapter that would screw into the valve on the car and that would take the head of the pump, but the adapter would keep getting stuck to the car. Great fun!

I'd venture that was LPG/Autogas.

Gas Networks Ireland has a plan to roll out 70 refuelling stations for CNG across the country.

Bigus

Michael Noonan put a 10 year halt on excise rises on cng but that was a good few years ago.

ezra_

Alf Veedersane wrote: »

I'd venture that was LPG/Autogas.

Gas Networks Ireland has a plan to roll out 70 refuelling stations for CNG across the country.

Actually LPG sounds right.

What is the difference between it and CNG?

Ubbquittious

ezra_ wrote: »

Actually LPG sounds right.

What is the difference between it and CNG?

CNG is methane
LPG is Propane with some butane mixed in

CNG tanks are usually filled to around 200 bar, LPG only 15. I think the home CNG refuellers take an extremely long time to fill a car. 8 hours or so

mullingar

Ubbquittious wrote: »

CNG is methane
LPG is Propane with some butane mixed in

CNG tanks are usually filled to around 200 bar, LPG only 15. I think the home CNG refuellers take an extremely long time to fill a car. 8 hours or so

Correct,

LPG, is Propane and a gas in atmospheric pressure, once compressed to approx 0.5- 1 bar (depending on temp), it liquefies so is very easy to transport/refill

CNG does not liquefy easily so must be compressed to get any real capacity

Doltanian

I'd prefer if they invested into a LPG network with additional refueling stations around the country to compliment what is already available, as its a proven technology in use almost 40 years.

CNG is far more dangerous because it is compressed Natural Gas, you can also liquefy Natural Gas also but it involves cooling it to like -160c or something and that technology is only used in a fleet of trucks in China where around 100,000 trucks use it. The CNG is commonly referred to in Thailand as the bomb in the boot and is very popular in Thailand but LPG is far more popular worldwide, particularly in Poland, Italy and Turkey.

I guess they prefer to use CNG to harness domestic produced Natural Gas rather than LPG which is a by-product from Refining crude oil.

I'm sure that truck hauling grain to the Guinness Brewery is responsible for some massive methane emissions after the Guinness itself is consumed :eek: If there was a way to harness Guinness Farts we'd almost be self sustainable for gas. :pac:

Alf Veedersane

LPG was included in the Alternative Fuels Framework but maybe there's an element of favouring CNG from the point of view of facilitating generating biomethane from AD. Maybe, i dunno.

IIRC, it did reference the positives of LPG being that it was easier to get to more rural areas

Doltanian

Alf Veedersane wrote: »

LPG was included in the Alternative Fuels Framework but maybe there's an element of favouring CNG from the point of view of facilitating generating biomethane from AD. Maybe, i dunno.

IIRC, it did reference the positives of LPG being that it was easier to get to more rural areas

CNG relies on a hookup to the natural gas grid, wheras LPG is trucked around to bulk tanks. CNG could also be trucked I suppose but due to its compressed state and non-fluid characteristics I think it would be much more trouble than it would be worth.

Alf Veedersane

Doltanian wrote: »

CNG relies on a hookup to the natural gas grid, wheras LPG is trucked around to bulk tanks. CNG could also be trucked I suppose but due to its compressed state and non-fluid characteristics I think it would be much more trouble than it would be worth.

Well if GNI are rolling out the filling stations, they're probably going to be mostly in urban areas and connected to the grid. I don't really see a major issue.

Not that I think it needs to be either/or.

mikeecho

I'm bumping this.

Just before 7am this morn on newstalk there was a guy from Calor Gas on, they were taking about rolling out CNG, but he spoke of it as a use for energy for industry & farms , where there was not currently natural gas availibity.

Anyhow, Circle K will be rolling out CNG pumps to it's forecourts in the coming 24 months.

Let the battle of Gas Vs Electric begin.

Also, the duty on CNG for road use is at circa 5￠ , and diesel is about 48￠.
CNG's lower duty rate will last for the next 5yrs.

So.. in 5yrs.. CNG might go the same way as E85.

CJhaughey

I can remember widespread adoption of CNG back in the 80s in NZ.
http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/487977/Flashback-to-LPG

No reason it couldn't be done here if companies make the infrastructure available.