Ireland lose out on "lucrative" EU banking agency. Is this a lesson for Dublin?

realitykeeper

http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/ireland-lose-out-to-french-again-over-eu-banking-agency-463216.html

I saw this article in the Examiner this morning and reading the article I noticed the word "lucrative" being used to describe this European banking watchdog. I do not dispute the fact that having such an agency based in Ireland would indeed be lucrative but what does it say of Ireland itself?

The establishment here readily acknowledge that these EU state entities are lucrative and yet continue to pretend that Dublin is not a parasite on the rest of the country by keeping the vast bulk of government run agencies and state departments in Dublin.

amcalester

I don't think you know what parasite means.

jobbridge4life

realitykeeper wrote: »

http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/ireland-lose-out-to-french-again-over-eu-banking-agency-463216.html

I saw this article in the Examiner this morning and reading the article I noticed the word "lucrative" being used to describe this European banking watchdog. I do not dispute the fact that having such an agency based in Ireland would indeed be lucrative but what does it say of Ireland itself?

The establishment here readily acknowledge that these EU state entities are lucrative and yet continue to pretend that Dublin is not a parasite on the rest of the country by keeping the vast bulk of government run agencies and state departments in Dublin.

It is the function of a capital to act as the seat of Government, it is wholly appropriate for a small country like Ireland to have Government Departments in Dublin. In addition as Dublin is the most accessible part of the country for the overwhelming majority of the population, this is doubly the case.

The idea that Dublin is a parasite is grossly inaccurate, on the contrary Dublin is the economic engine of the country. The determination of some people in this country to denigrate and resent our capital city is astounding.

cgcsb

realitykeeper wrote: »

The establishment here readily acknowledge that these EU state entities are lucrative and yet continue to pretend that Dublin is not a parasite on the rest of the country by keeping the vast bulk of government run agencies and state departments in Dublin.

Dublin and the South-West i.e. Cork are the only regions of Ireland that generate more tax revenue than they spend. Indeed Dublin accounts for most of Ireland's GDP, how can this be viewed as a parasitical relationship. Surely the rest of Ireland is the parasite?

If anything it demonstrates how much parish-pumpism costs Ireland. If we had spent the money building metro lines and housing in Dublin, you'd be sure that a lot more institutions would be looking to set up here.

realitykeeper

jobbridge4life wrote: »

It is the function of a capital to act as the seat of Government, it is wholly appropriate for a small country like Ireland to have Government Departments in Dublin. In addition as Dublin is the most accessible part of the country for the overwhelming majority of the population, this is doubly the case.

And yet an even smaller country like Switzerland (with it`s capital city smack bang in the middle) is far more successful, despite doing the exact opposite.

Dr Crayfish

Why are we even trying to bring more business here if there's nowhere for anyone to live?

Muahahaha

Dr Crayfish wrote: »

Why are we even trying to bring more business here if there's nowhere for anyone to live?

I think the Govt. were just hoping that at all this Brexit related moving would go our way on account of being english speaking. They are now finding out that without decent housing available for employees companies realise that attracting employees from abroad will not be easy. Couple that with our high cost of living which feeds into higher wage demands and it is not surprising that companies will choose to avoid locating to Dublin.

Dr Crayfish

Muahahaha wrote: »

I think the Govt. were just hoping that at all this Brexit related moving would go our way on account of being english speaking. They are now finding out that without decent housing available for employees companies realise that attracting employees from abroad will not be easy. Couple that with our high cost of living which feeds into higher wage demands and it is not surprising that companies will choose to avoid locating to Dublin.

Yeah but most EU countries, especially the Northern Ones would be packed with probably more employable people with perfect English anyway. We need infrastructure first, then the jobs will follow.

Help!!!!

When it comes to the EU now that England is leaving the EU, Ireland will become more & more irrelevant when it comes to the EU. Germany & France are slowly working the EU to have them be the main beneficiary's where the like of ourselves will get the scraps if lucky. We are just a little island out in the Atlantic the other side of Britain to them. Now that both Germany & France want corporation taxes across the EU to be more in line we will look less attractive than Paris/Berlin. Google have already bought land next to Apple in Denmark so dont be surprised when they leave Ireland all together.
Our politicians are not seeing what is happening in the EU. They want 1 President, 1 army. We will be told do us they say & we will just have to do it. Great future our politicians have sold us out for

Idbatterim

yeah I really wonder where they werent looking to located in Cork, Limerick or Galway :rolleyes:

Help!!!!

Idbatterim wrote: »

yeah I really wonder where they werent looking to located in Cork, Limerick or Galway :rolleyes:

Because there was no way we were getting them anyway:mad:

Dr Crayfish

Help!!!! wrote: »

They want 1 President, 1 army. We will be told do us they say & we will just have to do it. Great future our politicians have sold us out for

But sure our current Government dictate to us and nanny to us as is, and don't have the people's interests at heart. Does it even matter who makes the ridiculous rules any more?

Help!!!!

Dr Crayfish wrote: »

But sure our current Government dictate to us and nanny to us as is, and don't have the people's interests at heart. Does it even matter who makes the ridiculous rules any more?

Problem will be they will have no jobs to give us. I can see us being truly shafted by the EU. We're only relevant now to give the Brexiteers a hard time, when their gone we might all have to immigrate

odyssey06

Last time I checked, and I was quite upset when I found this out, that counties other than Dublin are represented in the Dail. As much as Dubs would like it to be, incredibly non-Dubliners can actually elect TDs who sit in the same Dail as TDs elected by true Dubliners.

Who, where or what is this "Dublin" entity? Is it different to the Dublin that Dubliners actually live in? Is it more than the sum total of Dublin 1, 2, 3,4, 5 etc??? It seems to represent some sort of nebulous concept i.e. "The State".

Goodshape

cgcsb wrote: »

Indeed Dublin accounts for most of Ireland's GDP, how can this be viewed as a parasitical relationship.

Presumably because it's sucking the people, the culture, the small businesses, and the life out of the rest of the country in order to fuel it's all-important 'economy' which, in turn, benefits Dublin itself more than anywhere else.

"Dublin accounts for most of Ireland's GDP" – I've no doubt it does. GDP isn't everything when it comes to quality of life though. And I live in Dublin, and I contribute to that "most of Ireland's GDP", and I'm here because there's sweet feck all for me in my home county.

CelticRambler

realitykeeper wrote: »

Switzerland (with it`s capital city smack bang in the middle)

Has Bern been moved??? :eek:

Coz last time I was there, it was pretty damn close to the Western border and a long way from the East.

zetalambda

Idbatterim wrote: »

yeah I really wonder where they werent looking to located in Cork, Limerick or Galway :rolleyes:

Is this a Question, Answer or a Comment?

jobbridge4life

Goodshape wrote: »

Presumably because it's sucking the people, the culture, the small businesses, and the life out of the rest of the country in order to fuel it's all-important 'economy' which, in turn, benefits Dublin itself more than anywhere else.

"Dublin accounts for most of Ireland's GDP" – I've no doubt it does. GDP isn't everything when it comes to quality of life though. And I live in Dublin, and I contribute to that "most of Ireland's GDP", and I'm here because there's sweet feck all for me in my home county.

People move to Dublin because it is a city, which offers much greater facilities and general opportunities. The same reason people flock to cities across the globe. Ireland's smaller towns and villages have suffered an especially severe decline due in large part to the policy of not encouraging greater centralisation of the population. One off housing is a major problem in this regard.

Cities are the future. Dublin is our only realistic chance of having a global city. Dublin's success does not deprive rural communities of anything, its decline on the otherhand would.

Sugar Free

CelticRambler wrote: »

Has Bern been moved??? :eek:

Coz last time I was there, it was pretty damn close to the Western border and a long way from the East.

Not to mention the fact it's not in the EU...

Goodshape

jobbridge4life wrote: »

Cities are the future. Dublin is our only realistic chance of having a global city.

You say that as if it were automatically and unquestionably a good thing. We're a tiny, beautiful, island with a wonderful rich culture. But sure **** all that, yeah?, GDP and massive cities is what we want, because...


...


???

Idbatterim

zetalambda wrote: »

Is this a Question, Answer or a Comment?

it was sarcasm of the highest order. Think of father Jack in that father ted episode

I think the Govt. were just hoping that at all this Brexit related moving would go our way on account of being english speaking. They are now finding out that without decent housing available for employees companies realise that attracting employees from abroad will not be easy. Couple that with our high cost of living which feeds into higher wage demands and it is not surprising that companies will choose to avoid locating to Dublin.

impossible housing situation in Dublin, its beyond a crisis. Third world transport system. losing over 50% of your income over a pittance, hard to believe these agencies arent flocking here in their droves :rolleyes:

odyssey06

Ireland lost out to Paris for the EU Banking Agency... on the drawing of lots. We could have just as easily won it.
https://www.rte.ie/news/business/2017/1120/921549-paris-edges-out-dublin-to-host-eba/

This report is probably more of a concern: "Dublin Ranked 7th in EMA location list"
https://www.rte.ie/news/analysis-and-comment/2017/1121/921794-dublin-ranked-7th-in-ema-location-list/

Amsterdam headed the list as favoured host city in the staff survey, and went on to win the bid. The vast majority (81%) said they would likely or very likely to move to Amsterdam if the agency did, with Barcelona the next favourite (76%) followed by Vienna (73%), and Milan, Copenhagen and Brussels.

realitykeeper

Muahahaha wrote: »

I think the Govt. were just hoping that at all this Brexit related moving would go our way on account of being english speaking.

Many Europeans speak far better English than most Irish people despite it not being their first language.

Gerrup Outta Dat!

We need to solve the housing crisis. Build UP.

Build 50-storey apartment/ office blocks around the quays. It’s the only way.

realitykeeper

CelticRambler wrote: »

Has Bern been moved??? :eek:

Coz last time I was there, it was pretty damn close to the Western border and a long way from the East.

It is in the central plateau, a trifling 50 miles from the country`s epicenter. By contrast, Dublin is on Ireland`s eastern extremity and a long long way from Clare to there.

Sugar Free wrote: »

Not to mention the fact it's not in the EU...

Nobody said it was (because the point would have been irrelevant). Focus Sugar Free.

realitykeeper

Dr Crayfish wrote: »

Why are we even trying to bring more business here if there's nowhere for anyone to live?

What about outside Dublin? There is an entire country out there just waiting to be developed. Think New World. Think what an enterprising people like the Dutch or Swiss might do had they such abundance bestowed upon them. This huddling together in the snug mentality must end. Dublin alone is not Ireland.

Marcusm

realitykeeper wrote: »

And yet an even smaller country like Switzerland (with it`s capital city smack bang in the middle) is far more successful, despite doing the exact opposite.

Been is the 5th largest city in Switzerland and likely most people would guess the capital was Zürich or Geneva. It’s not really a comparator with Ireland where there are many orders of magnitude difference in population between Dublin and the next 3 cities. Certainly, development in Ireland has been too skewed towards Dublin but there would have been no sense in putting forward any other Irish city in this instance.

xl500

Im Sure the staff of Banking Agency were Crapping themselves before the decision

Imagine Dublin or Paris

listermint

realitykeeper wrote: »

Many Europeans speak far better English than most Irish people despite it not being their first language.

That's just stupid.

Attempt to be offensive I presume or just stupid.

uck51js9zml2yt

We lost out for no other reason than the coin fell on the wrong side.
There's nothing to see in this decision other than gambling is bad for you!

listermint

xl500 wrote: »

Im Sure the staff of Banking Agency were Crapping themselves before the decision

Imagine Dublin or Paris

Paris isn't actually that nice. Have you been. As in properly bin or just spent time at the tower?


And well the locals they aren't that nice either.

xl500

listermint wrote: »

Paris isn't actually that nice. Have you been. As in properly bin or just spent time at the tower?


And well the locals they aren't that nice either.

Oh I have Been

cgcsb

Muahahaha wrote: »

I think the Govt. were just hoping that at all this Brexit related moving would go our way on account of being english speaking. They are now finding out that without decent housing available for employees companies realise that attracting employees from abroad will not be easy. Couple that with our high cost of living which feeds into higher wage demands and it is not surprising that companies will choose to avoid locating to Dublin.

London is more expensive than Dublin and staff that move over will not be getting a pay cut, so it'll be a win win for them

kravmaga

realitykeeper wrote: »

And yet an even smaller country like Switzerland (with it`s capital city smack bang in the middle) is far more successful, despite doing the exact opposite.

You cant compare Ireland to Switzerland, you joking me?? They are not even in the EU for a start.

Switzerland has been a very wealthy country for a long time and Ireland is not even in the half-penny place, so I think you need to pick a country in the EU and not one of the richest countries in Europe as a comparison.

cgcsb

Goodshape wrote: »

Presumably because it's sucking the people, the culture, the small businesses, and the life out of the rest of the country in order to fuel it's all-important 'economy' which, in turn, benefits Dublin itself more than anywhere else.

"Dublin accounts for most of Ireland's GDP" – I've no doubt it does. GDP isn't everything when it comes to quality of life though. And I live in Dublin, and I contribute to that "most of Ireland's GDP", and I'm here because there's sweet feck all for me in my home county.

Cities take in workers from surrounding countryside. That is how cities have operated since the industrial revolition. Dublin doesn't benefit from it all, indeed our local property tax is distributed to other councils. We can't even pay a few quid to extend Dublin Bikes. Our rail network still operates diesel locos and no new lines have been built in 100 years. How is a city supposed to function without investmen/

cgcsb

xl500 wrote: »

Im Sure the staff of Banking Agency were Crapping themselves before the decision

Imagine Dublin or Paris

Paris is boring tacky and insular if u ask me

ixoy

cgcsb wrote: »

Paris is boring tacky and insular if u ask me

And it ranked lower than Dublin in that ex-pats survey that was so recently used to give out stink about Dublin.

It's worth noting as well that the EBA would see a fair number of people coming in from other EU countries. Proximity to an airport would be fairly important and one that has a good number of flights. That ruled out nearly anywhere else for this particular agency's needs.

Dr Crayfish

realitykeeper wrote: »

What about outside Dublin? There is an entire country out there just waiting to be developed. Think New World. Think what an enterprising people like the Dutch or Swiss might do had they such abundance bestowed upon them. This huddling together in the snug mentality must end. Dublin alone is not Ireland.

But sure none of you want to live in towns or cities around Ireland. You all want a big horrible one off housing McMansion miles away from everything, instead of having clustered centres where facilities could be shared and developed - maybe it might even attract foreign investors!

CelticRambler

realitykeeper wrote: »

It is in the central plateau, a trifling 50 miles from the country`s epicenter. By contrast, Dublin is on Ireland`s eastern extremity and a long long way from Clare to there.

80km is hardly "trifling" when (a) that distance to the west takes you over the border into another country; and (b) you said "smack bang in the middle" ... which it isn't if it's offset by 25% of the country's width. :rolleyes:

In case you didn't know, the Central Plateau is in the north of Switzerland, so by definition, any town/city in the Central Plateau is not in the centre of the country.

And it's 329km from Loop Head to Dublin, vs. 336km from Saint Moritz to Bern, (unless you want to go mountain-climbing en route). So Dublin being on right on the coast doesn't seem to be such a disadvantage after all, does it?

When were you last in Switzerland?

realitykeeper

Marcusm wrote: »

Been is the 5th largest city in Switzerland and likely most people would guess the capital was Zürich or Geneva ... there are many orders of magnitude difference in population between Dublin and the next 3 cities.

My point exactly and the Swiss have Switzerland to prove it. There is no housing crisis or traffic chaos in Berne and in rural Switzerland, communities are not dying a slow death.

realitykeeper

kravmaga wrote: »

They are not even in the EU for a start.

Irrelevant to the point being made.

realitykeeper

Dr Crayfish wrote: »

But sure none of you want to live in towns or cities around Ireland. You all want a big horrible one off housing McMansion miles away from everything, instead of having clustered centres where facilities could be shared and developed - maybe it might even attract foreign investors!

Whereas you all want to live in a big horrible town called Dublin. The spire does not inspire. The floozie in the Jacuzzi across from Heuston station is a joke. The boardwalk with its junkies, the vomit in Temple bar, the common Dublin accent and to top it all the pride Dublin people take in their horrible city is cringe worthy. Imagine what foreigners must think when Dublin is shown off with pride, it`s like passing flatulence and then boasting about it. I do not want to cause offence but that is how I see it. There are other towns and cities in Ireland that would have facilities (at a fraction of the cost) if the money was not wasted in Dublin.

CelticRambler

It's easy avoid a housing crisis and traffic chaos when the city is pretty dull and no-one goes there willingly!

But still you'd prefer if Ireland had 32 local, largely autonomous governments (there are two regional councils for the Appenzell area alone - one for the Protestants, one for the Catholics), and Rule-by-Referendum is the norm.

Oh, and everyone to bed (or at least shut inside with the music turned off) by 10pm.

Yeah, I can see that working in Ireland.

Oh, and I presume the irony isn't lost on you, of the Swiss voting to restrict the free movement of EU people; as a result, suffering a 20bn€ drop in funding for EU-sponsored projects (and the jobs that go with them); and finally having to concede several points (despite the "will of the people" in order to maintain their other trading arrangements.

Seth Brundle

realitykeeper wrote: »

Whereas you all want to live in a big horrible town called Dublin. The spire does not inspire. The floozie in the Jacuzzi across from Heuston station is a joke. The boardwalk with its junkies, the vomit in Temple bar, the common Dublin accent and to top it all the pride Dublin people take in their horrible city is cringe worthy. Imagine what foreigners must think when Dublin is shown off with pride, it`s like passing flatulence and then boasting about it. I do not want to cause offence but that is how I see it. There are other towns and cities in Ireland that would have facilities (at a fraction of the cost) if the money was not wasted in Dublin.

Your views are always so negative. I'd say you're some craic at a party! :rolleyes:


For ages you were telling us of a recession that woukd hit us in Oct or Nov 2017. How did that prediction work out in the end? Youre a timewaster; some may even say a troll.

Nermal

realitykeeper wrote: »

My point exactly and the Swiss have Switzerland to prove it. There is no housing crisis or traffic chaos in Berne and in rural Switzerland, communities are not dying a slow death.

Yes they are:

https://www.independent.ie/life/travel/travel-news/this-idyllic-swiss-village-wants-to-pay-families-over-60000-to-move-there-36342801.html

We should never have rolled the internet out to whatever hamlet it is you live in.

Collie D

realitykeeper wrote: »

Whereas you all want to live in a big horrible town called Dublin. The spire does not inspire. The floozie in the Jacuzzi across from Heuston station is a joke. The boardwalk with its junkies, the vomit in Temple bar, the common Dublin accent and to top it all the pride Dublin people take in their horrible city is cringe worthy. Imagine what foreigners must think when Dublin is shown off with pride, it`s like passing flatulence and then boasting about it. I do not want to cause offence but that is how I see it. There are other towns and cities in Ireland that would have facilities (at a fraction of the cost) if the money was not wasted in Dublin.

Ah so it's just an anti-Dublin rant you're making and not any actual point about the decision? Glad we've cleared that up.

Moving on..

zetalambda

odyssey06 wrote: »

This report is probably more of a concern: "Dublin Ranked 7th in EMA location list"
https://www.rte.ie/news/analysis-and-comment/2017/1121/921794-dublin-ranked-7th-in-ema-location-list/

Completely understandable. If you put yourself in their shoes, moving to somewhere like Dublin is like taking a step back in life. Relocating from London to Dublin is akin to moving from Dublin to Waterford.

Dr Crayfish

zetalambda wrote: »

Completely understandable. If you put yourself in their shoes, moving to somewhere like Dublin is like taking a step back in life. Relocating from London to Dublin is akin to moving from Dublin to Waterford.

Don't be ridiculous. It was a step forward for me anyway, I'd never have been able to afford my own place there. London is a global mega city, Dublin is a small calm city on the sea, a lot of people prefer the lifestyle here. Including myself, I moved back here from London a couple of years ago after 4 years there. I love London but way prefer the lifestyle here, and not having to queue for absolutely everything!

fly_agaric

Dr Crayfish wrote: »

Why are we even trying to bring more business here if there's nowhere for anyone to live?

I think the govt. have a wormhole up their sleeves - they can invite Brexit refugees to set up in the office blocks going up around Dublin and they can use the wormhole to store their employees when they are not on the job.
No state investment in extra living spaces or commuting capacity needed for Dublin - just private office blocks!

zetalambda

Many people, including myself, assumed that being the only other English speaking country in the EU and having an international financial hub in Dublin would make us the default location for Brexit jobs. But i never thought we would do this bad. While Paris and Frankfurt are hoovering up the Brexit jobs (5000+), we've managed to secure a pitiful 150 jobs. However, 8000 job relocations are yet to be announced by Deutsche bank and JP Morgan although I wouldn't get too excited as the former is German but JP Morgan could potentially move some of those jobs to Ireland. I wont dust my CV off just yet though.

https://www.bloomberg.com/graphics/2017-brexit-bankers/

Dr Crayfish

zetalambda wrote: »

Many people, including myself, assumed that being the only other English speaking country in the EU and having an international financial hub in Dublin would make us the default location for Brexit jobs. But i never thought we would do this bad. While Paris and Frankfurt are hoovering up the Brexit jobs (5000+), we've managed to secure a pitiful 150 jobs. However, 8000 job relocations are yet to be announced by Deutsche bank and JP Morgan although I wouldn't get too excited as the former is German but JP Morgan could potentially move some of those jobs to Ireland. I wont dust my CV off just yet though.

https://www.bloomberg.com/graphics/2017-brexit-bankers/

I don't want them, we have no room, where would they live? All it's going to do is push up rent and property prices even further. We need the infrastructure before we can take on more people and jobs.